Economics is a factor too

[Gator]

I guess Van caught the bus and left town.
 
 
This comment caught my eye:
 

No idea of social security schemes in the USA but in Australia someone on minimum wage gets BIG government benefits that would bring them up to equal with an income circa $55k.

There is a mistake somewhere.  Either the number 55K is wrong or you meant to say Greece rather than Australia.  I know that the Oz economy is doing well selling natural resources to the booming Asian economies.  However, this seems too much.  Someone on the government dole in the US would need to have many illegitimate children to be paid that much. 

[nicknick]

This comment caught my eye:
 
There is a mistake somewhere.  Either the number 55K is wrong or you meant to say Greece rather than Australia.  I know that the Oz economy is doing well selling natural resources to the booming Asian economies.  However, this seems too much.  Someone on the government dole in the US would need to have many illegitimate children to be paid that much.

I would agree with you that those figures are probably not correct.  However, Kuna is actually talking about benefits given to those on minimum wage rather than those without work as you refer to above.

I don't know about Australia, but  I can give you the comparable figures for the UK.

A single person in the UK working 40 hours a week on the minimum wage of £5.93 per hour will earn £12,334 per year - or 19,735 USD for the Yanks reading this.

A single person will also be entitled to £220 in benefits called 'working tax credits' and also, typically, £1,500 help towards their rent, called 'housing benefit' - this will be higher in London.


To take a more extreme example.  A couple with the husband working on minimum wage and the wife staying at home looking after two children under the age of three.

They would get £6,800 a year in 'housing benefit;' to help with their rent and get further benefits of £6,000 a year called 'child tax credits' and 'working tax credits'.

This would give them a total income of 12334 + 6800 +6000 = £24,334

Converting this to AUD gives a total income of approx 37,000 AUD - some way short of the 55k figure that Kuna gives for Australia.


It may well be that Australia is a lot more genorous than the Uk - but I doubt it somehow.

[Kuna]

My rough numbers based on a couple with 2 children.

It's complicated... and we're way out of the range of any govt benefits so we don't keep up to date on it... but here's a quick rundown:

If you earn less than $46,355 per year you get Family Tax Benefit A which is:

For each child	Per fortnight	Per year
Under 13 years	$164.64	$5,018.75
13–15 years	$214.06	$6,307.20
16–17 years	$52.64	$2,098.75
18–24 years	$70.56	$2,565.95

I think low income earners also get Family Tax Benefit B as well (which never used to have an income test - but it does now - >$150,000 for a single income family and you get $0):

Age of youngest child	Each fortnight	Each year
Under 5 years	$140	$4,004.05*
5–15 years (or 16–18 years if a full-time student)	$97.58	$2,898.10*

PLUS...  they get a Family Tax benefit "Supplement" at Tax Return time:

For the 2010-11 financial year	Amount
Family Tax Benefit Part A supplement	up to $726.35 per child
Family Tax Benefit Part B supplement	up to $354.05 per family

PLUS Rent Subsidy for Low income renters:

Family situation	Maximum payment per fortnight
Single, 1 or 2 children	$136.78

Low income earners have subsidised childcare:
Childcare "benefit" is $136 per week

PLUS Child Care "Rebate" is:

Financial year	Maximum rebate
2011/12	$7,500 (subject to the passage of legislation)

So... adding that up for a family with 2 children:
Income     $46,000

Tax Benefit A $8,528

Tax Benefit B $ $4004

Family Tax Benefit Supplement $1,400

Rent Assistance $3,500

Child Care Benefit $3,536

Child Care Rebate $7,500

Total equivalent income including handouts:  >$74,000

If you take out the childcare and assume one parent is at home looking after the kids: >$63,000

But wait... there's more!
They also get $5,437 per child in the Baby Bonus...

... and of course low income earners in Australia get free healthcare.

[Gator]

Golly!  Those are large numbers.    Shhhh!  Don't tell Obama about this.  America already has a huge deficit without expanding welfare. 
 
Evidently the percentage of the population receiving this is small; otherwise, Oz would soon be talking like Greece.
 
Welfare in the US is administered by the states and not the federal government, yet the feds pay for it (flat rate based on population).  So it varies from state to state.  I know little about it but I don't think a person on welfare receives anywhere near what you give in Australia.   In America it is perceived as helping those in need yet most white people consider it a disincentive to work and sociologists say it perpetuates negative racial stereotypes.  In other words - it is far from perfect.