Coronavirus, how are you preparing for it and how it is affecting you so far?

[BillyB]

There are late night commercials telling people they are entitled to compensation if they took certain medications in the past. These medications have been through years of vigorous clinical trials and after 5 or 10 years, they say "Whoops! We messed up and those drugs are actually dangerous to the human body."

I'm all for doctors being allowed to give drugs in emergency situations but they disagree with what drug to give to a person as a last resort. Some will choose HCQ and others will choose something else. Why? Because there is no evidence whatever they're using is a safe and effective treatment for someone diagnosed with COVID-19. NOTHING. It's a matter of opinion. I can find a doctor and someone on Fox News that will say they know a safe and effective treatment but it doesn't make it true. There has never been a safe and effective treatment found for ANY coronavirus in history. To think they are going to magically find something sitting in their medicine cabinet is nuts. Every medicine we have has been designed for something else. There is no medicine designed to fight a coronavirus. They've tried before such as on SARS and MERS and they've failed.

Same with vaccines. No vaccines ever been found for a coronavirus. Governments are under great pressure to deliver results so there will be rush to deliver. Standard procedures for testing safety and effectiveness will be throw out the window. If a vaccine is invented, most likely it will not be effective for 100% of the people. They can't even get the test kits right and those are easier to create than a vaccine. Who knows? After we all get our shots, 5 years from now we may be entitled to some compensation because we're all F'd up. By the time we split the money from the government and court approved settlement, we'll each get $6.92 and have to live with Joe Biden disease for the rest of our lives.

[calmissile]

There are late night commercials telling people they are entitled to compensation if they took certain medications in the past. These medications have been through years of vigorous clinical trials and after 5 or 10 years, they say "Whoops! We messed up and those drugs are actually dangerous to the human body."

It appears you are contradicting yourself.  You indicate that laying on your potential death bed you will not take a drug that has not been 'proven' in clinical trials.  At the same time you are telling us that there are many lawsuits and awards to people because the clinical trials were flawed.

I'm all for doctors being allowed to give drugs in emergency situations but they disagree with what drug to give to a person as a last resort. Some will choose HCQ and others will choose something else. Why?  Because there is no evidence whatever they're using is a safe and effective treatment for someone diagnosed with COVID-19.

This is simply not true.  There are multiple doctors and recovered patients that have offered evidence that HCQ allowed the patients to recover in record times.  In some cases the doctors indicated that the early use of HCQ prevented the virus from getting more severe and resulted in avoiding the use of ventilators and oxygen.

The negative side effects of HCQ are well known and doctors would not likely prescribe it to patients with a high risk of side effects.

NOTHING. It's a matter of opinion. I can find a doctor and someone on Fox News that will say they know a safe and effective treatment but it doesn't make it true. There has never been a safe and effective treatment found for ANY coronavirus in history. To think they are going to magically find something sitting in their medicine cabinet is nuts.

It is your statement that is nuts!  Most of us have medications in our medicine cabinet that are used to treat different ailments.

Every medicine we have has been designed for something else. There is no medicine designed to fight a coronavirus. They've tried before such as on SARS and MERS and they've failed.

According to Dr. Fauci, the reason that there were no vaccines for some viruses is because the virus disappeared before clinical trials could be completed.

Same with vaccines. No vaccines ever been found for a coronavirus. Governments are under great pressure to deliver results so there will be rush to deliver. Standard procedures for testing safety and effectiveness will be throw out the window. If a vaccine is invented, most likely it will not be effective for 100% of the people. They can't even get the test kits right and those are easier to create than a vaccine. Who knows? After we all get our shots, 5 years from now we may be entitled to some compensation because we're all F'd up. By the time we split the money from the government and court approved settlement, we'll each get $6.92 and have to live with Joe Biden disease for the rest of our lives.

So now you don't want us to have any confidence that our academics and labs can come up with a safe vaccine?

[Faux Pas]

Yes, I did.  The rate of death in HC taking patients was more than double that of patients with no treatment.

Then you didn't read it because that is a lie

I responded to what you posted.  If it's irrelevant, then your post was.

Yeah well, that post wasn't directed to you

Were they actually censored, you wouldn't know that physicians are using HC and claiming excellent results.  As I noted previously, there are also physicians claiming megadoses of Vitamin C make a huge difference.  There are some claiming Vitamin D dosages make a difference.  There are others claiming giving metformin to patients has given excellent results.  But none of those have been yet clinically proven to make a difference.

You should Google more

This post was composed without the aid of google.

Yeah right

[BillyB]

You indicate that laying on your potential death bed you will not take a drug that has not been 'proven' in clinical trials.

I never implied that. I explained clearly what HCQ does to the immune system. It suppresses it. Some people die because their immune system is too weak and COVID-19 wins. Some people die because their immune system went into overdrive creating so many antibodies that the antibodies are killing organs too. If on my death bed and the doctor says I'm dying because my immune system is in overdrive, I'd give permission for HCQ. If I'm dying because my immune system is too weak, I'd refuse HCQ. Most people who are on the HCQ bandwagon have no idea what it does and what the side effects are so they are more likely to make uneducated decisions. Trump went silent on HCQ. That should speak volumes to people here but apparently we are still talking HCQ when Remdesivir is now the drug of the month.

This is simply not true.  There are multiple doctors and recovered patients that have offered evidence that HCQ allowed the patients to recover in record times.  In some cases the doctors indicated that the early use of HCQ prevented the virus from getting more severe and resulted in avoiding the use of ventilators and oxygen.

Those are opinions. The dead, unfortunately can't offer their opinion. You read a few articles to formulate your opinion. Two early studies warn against HCQ. When a patient is in the hospital, doctors are doing a variety of things to help the patient. If the patient recovers, who's to say it wasn't something else that help the patient? Who's to say the patient's own immune system got the upper hand and defeated the virus itself? That's why we do studies to understand these things.

The negative side effects of HCQ are well known and doctors would not likely prescribe it to patients with a high risk of side effects.

Doctors know how to prescribe HCQ to people with malaria and lupus. They are entering the unknown when treating COVID-19 which the drug isn't designed for.

According to Dr. Fauci, the reason that there were no vaccines for some viruses is because the virus disappeared before clinical trials could be completed.

He's doing what he is supposed to do and that is give people hope so they don't panic. Panic kills. Some viruses in history have disappeared. Flu viruses, one being the Spanish Flu disappeared after a few years but we are dealing with a coronavirus that does not disappear without human intervention. SARS and MERS and your common cold viruses do not disappear. We do not need to take action against cold viruses because they cause us no harm. Action was taken against SARS and MERS to stop the spread. Early studies say SARS-COV-2 is taking 11-12 years off the average lifespan of humans. Forget about treatments. Without immunity and without a vaccine the cause of death of most of us will eventually be COVID-19.

So now you don't want us to have any confidence that our academics and labs can come up with a safe vaccine?

When the first wheel was invented, do you think it could win the Indianapolis 500? Don't expect the first vaccine ever created for a coronavirus to be perfect. It may not work perfect and it might actually harm a few people but as long as they believe it saves more lives than harm, it will be acceptable. There are times where vaccines and medicines were recalled. I hope that doesn't happen to the vaccine(s) they are planning to give to everybody in the world. I'm not going to be first in line for a vaccine. I'm fairly healthy compared to most people my age. For some time I will observe the effects on the first batch of people to get their shots. It'll be hard to filter out the BS from media, doctors, and people who claim the shots are the cats meow. There may be a number of vaccines floating around. When the dust settles, I'll go for the one that is determined most effective and safe.

[msmob]

I didn't call it a cure. I said it was a treatment that doctors are using and claiming excellent results yet they get censored

If making bogus, misleading claims that get sheeple worked up in these bizarre times, removing their bollox is no bad thing .. 

[Boethius]

Doctor Boe, please provide your evidence that it is because of isolation.

As I recall, prior to the lockdown of the schools, the young were intermingled with the rest of the age groups that were spreading the virus.

There are reports of debilitating strokes in COVID-19 patients under age 45.  They weren't in an age group with a "foot in the grave".  Now, think about the cost to society in treating victims with strokes so severe, they are usually seen in people over age 75.  That's without even accounting for human impacts, just medical over the life of the stroke patient.


COVID-19 has killed more people (over 313,000 in 8 months, assuming a first infection in October 2019, and that's with isolation) than SARS and MERS combined (1632 over 7 years), as it is far more infectious.  If people think that would have zero impact on the economy (i.e., if it were just allowed to run its course), they are dreaming. 


This post was composed without the aid of google.

[Shadow]

Don't expect the first vaccine ever created for a coronavirus to be perfect. It may not work perfect and it might actually harm a few people but as long as they believe it saves more lives than harm, it will be acceptable.

That is NOT how medicine works. IF any vaccin or medication will be released t will not be a matter of it might kill you or heal you.Remember that a success rate of 95% is equal to nothing. This means any medication or vaccin should at least reach a 99,5% succes rate to be acceptable. And to test that is not easy, which is why it takes time.In the mean time, snake oil sales men and woo supplers will have a field day as over 90% of people using their product recover.

[BC]

Shadow,

I would think slightly lower than 95% effectiveness would be ok for a start as long as it is proven 100% safe AND vaccination of everyone is mandatory.  Anti-vax folks will riot of course in the USA.

The ideal would be to combine with normal influenza vaccinations and kill two birds with one stone.  Granted influenza vaccines are not as effective due to different strains/mutations but still if mandatory would save a lot of folks that nowadays don't get vaccinated.

There will be more problems in the US as by then Covid will likely be running riot.  Except for UK and a couple others the fire will hopefully stay at very low level embers, still being tracked and isolated along with mass antibody testing that may reduce the requirement of vaccinating everyone the first time if antibodies persist for a reasonable period of time..

I am absolutely dumfounded how so many opportunities were and still are being missed in my country of birth.

Below instructions for our second phase beginning tomorrow.

[Faux Pas]

If making bogus, misleading claims that get sheeple worked up in these bizarre times, removing their bollox is no bad thing ..

No surprise coming from you. You are wrong about everything all the time. Censorship is always a "bad thing"

[Faux Pas]

Shadow,

I would think slightly lower than 95% effectiveness would be ok for a start as long as it is proven 100% safe AND vaccination of everyone is mandatory.  Anti-vax folks will riot of course in the USA.

Whoa, I don't even like the way that sounds. No vaccine has been proven 100% safe afaik, ever. If that were the requirement we wouldn't be using vaccines for polio, rubella and a host of others even now. I never had a flu shot until I was 50 years old and only then because my doctor strongly suggested it because of my age. Mandatory vaccinations is a violation of our liberties. That's New World Order thinking there friend

The ideal would be to combine with normal influenza vaccinations and kill two birds with one stone.  Granted influenza vaccines are not as effective due to different strains/mutations but still if mandatory would save a lot of folks that nowadays don't get vaccinated.

And a lot of other things could be included too, with or without your knowledge

I am absolutely dumfounded how so many opportunities were and still are being missed in my country of birth.

Such as?

[Shadow]

Shadow,

I would think slightly lower than 95% effectiveness would be ok for a start as long as it is proven 100% safe AND vaccination of everyone is mandatory.  Anti-vax folks will riot of course in the USA.

As 95% is about the usual survival rate (though it could be anything from 90% to 97%) a vaccine that has a clinical survival rate of 95% is equal to nothing. Survival rate of a vaccine should be clearly better than no treatment.
I am very happy my kids have their full program of vaccination, which has protected them from a smallpox and rubella outbreak locally.

Unfortunately the number of people believe that vaccination is not needed because they have caused the disease to be rare is too high for comfort.
By the way I never took a flu shot. Prefer to get my flu in the wild

[msmob]

No surprise coming from you. You are wrong about everything all the time. Censorship is always a "bad thing"

Removal of bollox that harms heath isn't censorship - it's protection .. and these are not normal times and ( as usual ) your filters are misaligned )

[msmob]

Ah yes, eliminate all dissent to your opinion. No doubt you would've been a jack booted thug for Hitler and the Bolsheviks

The posting of misleading and inaccurate bollox re the

1/ efficacy of meds for use in totally unproven circumstances

and

2/ '5G masts are dangerous and should be destroyed' is something normal folks think is 'OK' ?

[Gator]

As 95% is about the usual survival rate (though it could be anything from 90% to 97%) a vaccine that has a clinical survival rate of 95% is equal to nothing.

Disagree that is "equal to nothing."  In fact a totally vaccinated population at a reasonable vaccine effectiveness should essentially eliminate the disease spread, maybe eventually eradicate the disease.
 
I don't know how you derived the 95% survival rate for a vaccine.   The ultimate goal of a vaccine is to provide immunity to the vaccinated.  Most vaccines provide at least 90% immunity.  This means 90% fewer infections, 90% fewer hospitalizations, and 90% fewer deaths.  That's not nothing! 
 

Prefer to get my flu in the wild

Without a vaccine, you have a 80-85% chance of eventually becoming infected with COVID-19.   Hiding under your bed will not prevent becoming infected, as it is shown a majority of the new cases are happening to people following lockdown procedures. 

[Shadow]

Disagree that is "equal to nothing."  In fact a totally vaccinated population at a reasonable vaccine effectiveness should essentially eliminate the disease spread, maybe eventually eradicate the disease.
 
I don't know how you derived the 95% survival rate for a vaccine.   The ultimate goal of a vaccine is to provide immunity to the vaccinated.  Most vaccines provide at least 90% immunity.  This means 90% fewer infections, 90% fewer hospitalizations, and 90% fewer deaths.  That's not nothing! 
 

We are talking about a different thing. A vaccin that stops 95% of caes is not the same as a vccin that offers a 95% survival rate for those infected.Any vaccin should either resist infection or increase survival rate of those infected to higher than not using any medicin.

Without a vaccine, you have a 80-85% chance of eventually becoming infected with COVID-19.   Hiding under your bed will not prevent becoming infected, as it is shown a majority of the new cases are happening to people following lockdown procedures.

When the majority of people follow lockdown that is not surprising.

[GQBlues]

RWD’s Sunday morning funnies!

You mean coming to RWD and telling everyone what is wrong with world, what this virus is doing to my life and arguing with irrelevant people on an irrelevant forum??? Is that what you think I am doing?

Think? Read your posts DUDE. You are complaining about people who complain exactly like you do! LMAO!

I am hoping good health to all, trying to understand facts( which there are few here)of virus and watching 'grown' men arguing over who is 'right' and who is 'wrong' !!!!

Ahhh! Yes! Spoken as though unlike you, of course, who holds Darwin’s Secrets of Life in the palm of your hands. Sounds good to me, bruddah! Just don’t expect a dollar bill coming from me, OK?

Since you 'asked', I have been helping with my local hospital, the sheriff dept. and some local officials.

I didn't really 'asked' that. But since you're so desperate for a meager attention, you couldn't resist to feed the board with some BS. LMAO! Were you helping the sisters of mercy, too? You could at least be a little original man.

Anyway, once you’re through with these, let me know. I have something else for you to do! What a howler! You’re stuck home alone with no one to play then come here spread BS.

So which one are you, GQB?

I'm your Batman!

Smart man GQB!!!

And like most relationships threads here, they'll get a few looks , maybe a post and fade.

If I start one about politics or now the virus, I'll get 50 pages and 1000 post in a few weeks!!

See what I mean? Freaking complaining again. Since we know you hate complainers, you must hate yourself, dude. LMAO. Lockdowns must drive yourself nuts stuck in a house for days by yourself. How do you ever deal with that?

It’s little wonder you’d like to come to RWD and hoping upon hope you can have someone to discuss dating and relationships with young women from poor countries 20-30 years your junior. Things have changed quite a bit here, LAman.

Otherwise, you don't like to have to read any of the thread, don't! This is really VERY simple.

[Faux Pas]

Disagree that is "equal to nothing."  In fact a totally vaccinated population at a reasonable vaccine effectiveness should essentially eliminate the disease spread, maybe eventually eradicate the disease.

But it doesn't. In the early 2000's Rotary International set out to eradicate polio sending medical teams across the globe not only to every outbreak but to immunize every possible outbreak from all possible models. They even claimed eradication at one point and it appeared to have worked. Now polio is back and on the rise
 
The human race has been in a battle with microbes since the beginning of time and the only unprecedented difference is the reaction to this one

[msmob]

So say you. Silence everyone who might disagree. As per usual Moobs is wrong

In BOTH cases, I most certainly DO know better than you

1/ You'll only have heard about HCQ in the last 4 months ..

2/ mmWaves in the freq range used by 5G have been around for 3 generations .. In the US they've been used in point-to-point mw links and satellite transmission

5G masts are low powered and won't penetrate trees and foliage like, say 2.4GigaHertz.... so where were the loonies protesting about WiFi and Bluetooth, sat tv, and scanners in airports ?


Google ain't your friend ..

Still you'll have 'Confederate' on your side ... that MUST be 'reassuring' ..


 

[Confederate]

In BOTH cases, I most certainly DO know better than you

1/ You'll only have heard about HCQ in the last 4 months ..

2/ mmWaves in the freq range used by 5G have been around for 3 generations .. In the US they've been used in point-to-point mw links and satellite transmission

5G masts are low powered and won't penetrate trees and foliage like, say 2.4GigaHertz.... so where were the loonies protesting about WiFi and Bluetooth, sat tv, and scanners in airports ?


Google ain't your friend ..

Still you'll have 'Confederate' on your side ... that MUST be 'reassuring' ..

Says the lonely “jack booted thug” w/ herpes from mum’s basement.

[Faux Pas]

In BOTH cases, I most certainly DO know better than you

No you don't. Both cases of what? You are a champion of censorship. Do stay on topic or STFU
 

1/ You'll only have heard about HCQ in the last 4 months ..

Another lie from the mouth of Moobs. You might not be the only Gobshite that knew someone with lupus

2/ mmWaves in the freq range used by 5G have been around for 3 generations .. In the US they've been used in point-to-point mw links and satellite transmission

5G masts are low powered and won't penetrate trees and foliage like, say 2.4GigaHertz.... so where were the loonies protesting about WiFi and Bluetooth, sat tv, and scanners in airports ?


Google ain't your friend ..

Back to the Moobs moronic behavior of strawman construction. Please do point out where I posted one thing about mmWaves or 5G masts. Take your time, Ill wait

Still you'll have 'Confederate' on your side ... that MUST be 'reassuring' ..

Confederate owns you worse than Trench. That must be very comforting to you

 

[GQBlues]

I'm all for doctors being allowed to give drugs in emergency situations but they disagree with what drug to give to a person as a last resort. Some will choose HCQ and others will choose something else. Why? Because there is no evidence whatever they're using is a safe and effective treatment for someone diagnosed with COVID-19. NOTHING. It's a matter of opinion.

You're so full of croc! It's unnerving. So all doctors are wrong because whatever they use, nothing works!

Then why the hell did we ever even bother hospitalizing any of these people if these doctors have no clue what they're doing other than disagree amongst each other! They didn't know to just to email you for the answers because YOU know? Hell, last we went through an exercise you had problems with simple arithmetic.

If it's a matter of 'opinion', why is yours so valid over others?

When the first wheel was invented, do you think it could win the Indianapolis 500?

What a brilliant metaphor! Explains a lot!

Don't expect the first vaccine ever created for a coronavirus to be perfect. It may not work perfect and it might actually harm a few people but as long as they believe it saves more lives than harm, it will be acceptable.

There's the silly and wild statement again. Will you be so kindly grace us a bit of your knowledge and be a bit 'more' precise. What realm of acceptability are YOU talking about before it is deemed 'ready' Marcus MD? 49 dead, but saved 51 can actually fit into your statement above. Ok, maybe best stay away from calculations and numbers. how about simply elaborating on that statement above?

 

I never implied that. I explained clearly what HCQ does to the immune system. It suppresses it. Some people die because their immune system is too weak and COVID-19 wins. Some people die because their immune system went into overdrive creating so many antibodies that the antibodies are killing organs too. If on my death bed and the doctor says I'm dying because my immune system is in overdrive, I'd give permission for HCQ. If I'm dying because my immune system is too weak, I'd refuse HCQ. Most people who are on the HCQ bandwagon have no idea what it does and what the side effects are so they are more likely to make uneducated decisions. Trump went silent on HCQ. That should speak volumes to people here but apparently we are still talking HCQ when Remdesivir is now the drug of the month.

It amazes me how you wildly swing your conviction/opinions based on your time surfing the internet. Then when in doubt, you subtly cover both sides of the argument to appear ‘smart’. Are you even understanding what you think you know? On one side of your mouth, you say according to the internet HCQ doesn’t work against COVID, yet open to it if the doctor tells you it can work while at your death bed. LMAO!

HCQ should only be used at the early stages of infection. Why? Because like its use for Lupus, which you already cited, it’s an immunity suppressant. An overly reactive autoimmune systems play a major part in the fatality cases with COVID and other disease and illnesses because it attacks even the healthy cells and causing more harm than good..

So under that very methodology why do YOU think it cannot work on COVID patients again? I asked this question before to answer it yes or no. Instead, like msmoby, you deflect and obfuscate.

Your conviction is much too inconsistent to be believed. Internet will do that to you. Look at what you’re posting..

There’s no such thing as a vaccine that’s 100% ‘safe’ and not cause any harm. And for you to be peddling some BS that you won’t try it unless it’s proven to be 100% safe is BS. It flies in the face of you peddling having your household don N95 mask at a time when the experts were saying it doesn’t help, and there’s no proof it stops the virus spread. Now here you are being a disciple to the same ‘experts to bank your beliefs. For starters, N95 mask is NOT 100% safe.

From the onset of this viral saga, follow everything Dr Fauci have said from the very beginning. The dude is guessing along with everyone else – albeit scientifically - but basically having the same result. In short, he’s just as clueless as the sheep he’s herding.

[Gator]

We are talking about a different thing. A vaccin that stops 95% of caes is not the same as a vccin that offers a 95% survival rate for those infected.

No shit!  So what were you talking in the following?

As 95% is about the usual survival rate (though it could be anything from 90% to 97%) a vaccine that has a clinical survival rate of 95% is equal to nothing.

Why is it nothing? 

When the majority of people follow lockdown that is not surprising.

Yes, but take it to the next step.  Why is the infection rate about the same whether a person follows or disregards lockdown policies?

 

[msmob]

Says the lonely “jack booted thug” w/ herpes from mum’s basement.

Ah, so now I'm a 'Nazi' for mocking your 'truths'   

Again. there is no basement and if only Mum would live with us and allow us to live near the Med and sit by the pool at the villa in Cyprus ..

'Confederate' ALWAYS resorts to 'insults' when he is busted ... which happens .. rather a lot ..  a bit like his 'nick' .. he chose the side with no morals and the losers 

[Gator]

If people think that would have zero impact on the economy (i.e., if it were just allowed to run its course), they are dreaming. 

Only an idiot believes this. 

Reopening will in fact result in more cases of infection, maybe even exponential increases in some locales, requiring adjustments in reopening policies.  Nevertheless, the economy will improve. However, we all must accept it will take a long time for the economy to return to something close to normal. 

OTOH if we stay in lockdown it is certain the economy will continue to deteriorate, and not long before reaching devastating  levels.   Many people feel economically devastated now.   

[Confederate]

Ah, so now I'm a 'Nazi' for mocking your 'truths'   

Again. there is no basement and if only Mum would live with us and allow us to live near the Med and sit by the pool at the villa in Cyprus ..

'Confederate' ALWAYS resorts to 'insults' when he is busted ... which happens .. rather a lot ..  a bit like his 'nick' .. he chose the side with no morals and the losers 

Ah yes, another bullshyte reply from Mr Diarrhea of the mouth and brain.

Go ahead and attempt to discredit your superiors by attempting to label them with the “conspiracy theorist” tag. Apparently you’re surprised when others respond.

Go ahead and post some more desperate photos of your latest victim, stuck in Russia, you know you want to!!

 

A Confederate is a man who believes in local governance and freedom from tyranny, both in thoughts but especially against centralized tyranny. But by all means, continue to post your piss ant opinions, disguised as authority!!