Economist article disects Russian-Soviet character

[Tristan]

I was impressed with the breadth of this article in the Economist in its December 10, 2011 issue.  The title and subtitle are:
 
THE LONG LIFE OF HOMO SOVIETICUS
This week's elections and upheavels in Russian show how hard it is, 20 years after the system collapsed, for the country to put away its Soviet past
 
The comments are also worth reading if you have interest in this subject.
 
http://www.economist.com/node/21541444

[mendeleyev]

+1

[Muzh]

Oh boy. I'm sorry.
 
I posted the same under the Presidential Candidates thread.
 
 

[mendeleyev]

Muzh, you are a bad boy! 

But happy new year anyway (to you that is, as we don't wish to risk superstition by greeting your RW too early.) 

[SFandEE]

Thanks for posting.  Saw the magazine in bookstores, but hadn't taken the chance to read the article.  In spite of the ongoing economic challenges and desire for strong central leadership in the FSU related in the article, one thing is clear to me.  I'll never listen to anyone again who tries to convince me that Russians are my enemy.

[Muzh]

Muzh, you are a bad boy! 

But happy new year anyway (to you that is, as we don't wish to risk superstition by greeting your RW too early.) 

 
Thanks Jim. Likewise.   

[chivo]

TWENTY years to the month since the Soviet Union fell apart, crowds of angry young people have taken to the streets of Moscow, protesting against the ruling United Russia Party (“the party of crooks and thieves”) and chanting “Russia without Putin!” Hundreds have been detained, and the army has been brought into the centre of Moscow “to provide security”.
 
This is the start of the article. All I have to say is...
 
Really?
 
An old acquaintance emailed me the night before the protest last week and I asked her to meet me in the center not knowing anything about what was happening. We happened upon the rally outside Mayakovskaya Metro and didn't see any Russian Army, but did walk right into the protest as one couldn't help but be in the middle of it just by exiting the metro. It was the main protest BTW and yes OMAN and the riot police were there. Actually outnumbered the protestors that evening.
 
What they were chanting was "победа...для России" (victory for Russia). But I was only around for maybe 10 minutes as my friend started to get nervous and we continued on our way.
 
I did see them detain a couple of guys but that was about it. I and my friend had dinner at the Starlight Diner and the protest was over by the time we left without a trace of what had occured earlier except for a few police hanging around shooting the breeze.
 
To be fair, overall the article had some good moments, but again the Economist tends to lean toward its anti-Russian ways.  People, don't believe everything you read. And when it comes to the Economist, do yourself a favor, take it with a grain of salt.
 
Oh and that survey they had in the article about Russia was taken by the Pew Global Attitudes Project a Wahington based "fact tank". Gee, thanks for that unbiased survey 

[Muzh]

I hope she is not lying. Or maybe it was Limonov's "parade" that you saw.
 
 
We, the Middle Class, Are Not Revolutionaries
 
  By Yulia Latynina     
 
Other Russia leader Eduard Limonov wrote in on his LiveJournal blog: "If the bourgeois leaders had not led the tens of thousands of angry citizens from the center of town, that evening they could have been in the State Duma or Central Elections Commission."
 
That is, according to Limonov, the protesters should have violently stormed and seized the State Duma.
 
My question is, "Who, according to Limonov, should have taken the Duma? Me, for example? Or perhaps journalist Leonid Parfyonov or writer Boris Akunin, together with their wives and children, whom we met an hour before the rally?
 
I attended the rally as an ordinary participant, and I saw what type of crowd it was. With the exception of a few flag-waving groups of professional revolutionaries, 80 percent of those present were young, educated white-collar managers. In other words, it was Russia's "Third Estate" — a bourgeois crowd.

     The political fringe did not attend the demonstration because they will not go anywhere without a bribe of at least 100 rubles, and for 100 rubles they would even support Vasily Yakemenko, head of the Federal Agency for Youth Affairs.
 
The pensioners did not join in because they only protest issues like the monetization of benefits, not the falsification of election results.
 
Since those who did show up at the demonstration had a head on their shoulders, they had no intention of seizing the State Duma simply to satisfy Limonov.
 
If Limonov thinks an opportunity was lost, why doesn't he storm the Duma building himself along with his 500 supporters?
 
And if Limonov thought that socialite Ksenia Sobchak, journalists Bozhena Rynska and Leonid Parfyonov and tens of thousands of other successful people who are able to think with their own brains would seize the Duma based on his command, he is deeply mistaken. It is as if Limonov appointed himself chief of the Central Elections Commission, stole millions of votes, and acted as if he had a mandate from millions of Russians.
 
I will not try to speak for all the tens of thousands of angry citizens. I will speak only for myself. I had never attended a street demonstration before because I had always considered them a complete waste of time. I took part in this rally because it would have been unconscionable not to.
 
If, when we gathered on Bolotnaya Ploshchad, someone had told me to seize the Duma, I would not have gone. Why should I? To take a bullet for Limonov? I cannot speak for Parfyonov and Sobchak, but I don't feel a personal need for such action.
 
I did exactly what I wanted to do and achieved exactly the result I was after. We, the Russian Third Estate — the virtual party of blogger and up-and-coming politician Alexei Navalny — showed the ruling kleptocracy that if they want to avoid a revolution, they are going to have to dump Prime Minister Vladimir Putin.
 
We showed the ruling elite that Putin will not be the country's dictator for life. And nobody has any intention of letting Limonov become dictator — not even for a day.
 
 
   Yulia Latynina hosts a political talk show on Ekho Moskvy radio.

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/opinion/article/we-the-middle-class-are-not-revolutionaries/449860.html#ixzz1gXm2x52t

[chivo]

No, I think we are in agreement. She writes that she went to a peaceful protest. I said the weekend protest (well in another thread) was peaceful. The protest I saw was by Mayakovskaya and during last week right after the elections, not the weekend protest by Bolotnaya Ploshchad.
 
Am I missing something here?

[OlgaH]

I watched some videos on youtube. Police did not touch those who were chanting for Putin and his party, but the police arrested those who were against Putin.

[chivo]

You're right Olga. The protests that happened during the week right after the elections were much more aggressive on both sides. The police did rough up a few people and depending on the source arrested around 80 people. All anti-Putin protesters.
 
The man to follow in all this is Forbes Russia Man of the Year Alexey Navalny who was roughed up a little and given some jail time following the protests. Good guy and really the force behind the real opposition
 
Of the two people I saw apprehended, one took a few shots. I'm not here to defend the police or the protesters. My thing with this thread is how the media depicts things in Russia, especially the Western press.
 
Maybe you caught Fox's news report that was release on TV in America about the protests using footage from the recent Greek riots  . Of course it was on their website also but good luck finding it now. Looters and fires everywhere, it was comical, but hey it is Fox News.
 
I was also watching the BBC on Sunday following the peaceful protest at Bolotnaya Ploshchad in which they said there were 150,000 angry protesters gathered over the weekend when in reality maybe 40,000 showed up and couldn't have been more peaceful. The police were as well even though I do think some stayed away fearing some sort of retaliation from the police. My favorite poster from that rally was "we didn't vote for these crooks, we voted for the other crooks"  .
 
And I do have a problem with The Economist (again this particular article was more balanced than usual) not to mention other news outlets from the West. Just look at that ridiculous article from The LA Times that was posted recently about Russians leaving in droves. Good article but maybe about 12 years too late. Oh and how about the little tweet from known Russophobe Senator John McCain about "hey Mr Putin, get ready for a Russan Spring coming to a neighborhood near you" as if this isn't already happening in America. I could go on but hopefully you get my point.
 
The last thing the West and especially America wants is a strong Russia. And it certainly reflects in their news reporting. Unfortunately many people believe what they read or see without considering the source.
 

 
 

[OlgaH]

No, Chivo, I did not watch the fox news and honestly I did not read the economist article.

Interesting to read comments to the videos of protests, to the Russian media articles and on the Russian forums. 

Protests are one thing but right now the "heads" in the Russian regional administrations that collected less votes than it should be in favor of the United Russia are between the hammer and the anvil of the ruling party. And the "heads" have started "to fly".

Question is what will make Russia stronger? I doubt that a blindfolded patriotism with bear ass will make Russia somehow stronger, but it gives a pretty powerful mass illusion 

[mendeleyev]

Protests are one thing but right now the "heads" in the Russian regional administrations that collected less votes than it should be in favor of the United Russia are between the hammer and the anvil of the ruling party. And the "heads" have started "to fly".

Yes, and one of those governors about to be looking for a job may decide to run for president.

[OlgaH]

Yes, and one of those governors about to be looking for a job may decide to run for president.

and proposing himself as a candidate he has to be supported by no less than 500 electors officially registered at the Central Election Commission of the RF and collect no less than 2 millions signatures in his support.

[Faux Pas]

Maybe you caught Fox's news report that was release on TV in America about the protests using footage from the recent Greek riots   . Of course it was on their website also but good luck finding it now. Looters and fires everywhere, it was comical, but hey it is Fox News.

Thats not what I saw on the Fox News reporting in America. Is that what you saw? Really? Were you watching it in America or Moscow? My wife and I were both watching it on Fox and saw different reports over the course of a few days. We saw no looting or fires, I recognized it as Russia and my wife reminded me that we had been exactly there before. We were never in Greece.

The last thing the West and especially America wants is a strong Russia. And it certainly reflects in their news reporting. Unfortunately many people believe what they read or see without considering the source.

I would just have to consider this hyperbole chivo. America has no dog in this fight. America and the West benefit from a strong and stable Russia. Seems to me you are either misinformed or deliberately misleading.

News reports are wrong or half reported all the time and it isn't just Fox News as even you eluded to. Did you believe what you saw on the Russian channel reports?