What would you do if this happen to you? Pt 1.

[Kevin]

Every once in a while we have a situation that takes everyone by surprise.
This is a true story and I though because of the numerous personalities on
this list it would make for a great debate and a fun game. It has 4 parts. I post a different part each day.

I will put you in the Men position and see how you would react to this situation compared to how he did.

Background History.

Here we go and the start is very common for all of you. You have spent
some time writing ladies in the agency and have decided on a few to visit.
You make your first trip and meet the ladies and pick one lady that you find
special and spend some time with her. Everything is going fine and you
decide this is your lady and you get engaged. You meet her father and get
along great. You return home engaged. You start writing letters and she
normally returns them once a week as she lives in a local village 2hrs from
Kherson. You also provide her with a mobile phone.

You make your second trip and meet her in Kiev with her father. Another
perfect week spent with your lady. You get along great with the father and
daughter and you start to plan your wedding. You agree to return back 2 week
before the wedding. You leave giving your lady $200 cash and a she has the
mobile phone you bought her to stay in touch. Everything is great so you
head back home to return in a month for the wedding.

You return home and send her a letter and wait for her response within a
week. A week goes by and no response so you ask the agency to contact her.
The agency is unable to reach her on the mobile, but we know this lady takes
some time to come to the office so we wait for her. The agency also sends a
letter via postal to her home.

Another week goes by and stills no answer. You ask the agency to get
involved. The agency finally gets in touch with the father. Your lady went
to another town to work because she needed money is the response from the
father. He will call her and tell her to come to the agency. Agency is
unable to reach the lady via mobile. Father is can reach her every once in a
while. Father says everything is ok and she will be in Kherson for the
wedding. Father said she lost her mobile and that is why she not answering
it. She will be in Kherson when you arrive.

Ok. This is where you guys come in. What would you do at this point?

1.. Come to Kherson even though you haven't been able to contact her in a
month?
2.. Wait till you hear from her?
3.. Other options?
Keep in mine that you are bring family members for the wedding with you.
And then I'll tell you what we did and he did. It goes to take at least 5
parts to get though this.

Thanks
Kevin Hayes
www.khersongirls.com
(352) 505-8043

[andrewfi]

First thing is to pay you to go see her and see what is going on. The rest follows from your findings. If the agency was not yours then I would deal with the proprietor of that agency. I can not imagine getting married to somebodythrough an agency where I did not trust the staff/owner enough to do this simple thing.

[Kevin]

I guess I wasn't clear.  I am the agency in the case and this story is about a client of mine and a lady in my agency.

Kevin

[tim 360]

Lets see here Kev.  He comes over and uses your agency and he spends a little time with this girl and gets engaged and goes home.  She returns to her little town 2 hours from Kherson.  He comes back and spends a week in Kiev with his new fiance and father and everything is great and they will be set to wed in a month over there.

At this point the guy should be seriously questioning his sanity and his decision making process.  Spending 1 week and maybe a couple days with her does  not give them time to know each other at all and Dad is always in the picture?

Then on top of that there is her going to another city to work?  The missing and lost mobile phone?  He should ask you for "your take" on all this especially since he is coming over in 2 weeks to marry the girl.   Obviously something is amiss here and marriage should not be on his mind. 

1.  Going there to Kherson seems a waste.

2.  Waiting to hear from her?  Keep waiting.  Of course he left her enough $ for her to replace the phone and if she spent it he could get another one to her if he wants to.  You could be of help in this as well as also speaking with the girl to find out just what is amiss. Also communication with Dad is limited.

3.  Don't get the tuxedo and ring out and don't send any relatives over until he is clear on everything with her and Dad. 

4.  No good communication should equal no marriage.

[prince_alfie]

I agree that good communication is key. However, we can't be perfectionists here. I am willing to give benefit of the doubt here.

Keep in touch but suggest delaying the wedding. Make sure that she is trustworthy and that she didn't lose the mobile phone on purpose. (I have lost a phone before and it was horrible for weeks!) Have the agency facilitate any transaction for free as to make good on its promises.

Honesty is priceless. The agency's goal ought to be making it as easy as possible to communicate between male and female.

[jb]

Kevin,

Not enough information posted to form an opinion yet, but so far it don't look good for the home team.

[Todd]

Interactive trip report is a great idea.  I look forward to seeing how this develops upon my return from Saudi.  (RWD is
banned in Saudi.)  Clearly, a miscommunication has taken place and expectations haven't been clearly laid out by one or
both parties.  There might be a little bit of cultural differences cropping up as well.  For example, I'm pretty hazy on Ukrainian marriage custom.  What is the bride's family financially responsible for? 

[andrewfi]

I guess I wasn't clear.  I am the agency in the case and this story is about a client of mine and a lady in my agency.

Kevin

I assumed that this was the case. So I guess as a concerned and responsible agency owner that you volunteered to just as I suggested, yes? Probably things were much more clear afterward?

[KenC]

Buy another cell phone and have it delivered to her new village via the agency.  Call her and find out what the hell is going on.
KenC

[groovlstk]

Although there's not much info to go on, from what you've told us I'd drop her like a hot potato.

From time to time guys post here that their gf has stopped writing or that her letters are suddenly shorter and not so regular, and want to know if they should be worried. Time and again people blow sunshine up these guys' butts and make excuses for the girl when it's pretty clear to me that she's got a local boyfriend (and probably always had, but now her local relationship has turned more serious), is no longer interested, or her living situation has improved to the point where she's no longer eager to relocate to live with a guy who's almost a perfect stranger. 

If a girl really loves you, she'll do whatever is necessary to communicate with you.

[Manny]

Firstly, how does the guy make a marriage decision based on one visit? Are we talking SRM here Kevin? Or 20 year age gap etc?

We would have half a clue if we knew if they managed to dump Father and had consumated the relationship.

How did Father end up tagging along?

Presumably the Father (being the sort who feels the need to accompany daughter on dates) has her address and a contact number where she is? They are not in the Amazon, they have phones in most places!

The girl who is to become your wife does not manage to initiate contact in a month? Maybe a phone is hard, maybe she could find a new pal and send an sms, maybe write a letter, maybe find an internet facility?

We know this is doomed to failure but as a last ditch attempt, I would have a letter translated professionally and have it sent DHL to wherever she is and give her a firm time limit to re establish contact, like 3 days from receipt, failing which I would forget her and Kevin as the responsible agency owner should delete her from his books.

From this the man would learn a lesson not to get engaged after one visit and to suspect a girl who need Father as chaperone!

[Admin]

Firstly, how does the guy make a marriage decision based on one visit? Are we talking SRM here Kevin? Or 20 year age gap etc?

We would have half a clue if we knew if they managed to dump Father and had consumated the relationship.

How did Father end up tagging along?

Presumably the Father (being the sort who feels the need to accompany daughter on dates) has her address and a contact number where she is? They are not in the Amazon, they have phones in most places!

The girl who is to become your wife does not manage to initiate contact in a month? Maybe a phone is hard, maybe she could find a new pal and send an sms, maybe write a letter, maybe find an internet facility?

We know this is doomed to failure but as a last ditch attempt, I would have a letter translated professionally and have it sent DHL to wherever she is and give her a firm time limit to re establish contact, like 3 days from receipt, failing which I would forget her and Kevin as the responsible agency owner should delete her from his books.

From this the man would learn a lesson not to get engaged after one visit and to suspect a girl who need Father as chaperone!

Manny,

So far, you are the only one I have seen bring over the SRM acronym from the RWG site. While I recognize there is a certain 'shorthand' to this activity - that is one shorthand which I would personally not like to see catch-on here. It suggests a strata which, IMO, is a load of BS.

I really don't mean to 'come down on you' about this - but at the same time, I really *do* wish you could find a way to make your points without using what I consider to be demeaning (and invalid) terminology.

Make sense?

- Dan

[Christopher]

Hire a PI and have her and her father checked out by them.  Its only a little money compared what you could really use.  She would never know and if she did all you have to say is that you wanted to know exactley where she was.  As the agency owner give the PI all the info on her that you can as a show of good faith to the paying customer.

As other people have stated this seems like a bad relationship if he proposed to her that quick. 

[Manny]

Manny,

So far, you are the only one I have seen bring over the SRM acronym from the RWG site. While I recognize there is a certain 'shorthand' to this activity - that is one shorthand which I would personally not like to see catch-on here. It suggests a strata which, IMO, is a load of BS.

I really don't mean to 'come down on you' about this - but at the same time, I really *do* wish you could find a way to make your points without using what I consider to be demeaning (and invalid) terminology.

Make sense?

- Dan

No it really does not make sense, as many posters here are RWG members as well and the SRM abbreviation is well documented (Second Rate Mutha) and I am sure most people are familiar with it. If not - they are now.

It is a fact of life that many men who embark on this journey are SRM's - and my question was relevant to the theme!

It is not a point that should be overlooked. I would post a link explaining it more fully with pictures but you would delete it with your "dont mention other boards" policy (despite the fact you just have done yourself)

Do I see heads in the sand and/or double standards here?

[Manny]

what I consider to be demeaning (and invalid) terminology.


Demeaning or not, it is a fact that SRM's abound in the MOB enterprise.

Invalid?  Did you check some of the pictures from some socials? Herman Munster meets Anna Kournikova! How invalid do you want?

There is a difference in people, those who have a choice and CHOOSE the FSU, and those that cant get anything else and hope to use wallet power to delude themselves - the latter are SRM's - That is not invalid!

I am aghast that you have jumped on me AGAIN for something so minor! I think I am on the wrong board!

[Admin]

Do I see heads in the sand and/or double standards here?

Nope - what you see is someone who does NOT believe there is a caste system in play. You see someone who rejects the arrogance often on display from those who hold themselves superior to others. You see my intolerance for those who would seek to puff themselves up by disparaging others. Others whom they know NOTHING about.

Demeaning or not, it is a fact that SRM's abound in the MOB enterprise.

According to whom? By what standard?

I am aghast that you have jumped on me AGAIN for something so minor! I think I am on the wrong board!

You may be. If you are here with the intent to demean others - you are, most definitely, on the wrong board.

- Dan

[Jack]

I think second rate mutha's is also demeaning especially when saying that most the men in this wonderful pursuit are second rate mutha's which I disagree with.

I think some of the photos I have seen of some of some of the men with the women from the socials Manchucker is referring to are disgusting and gives the entire pursuit for a Russian bride a black eye. I almost throw-up when I see some of those photos.

[Durk]

       Kevin:

        You first have given us incomplete case info. NO AGES,NO TIMEFRAMES,
NO PROFILE INFO.,NEI  ??? To give you a quick reply neither the guy or the
girl are with the love me formula on this one. Gotta go with Groov on this!
           

                                                                              D

[Kevin]

The lady and client age are close to each other. 

Well it seems that the majority voted not to come.  Everyone seem to agree something is wrong as this lady hasn't contacted the office and we don't understand why.
 
Lets us continue. As all of the facts are still not fully understood and won't be for at least some time. Some of the info I will give might be corrected at a later date.
 
By this time the agency is concerned about the lady as there was no money or scams that we can detect. The lady showed sincere interest with the client and we are very confused why she hasn't contacted the office. Further attempts at talking to the father we find out their was a family problem after the visit in Kiev. We are not sure of the details but it seem to have something to do with the money that was given $200 and a conflict with the step mother at home.  We learn though the father that the lady has left the family to seek work until the client arrives. The father is sure she will arrive in Kherson for the wedding and will resolve the family conflict as soon as he talks to her. He also tells us she is on the way to kherson. (2 days prior to the client arrival date). The father states he has talked to her on the phone. (** a few days ago phone was lost **). Our first warning flag is raised.  Lady is suppose to be working in a hospital in Sevastopol.  Agency had planned to drive to lady home today. but with the news she is working in Crimea the trip was cancelled.  Lady is on the way to Kherson.
 
 
Client decided to make the trip based on the chemistry in prior meetings. The fact everyone in the agency believe the lady was sincere and no sign of a scam.. "For those who voted not to come we will see. For those who voted to come it was the same decision the client made. He felt that the chemistry was real and didn't want to lose a lady he was in love with.
 
So now we have the client coming to Kherson with family. The backup plan will be to stay in Kiev and see the tourist attractions.  Another phone call to the father and he claims she is on the way.
 
 
**** Client has arrived in Kherson with Family. *****
 
We now have a client and family in Kherson...  Another call to the father and the daughter is on the way still to Kherson.  We are told she has no money, No phone and it will take some time for her too arrive.   
One day goes by. No lady.  We wait, Father not reachable on phone.
Day 2 No lady... Client is upset and want to take some action.  I (agency) take the client to see the father at his work...   We arrive at the father work. Father said daughter is serious about marriage and he spoke to her 3 days ago. She is with a friend and might have gone to a local beach area to work or could still be in Sevastopol working. He isn't sure where she is. We ask for her friend phone number or mother number. He doesn't know it.  He offer to go to the local beach with us the following morning to search for her.  We agree to a 8am pickup at his work for the following day and return back to kherson. Father admits to family fight and the fact the lady left home after Kiev.  We are unable to reach Step mom or real mother.
 
 
I'll stop here and let you again decide. If this was you what would you do.
 
1. Send family back to Kiev to see the attractions and wait.
2. Go back to Kiev with Family.
3. Go with the father to the beach (1hr drive).
4. Go alone with an interpreter to the beach.
5. Go to Sevastopol and check all of the hospitals to see if she is working (3-4hr drive plus time in city).
6. Go and visit the Step Mom or Mother
7. Go and visit the Friend Mother.
8. Call the Police as we suspect foul play.(Missing Person)
9. Return back home.
 
 

Thanks
Kevin Hayes
www.khersongirls.com
(352) 505-8043

[jb]

It still seems like a cluster fcuk at this point, but as he is already there and throwing good money after bad, he might as well play it out to the bitter end. 

I really do think getting married at this point would be a huge mistake no matter how convincing her story sounds.

[wxman]

Just my gut feeling. I think the father is lying and has not talked to her on the phone. He has an idea where she is (probably because she knows some people from that area), but he is not sure, which leads me to believe he has had no contact with her since she left. I have a sense that she had a change of heart about the marriage, and that was what the argument was about. The father and stepmother saw the future husband as a cash cow and when she had a change of heart, they saw the end of the cash machine. She did not want to deal with it, and left. If she truly loved this man, she would be in contact with him frequently before the marriage, helping to plan all the details. The fact that she has not called the agency or him right before the wedding is a big sign of cold feet. Even if she lost her mobile phone, she could still make a call from a pay phone to the agency as the cost to do that is not very much. I sense she will not show up, and i would have never made the trip, but since they are all there, might as well do some sight seeing.  

[Durk]

       Geee! JB did you forget about the great spell check function ?    
     
              Kevin you still are not giving us the complete case. The couple being the same age
does not tell us they are in their twenties or thirties or even late thirties. You as an owner should
have never let your client go this route this soon. The cluster started when you let the family get
on the plane. A question. Was there a RING involved? Based on the word engaged if there was then
the word scam is starting to really play a role. Some Cash And More like the RING. Gee diamonds do
well on *b**!     I am really concerned as to how well you really know your girls and their FAMILIES. You  think mom and step mom are ok with this? NOTTTT. You are really being tested
here and  I for one would have never allowed myself to get in the middle of this. Wx said the girl
has cold feet. Well  even if she does she should still feel ok about talking to Lana about it. You
as an owner need to impress this upon the ladies in your office. Use your resources and stay out
of issues like these. If you think the adults are ok with this they are not. The "cash cow" may be
saying MOOOOOOOOOney but the family still wants the best for their children. Blood is thicker than
water and that culture is no different in that respect than ours.

                                                                                                 D

[Christopher]

Durk I think you are missing the point.  He owns an agency and his reputation is on the line because of this.  He comes here seeking advice from the multitude of readers here who have used agencies and have good and bad opinions of them.  He wants to make sure he has done right by his customers both men and women.  Yes he could easily just step aside and say deal with it on your own but then that person comes to a board like this and tells everyone here that he owns a scam agency.  How many times have we seen a person with one bad experience call an agency a scammer.  I commend him for coming here and talking abot it.

I do have a couple of questions.  I realize that everyone who comes to you is an adult but do you talk to them about some of the proper ways to go about a relationship?  I know there is only so much hand holding you can do.  Did they talk to you about getting engaged prior to their actually proposing?  If they did what was your response?  Out of curiosity was he a divorcee?  If so how recently?

My own perosnal thoughts on this are that if you need someone to hold your hand then you have no business doing this.  I realize a certain terp won't like that. I look forward to hearing the rest of the details.

[Leslie]

Dan,

My almost inexhaustible toddler is sleeping and I have had the chance to read this thread.  I appreciate your dislike of slang terms like SRM.  Perhaps you should include this character string in the board's swear (curse) word lexicon.  Spencer did this to "Jack"  so if you tried to refer to Mr Bragg all you got was ****

IMHO there is no person to demean on this thread.  Kevin is posting this story in order to promote his agency business.   I don't think this short of reportage belongs in the trip report section.  Perhaps you will consider moving it?

So far the story does not reflect well on Khersongirls.  However I have no doubt that by the end of this tale Kevin's agency will appear as the "knight in shining armour"  He is not going to post a story which reflects badly on his business.  He is not a fool -though some of his clients appear to be !

[wxman]

Leslie,

Your assessment of this situation may very well be "dead on". I never thought about it like that, and it does seem logical. We will see how the story unfolds.