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Author Topic: More Bad News for Russia  (Read 1075835 times)

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Offline southernX

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« Reply #4475 on: May 01, 2016, 06:03:29 PM »
you know   tiger paws  ;D  there is an odd  fact in regards to all this propaganda about NATO & AMERICA  wanting to put a ''ring '' of NATO countries around russia

fact is all the countries who have joined NATO have asked for that to take place , there are others who as yet have not been allowed to join NATO , yet still desire to

the other important point is that at no time has NATO or the US ever expressed any desire to invade or capture russia , nor has russia ever been invaded by a nato country other than germany during ww2 , when america was a russian ally

russia threatens others & seeks to be isolated by its actions and  then complains loudly about it


SX

« Last Edit: May 01, 2016, 06:05:11 PM by southernX »
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Offline AkMike

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« Reply #4476 on: May 01, 2016, 07:09:50 PM »
And keep in mind that for sometime of the beginning of WWII Russia was allies with the Nazi's.  :cluebat: 

Offline msmobyone

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« Reply #4477 on: May 01, 2016, 10:40:03 PM »
And keep in mind that for sometime of the beginning of WWII Russia was allies with the Nazi's.  :cluebat:

Yes, they carved up  Poland between 'em and Britain / USA did nothing to discourage  it... in fact, 'your lot' really took their time to get - officially - involved

BTW

It was the Soviet Union - run by a lot of Georgians..
Please excuse the Curmudgeon in my posts ..he will be cured by being reunited with his loved one ;)

Offline mendeleyev

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« Reply #4478 on: May 02, 2016, 02:19:58 AM »
I would have been more prepared to take this seriously if you had referenced just about any other "coup" story.  This nonsense about neo-Nazis taking over Kyiv has been discredited since the day that it was first published.  There are far more neo-Nazis in Moscow than in the whole of Ukraine.  Besides which, Ukraine had had pro-Russian governments right from when the Soviet Union broke up.  Are you trying to imply that it took the US more than 20 years to actually manage a coup?  Please get real.

Thank you, Kiwi. You nailed it. As someone who has stood there when Maidan was aflame, the Kyiv "coup" bullshit is just that--pure bullshit.

There was a coup however: the Crimean (pro-Russian) parliament was stormed by unmarked armed forces (dropped by helicopters from a larger neighboring nation) and disbanded. A day later a new Rada was announced, led by a Russian member of the Security services. The neo-Nazi conspiracy theorists however have chosen to ignore that coup--or perhaps they just do not have the brain cells to understand what happened.

As to anyone dumb enough to complaint about NATO encircling Russia, I'm often only too happy to remind such idiots that NATO at one time paid for a base INSIDE Russia, approved by none other than Vladimir Putin.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2016, 02:25:56 AM by mendeleyev »
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Offline TigerPaws

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« Reply #4479 on: May 02, 2016, 07:26:33 AM »
Just curious.  When was the last time you were in Russia?  I lived there last fall.  You act as if the sanctions are having no effect and that Russia shrugs them off without cost.  I have news for you.  Russia has exhausted its petro dollar reserve fund which, before Maidan, was at over 475 billion dollars (at the then current exchange rate).  Russia has gone from 38 Rubles to the Dollar to, at some times, over 80 Rubles to the Dollar.    Russia is using every possible device to keep Ru including ssian citizens from going outside of Russia.  Over 6 percent of all Russians now have travel bans, keeping them from leaving the country.   Instead Russia is trying to redirect its citizens to vacation in Russia BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE WANTS TO GO THERE!

You have described a very harsh assessment of Western Europe, while at the same time ignoring that Russia is greatly suffering the double whammy of low oil prices and sanctions.  Use your geopolitical intelligence that I have seen you exhibit quite often.  No one wins in sanctions.  But right now, Russia is losing more than the Western Alliance that chose to sanction Russia for its behavior in Ukraine.

To answer you question directly I was in Russia for several months this past winter for business and so that my wife and daughter could stay and visit with family. I traveled extensively including several trips to the Ukrainian border and one covert trip across the border to look over the equipment I arranged to be delivered. I visited front line units and much, much more.

Yes Russia is suffering but I have also seen the build up of the in country production and the push to increase this even more. This takes time but once it builds Russia will rely less and less on outside sources of goods and supplies.

Russia is playing a long game, the EU is also suffering because of the loss of exports. Additionally Russia is reducing its U.S. cash and bond reserves buy using these finical instruments for external contract payments and to purchase physical Gold.

If Russia wanted to cripple the EU and crush NATO it could be accomplished fairly quickly without firing a shot by canceling all Natural Gas contracts with NATO Member countries and those EU member nations engaged in "Aggressive" actions against Russia. Do this a few weeks before the start of winter and watch the domino's fall. 

 

Offline jone

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« Reply #4480 on: May 02, 2016, 10:03:08 AM »
Yeah, reminds me of the Japan embargo by the US, right before the start of WWII.  I guess we all know how that turned out.

Russia is playing the long game and they have some very intelligent people that are in both their government and military.  The problem is that these people are no longer making the big decisions.  I, too, have had business in Russia.  While Russia appears to seek re-establishment of their client states which made up the Eastern Block under the Soviet Union, the monetary systems of its lesser allies (and sycophants) continue to deteriorate.  Armenia, for example, is tied to the Ruble.  How long are the Armenians going to accept the degradation of their economy to accommodate Moscow's whims. 

I had the chance to tour Kazakhstan in October.  The infrastructure there is continuing to out strip any infrastructure development by Russia.  The reason?  Western Countries, particularly, the US, continue to invest there and are in joint partnerships with the Kazaks. 

The former Soviet block countries, even the Asian ones, are turning towards the West for development because Russia no longer has money or interest.   As a note, while I was there, Putin shows up.  The purpose of his visit?  To arrange joint development of oil resources in the Caspian Sea.  Pretty silly, in my estimation.   It demonstrates, once again, what a big gamble Putin is taking with Russia's future.    He's subscribing to all of these developmental projects and has no cash to implement them.   He's hoping, instead, that militarily Russia will influence its neighbors and, therefore, control their development.   

There is your longterm.  Unless he wins on the battlefield, he loses influence.  And, ultimately, he pushes his developing neighbors right into NATO.  Under the influence of the Soviet Union, Eastern Block countries were subservient to Russia.  These countries created an artificial standard of living for Russians.  Now that these countries no longer wish to foot Moscow's bill, and the price of oil remains low, and the sanctions continue to bite, Russia has no choice but to do something stupid.  Like instigate war. 
Kissing girls is a goodness.  It beats the hell out of card games.  - Robert Heinlein

Offline jone

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« Reply #4481 on: May 02, 2016, 10:15:11 AM »
Lest I  be misunderstood, I want to further comment on where I see Russia right now:

I love Russia.  I have spent much time there over the last few decades.  I understand what Putin is trying to do.  He has been dealt a busted flush.  So he has to push in all directions.  Then, along come sanctions and (Holy Sh&t) the oil market tanks.  In many cases, it now costs more to suck the oil out of the ground than what is being paid for it. 

Belligerence is the only option left to him.   Include his KGB/FSB upbringing, and the further inclusion of an additional many such men in his government, and a single party government, the pressure on him becomes almost intolerable.

I hope he can find his way out of his hole.  Because, quite honestly, the alternatives to Putin, in my mind, are much worse.
Kissing girls is a goodness.  It beats the hell out of card games.  - Robert Heinlein

Offline msmobyone

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« Reply #4482 on: May 02, 2016, 10:26:40 AM »

Yes Russia is suffering but I have also seen the build up of the in country production and the push to increase this even more. This takes time but once it builds Russia will rely less and less on outside sources of goods and supplies.

Covert crossings of national borders ?  :D

A good place to compare life in Ukraine /Russia is here

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34066101

I've been and the train even enters into Ukraine ..there was a blue metal screen erected- but as the train can wonder in and out - I can't see how people can't.

Sorry, but you were joking when you suggested Russia would dare [ could ever afford] to cut off gas, right.. ?  Just like Russia has been busy building up protectionist food production - and the consumer is paying through the nose for this - Europe is looking to alternatives to Russian energy. It can't / won't happen over night.

It's all rather silly - when viewed in isolation - protectionism normally creates inefficiency and high costs  -it is often a facet of short-sighted patriotism ...
« Last Edit: May 02, 2016, 11:12:21 AM by msmobyone »
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Offline TigerPaws

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« Reply #4483 on: May 02, 2016, 10:53:09 AM »
Yeah, reminds me of the Japan embargo by the US, right before the start of WWII.  I guess we all know how that turned out.

Russia is playing the long game and they have some very intelligent people that are in both their government and military.  The problem is that these people are no longer making the big decisions.  I, too, have had business in Russia.  While Russia appears to seek re-establishment of their client states which made up the Eastern Block under the Soviet Union, the monetary systems of its lesser allies (and sycophants) continue to deteriorate.  Armenia, for example, is tied to the Ruble.  How long are the Armenians going to accept the degradation of their economy to accommodate Moscow's whims. 

I had the chance to tour Kazakhstan in October.  The infrastructure there is continuing to out strip any infrastructure development by Russia.  The reason?  Western Countries, particularly, the US, continue to invest there and are in joint partnerships with the Kazaks. 

The former Soviet block countries, even the Asian ones, are turning towards the West for development because Russia no longer has money or interest.   As a note, while I was there, Putin shows up.  The purpose of his visit?  To arrange joint development of oil resources in the Caspian Sea.  Pretty silly, in my estimation.   It demonstrates, once again, what a big gamble Putin is taking with Russia's future.    He's subscribing to all of these developmental projects and has no cash to implement them.   He's hoping, instead, that militarily Russia will influence its neighbors and, therefore, control their development.   

There is your longterm.  Unless he wins on the battlefield, he loses influence.  And, ultimately, he pushes his developing neighbors right into NATO.  Under the influence of the Soviet Union, Eastern Block countries were subservient to Russia.  These countries created an artificial standard of living for Russians.  Now that these countries no longer wish to foot Moscow's bill, and the price of oil remains low, and the sanctions continue to bite, Russia has no choice but to do something stupid.  Like instigate war.

Like it or not, believe it or not a War is coming, how big it will be and when and how it will start are the only things which is as yet unknown. The reasons are global including the 20 plus Trillion USD America is officially in debt, the actual number is far higher and the amount is the subject of tremendous speculation.  The derivatives market is estimated at 220 plus Trillion USD world wide, every nation is up to its collective eyes in it, derivatives are the real weapons of mass destruction.

Everything in the global finical markets is suppressed, manipulated and faked. The world will go to War to cover up the corruption as the system fails. How many will die will be dependent on how big and wide spread the War becomes. Rememberit was Vasili Arkhipov, who was the man who stopped a nuclear war because of his actions on October
27, 1962. http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/oct/27/vasili-arkhipov-stopped-nuclear-war

Will cooler heads prevail again?

Russia is now the
Boogeyman a convenient propaganda tool, most Americans equate Russia today with the Soviet Union so it east to demonize them. Lets be honest the vast majority of American's are lucky they are able to walk, talk and breath at the same time. The bury themselves in TV, Facebook and whatever BS is distracting at the moment. Most of the public has the attention span of just a few seconds and if it is not in their backyard, if they do not see the issue.

 

Offline AkMike

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« Reply #4484 on: May 02, 2016, 10:56:32 AM »
As if Moscow doesn't already have enough problems to contend with, Now they have rabid hedgehogs to contend with.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/article/rabid-hedgehogs-roam-moscow-region/567685.html

Offline TigerPaws

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« Reply #4485 on: May 02, 2016, 11:01:06 AM »

Sorry, but you were joking when you suggested Russia would dare [ could ever afford] to cut off gas, right.. ?  Just like Russia has been busy building up protectionist food production - and the consumer is paying through the nose for this - Europe is looking to alternative to Russian energy. It can't / won't happen over night.

It's all rather silly - when viewed in isolation - protectionism normally creates inefficiency and high costs  -it is often a facet of short-sighted patriotism ...

Oh! I agree the chances are slim to nonexistent that Russia would cut off gas supplies, my suggestion was only a hypothetical as to how NATO could be crushed. This very scenario was a subject of much discussion during my time at the U.S. War Collage. The results were always War.

Sanctions are unproductive.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2016, 11:22:55 AM by TigerPaws »

Offline Muzh

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« Reply #4486 on: May 02, 2016, 01:43:41 PM »

SATIRE IS THRIVING IN RUSSIA, WHILE MANY RUSSIANS AREN’T





A puppet of Russian President Vladimir Putin, left, whispers to a puppet of former Moscow mayor Yuri Luzhkov, June 29, 2000 on the set of satirical television show Kukly. NTV refused to remove Putin's puppet from the show after making fun of him. Within months, the channel was under state control.


http://www.newsweek.com/russia-political-satire-vladimir-putin-ntv-454525?utm_medium=email&utm_source=Behind-the-Barricades-With-Trump-Cruz-and-Mr-Bad-H&utm_campaign=newsweek_email_newsletter
To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason, and whose philosophy consists in holding humanity in contempt, is like administering medicine to the dead. Thomas Paine - The American Crisis 1776-1783

Offline TigerPaws

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« Reply #4487 on: May 02, 2016, 05:20:30 PM »
Hum.... Not so bad for Russia
Gazprom profit jumps 71% as ruble drops http://www.rt.com/business/312040-gazprom-profit-gas-ruble/

Offline AkMike

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« Reply #4488 on: May 02, 2016, 06:18:11 PM »
Yeah sure,,  The chart on this link shows just how great they're doing.,,

Of course RT NEVER distorts the truth does it?  :wallbash:

http://www.indexmundi.com/commodities/?commodity=russian-natural-gas


Month

Price

Change

Oct 2015 6.01 -
Nov 2015 5.87 -2.33 %
Dec 2015 5.81 -1.02 %
Jan 2016 5.09 -12.39 %
Feb 2016 4.79 -5.89 %
Mar 2016 4.09 -14.61 %
« Last Edit: May 02, 2016, 06:21:41 PM by AkMike »

Offline mendeleyev

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« Reply #4489 on: May 03, 2016, 01:17:00 AM »
Quote
Yes Russia is suffering but I have also seen the build up of the in country production and the push to increase this even more. This takes time but once it builds Russia will rely less and less on outside sources of goods and supplies.



Reality check: one of the frustrations in the business community is that there is no advance in production because most of it is controlled by Oligarchs and the people in the trenches have their hands tied.

Russia bulldozed as much European cheese into landfills last summer as it produced independently on domestic markets. My wife now reads labels like they were the 4 gospels. Everything from ice cream to butter to milk is produced using vegetable oil as a substitute for milk because the cattle industry in Russia is in decline despite the cheery lies reported by the government. Ask any housewife - they are not fooled.

Speaking of cattle, one state, Nebraska, gives Russia a run for the money when it comes to production of beef and beef products. In fact, Russia produced more beef for market in 1998 (a time of near famine) than it did in 2015 or will in 2016. Factor in the other Midwest farm states and suddenly the country with one-sixth of all land on the earth's surface doesn't look so big after all.

This year Russia is expected to produce 3.75 million metric tonnes of poultry for market. Little Finland did 3.8 back in 1996.

The only things that the domestic promises have produced in 2015 and 2016 in Russia are empty rhetoric and hot air. We are headed back to the old Soviet days when meeting quotas is accomplished by fudging numbers and towing shells of trucks out on the factory lots and calling them ready for market even though there were no engines or steering wheels inside.

During many of the Soviet years, little private dacha gardens had higher production yields than state farms. Look for that to return.

As for vegetables, well thank God there is Belarus and all their farms on the border. The Eurasian Union will be good for something.

« Last Edit: May 03, 2016, 01:23:30 AM by mendeleyev »
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Offline mendeleyev

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« Reply #4490 on: May 03, 2016, 02:13:50 AM »
All this talk of domestic production reminds me of an old Soviet joke:

There were two friends, Ivan and John. Ivan was from Tolyatti and John was from Detroit. Both worked in auto manufacturing factories and had met during an educational exchange at the Ford motor plant in Gorky.

They just happened to die on the same day, and woke up to find themselves facing Saint Peter just outside the Pearly Gates. Unfortunately, Peter had bad news as both had failed the entrance exams for heaven. So, they were dispatched to the warmer regions underneath the earth's surface - and we don't mean Uzbekistan or Florida, either.

There, Lucifer met the two and after some small talk about cars and such, they were given a choice: each man could choose to enter capitalist hell, or communist hell.

Ivan thought about it, and after awhile decided to enter communist hell. It was all he knew and he feared being out of place among so many capitalists. After all, he really didn't have the right clothes to blend in with such a crowd.

John made his decision more quickly. He reckoned that it might be easier to move into a management position someday if hard work was rewarded. Plus, he had many friends in capitalist hell.

Exactly one year later, and it just happened to be May 1, all the inhabitants of both hells were given a one day pass to rest and relax in the forest on Mayday. As luck would have it, the two friends happened to bump into each other. Eager to share experiences, they began to tell each other about their versions of hell.

"What is it like in capitalist hell?" Ivan asked John.

"Oh, the work is back breaking," John explained. "The food is horrible, and we are allowed a shower just one day each week. From dawn to dark we shovel shit for 16 hours a day with hardly a break. I return to my cell each night covered with excrement, so exhausted that I just fall into bed until the bell sounds at 4am the next morning. They don't pay benefits until after the 20th year, there is no pension plan, and no paid vacation."

"Tell me about communist hell," John said to Ivan.

"It is boring," Ivan told John. "Just like in the Soviet Union there are always shortages, and so we stand around idle a lot."

"Shortages?" queried a surprised John. "What kind of shortages?"

"It is the same-old, same-old bad management" Ivan explained. "One day they say there are no shovels, and then the next day it seems as if they have run out of shit."



« Last Edit: May 03, 2016, 02:15:49 AM by mendeleyev »
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Offline AkMike

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« Reply #4491 on: May 03, 2016, 07:15:27 AM »
Putin fires top cops and promotes loyalist to him to consolidate his power. It looks like Stalin's Iron Fist is returning especially sine he formed his own National Guard recently.

http://www.businessinsider.com/putin-just-made-a-major-change-to-russian-law-enforcement-2016-5

Offline TigerPaws

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« Reply #4492 on: May 03, 2016, 07:18:43 AM »
While I agree with most of what was said in the two posts above, Russia today needs to be put into proper perspective. The Soviet Union collapsed a mere 25 years ago (1991) after 70 years of iron handed rule and while Russia is an old nation they have a very young economy which has only recently been left to flourish on its own.

Most of the current leaders (Putin included) were part of the old Soviet Union, they grew up, were educated, lived and worked in that system. It is important to remember that in order to put their actions today into perspective.

In 2000 when my wife left her small town 1,000 km east of Moscow she was living in a Soviet built 11 story apartment block with her mother, sister and grandmother. She was still washing her clothes in the bathtub and hanging them to dry all over the apartment. Not exactly a vision of a modern first world nation.

After the collapse there were some 25 million ethnic Russians scattered across the Former Soviet empire, some wanted to stay where they were, many were not able to afford to get out and others like my wife who was born and raised in Tajikistan were forced to leave at gunpoint by the new ethnically pure local Tajik government.

Nothing about the collapse was easy, the economy was in shambles, the political system was in disarray the newly elected Yeltsin administration was incompetent so the criminals took over. It was the criminals and criminal opportunists who were the first to adapt to the new reality which led to further economic instability.

If we are honest the improvements to Russian economy is because of the stability brought to Russia by a charismatic and pragmatic hard line Russian Nationalist Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin. But change takes time, a lot of time and change is not without its ups and downs along the way. Look back into U.S. history, who controlled most of the major cities before that wonderful and failed American experiment Prohibition? Gangsters and criminals. As
Al Capone is reputed to have said Don't fight the police and politicians, pay them off. Before that there was the robber Barron's and the new industrialists, the U.S. was a mess, child labor, mining wars and terrible worker exploitation and much, much more.

Eventually the U.S. grew up, laws were enacted, enforcement mechanisms became stronger and America flourished. Russia given time, likely two generations, but who knows it might take more, should evolve and grow up to become what I believe most hope it can be.


 


 

Offline TigerPaws

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« Reply #4493 on: May 03, 2016, 09:15:32 AM »
http://news.vice.com/video/shell-shocked-ukraines-trauma

For those of you who have never seen war, death and its aftermath, who have never experienced the feeling and knowledge that the man next to you would die for you and that you would lay your life down for him please forget for a minute that this conflict is between Russia and Ukraine. Look and listen to the people.

War is Hell.

While the Vice News report is shown from the Ukrainian side of the conflict be assured that the suffering goes on ill-regardless of which side we are talking about.

I am not attempting to suggest who is right and who is wrong in this conflict, but much of the bureaucratic BS shown sounds just like it was towards the end of Vietnam and the men our men suffered just the same.

While you are in the Military you are take care of, you are family. When you leave for any reason you are forgotten and ignored.   

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« Reply #4494 on: May 03, 2016, 09:35:12 AM »
Quote
If we are honest the improvements to Russian economy is because of the stability brought to Russia by a charismatic and pragmatic hard line Russian Nationalist Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin. But change takes time, a lot of time and change is not without its ups and downs along the way. Look back into U.S. history, who controlled most of the major cities before that wonderful and failed American experiment Prohibition? Gangsters and criminals. As Al Capone is reputed to have said Don't fight the police and politicians, pay them off. Before that there was the robber Barron's and the new industrialists, the U.S. was a mess, child labor, mining wars and terrible worker exploitation and much, much more.


I hear that "logic" a lot. It doesn't hold water, however.

Putin took over in 2000. He used the first 8 years to build up the oil industry. He gave loyalists the opportunity to become wealthy to mindboggling degrees. To those who were not loyal, they were stripped of assets and put in jail. Some died.

Outside of natural resources, change was much more gradual. Restive regions like Chechnya were bombed into the stone age, then rebuilt with oil money and new local leaders who were loyalists.

In 2008, Dmitry Medvedev, a person with much more liberal and pro-democracy views came to office. He began to reform the economy and especially the legal system, not a surprise given his passion as a professor of law. When it comes to positive changes for the everyday Russian, more improvements came during 2008 to 2012 than the previous 8 years. I will allow that the previous terms did have those challenges that you mentioned. But after 2008 the country experienced a totally new attitude toward small business and began to enjoy changes in the rule of law.

In 2012, in a move that surprised Medvedev and others, Putin decided to return. There were reasons for that return, and many of those reasons had to do with uncertainty in the security services, and the fact that some of the old loyalist Oligarchs were just not feeling the same amount of love under an Medvedev administration. There was also the question of whether Putin could trust a new more open society to look past some of the darker moments of his previous rule.

After the election of 2012, Putin made a gesture to the West by allowing NATO to have a base INSIDE Russia. Of course, high rent was a part of the deal, but it turned to a lie the idea that Russia was being surrounded by aggressive West out to dominate Moscow & Co. Oh, and part of the deal included Washington recognizing a flawed 2012 election that returned Putin to power.

There were some quirks in the NATO base: Putin soon insisted that companies run by Oligarchs, instead of NATO personnel, have exclusive access to maintenance of NATO planes, for example. That went over in DC and Brussels like a lead balloon, and when Russian media (then still independent) began to inform the Russia public about a NATO base inside Russia, it didn't take long for the deal to end. Today, the old story of "NATO is trying to surround us" is back, and it seems that nationalism trumps reality these days.

As for your theory that these things take time, and Russia is a young democracy still finding her way, that is hogwash. In four short years, Putin has dialed the liberalization of Russia back to previous levels. Medvedev had allowed regional governors to be elected (as provided for in the RF Constitution, something that Putin had ended after Beslan). Putin has reversed that constitutional right, and we are not only seeing him appoint governors, but in some cases other elected positions.

The loyal opposition had flourished under Medvedev, as he understood that democracy has competing voices. All opposition has been crushed in the four years since Putin's return. Media is no longer independent and has almost exclusively come under Kremlin control, with a couple of exceptions to showcase to the West (Radio Echo Moscow and Rain TV, for instance). Both of those however are under incredible scrutiny and pressure.

The clock has been turned back on the rule of law. Courts are no longer independent, and the old Soviet "telephone verdict" idea of courts waiting for a phone call from on high before determining a case has returned with a vengeance.

Today, small business owners watch helplessly as their kiosks (with stamped documents) as bulldozed overnight. In their place, new stores that just happen to be owned by Oligarchs.

Oddly, if your theory were true, then it should have taken as much time for the oil industry and the military to modernize as say, the farming industry. But your theory is not true: farming has improved thanks to the Medvedev era, but it is sliding back into old habits as corruption is the order of the day. The oil industry has modernized at lightening speed even given the more recent downturn in oil pricing.

The military modernization programme has exploded. If Putin needs more time to "turn around" the rest of the economy, then why in hell has the military advanced so rapidly? Answer: because it is a priority and receives funding and attention. The rest of the economy, not so much.

The idea that Russia just needs more time is a nice soundbite. In reality, it is a falsehood.

« Last Edit: May 03, 2016, 09:39:55 AM by mendeleyev »
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« Reply #4495 on: May 03, 2016, 09:36:45 AM »
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I am not attempting to suggest who is right and who is wrong in this conflict


Ah, but I will. A small neighbor was invaded in two regions, Crimea and the East, by the neighborhood bully.

Fact: you don't see Ukrainian equipment and troops operating inside Russia.
The Mendeleyev Journal. http://mendeleyevjournal.com Member: Congress of Russian Journalists; ЖУРНАЛИСТЫ.RU (Journalist-Russia); ЖУРНАЛИСТЫ.UA (Journalist-Ukraine); ЖУРНАЛИСТЫ.KZ (Journalist-Kazakhstan); ПОРТАЛ ЖУРНАЛИСТОВ (Portal of RU-UA Journalists); Просто Журналисты ("Just Journalists").

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« Reply #4496 on: May 03, 2016, 09:42:39 AM »

Ah, but I will. A small neighbor was invaded in two regions, Crimea and the East, by the neighborhood bully.

Fact: you don't see Ukrainian equipment and troops operating inside Russia.


With all due respect you are not looking at the human cost, you view is distorted by you political agenda. The post was and is not a political view.

Perhaps you are so jaded in your view that you missed the point.

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« Reply #4497 on: May 03, 2016, 09:58:47 AM »

I hear that "logic" a lot. It doesn't hold water, however.

The idea that Russia just needs more time is a nice soundbite. In reality, it is a falsehood.


It may not hold water in your view and that is fine, everyone is entitled to an opinion.

The future is always in flux, the leaders of any given country come to power and fall from power, few if any are good, some are competent, most are inept and or criminal. 

Change comes slowly and not everyone agrees with change. I currently have one home in Russia and I am looking to purchase another, I do business with factions within Russian so I have a vested interest in believing there will a change for the better.

Our daughter speaks and reads Russian fairly well and she is beginning at my insistence to learn
Mandarin because these regions represent the economies of tomorrow. Will America continue to play a major roll in the world? It is difficult to say, the U.S. is teetering on precipice of an economic disaster which will have global ramifications.

What things on the other side will look like is anyone's guess.


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« Reply #4498 on: May 03, 2016, 10:02:04 AM »
I think we ALL are looking at the human cost.  What other cost is there?  Most of us know families that have seen their sons go off to war.  Families with sleepless nights and wondering whether they will see their loved one again. 

Mendy has an agenda.  But, I think all of us who have known him for awhile realize that this point of view was arrived at, not preconceived.    Most of his authorship stems from cultural integration and celebrating the Russian people.  But, Tiger Paws, you must not be fully aware of the risks Mendy takes by writing the things he does, living inside of Russia.  I know that I am not the only one who has contacted him out of concern for speaking out.  Your position is fairly comfortable, knowing your activies.  His is not.

We all know of the 75th Paratrooper Division who now reside at the Cemetery in Perm.  These men went into Ukraine early in the war and came home in boxes. The human cost is something Russia historically has been willing to pay.  But the reasons that these men died was not because of some great injustice done the Russian people.  But, instead, it was a political decision to exercise influence over a neighbor and a statement of a new aggressive military posture.

Some on this forum would state that the more dead Russians, the better for Ukraine.  But I would say that I am sad for any soldier killed in this conflict.
Kissing girls is a goodness.  It beats the hell out of card games.  - Robert Heinlein

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« Reply #4499 on: May 03, 2016, 10:36:47 AM »

We all know of the 75th Paratrooper Division who now reside at the Cemetery in Perm.  These men went into Ukraine early in the war and came home in boxes. The human cost is something Russia historically has been willing to pay.  But the reasons that these men died was not because of some great injustice done the Russian people.  But, instead, it was a political decision to exercise influence over a neighbor and a statement of a new aggressive military posture.

Some on this forum would state that the more dead Russians, the better for Ukraine.  But I would say that I am sad for any soldier killed in this conflict.

Yes and the 58,220 dead in Vietnam was for a noble cause?

I have been to the Wall, I have touched the names of good young men I knew and commanded, and yes I remember each and every one of them. Some still haunt my dreams today, at least I will not forget them.

The U.S. has much more blood on its hands but most people quickly ignore and forget that.

There is no just war, necessary wars sometimes, but never just.

How Many Died in the Bombing of Dresden?
Figures suggested have ranged from 35,000 through 100,000, and even up to half a million at the wilder fringes of speculation. All because the U.S. Generals wanted to see if it could be done.

What about
the carpet-bombing of Hamburg that killed 40,000 people or the firebombing of Tokyo, where 2,000 tons of incendiary bombs were dropped over the course of 48 hours. Almost 16 square miles in and around the Japanese capital were incinerated, and between 80,000 and 130,000 Japanese civilians were killed in the worst single firestorm in recorded history.

How many children died, how many women, how many innocents were burned alive?

The U.S. and its so called allies are still intentionally killing innocent people today simply because they get in the way and because they can.

There are no innocent players on the world stage.



 

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