Russian Women Discussion
RWD Discussion Groups => Starting Out => Topic started by: krimster2 on April 14, 2018, 11:39:26 AM
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my single brothers...
early neolithic farmers learned how to separate the wheat from the chaff at harvest time
and if you’re expecting any kind of harvest in Ukraine, you need to learn how to do the same
that is, separate the women who will sleep with you, from those who won’t...
now, let me begin with a disclaimer here, so the religious righty-right won’t have the usual knee-jerk reaction. all women should be treated respectfully, they are truly one of the most beautiful things in the universe. any kind of physical coercion of a woman is despicable, period, and frankly unnecessary. psychological coercion is fair game by me, since women use it on men constantly, what’s good for the goose...
so my brothers, let me show you my little “thresing machine”
it works like this:
you meet a woman on the street in Kyiv, and you invite her to lunch
at lunch you invite her to diner
at diner, you mention that the Spanish word for bathroom is “banyo” and you heard the Russian word “banya” is that the same as “bathroom”?
No, it isn’t!
after she explains it to you, you say with enthusiasm that you want to go, but then with some hesitation, “not by yourself...” and let your voice trail off...
if she has any interest in you at all, she’ll volunteer herself as your companion...
if not, you finish diner, tell her good night, and “move on"
all the 5 star hotels in Ukraine will have a banya in the ground floor or basement
now, the next part is the part that requires some “finesse” on your part
your joint banya experience will go one of two ways, either you go into separate saunas and showers or you share one...
obviously you want to share one, since this will mean being naked with her!
I personally have never had separate saunas with a woman in Kyiv, even if I had only known her over diner...
ok?
i’ve taken you this far...
the rest is up to you...
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Wrong!:D I've been to Moscow so know what it is like there, though I only know a few scant words of Russian so usually stick to English.
how long were you there? I lived and worked there. Correct me if I'm wrong but did you even date anyone in Moscow?
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how long were you there? I lived and worked there. Correct me if I'm wrong but did you even date anyone in Moscow?
I was just there one week as a tourist so did not date anyone there. I got a general impression of what the women were like. I thought I was already sorted with girl hence why I didn't date there.
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my single brothers...
so my brothers, let me show you my little “thresing machine”
it works like this:
you meet a woman on the street in Kyiv, and you invite her to lunch
at lunch you invite her to diner
at diner, you mention that the Spanish word for bathroom is “banyo” and you heard the Russian word “banya” is that the same as “bathroom”?
No, it isn’t!
after she explains it to you, you say with enthusiasm that you want to go, but then with some hesitation, “not by yourself...” and let your voice trail off...
if she has any interest in you at all, she’ll volunteer herself as your companion...
if not, you finish diner, tell her good night, and “move on"
all the 5 star hotels in Ukraine will have a banya in the ground floor or basement
now, the next part is the part that requires some “finesse” on your part
your joint banya experience will go one of two ways, either you go into separate saunas and showers or you share one...
obviously you want to share one, since this will mean being naked with her!
I personally have never had separate saunas with a woman in Kyiv, even if I had only known her over diner...
Smooooth
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The average male expat in Moscow is not much competition if you know what I mean,
NO, I don't ... I know one or two and I hope they notice this post
Really, are you trying to outdo Trench - posting such nonsense?
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Probably because he hasn't had success there himself. If you are any sort of half decent, articulate guy who is healthy, doesn't drink to excess and act like a fool then you'll do very well. The average male expat in Moscow is not much competition if you know what I mean, let alone the average Russian dude.
There's double the number of people in Russia and Ukraine than in the Phillipines.
Trench hasn't even been to Russia, doesn't speak Russian and basically has no idea what it's like there.
Sting23, like you I lived and worked in Moscow. I got married there. I personally worked with large numbers of expats and locals. I met with some. like me, very highly educated expats. When I was teaching English several of my clients were academics who wanted to improve their English to attend academic conferences and give lectures in English at conferences. Why? Because there are far more conferences in English than in Russian and listening to translators is boring, their words.
If you're one of those people who think all Russian men are alcoholics and Russian women are just waiting to be rescued by a sober expat than you wasted your time in Russia.
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If memory serves me correctly. I recall the reason FSU women aren’t interested in the men over there can be explained in one word “disappointing”. Maybe lack of ambition. Men don’t know how to compliment. Alcoholics...well giving the facts that every time I visit over there for 50 straight days. Booze and vacations go hand and hand. So I drink from the time I wake up till the time I go to bed. Might as well. Hey a 15 pack of beer is 30$ in Canada. So I won’t talk bad about them just enjoying themselves. I could go on. I love being the massive upgrade with minimal effort or should I toot my own horn and say I’m a natural.
There’s nothing wrong with the men over there..they just aren’t as cool. They do try and start trouble when drinking. Last one guy said..hey American... what brings you over here. I said I’m not American. He said where you from..I said Canada...he said it’s the same thing. I said really. I thought you Russians were smarter then that. He got up and said I’m not Russian..I said you could have fooled me...you speak the language. He laughed and invited me for a drink. I gave him the shoo sign. He complied. My wife was impressed. I couldn’t blame her at all. They like to drink and get mouthy and foolish...so do I so I have no problems with their love of alcohol.
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Both Russian women and Ukrainian women overwhelmingly marry Russian men and Ukrainian men. Those that can't find a mate would never say, I assume, that they couldn't find a man locally, so there must be something wrong with the locals. :-\ I suppose that is human nature.
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Sting23, like you I lived and worked in Moscow. I got married there. I personally worked with large numbers of expats and locals. I met with some. like me, very highly educated expats. When I was teaching English several of my clients were academics who wanted to improve their English to attend academic conferences and give lectures in English at conferences. Why? Because there are far more conferences in English than in Russian and listening to translators is boring, their words.
If you're one of those people who think all Russian men are alcoholics and Russian women are just waiting to be rescued by a sober expat than you wasted your time in Russia.
I am pretty certain our Sting23 actually believes what he posts - that IS rather scary ...
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some demographic observations:
an endangered species in Russia is a stable single man with an income sufficient to support a family...
women over 30, a divorcee with kids, aren’t in very high demand in the Russian “market”...
Russian culture has elevated men to the position that women have in Western culture, Russian mothers dote on their sons, their daughters less so, this favoritism carries past the maternal relationship... the majority of conservative Russian men hold an old-fashioned patriarchal-centric view that many younger Russian women do not share, these women are more Western in their views on feminism.
most single Russian women have a difficult life and have “escapist” fantasies...
when combined, these factors tend to elevate westerners, particularly for women less tied to tradition...
I am the father of two Russian-American teenage girls, and married to a beautiful Russian woman. 3 years of living in Crimea made me acutely aware of how Russian women are treated by Russian men...
Russian culture does not respect the things that we in the west would label as a “human right”
there is no such thing in Russia. The social and legal protections that women have in the west is absent in the east, male behavior reflects this lack of protection
the problem of how women are treated by men in Russia, is part of a bigger problem, of how human beings are treated...
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Sting23, like you I lived and worked in Moscow. I got married there. I personally worked with large numbers of expats and locals. I met with some. like me, very highly educated expats. When I was teaching English several of my clients were academics who wanted to improve their English to attend academic conferences and give lectures in English at conferences. Why? Because there are far more conferences in English than in Russian and listening to translators is boring, their words.
If you're one of those people who think all Russian men are alcoholics and Russian women are just waiting to be rescued by a sober expat than you wasted your time in Russia.
DaveNY, don't know how you extrapolated from my comments that all Russian men are alcoholics and women want to be rescued. I said if you're reasonably heathy, intelligent and can carry a conversation you'll have no problem with the ladies.
I don't you when you were last in Moscow or your age range. My social group is 20's and 30's. You are probably far older. If I recall you were there in the late 90's which is a completely different era. I lived there last year. Most expats I met were fresh outta school bumming around Russia drinking and chasing girls.
Certainly didn't waste my time at all personally or professionally. Perhaps you did?
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Sting23
I don't think we need to let differences of our individual experiences or interpretations lead to conflict
they're just different, and they can each be equally valid...
definitely a generational difference at play and I'm sure other differences as well over various disagreements
at your age, my career dominated my life and I had nothing in my life other than my career!
it would have been a huge sacrifice on my part to go live in Russia on a $2,000 mo salary (average engineer salary)
even the non-cash compensation :) would not have been an enticement!!!
but if you're young and in search of a Bohemian life-style I can see why it'd pull you there!!!
but unless you're "well heeled" you career will pay the price, some people may be willing to make this trade and I do envy them this...
there's a lot to be said for "living for the moment"...
if you can safely ignore the rest...
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DaveNY, don't know how you extrapolated from my comments that all Russian men are alcoholics and women want to be rescued. I said if you're reasonably heathy, intelligent and can carry a conversation you'll have no problem with the ladies.
I don't you when you were last in Moscow or your age range. My social group is 20's and 30's. You are probably far older. If I recall you were there in the late 90's which is a completely different era. I lived there last year. Most expats I met were fresh outta school bumming around Russia drinking and chasing girls.
Certainly didn't waste my time at all personally or professionally. Perhaps you did?
Last in Russia in 2016. Couldn't go last year due to work. First went to Russia in '92 when I was living in London. I went because I'd never been and I'd been to most places in Europe. Went a couple more times for vacations. In 1999 when Russia was suffering economically I lead a team of 5 into Moscow looking for business opportunities. Unfortunately there wasn't much there. Second trip in 1999 met my wife.
In 2000 when the company I worked for was bought, I was given a golden handshake (less than a golden parachute) to leave. Moved to Russia taught English and found a much better paying job with an American company. Lived there till 2006. Since coming back to US I've been to Russia at least once a year till missing a trip last year.
So Sting23 I've probably heard and seen, at least in Moscow, as much as anyone who isn't a local. Yes I am much older than you, I'm in my 60s.
As for your statement that "if you're reasonably heathy (sic), intelligent and can carry a conversation you'll have no problem with the ladies" in general you're wrong. Most RW in Moscow, and even more so outside of Moscow, don't speak a foreign language well enough to carry on a conversation in English or German or French, etc.
Knowledge of English among the younger generation has gotten somewhat better in the last 15 years IMO but an expat would have to work hard to find a young RW who spoke good English AND was willing to have an extended conversation AND was willing to date an expat. It's my opinion and the opinion of a number of expat and local English teachers that I know that the Kremlin doesn't want Russians to speak good or fluent English, as is the case in many European countries, because this would lead to an even greater brain drain out of Russia.
Sting23 if you've lived in Russia you must know sex tourism is a well known phenomenon in Russia and young RW tend to be leery of most foreigners trying to date them because of this. IIRC there has actually been government announcements about the dangers to local women from sex tourists.
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cool bio DaveNY
ever had any "run-ins" with any "hooligans" over there?
did you live in an apartment in Mockba or dacha?
was it hard adjusting when you returned to the USA?
are things different now compared to 10 years ago
btw, will be taking my first trip back to Krim in July since it changed owners...
I am really paranoid about being in Russia now, should I be???
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... but an expat would have to work hard to find a young RW who spoke good English AND was willing to have an extended conversation AND was willing to date an expat. It's my opinion and the opinion of a number of expat and local English teachers that I know that the Kremlin doesn't want Russians to speak good or fluent English, as is the case in many European countries, because this would lead to an even greater brain drain out of Russia.
I disagree. Meeting women who speak English, will talk to you and will date an expat aren't that difficult to find. I've found them and every expat I know has found them as well. English is taught in public schools and there are numerous private schools that teach English here. I've never heard of this Kremlin plot to keep people from speaking decent English. I'm very sure it doesn't exist, there's just no evidence. If Russia is trying to prevent a brain drain they're doing a very poor job.
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I disagree. Meeting women who speak English, will talk to you and will date an expat aren't that difficult to find. I've found them and every expat I know has found them as well. English is taught in public schools and there are numerous private schools that teach English here. I've never heard of this Kremlin plot to keep people from speaking decent English. I'm very sure it doesn't exist, there's just no evidence. If Russia is trying to prevent a brain drain they're doing a very poor job.
mhr7 I agree English is taught in public schools in Russia. My wife was a math teacher I've been in Russian high schools. I've met some students who spoke excellent English and had little trouble speaking to me in English however all these students received additional English training at their parents' expense. Their parents realized their children needed knowledge of English if the kids were to go on to higher education outside of Russia or to work internationally.
What I'm talking about is the English language training that is offered in many European countries. In places such as Germany and the Netherlands. These students are taught English to such a degree that most can speak reasonably good English without the added cost of private English lessons. For instance, in the larger European cities such as Amsterdam, Berlin even Paris I can walk into a McDonald's and in most cases order my meal in English. If the employees of a store in Europe are under 40 and certainly if they're under 30 there is almost always someone who can speak English available to serve an English speaking customer. Can't do that in Moscow, even today, I've tried.
This theory is just that a theory and was told to me by a number of Russian teachers who had been pushing for years for funding and resources for greater English language instruction. The brain drain from Russia is a real problem.
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cool bio DaveNY
ever had any "run-ins" with any "hooligans" over there?
did you live in an apartment in Mockba or dacha?
Moved in with my wife when I lived there. First thing we did was find a larger apartment. Her place was small for her, add in my 6'8" body and we were really cramped. As for the criminal element never a problem for me but I'm an older guy. Knew some black guys who had been roughed up and one guy who had been hurt really bad by some skinheads.
was it hard adjusting when you returned to the USA?
When I was teaching English I only taught the minimum amount needed for my visa. I traveled back home several times due to problems with property I owned and had rented out. When I got a job with an American company part of my job was travel to Europe, I have Italian citizenship, and the US so I was never really away for years on end. Still it was nice to be home.
are things different now compared to 10 years ago
Moscow has changed dramatically. It continues to grow. Old buildings are being replaced with modern highrises at purchase prices equal to any large European or American city. Much to the disdain of many Russians, Russia is becoming more European or worse American. Women wear the latest European fashions. Rich Russians drive the newest BMWs, Mercedes, etch. Lots of Japanese cars on the road. Traffic is terrible. Don't drive in Moscow unless you're use to driving continuously in rush hour traffic.
btw, will be taking my first trip back to Krim in July since it changed owners...
I am really paranoid about being in Russia now, should I be???
I missed going to Russia in 2017 but 2016 was fine. Just don't argue politics or criticize Russia in public. Don't announce yourself as American. Don't wear an American flag on your luggage. Years ago I would have said don't wear American branded clothing but now it's not uncommon to see a Yankees tshirt on a Russian or a tshirt with an American basketball team's name. The Internet makes it easier for Russians to buy international.
Because the 2018 FIFA World Cup (soccer to us Americans) is in Russia this year there'll be lots of additional tourists and maybe even a few extra Americans in Russia so you should just blend in with the crowd.
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I’m an American and have been living in Russia since 2009. I mean living, I don’t need visas because I have the Russian version of a green card. Pretty sure 2013-late 2014 I never even left the country. I own an apartment in the city center of SPb, I own a car here, I was married here, my children were born here, I used public medical insurance to have surgery for an ulcer, I work in a Russian company with Russian colleagues who speak only Russian, I’ve been all over the country with Russian hooligans supporting a sports team, I use this as a smile in text messages ))
I could list more but you get the point. I’ve never had a single issue from anyone because I’m an American though I don’t go signaling that I’m an American walking down the street, but that’s stupid shit to do in general even in your own country. I’ve seen plenty of tourists walking around as obvious tourists and haven’t witnessed any ill treatment from anyone especially when they are asking for help or something.
If you go to a forgien country and start talking all political you probably need to re-evaluate your priorities in life. If I’m with my colleagues and they are discussing some political issue (usually on the local level) if I have an opinion I usually chime in with my thoughts and it’s socially acceptable because I, you know, pay taxes.
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I’ve never had a single issue from anyone because I’m an American
It's Russian propaganda, it can't be true :P
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It's Russian propaganda, it can't be true :P
I admit it, I’m one of those Russian bots that is responsible for anything anyone disagrees with on the internet. ))
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I lived 3 yr in Krim
dealt with a pickpocket once who tried to steal a non-existent wallet
got into 1 fight with young drunken guys who were harassing my wife and children to impress their girlfriends
got into another fight with a drunken guy who grabbed my wife's ass!!!
locals thought I was psycho for such over-reactions (and compared me to being Georgian!)!!
driving in Krim was a challenge!
pedestrians don't even bother to look and will dart in front of you
road rage is pretty common, watch for slow drivers trying to block you passing them
if you live below the third floor in an apartment you will have to have massive steel bars over your windows
it feels like living in a prison...
drug and alcohol abuse were common sights
people passed out, even 2 deaths from drunks passing out at night after drinking in winter, that kids saw on way to school
needles, syringes in parks
and for gods sake be careful of people's dogs there, no one will care if their dog bites you or your kids...
it appears that while I am in Krim, publicly making statements supporting Ukraine could earn me a beat-down by Russians or jail by the police
so other than not being free to speak the truth, I might be OK so long as I don't run into any bad luck or drunken pridorki...
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I’m an American and have been living in Russia since 2009. I mean living, I don’t need visas because I have the Russian version of a green card. Pretty sure 2013-late 2014 I never even left the country. I own an apartment in the city center of SPb, I own a car here, I was married here, my children were born here, I used public medical insurance to have surgery for an ulcer, I work in a Russian company with Russian colleagues who speak only Russian, I’ve been all over the country with Russian hooligans supporting a sports team, I use this as a smile in text messages ))
I could list more but you get the point. I’ve never had a single issue from anyone because I’m an American though I don’t go signaling that I’m an American walking down the street, but that’s stupid shit to do in general even in your own country. I’ve seen plenty of tourists walking around as obvious tourists and haven’t witnessed any ill treatment from anyone especially when they are asking for help or something.
If you go to a forgien country and start talking all political you probably need to re-evaluate your priorities in life. If I’m with my colleagues and they are discussing some political issue (usually on the local level) if I have an opinion I usually chime in with my thoughts and it’s socially acceptable because I, you know, pay taxes.
Kunstkammer have you ever thought of taking out Russian citizenship? I looked into it back in 2004. Talked to an immigration lawyer in the US and she said there was no problem with the US government. Also talked to a Russian lawyer who had been in the Russian civil service and she also said I wouldn't be required to renounce my US citizenship or do military service. At the time I was over 50 so I felt far certain I would avoid the Russian draft if I took Russian citizenship. My only real worry about taking out citizenship was the Russian language requirement however I was assured it wouldn't be too difficult and very few westerners have failed it. IIRC at the time Russia was apparently trying to coax western businesses and westerners to live and work in Russia.
In the future do you think you'll move back to the US? In all the time I was in Russia of the hundreds of Americans I met in Russia I only met maybe 3 or 4 Americans who planned on permanently living in Russia. One of those got divorced about a year after I talked to her and moved back to the US.
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Kunstkammer have you ever thought of taking out Russian citizenship? I looked into it back in 2004. Talked to an immigration lawyer in the US and she said there was no problem with the US government. Also talked to a Russian lawyer who had been in the Russian civil service and she also said I wouldn't be required to renounce my US citizenship or do military service. At the time I was over 50 so I felt far certain I would avoid the Russian draft if I took Russian citizenship. My only real worry about taking out citizenship was the Russian language requirement however I was assured it wouldn't be too difficult and very few westerners have failed it. IIRC at the time Russia was apparently trying to coax western businesses and westerners to live and work in Russia.
In the future do you think you'll move back to the US? In all the time I was in Russia of the hundreds of Americans I met in Russia I only met maybe 3 or 4 Americans who planned on permanently living in Russia. One of those got divorced about a year after I talked to her and moved back to the US.
I don’t really have any interest in becoming a Russian citizen, on the basic level the only thing I can’t do is vote. I really don’t have a desire to vote, there could be negative effects to becoming a Russian citizen not pertaining to loss of American citizenship but to loss of support from the US State Department in the highly highly unlikely event unfounded legal trouble arises and I could be denied exit from Russia based on being a Russian citizen. Lots of unlikely scenarios but i’d Rather not have to ever deal with them. Basically just to vote? No thanks.
I had to take a test for my residency permit (the 2nd time, it wasn’t a requirement the first time) it is more than a language test, it anolougues to the US citizenship test, for language there is a writing portion, a speaking portion, a grammar section, and a reading comprehension section, it’s fairly simple and is only at level A2. After that there are sections on Russian history, law, and something else I forget. I passed it fairly easily but there were (Russian) Moldavian citizens taking the exam with me whom failed the history section, kinda shocked me.
I really don’t plan to move to the US, as I don’t have any real reason to, except for maybe my parents getting older. I’ve pretty much ‘gone native’ and don’t really talk to other expats and I actually actively try to avoid them. Most of them are here for work or something and trying hard to be ‘American expat guy’ and I’m just a normal guy that happens to be an American but it has little to no impact on whatever I happen to be doing. The expats I’ve come across seem to want everyone around them to a) know they are American and b) know they aren’t a lowly tourist. It’s annoying to everyone around them.
I think any apprehension that I might be ‘that kind’ of expat usually goes away when it dawns on them I’m using colloquial phrases and can actually give directions. Actually the only time I like to ‘show off’ is when I hear parents talk about their ‘bilingual kid’ (because he gets extra English lessons) and start talking to my son in English and they can see him speaking perfectly and fluently, then they see him speaking to his mother in perfect Russian. They usually stop bragging after this.
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I don’t really have any interest in becoming a Russian citizen, on the basic level the only thing I can’t do is vote. I really don’t have a desire to vote, there could be negative effects to becoming a Russian citizen not pertaining to loss of American citizenship but to loss of support from the US State Department in the highly highly unlikely event unfounded legal trouble arises and I could be denied exit from Russia based on being a Russian citizen. Lots of unlikely scenarios but i’d Rather not have to ever deal with them. Basically just to vote? No thanks.
I had to take a test for my residency permit (the 2nd time, it wasn’t a requirement the first time) it is more than a language test, it anolougues to the US citizenship test, for language there is a writing portion, a speaking portion, a grammar section, and a reading comprehension section, it’s fairly simple and is only at level A2. After that there are sections on Russian history, law, and something else I forget. I passed it fairly easily but there were (Russian) Moldavian citizens taking the exam with me whom failed the history section, kinda shocked me.
When you took your test for your residency permit were there any other westerners taking the test with you? When I spoke with a Russian lawyer about Russian citizenship she said the vast majority of those taking out Russian citizenship were from the 'stans, Moldova, Africa, very few westerners. Of the westerners most were women who had married Russians.
I really don’t plan to move to the US, as I don’t have any real reason to, except for maybe my parents getting older. I’ve pretty much ‘gone native’ and don’t really talk to other expats and I actually actively try to avoid them. Most of them are here for work or something and trying hard to be ‘American expat guy’ and I’m just a normal guy that happens to be an American but it has little to no impact on whatever I happen to be doing. The expats I’ve come across seem to want everyone around them to a) know they are American and b) know they aren’t a lowly tourist. It’s annoying to everyone around them.
The longer I was in Russia the easier I found it to simply blend in. Being married to a Russian certainly helps. I knew no one other than my wife when I moved there so her circle of friends became mine.
I think any apprehension that I might be ‘that kind’ of expat usually goes away when it dawns on them I’m using colloquial phrases and can actually give directions. Actually the only time I like to ‘show off’ is when I hear parents talk about their ‘bilingual kid’ (because he gets extra English lessons) and start talking to my son in English and they can see him speaking perfectly and fluently, then they see him speaking to his mother in perfect Russian. They usually stop bragging after this.
With our girls (8 year old twins) we tend to do the each parent speaks their own language to the kids. When my wife takes the girls out with her Russian friends everything's in Russian so the girls get to hear other Russians speaking Russian. The girls have few problems speaking with other kids when we're in Russia so they're about as bilingual as Russian-American kids can get.
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With our kids we use the system ‘one parent one language’ I only speak to them in English and my wife only in Russian. My son is actually forced to sit in an English class in sadik where he speaks better English than his teacher. My daughter isn’t really speaking yet, but she responds the same way the same words in English or Russian.
As for the test there were like 4 people there besides me. I think they were all from Moldova or maybe one from some Stan but they were all ethnic Russians. When I was waiting 3 times in the wonderful FMS/OVIR whatever you want to call it to get my document renewed there were hundreds of Ukrainians and some people from other FSU republics. It was mostly Ukrainians though going by passports I saw. I think I saw some Turks and a Greek and there was an Arab but I didn’t see his passport. But this is just the day I went. Not a scientific analysis.
I grew up in a military family and then was in the military blending in and adapting to new location and people is in my programming, it was easy for me.
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Thanks to those living / lived in Russia for a great thread.
I only live there half the year. I admit to being enthusiastic and trying to do as much as I can and see new places.
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you meet a woman on the street in Kyiv, and you invite her to lunch
at lunch you invite her to diner
at diner, you mention that the Spanish word for bathroom is “banyo” and you heard the Russian word “banya” is that the same as “bathroom”?
No, it isn’t!
after she explains it to you, you say with enthusiasm that you want to go, but then with some hesitation, “not by yourself...” and let your voice trail off...
if she has any interest in you at all, she’ll volunteer herself as your companion...
if not, you finish diner, tell her good night, and “move on"
all the 5 star hotels in Ukraine will have a banya in the ground floor or basement
now, the next part is the part that requires some “finesse” on your part
your joint banya experience will go one of two ways, either you go into separate saunas and showers or you share one...
obviously you want to share one, since this will mean being naked with her!
I personally have never had separate saunas with a woman in Kyiv, even if I had only known her over diner...
ok?
i’ve taken you this far...
the rest is up to you...
Yep already did the private banja scene with girl :D
Surprised the heck out of me as it's pretty unheard of to have private banja/sauna thing in the UK. I think it would be regarded particularly by women here as seedy. In fact I think if you mentioned it to a lot of UK women it would likely signal the end of a relationship or any attempt at one, lol.
What got me is that the girl doesn't have any qualms against using a banja that is in the basement of the hotel but she will not stay in a hotel as it makes her a prostitute :-\
In the UK it is more likely the other way around where a girl might be thought of as a prostitute. Apparently a cultural difference it seems but one I find most bizarre and lead to a bit if unease on my part until I understood that they view it differently, lol. They apparently see the two as separate businesses/establishments even though it is in the same building :-\
All this cultural stuff can be a strange old affair!
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"Yep already did the private banja scene with girl :D
yeah, but damn, those are such great memories, I just feel compelled to bring it up once in a while
the same would be in the US of the banya, it would not fly there!
the thing about the banya is that at least in the ones that are in Kyiv's 5 star hotels like the Dnipro fro example
are very discreetly located in the ground floor with no station attendant (only in the winter OFF season)
so you can go there discreetly without any hotel staff interacting
a long time back the big hotels in kyiv used to have a "matron" on each floor to kinda "oversee" things who'd intimidate your girl friends unless you slipped her something green, but they haven't done that in awhile - but Ukrainian girls are VERY intimidated by this, so even though the "danger" is gone, the paranoia isn't
that's why in some places it's better to have an apartment and avoid this particular hassle! this is what I did you can still rent the banya without being a guest
it wasn't in any way difficult or awkward for either of us if I were to caress a woman' cheek or arm or leg and get her to respond
in the US people would be a bit more awkward, but Ukrainian women were pretty much fully "into it"
I was very successful at turning foot massages into foreplay
and every woman I ever went hiking with got a foot massage
most of my relationships with girls in kyiv were similar, mid-20ish, tallish (I'm 6'4") bi-lingual
I ended up marrying a Ukrainian woman 28 who was 6'1" light brown hair and green eyes
who I met in Kyiv
I did have some really WEIRD encounters though
I liked this Ukrainian "Goth" girl I met at the kreschatik street McDonalds
and invited to my apartment which was nearby
I found her "interesting" awesome English, was studying at Taras Shevchenko Univ
an intellect sharper than a scalpel
my guess was 22 yr old kinda looked like a young version of the actress Anne Hathaway
she really was "quizzing" me on "life in America" , is it real what you see in the movies"
the conversation abruptly turned when she asked me, "American men are circumcised, yes?"
yes, I responded
our men are not, she said,
you are circumcised, yes?" she asked
er um yes, I replied
would you show me please, she asked?
so the life erotic in kyiv can be quite varied
everything from cocaine-fueled orgies with escorts
to "show me yours and I'll show you mine"
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What got me is that the girl doesn't have any qualms against using a banja that is in the basement of the hotel but she will not stay in a hotel as it makes her a prostitute :-\
All this cultural stuff can be a strange old affair!
Forgive me, but I am left wondering if this a Trench fantasy.
Perhaps it is my age, but I can think of a lot more interesting places for cracks at intimany. ....
A proper banya session involves making each other mutually hot in a different sense?
Could this be why a woman wouldn't object?
The best 'private' banya we have hired was with another couple in the mountains above Sochi.
.....and no..... it wasn't like that....It was fun, though.
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"Yep already did the private banja scene with girl :D
yeah, but damn, those are such great memories, I just feel compelled to bring it up once in a while
the same would be in the US of the banya, it would not fly there!
the thing about the banya is that at least in the ones that are in Kyiv's 5 star hotels like the Dnipro fro example
are very discreetly located in the ground floor with no station attendant (only in the winter OFF season)
so you can go there discreetly without any hotel staff interacting
a long time back the big hotels in kyiv used to have a "matron" on each floor to kinda "oversee" things who'd intimidate your girl friends unless you slipped her something green, but they haven't done that in awhile - but Ukrainian girls are VERY intimidated by this, so even though the "danger" is gone, the paranoia isn't
that's why in some places it's better to have an apartment and avoid this particular hassle! this is what I did you can still rent the banya without being a guest
Certainly are good memories Krimster :D Thanks for the tip on the Dnipro, knew they had some kind of spa facility there but not of the private Banja sort. I've stayed in the hotel Ukraine before and rang the bell just off reception for the sauna, I was surprised when the door opened and this stange looking guy (the attendant apparently) popped his head out. I wasn't with a girl at the time just curious. So I'm guessing they have similar in the basement there. Attendant guy didn't seem that hospitabe (not rude but not exactly welcoming/cheerful) so had I been with a girl I can see how she might find it awkward/intimidating.
With girl that I did the banja thing with I did rent an apartment and we went to a banja in a hotel that was way out of Kiev by taxi - on the outskirts. It was a big hotel most probably five star, done out nice inside. We went inside to Receptoon then down to the private banja - it was quite sizable with a number of rooms for us to enjoy, like a whole sauna facility but just for us, I could not believe it, lol. Anyway one room had a sauna, another a steam room I think and yet another a bed :D there was also one of those big bucket things you stand under pull the rope and a load of water gushes over you, fortunately it was not real cold as I feared just a little cool.
Anyway, there were apparently two types of private banja we could have gone for - a Turkish themed banja and a Russian themed banja - she chose Russian since she was Russian/Ukrainian. I think it was a good choice. Like I say compared to back home it was far out, and yes only the sort of experience I would have dreamed off.
You've certainly lived one he'll of a life Krimster. I just wish I could go back in time and lived mine more the way you have lived yours. I'm now 40 but time over again I would have learnt Russian early saved up a load of dosh and spent a long time of my youth over in Ukraine/Russia :) Still hasn't been a bad life could have been worse and still plenty of time to get more FSU experiences in I hope. The way they live their lives over there is just so much better than in much of the west I think where all the joy has pretty much been squeezed out of life by uptight values and stuffyness.
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Forgive me, but I am left wondering if this a Trench fantasy.
Perhaps it is my age, but I can think of a lot more interesting places for cracks at intimany. ....
A proper banya session involves making each other mutually hot in a different sense?
Could this be why a woman wouldn't object?
The best 'private' banya we have hired was with another couple in the mountains above Sochi.
.....and no..... it wasn't like that....It was fun, though.
With another couple... you mean like you were like swingers! ;D
Could it be that Trenchy here has had a FSU experience that Mobers has not!!! And that are Mobers is just a tinsy winsy bit jealous, lol
Appears for once you have some catching up to do Mobe. When you are next with your other half discuss this with her and book yourself in for the real banja experience, not the touristy version, you won't regret it 😉
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“Perhaps it is my age, but I can think of a lot more interesting places for cracks at intimany. ....”
top o’ the mornin!
aye, tis true, but need to start the new cadets out slowly...
also, the banya is a part of Russian Kultura, our “victims” “know the score” to the tune that’s about to be played, so to speak, so their acceptance of being there is in Russian Kultura the beginning of an “invitation”
A proper banya session involves making each other mutually hot in a different sense?
oh very much 100% true
and if you’re good at it and you meet a girl who’s also good at building it, it can be a pretty intense erotic experience... and besides the “display” in the sauna, you have the shower which generally involves more touching and then I usually “finish up” partly in the pool (and this is my favorite part)
and ‘tis why I introduced it to our younger brothers. if they master this basic lesson, should we provide more advanced ones?
what would you recommend?
never did a multi-couple or group banya, for my “style” it wouldn’t really add much, also these girls were so damned hot, you would not need to add a second for more eye candy
I did end up in a Russian oligarch’s party at his dacha/mansion near the airport I was the only American at this party and was very roughly handled by the party’s “escorts” who forced me to take illicit drugs... how I’m still alive I don’t know... stay away from this kind of “action”
stupid of me, hope there’s no pee pee tape of that night...
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Could it be that Trenchy here has had a FSU experience that Mobers has not!!! And that are Mobers is just a tinsy winsy bit jealous, lol
You are dreamin' of the life and I am livin' the dream - what's there to be jealous of ? ;)
Appears for once you have some catching up to do Mobe. When you are next with your other half discuss this with her and book yourself in for the real banja experience, not the touristy version, you won't regret it 😉
Duh, you've 'tried it' in some underground room in a hotel and that's 'real' ? .... REAL banyas are the one's at folks homes, when you take turns to go in , take tea, chat about the world or places in the mountains, where you run out into a roaring mountain stream .... or run out and roll in the snow ...
'Sure' .... like you've tried that ... ;)
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You are dreamin' of the life
Moby --he is a liar --I don't believe he has had any of these "experiences " .
The fantasy is coming from his sex tourist forums that he frequents and gets his kicks from-- and believes the BS there from the likes of that clown fantasist DK .
This is a guy who on meeting managed to get a girl to flee before she had even finished her coffee!!
The "highlight"of that trip he actually made was he was staying at an excellent hotel that has about as much opportunity to meet someone as any location possible- right there on doorstep.
He wrote about it being a miserable place with nothing to do !!
The only way -- and I mean the ONLY way --there is any possibility of there being a grain of truth in what he wrote is if he had hired ( paid) that girl. But --knowing how tight he is about money -- I can't see that as a possibility either -- so it only leaves it to something he has read.
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" or run out an roll in the snow"
did not like that part, cuz then you have to have that awkward conversation about shrinkage, it's just so embarrassing for that to happen to have your willy shrink down to the size of a noodle in front of her ... when just a minute ago... I dunno, I guess all's well that ends well...
ohhh sure, yur gonna tell me an Irishman never has that problem, not even on a freezing night in St Petersburg with 3 shots of vodka?
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top o’ the mornin!
NEVER heard any real Irish person say that ;)))
aye, tis true,
And I'm from the north .. We'd say "Achk, at's troo!" ;)
but need to start the new cadets out slowly...
Our Trench is a 'Space Cadet', as we'd say in Norn 'Irn
also, the banya is a part of Russian Kultura, our “victims” “know the score” to the tune that’s about to be played, so to speak, so their acceptance of being there is in Russian Kultura the beginning of an “invitation”
A proper banya session involves making each other mutually hot in a different sense?
oh very much 100% true
and if you’re good at it and you meet a girl who’s also good at building it, it can be a pretty intense erotic experience... and besides the “display” in the sauna, you have the shower which generally involves more touching and then I usually “finish up” partly in the pool (and this is my favorite part)
and ‘tis why I introduced it to our younger brothers. if they master this basic lesson, should we provide more advanced ones?
what would you recommend?
never did a multi-couple or group banya, for my “style” it wouldn’t really add much, also these girls were so damned hot, you would not need to add a second for more eye candy
I did end up in a Russian oligarch’s party at his dacha/mansion near the airport I was the only American at this party and was very roughly handled by the party’s “escorts” who forced me to take illicit drugs... how I’m still alive I don’t know... stay away from this kind of “action”
stupid of me, hope there’s no pee pee tape of that night...
I posted the video of our 'foursome' banya in one of my TR reports and simply cannot compete with your memories...
http://youtu.be/bu82tZb34Ns (http://youtu.be/bu82tZb34Ns)
For those with low boredom thresholds - it gets more interesting from 2:35 and ends with SC wanting to dip in the roaring torrent ( excuse my assassination of Russian - I know I should have said " Ti Zharko ? " )
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" or run out an roll in the snow"
did not like that part, cuz then you have to have that awkward conversation about shrinkage, it's just so embarrassing for that to happen to have your willy shrink down to the size of a noodle in front of her ... when just a minute ago... I dunno, I guess all's well that ends well...
ohhh sure, yur gonna tell me an Irishman never has that problem, not even on a freezing night in St Petersburg with 3 shots of vodka?
No.. I'm telling you that's EXACTLY why I have trouble believing about romps at proper banyas ;)
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Our Trench is a 'Space Cadet', as we'd say in Norn 'Irn
I posted the video of our 'foursome' banya in one of my TR reports and simply cannot compete with your memories...
http://youtu.be/bu82tZb34Ns (http://youtu.be/bu82tZb34Ns)
For those with low boredom thresholds - it gets more interesting from 2:35 and ends with SC wanting to dip in the roaring torrent ( excuse my assassination of Russian - I know I should have said " Ti Zharko ? " )
On competing with my memories I would have to agree Mobers there was certainly no Russian dude around thrashing a branch about while everyone else sat around bored, lol.
Edit: sorry, a Russian dude in speedo's!
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Ah, we see yet another one of RWD's forum know it alls that has dicovered today from the likes of mere old trenchy that having thought he knew it all about the FSU actually doesn't, lol, boy how am I savouring this moment :)
I think we should put this to the test
With the permission of the mods I created a poll ( you can only see the results if voting )
Trench - if you have any options you want adding - as you are the star - please let me know
The poll is here:
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=22705.0 (http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=22705.0)
( Members only )
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Sure, I have no problems with this, all options look fine to me :)
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Sure, I have no problems with this, all options look fine to me :)
Good, sport ! ;)
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In all honesty I can see how anyone who's not been in this situation may not find it believeable. By western standards it sounds much like the sort of thing young jocks (as they would say on the US) BS about to impress their peers. I assure you though it happened as you guys know on here I tell it all wart and all since I firmly believe this is how we all gain most out of this forum by getting it all out into the open - otherwise no one is able to comment to help you out is the way I see it.
This is why I tell you guys what I am about to tell you now. At the time while it was certainly a mine blowing experience that I enjoyed greatly it mistakenly begun to sow seeds of doubt in my mind. Towards the end of the sauna/banya experience I thought to myself no way would a legit girl do this especially since everything I heard about girls/her not wanting to stay in hotel as they would be deemed a prostitute. After all she was a hottie about 14 years younger than me. I'm an ok looking guy but have never considered myself a top tier in crowdy sort of guy. So was this her business and a deceitful girl? We said nothing to each other in the taxi back to the apartment. Just the odd few looks of distrust & suspicion - I feared the worst but did not wish to say. At that point I felt I would rather not know we still had the night together before departure the following day.
Later though as we redied for bed I had come around to asking her why she was ok using the sauna/banja if she had a hang up over hotels. I thought I had rumbled her that I had caught her out. Instead she went on to tell me that it's ok as it's treated as two separate businesses (though eitgin the same building) and it was quite alright doing that in Ukraine. I was more reassured by this though still found it a little strange passed it off as a cultural difference which is what it seems to have been. I'm now pretty sure she was straight up in this and feel bad that I thought such about her but it was a pretty strange cultural difference that came way out of left field for me to get my head around. Before this experience I had no idea that this sort of stuff went on over there. The only other thing like this I had heard of was saunas on Austria allowing nude participation but this was as a group in public and no sex involved and in fact it tended to be only the minority that seemed to go in nude in the ones I have been in and they were mostly old guys.
So there we have it, like I say compared to the UK it was a experience I was not expecting - she off course told me before we went but I was not really believing that it would go down that way. In fact I wondered if I was being taken in the taxi to be done in somewhere - i.e there would be a crowd of goons to meet me and do me in. The taxi drove us real far out and through some areas that were a bit semi desolate. Fortunately my experience didnt end that way, lol.
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All this doubt, but you took her to Cyprus, too ?
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All this doubt, but you took hot to Cyprus, too ?
I had doubt but in the last day or so it all changed around again and all was good. Like I say I felt bad for thinking badly of her. If any thing I felt more sure that she was genuine. In our contact between Kiev & Cyprus I felt she was being straight up with me.
The whole relationship generally tended to flit back & forth between I trust her and I don't. Very much like the original premise to the Homeland drama.
I think she is generally genuine and trustworthy but the way she acts tends to undermine this - basically the shopping sprees and the cultural differences such as above.
I think a lot of the shopping problem comes from both her lack of understanding of English Culture and what she has been led to believe or led herself to believe of English culture. I've tried to tell her but I think she has trouble understanding the cultural difference as I did hers. I don't think she realises that because salaries are generally equal here whether male or female each person unless they are a particularly high earner (few & far between) generally gets paid enough to support one adult and little more (a bit more for entertainment or support kids but that's all). I think she thinks that a men's salary is double like in Ukraine so will support both man and woman.
I think she has led herself to believe WM are all rich, at least those that can afford to fly. Sure the stronger currency can buy a bit more, but not enough for two if one is spending out a fair bit on fashion brand shopping. So I think she never caught onto the difference, believed me or just wanted to believe what she wanted. I tried to tell her man & women go halves in the west which went down like a lead balloon, lol. I'm not sure if I tried to tell her of ghe salary difference probably thinking it would sound weak to her, probably I should have labeled this point more as she's a young girl and may have been oblivious to it all.
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a dacha in the forest, a chilly snowy gray afternoon
ice on the windows on the inside
the smell of old wood
firewood in the ancient wood burning stove
heat the samovar
tea with honey....
completely different experience but nice way to spend a relaxing day with your sweetheart
this is more my speed now....
unfortunately cannot show my photos ...
my wife found my collection of the ones that did NOT feature her and hid them some where, and if I ever published the ones that featured her, I’d be cut-off for a week, noooooo...
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NEVER heard any real Irish person say that ;)))
THAT'S why everyone in Dublin was looking at me that way
but damn Trinity college, then the library, double damn
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I tried to tell her man & women go halves in the west which went down like a lead balloon, lol. I'm not sure if I tried to tell her of ghe salary difference probably thinking it would sound weak to her, probably I should have labeled this point more as she's a young girl and may have been oblivious to it all.
dude stop being so cheap.. on a date in the west guys don't go half with a girl.
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Poll looking good for me so far Mobers :D I'm in the lead with 4 votes!
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Poll looking good for me so far Mobers :D I'm in the lead with 4 votes!
According to the poll, there is two Trenches on this forum. Will the real Trench stand up? The poll has an error margin of +/- 3%.
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Poll looking good for me so far Mobers :D I'm in the lead with 4 votes!
?:))
As I see it - it's a tie - 4 folks think your a dreamer and 4 think you're their dating hero)
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According to the poll, there is two Trenches on this forum. Will the real Trench stand up? The poll has an error margin of +/- 3%.
There's THREE, now; )
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?:))
As I see it - it's a tie - 4 folks think your a dreamer and 4 think you're their dating hero)
Moby -- the only thing obvious from the is that he is not the only complete idiot on the forum ! :cluebat:
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my single brothers...
early neolithic farmers learned how to separate the wheat from the chaff at harvest time
and if you’re expecting any kind of harvest in Ukraine, you need to learn how to do the same
that is, separate the women who will sleep with you, from those who won’t...
now, let me begin with a disclaimer here, so the religious righty-right won’t have the usual knee-jerk reaction. all women should be treated respectfully, they are truly one of the most beautiful things in the universe. any kind of physical coercion of a woman is despicable, period, and frankly unnecessary. psychological coercion is fair game by me, since women use it on men constantly, what’s good for the goose...
so my brothers, let me show you my little “thresing machine”
it works like this:
you meet a woman on the street in Kyiv, and you invite her to lunch
at lunch you invite her to diner
at diner, you mention that the Spanish word for bathroom is “banyo” and you heard the Russian word “banya” is that the same as “bathroom”?
No, it isn’t!
after she explains it to you, you say with enthusiasm that you want to go, but then with some hesitation, “not by yourself...” and let your voice trail off...
if she has any interest in you at all, she’ll volunteer herself as your companion...
if not, you finish diner, tell her good night, and “move on"
all the 5 star hotels in Ukraine will have a banya in the ground floor or basement
now, the next part is the part that requires some “finesse” on your part
your joint banya experience will go one of two ways, either you go into separate saunas and showers or you share one...
obviously you want to share one, since this will mean being naked with her!
I personally have never had separate saunas with a woman in Kyiv, even if I had only known her over diner...
ok?
i’ve taken you this far...
the rest is up to you...
So you invite them to share a public toilet with you? Am I missing something?
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Moby -- the only thing obvious from the is that he is not the only complete idiot on the forum ! :cluebat:
HAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
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There are now 5 Trenches on this forum according to the poll which make Trench himselves(plural) tied for the lead. What is the new margin for error on this poll?
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Trench must be pleased so many members want to BE him ;)
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Moby -- the only thing obvious from the is that he is not the only complete idiot on the forum ! :cluebat:
or maybe it just tells you how silly this poll is, lol
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or maybe it just tells you how silly this poll is, lol
:cheesy:
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"So you invite them to share a public toilet with you? Am I missing something? "
a Russian banya is a sauna and not a toilette
In the Soviet Period, “Physical Culture” was heavily emphasized in the CCCP, so masses of Russians exercising at the beach, jumping into the Black Sea in the middle of winter, etc are all normal. some Soviet traditions have not been diminished by time...
the sauna is a part of that (though obviously predates the Soviet period, the Soviet Period accelerated it), every Russian woman knows what a banya is...
as I said earlier, easier to cut “with the grain” of social traditions, than to cut “against” it
if the two of you go to a banya together (after the 3rd data rule)
you will go together to the same banya and not separate
you will have to disrobe in the changing room together
you will have to go to a small wooden room that if you’re lucky is 10x10‘
and while you are completely naked you will sit next to your GF who is also completely naked!
ok, that’s the “objective description”
what about the subjective?
what do you feel when you see a woman naked for the first time?
young Ukrainian women have
well toned bodies, flawless glistening(in the sauna) skin, the women I took to banyas were all 9s
some blond/blue eyes, pale skin
some dark hair/eyes but because they were into “physical culture” had all-over tan
all of them looked like olympic athletes
sitting naked next to you!
this is what I call the “presentation phase”
and this is where it can get interestin’
subtle provocative poses, both you and her
you want to ‘escalate’ into maybe not so subtle
second phase is the “shower phase” to wash off the sweat!
you both get into the shower together
if you have a washcloth, it is very gentlemanly to hold in you hand
and use it to lightly scrub her back and torso and legs and ‘other’ places
third optional phase (because not all banyas will have this) is the “pool phase”
hopefully the pool will have steps in the corners
if it does, descend a few steps and sit
choose a step that lets “part” of you be out of the water while you’re reclined
heaven........
the reason this works is because the banya “outwardly” is asexual, familes do banyas together in Russia, so it starts out this way, but it quickly becomes ‘subverted’ or is better to say ‘perverted’?
OK, got it now?
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one aspect of Russian physical culture is the beach scene
VERY different from the American beach scene
swim suits can be anything in Russia, I’ve seen plenty of adults wade into the water wearing their underwear!!! pre-pubescent children, even older ones! are allowed to run around the beach sans clothing! my 2 daughters took a keen interest in this when they noticed boys their own ages running naked on the beach.
Oh malchiki!!!!
daddy, can we go play with those boys?
umm, well, actually I’d prefer...
thanks daddy!
malchiki! idisooda!
"chips off the block, these two..."
cadets are doomed!
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Krimster your knowledge of sauna/banja culture in the FSU on here is golden :) I've enjoyed hearing every moment of it and areas where I might improve my banja technique. If it were left to Mobers we would all be thinking a banja experience is wearing a cloth dunce hat while some gay dude beats you with a broom, lol.
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Be careful, Krimsters knowledge is a bit outdated. The banya scene in Moscow is more on the gay side these days.
(http://i.imgur.com/ltJirlX.png)
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and he's right as well about what he describes!
it's a different kind of banya, like the family banya
which can be a very relaxing and enjoyable day at the dacha
like I said, this is more my speed now
it's very "earthy"
but the seduction banya is also a real thing as well
expanding on the "psychology" of why this works...
Russian women have this thing about not being perceived as "cheap"
this is why they were terrified of the matrons on the 5 star hotels in kyiv
they've been "conditioned" to think this way
to seduce a Russian woman you have to treat her like she's a princess
do that and the rest is simple...
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"The banya scene in Moscow is more on the gay side these days."
well, your lucky day then!!!
not that there's anything wrong with that
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If it were left to Mobers we would all be thinking a banja experience is wearing a cloth dunce hat while some gay dude beats you with a broom, lol.
'We' would all be more realistic about Banyas ....but you can continue to dream on ...
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'We' would all be more realistic about Banyas ....but you can continue to dream on ...
Ha, ha, ha, so old Trenchy here has experienced a side of FSU life that Mobers did not know about nor have access too, lol.
I can tell you its there Mobe, from someone the other side of the fence. Its a world of seduction & temptation you have not yet transcended too. To you our forum 'authority' on everything FSU this will remain a hidden side to FSU society you are not privy to nor believe even exists!
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but the seduction banya is also a real thing as well
Absolutely :)
to seduce a Russian woman you have to treat her like she's a princess
do that and the rest is simple...
Tell me more, teach, impart me you're wisdom :D
What sort of stuff do I do to treat her like a princess?
I may already be doing some of this stuff but just in case I'm missing anything important.
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a Russian banya is a sauna and not a toilette
In the Soviet Period, “Physical Culture” was heavily emphasized in the CCCP, so masses of Russians exercising at the beach, jumping into the Black Sea in the middle of winter, etc are all normal. some Soviet traditions have not been diminished by time...
the sauna is a part of that (though obviously predates the Soviet period, the Soviet Period accelerated it), every Russian woman knows what a banya is...
as I said earlier, easier to cut “with the grain” of social traditions, than to cut “against” it
if the two of you go to a banya together (after the 3rd data rule) . .
the reason this works is because the banya “outwardly” is asexual, familes do banyas together in Russia, so it starts out this way, but it quickly becomes ‘subverted’ or is better to say ‘perverted’?
Hmm, not certain I agree with the "physical culture" of the USSR. My FIL was a former athlete, in great shape, and he did swim in the Dnipro in winter. He was very much an outlier in this.
The better half is also very athletic, and he used to jog in the park near our apartment. He was deemed "an idiot" for this activity. He even ran in forests when he was stationed at Chernobyl'. No one could understand why he would waste his time running.
There was very much a culture of mineral baths, mineral waters, spas, and such. Banyas, at least in Ukraine in Soviet times, were single sex only, or family. One would be required to provide proof of marriage if going to a family banya.
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c'mon msmob
you must've been exposed(sorry) to this at some point
every big Russian\Ukrainian 5 star hotel has this
5 star hotel banyas are pretty much guys with their girl friends
and NOT family banyas
i've heard that Irishmen are shy and reserved, it's OK, man...
my wife loves that Pierce Brosnan fella
the beauty of this is the way you work the ambiguity of "banya"
if not the banya?
your recommendation?
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Krimster your knowledge of sauna/banja culture in the FSU on here is golden :) I've enjoyed hearing every moment of it and areas where I might improve my banja technique. If it were left to Mobers we would all be thinking a banja experience is wearing a cloth dunce hat while some gay dude beats you with a broom, lol.
what the hell is a "banja"? hahahhaah
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BO, when you were younger and lived in Kyiv did you ever go to one of the “beaches” long the Dnipro on a hot day, there’s a large famous one, but I can’t remember the name now
when I was there there was this big “exercise culture” thing going on at this spot
hundreds of people, exercising in various ways
in the USA you’d get volleyball and that’s about it
also your husband’s “polar” swimming, although it’s not like everyone does it, but it’s not a small number either
I’m surprised you never encountered this
I call it “Physical Culture” because it reminds me of the various “State Academies of Physical Culture” located throughout Ukraine like in Kharkiv, Ukraine has a lot of people associated with this..
c’mon Bo, you can’t be one of those people who believed “There is no sex in the Soviet Union”
it’s OK if you want to be coy (with me...)
you're human to, share with us, you had to see some interesting things...
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Yes, Hydropark was very popular. But there was no discernible exercise culture there in Soviet times. There were gyms, and there were, for example, bodybuilders, but it's not like it is there now.
It was far more difficult to have sex if unmarried, because people generally did not live alone, although of course there were exceptions, and they could not rent hotel rooms in their cities, and if in other cities, no guests of the opposite sex were allowed if unmarried. So, one would have to find a time when family members were out, or resort to outdoor sex (which was quite common, at least in Ukraine).
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"Yes, Hydropark was very popular. "
that's the name!!! yes, exercise culture is very popular now!!!!
yeah the lack of opportunity problem was solved in creative ways
I was doing "midnight archeology" one night under a full moon in Chersonese
had to give up and go home because too many people were there trying
to look for a secluded spot to have a sex
and one couple almost fell into the hole I dug!!!
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I should have qualified, by unmarried, I meant young couples, not divorcees. Divorcees were a completely different story. They usually lived alone and were what the better half would describe as "sexually disturbed", he said you could see it in their eyes. He used to get hit on all the time. It was never direct, usually on the pretense of needing something repaired in her apartment. He always said no, but he would direct them to men he worked with who he knew would be willing to "do the job".
There were areas of Kyiv you could go to, to find a partner for the night, the area just off Khreshchatyk near the Opera House being one (still the same), another area if you were a woman looking for two men, yet another if you were a man looking for two women, another if you only wanted to perform oral, etc. - any variation you can think of. All of these places are still active.
The public bathrooms on Khreshchatyk were well known for gay sex.
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what the hell is a "banja"? hahahhaah
Its the kinky form of Banya ;D
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Well here is a Hollywood depiction of a Banya in Soviet times in Georgia, even my Banya experience wasn't nowhere near this full on!!!
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxLIgHIm2_w]
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c'mon msmob
you must've been exposed(sorry) to this at some point
every big Russian\Ukrainian 5 star hotel has this
5 star hotel banyas are pretty much guys with their girl friends
and NOT family banyas
i've heard that Irishmen are shy and reserved, it's OK, man...
my wife loves that Pierce Brosnan fella
the beauty of this is the way you work the ambiguity of "banya"
if not the banya?
your recommendation?
Of course we've tried posh hotel 'Banyas' - covered in a 'New Year in Sochi' ( Jan '16 )
I recommend nature .... the outdoors - not a time limited session... personally, a nice cove and diving off a yacht with a crew of 2, is more my style.
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"ff Khreshchatyk near the Opera House being one (still the same),"
this is true, I totally lucked out in 1996 getting my apartment EXACTLY in this area, without even knowing of the advantages until after I got there and was exploring in the evening
plus could go the opera which I loved, pretty classic fare like "Carmen" but the sets and actresses were lovely and so is the opera house...
AND it's near the giant escalator - SWEET!!!!
after the opera I'd go to "PantaGruel" and have a light meal and a pint of Guiness or two...
Yulia Tymoshenko was once there with her body guards when I was there and we made eye contact
but her guards gave me the "look".... and I backed off
I once took two stunning women with me to a 5 star restaurant in Kyiv, the women told me they could hear people speculating if I had picked up two hookers
even had guys come by and "wink" at me, I guess that's not a "usual" sight, one guy two gals, but it was platonic...
yeah, the favor thing, and "Mr Fixit" gawd I miss those days
and all that I received from grateful women...
bless you...
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"Well here is a Hollywood depiction of a Banya in Soviet times in Georgia, even my Banya experience wasn't nowhere near this full on!!!"
nor was anyone else's - funny!!!!
looked more like a depiction of a harem pool but with guys added
I guess that's what they think it looked like...
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"Khreshchatyk near the Opera House being one (still the same),"
this is true, I totally lucked out in 1996 getting my apartment EXACTLY in this area, without even knowing of the advantages until after I got there and was exploring in the evening
The thing is, though, that the women there are by and large looking for a good time, not a husband. So, for those contemplating meeting women there, know that you have to open your wallet. Wide.
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BO
they called me "rich kid" literally...
not all the girls I met on Khreshchatyk were this category...
there's a lot of offices with white collar jobs in the opera area
GUM, post office, hotels, government offices, banks, etc
in the day-time, you can easily run into an army of young white collar professional women coming to and from work, and they were really “sharp looking”!!!!
then there were the “waifs” young things, students, sweet girls
I felt drawn to these girls, they all had a dark side, some tragedy, loss of a parent
looking for some refuge, emotional support or for just a chance to smile...
or just love from another human being, since they never received it from anyone else
(as well as a rollicking good time, to counteract all the “gray" in kyiv)
me being a stranger and sympathetic
made it easy for me to be their confidant
some of these girls genuinely loved me, and I know I loved them...
I hope they all met someone who loves them the way I love my wife
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Trench, you need to cultivate a more refined sensibility...
my reason for telling you this
is not to criticize you
but to help YOU avoid criticism
you see we’re ALL PIGS
but some of us have learned to conceal this information...
and as a result, we don’t APPEAR to be pigs
you should examine the value of this idea...
may I ask your background
age what part of UK do you call home?
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There really are two types of bath houses in Russia/FSR. The first is the sauna type bath house that is typically set apart from a person's residence and is built of wood to absorb the heat of the steam.
The second type of bath house is the institutional one that is/was a place of coming together, particularly in Soviet times. It was communal and large. With sections for bathing, for massage, etc.
One is memorialized in the New Year's classic: The Irony of Fate (or What I did in the Bath House).
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Trench, you need to cultivate a more refined sensibility...
my reason for telling you this
is not to criticize you
but to help YOU avoid criticism
you see we’re ALL PIGS
but some of us have learned to conceal this information...
and as a result, we don’t APPEAR to be pigs
you should examine the value of this idea...
may I ask your background
age what part of UK do you call home?
I come from southern England, I'm 40 years old and live in a decent (not social housing) but not millionaire type of area. I earn the usual peasants wage like most of the rest of the UK. I can provide for a family so long as there is no extravagance in spending or in that case the women would have to work. So I have a lifestyle like most of the UK I guess.
The women I meet I of course don't get crude there unless I have known them for a while and know they find it funny too.
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you're in your prime then!!!!
it's really difficult hunting Russian Fox without a large budget!
it means you'll have to be more clever than most!
it's easier some time, to get the prey to approach you
than you to find and approach them
have you tried getting some professional quality photos
and putting an add in VK?
I could help you write an appealing biography in Russian if you'd like
serious offer - my mom was born in the UK, so I happen to like you poor buggers
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I come from southern England, I'm 40 years old and live in a decent (not social housing) but not millionaire type of area. I earn the usual peasants wage like most of the rest of the UK. I can provide for a family so long as there is no extravagance in spending or in that case the women would have to work. So I have a lifestyle like most of the UK I guess.
I'd consider 40 to be prime age...but wait another 5-10 years and it is no longer prime.
Fathertime!
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OMG
A 'dating profile' on VK? - Get real, man !
It's guys like Trench that mean gals hide their profiles - they're fed up of being hit on.
Is Facebook a dating site ?
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I'd consider 40 to be prime age...but wait another 5-10 years and it is no longer prime.
What matters is what a lass that might fancy Trench thinks and her age / expectations
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nothing ventured...
nothing gained...
the idea is sound...
run a flag up the flag pole and see who salutes it, this is a pretty efficient way to see who likes your flag...
in the USA, before I went to Ukraine, I tried some 'dating' sites and I got a lot of dates this way...
unfortunately, in Silicon Valley, my "worth" in the dating market, wouldn't allow me to date younger women
I really didn't like women my own age then (40 like you) as a girl friend
but silicon valley had the worse female/male ration in the USA
multi-millionaire's on every corner, so being "modestly" wealthy meant absolutely nothing there
when I first went to Ukraine in 1996, hardly any foreigners then
some of the women I met were "enthralled" by being with a Westerner
all to my advantage...
it makes sense to try as many different ways as possible, what didn't work for someone else
might work for you, because of this phenomenon called "luck"
finding your life partner is one of the most important things you will ever do...
put your best effort into it
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msmob
there’s always some bad in good people,
perhaps even in you...
the thing about Trench is
at least he is honest and forthright about himself
not a common quality on this board
not all of us are wealthy
or have a devilishly handsome grin AND a strong jaw line
we each have to play the hand we were dealt
do you really want to criticize someone
because he got a dealt a bad hand?
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OMG
A 'dating profile' on VK? - Get real, man !
It's guys like Trench that mean gals hide their profiles - they're fed up of being hit on.
Is Facebook a dating site ?
No fb isnt a dating site.
Yet your analogy is a bit off as the huge majority of single people I know have met and date many people off of of it .
Its doubtful that isnt true of similar social media sites.
Yes I understand tinder etc are more popular for that type of thing,but it doesn't mean thousands of people dont find dates on fb or vk.
When single I could and did.
But I do agree it's not the best and takes a bit of just being actively social.
Which frankly is what TC needs to do locally.
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run a flag up the flag pole and see who salutes it, this is a pretty efficient way to see who likes your flag...
Nationalism seems like a very poor way to pick a partner if you ask me..
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That's not what he was talking about ...
Krimster loves a bit of inneundo
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Yet your analogy is a bit off as the huge majority of single people I know have met and date many people off of of it .
Its doubtful that isnt true if similar social media sites.
Perhaps I am speaking for ladies in their late thirties / forties who are fed up with VK being used as a dating site ?
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you're in your prime then!!!!
it's really difficult hunting Russian Fox without a large budget!
it means you'll have to be more clever than most!
it's easier some time, to get the prey to approach you
than you to find and approach them
have you tried getting some professional quality photos
and putting an add in VK?
I could help you write an appealing biography in Russian if you'd like
serious offer - my mom was born in the UK, so I happen to like you poor buggers
Well I appreciate your offer Krimster :) I'll PM you on this when I get time in the next few days or so if ok with you.
I have a VK profile but there is not exactly a lot happening on it at the moment. I've got a few girls on there who accepted being asked to my adding them through a similar interest. Basically I don't know them but I guess could attempt to strike up a conversation. I would have to Skype with them as they can be from different regions - so back to the same deal as before, essentially visit one, time input without knowing first if they are naturally into you.
I'm wondering how you would work it? Would you look for girls in a particular city so you could visit many? Try and connect with girls of people you actually know on there? etc.
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Trench
Take ONE piece of advice on board .... you must do what is 'best' for YOU ...
You are no Krimster on the confidence front. It is POINTLESS asking what he would do - it isn't you ... not matter how you wish it so..
IF you have added lasses some time ago on VK- they already lost interest in you - or will think they are plan Bs and Cs ..
Alternatively, they might think you are a daft western guy ready to open his wallet ? ....
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Perhaps I am speaking for ladies in their late thirties / forties who are fed up with VK being used as a dating site ?
Plenty on fb are fed up with it too?
My point was it doesn't stop fb ftom being a source of a pile of dates with those aged women for my single buddies .
I admit times change fast and other ways to meet dwarfed it quickly but they di still actively meet women that age off of it pretty much weekly.
Whether women are fed up , delete profiles etc doesnt change that ultimately it's a social site,many single women arnt on them to date,but then again really truly why are they there? To only share photos and thoughts with friends?
Lol. Pretty much the idea if social media broadcasting yourself to the entire world is to be umm.. social.
It's pretty obvious vk is indeed used quite a it for dating ,and being social is why many have a profile up,even if they might not readily admit it.
Yes there might also be many tired of being hit on, and really these are the same ones tired of being hit on in public.
Ah the crosses some of us must bear.
I do understand your point,and doubt it's a great resource for TC, but social media has gone hand in hand with being social,lol which always has a lot of dating involved be it a dance place, a concert, a back yard bbq with 20 friends ,or social media sites.Women get tired of being hit on at all of those too, yet the other percent of them there,went for that very reason.
If there is one single thing TC needs most ,it is to learn empathy and to be able to stand in the other persons shoes and see their side.
To do that,since it doesnt seem to come nsturally, he needs more social interaction,
He should chat up everyone within 50 kilometers ,in any means available.
Looking in the fsu is a crutch.
He will still be limping, butt take it away there is far greater chance to walk straight.?
:)
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Trench lol
Oh no you might have to skype or viber with an attractive woman!!
It might not be productive or cost effective!
You might never meet her,or it might not lead to marriage and children.
You poor lad !!! having such a heavy burden as chatting up a beautiful lass on viber must be taxing.
I hope it doesn't wear you down too much, or cut into your vibrant social calendar.
I'm not trying to be mean,I'm trying to snap you out of this mentality of *what do *i* TC get out of it?*
You need to relax, and learn to just simply enjoy interacting with an attractive member of the opposite sex.
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Whether women are fed up , delete profiles etc doesnt change that ultimately it's a social site,many single women arnt on them to date,but then again really truly why are they there? To only share photos and thoughts with friends?
The point of FB / VK is 'lost' on me and even single folk who want to be contacted by / contact FRIENDS.. That's people one really knows / knew ?
Personally speaking, many ladies I know on VK, Odnoklassniki, etc have friends only profiles, now - such is the volume of clueless w.guys who think registering a profile will get them dates ?;)
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The point of FB / VK is 'lost' on me and even single folk who want to be contacted by / contact FRIENDS.. That's people one really knows / knew ?
Personally speakin,g many ladies I know on VK, Odnoklassniki, etc have friend sonly profiles, now - such is the volume of clueless w.guys who think registering a profile will get them dates ?;)
I think it depends on the mentality of the person. I only use FB for family and on that it can be occasionally handy when other forms of communication become difficult or to show members of a family something all at once. Beyond that I rarely go on there, I have no time for labour intensively constantly clicking 'like' buttons and documentating my life photo by photo. Nor do I have any interest in airing any dirty washing to those that know me or have people request friendship just to be nosy or on seeing my life take issue with it or get jealous. Believe me, you take a holiday somewhere nice, stick up a pic of you enjoying yourself and that pic thend gets interpreted different ways, some people read too much into ithe and think you are libing the high life and get jealous.
Others on the other hand love connecting with all sorts of new people on there even if they start out as complete strangers. Problem for them I think is that not all people have the same outlook like those above. Some are just interested in family, freinds and aquaintances, others like said just nosy or bored, or get jealous, or out for a laugh, etc.
On VK U tend to find some are open abut connecting with strangers and do so, others give the ? 'Do I know you' type of response - they basically are closed to connecting with strangers on there or just don't fancy you. I'm guessing some guys they will give a different response to than others depending on of they fancy a guy or why they think he is contacting them. I think VK is a not as straight forward as dating sites but potentially may drum up better leads in the longer run.
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Trench,
use your interests or hobbies to help you meet people!
what potential shared interest could there be that you have a lot of knowledge about?
local history? old MG cars? surely there’s something?
and if there isn't, then this is the first thing you should do is to get some kind of "interest"
because this will make YOU interesting to the people with this interest!
see how that works!!
start there...
where do people with this interest go?
go there, some will be women....
alright Trench, I'm pointing you "right"
you need to go out and practice...
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The point of FB / VK is 'lost' on me and even single folk who want to be contacted by / contact FRIENDS.. That's people one really knows / knew ?
Personally speakin,g many ladies I know on VK, Odnoklassniki, etc have friend sonly profiles, now - such is the volume of clueless w.guys who think registering a profile will get them dates ?;)
I will say this again --VK & Ordnoklassniki are NOT dating sites -just like RWD is not.
Making unwanted contact is a no no no.
Those who keep advocating contacting girls that way are giving clueless advice .
Basically --it is intrusive --for all the same reasons a girl in a smaller city will not be parading some unknown western guy around guy town .
So please --those that have kept pushing it -please stop.
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Basically --it is intrusive --for all the same reasons a girl in a smaller city will not be parading some unknown western guy around guy town .
A girl wants to date a western guy but he is 'intruding' in her life if he wants to visit her home town?
Would sound to me like the girl is either unrealistic in what a relationship entails or she doesn't think that much of the guy.
Perhaps VK like meeting a girl in her home town some girls don't mind at all and some do. Might also depend on how she feels about the guy as much as her personality. If she feels that she may be hit on a guy who has made a request then she may be open to accepting the request than she might otherwise be is my thought on it.
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every hunter knows it's easier to have the prey come to you
than for you to go and track and stalk the prey
so tell me guys, what "lure" works for the ladies...
how do YOU "lure" them in
this is part one
the second part is, "where de ladies be at"?
so ya' take these two things combine em' and presto!!!
ya' still not followin' me?
let's say you're into art (obviously an interest we all share, right?)
so you dress like you're straight out of GQ and you spend saturdays at the local art museum
and you learn how to act and talk with a high degree of sophistication
you run this flag up the flag pole - and you look around and see if anyone's saluting
OK?
justa a simple hypothetical every variable can be substituted with anything
you know who taught me this - birds!
just watch what a male bird does, all he's tryin to do is to get the female's attention...
so fellas, whadda' ya think YOU gotta do to get the females attention?
and if you say" fluff up your tail feathers and walk around in a circle" you're wrong, but that's kinda what most of you are doing...
OK, dang it, since most of you REALLY aren't going to get this, and I was really hoping you'd figure out for yourselves, which would make it easier for you to accept
'ya really want to make the female birds notice 'ya
besides having some "flash"
be a "kind, sympatheic, caring person, a friend"
how hard is it for you to be that to someone?
now do you understand...
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On VK U tend to find some are open abut connecting with strangers and do so, others give the ? 'Do I know you' type of response - they basically are closed to connecting with strangers on there or just don't fancy you. I'm guessing some guys they will give a different response to than others depending on of they fancy a guy or why they think he is contacting them. I think VK is a not as straight forward as dating sites but potentially may drum up better leads in the longer run.
Says the guy who started a thread on if he should make a VK profile not too long ago...
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krimster, your analogies go over his head...he can't gleam the nuggets of wisdom from it.
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his flag pole is probably pointing upside down if you catch my drift...
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The point of FB / VK is 'lost' on me and even single folk who want to be contacted by / contact FRIENDS.. That's people one really knows / knew ?
Personally speaking, many ladies I know on VK, Odnoklassniki, etc have friends only profiles, now - such is the volume of clueless w.guys who think registering a profile will get them dates ?;)
You know I don't advocate either as dating sites,they are far surpassed by other sites more geared towards that. I'v already stated that.
But they are social media sites and just because some men or women don't want contact from anyone they do not already know personally, the whole premise would not be even remotely as popular as it is, if the majority did not want others to see,notice,read, and indeed interact with them.
Try posting in a forum where noone ever replies and see how long the site lasts.
You and jay can have your old guys opinion about it, I'm old too.
But to think millions of dates havnt sprung out of interaction on those sites, because you know quite a few people who don't enjoy being contacted ,hide their profiles etc , is a tad funny as well.
Intrusive?
Dear Lord.lol
What our society has become. I do so hope those people find their safe places.!
If a woman is at a singles bar and is approached ,its intrusive to some degree even if she was there to be approached. !
So what?
If she puts a profile on a world wide website designated solely to interact with ,people ,
well let's say world wide..
its intrusive to be contacted by anyone ?
How burdensome it most be to just not reply ,or delete a message.
The crosses we all must bear!
I mean sharing with family and friends only is not so very difficult is it now? I'm quite sure they can manage.
If you truly believe social media internet sites,of all things, would function viably solely off people only interacting with he circle of people they already know, then I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.
Yes that's a big part of the sites anymore, and I agree they arnt dating sites.
But they function because many people do want to interact with people they do not know yet.and not only online interaction , people date off them daily.
I'll repeat I'm not advocating them as a great place to get a date,but plenty of single people do date from there, despite your ,and *many womens* misgivings.
But just think if we only interacted here with people we knew in person.And while certainly no dating site,how many people have met and dated from here? Certainly a few.
I'd cast as wide a new as possible if I were TC.
I'd use the good dating sites, as you e recommended, and I'd use viber and Skype to communicate and sort things out.
I'd be gasp* ! intrusive* and just talk to strangers at the market, on the train,at the bus stop , and yes even on social media.
No I wouldn't doggedly pursue strangers on fb or vk.. thats silly ,we agree on that point.
.But I sure would have a fb, and have interests in russian language groups, and locations, etc, etc etc.
and I sure wouldnt turn down friend requests from FSU women from such groups , or other friends circle of contacts.
I used to get them,and .often, and no not all were scammers.very very few were.
one very beautiful and intelligent fsu woman in particular lived somewhat near me at the time, which was cool ,back in Russia at this time, and yet still a couple guys from here have met her in person there. I met and dated several fsu women from the USA, who contacted me on fb or vk either out of the blue ,or thru a wide circle of online aquantences. To completely ignore it just limits things.
He needs as much luck and help as he can generate,and mostly a stronger sense of empathy and more,more ,and a I repeat more interaction of almost any kind with people he doesnt already know.
Just one random opinion though,
from someone that does wish the best of luck for him.
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AJ -- without trying to argue every point --- if a guy is in 20's and similar age to a girl -- I can see how that can work ( maybe !)
But is a guy is closer to twice a girls age -- reference my previous comments.
There are no hard and fast rules to any of this -- but having some sensitivity and empathy for others is a decent starting point.
The issue is about appropriate attention in the appropriate place -- because a girl puts a profile on a dating site does not mean it is appropriate for a guy to show up on her doorstep or at her work ie in an inappropriate part of her life .
I would never consider doing that at home and to me - I can only see it the same anywhere.
Additionally --I have heard many horror stories from girls about unwanted attention and guys that disrupt lives. One situation where the girls family and friends were threatened by an Italian guy -- and I mean serious threats .
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Sure, it's all about context, we agree.