My Russian Bride already here-on the wrong visa

[2tallbill]

Moreover it is virtually impossible I would think to get a Visitor visa these days and then do AOS like this thread talks about.

Nobody suggested that a person get a tourist visa then apply for an AOS. That is
actually illegal to file for a tourist visa when your intention is to marry. What happened
with the OP is that he met a girl here in the USA who was visiting on a tourist visa.
They met fell in love and are now engaged. The girl arrived in the USA without intending
for any of this to happen.

Some people might do the tourist visa with an AOS and get away with it but nobody
here will recommend it (I think) because it could blow up in your face.

That's my opinion,

Bill

[ML]

Moreover it is virtually impossible I would think to get a Visitor visa these days and then do AOS like this thread talks about.

You need to break this into two parts.

1) Getting Tourist Visa.

2) Marrying someone here on a Tourist Visa and then doing AOS.

Number 1.  Ease of getting the tourist visa depends on where the person is from.  All persons from FSU have a somewhat more difficult time getting tourist visa than do persons from many other countries.

And, the person will be denied the tourist visa if there is any hint that they may have a romantic friend in the USA, and that they are getting the tourist visa and later plan to file AOS to circumvent the longer wait apart from going the K-1 route.

They will also have trouble getting the tourist visa if they are married to a USA citizen because it is suspected they are probably trying to circumvent the longer wait apart from going the CR route.  However, the Embassy staff may take pity on the couple and grant the visa, since they know eventually the person will make it to the USA after the CR process.

Number 2.  This is the easy part.  There are no restrictions against marrying someone here on a tourist visa.  And the rules specifically allow for AOS for those who arrive on a tourist visa and marry a USA citizen.

Further, the USCIS has completely stopped trying to determine intent.  i.e. they no longer try to determine if the couple had the plan to arrive on a tourist visa and then AOS.  The only pitfall is if the married couple would be stupid enough to hint at or voluntarily provide this info in the written applications or the in person interviews.

So number two is not really a problem at all.

The problem is in number 1.

Note:  Even as number two is not a problem . . . it is really not a fair procedure compared to those who have to go through a lengthy period apart when going the K-1 or CR route.

There are three categories who can AOS  without going the K-1 or CR routes.
1) Tourist visa
2) Work visa
3) Student visa

The tourist visa is the most subject to abuse.  Because many in that category did meet abroad, plan to marry, and go the tourist route.

The work and student visas are less subject to abuse because in most cases the person comes to USA without knowing anyone here, at least in a romantic sense.

Then after working here or studying here, they just follow the standard procedure of dating, find a compatible partner, and get married.

There is probably a case for terminating the ability to AOS from a Tourist Visa because the tourist really hasn't established a connection with this country.  They probably should go back home at end of visa and start the K-1 or CR process.

However, there is little logic in forcing a student to stop their education or forcing a worker to stop their work and go back home after finding a mate in the USA.

Full disclosure:  I did marry a person who was here initially on a Student Visa and then was working under the Optional Practical Training program at the time of our marriage.

[calmissile]

You need to break this into two parts.

1) Getting Tourist Visa.

2) Marrying someone here on a Tourist Visa and then doing AOS.

Number 1.  Ease of getting the tourist visa depends on where the person is from.  All persons from FSU have a somewhat more difficult time getting tourist visa than do persons from many other countries.

And, the person will be denied the tourist visa if there is any hint that they may have a romantic friend in the USA, and that they are getting the tourist visa and later plan to file AOS to circumvent the longer wait apart from going the K-1 route.

They will also have trouble getting the tourist visa if they are married to a USA citizen because it is suspected they are probably trying to circumvent the longer wait apart from going the CR route.  However, the Embassy staff may take pity on the couple and grant the visa, since they know eventually the person will make it to the USA after the CR process.

Number 2.  This is the easy part.  There are no restrictions against marrying someone here on a tourist visa.  And the rules specifically allow for AOS for those who arrive on a tourist visa and marry a USA citizen.

Further, the USCIS has completely stopped trying to determine intent.  i.e. they no longer try to determine if the couple had the plan to arrive on a tourist visa and then AOS.  The only pitfall is if the married couple would be stupid enough to hint at or voluntarily provide this info in the written applications or the in person interviews.

So number two is not really a problem at all.

The problem is in number 1.

Note:  Even as number two is not a problem . . . it is really not a fair procedure compared to those who have to go through a lengthy period apart when going the K-1 or CR route.

There are three categories who can AOS  without going the K-1 or CR routes.
1) Tourist visa
2) Work visa
3) Student visa

The tourist visa is the most subject to abuse.  Because many in that category did meet abroad, plan to marry, and go the tourist route.

The work and student visas are less subject to abuse because in most cases the person comes to USA without knowing anyone here, at least in a romantic sense.

Then after working here or studying here, they just follow the standard procedure of dating, find a compatible partner, and get married.

There is probably a case for terminating the ability to AOS from a Tourist Visa because the tourist really hasn't established a connection with this country.  They probably should go back home at end of visa and start the K-1 or CR process.

However, there is little logic in forcing a student to stop their education or forcing a worker to stop their work and go back home after finding a mate in the USA.

Full disclosure:  I did marry a person who was here initially on a Student Visa and then was working under the Optional Practical Training program at the time of our marriage.

ML, I need to take exception to this portion of your comments.  At least in our case it was the opposite.  Prior to getting married, Larissa was denied a tourist visa.  She made no hint of having a boyfriend or any other detrimental reason for denial.  Almost no one was approved that was in the same interview session at the US Embassy.  Women were crying after multiple denials, etc.

We later married in July in Kiev while I was there briefly.  Immediately afterward, Larissa applied for a tourist visa.  She was very straightforward with her reasoning....   I need to visit to check out the schools for her daughter and get a feel for her compatibility with the US culture etc.   She stated that she planned to immigrate to the USA later if all went well.  She had a number of businesses to clean up before she could move anyway.

Larissa was granted a 5 year multi-entry tourist visa and Lisa (age 5) was granted a 10 year multi-entry tourist visa.  After arriving on the tourist visa, we applied for an Adjustment of Status and both Larissa and Lisa were granted Green Cards.

It's hard to know what was in the minds of the reviewers, but I think I got some insight partly because of the comparison with several of her friends that had a much more difficult time.  So here is my theory...

I suspect that since I had made many trips to Ukraine and we had documented conversations and plans for over a year before getting married, the feds might have realized this is not a typical MOB and is more likely to be a stable relationship.

There was no deceit in the reasons for wanting the tourist visa.  It is natural to want to be with your husband and have the family united.  Perhaps the embassy has a bias in this direction.  From a common sense perspective, it would seem to me that the government would have a preference to unite citizens with their families (providing it does not appear to be a sham marriage).

As we all know, it is not in the State Departments interest to lay out absolutes in the rules.  If that were the case they could not make changes in immigration policy without changing the laws/rules.  In this way they can change preferences for countries/age/sex/marital status/religion/etc, without having to make any public announcements about what the rules are or what the preferences are from one time period to another.  At least that's my theory.

[ML]

Doug, thanks for your response.

However, didn't the last sentence of mine that you bolded cover your situation?

[tfcrew]

Moreover it is virtually impossible I would think to get a Visitor visa these days and then do AOS like this thread talks about.

Virtually yes. There are always cases that fall into the cracks.

Posted by: calmissile

I need to take exception to this portion of your comments.  At least in our case it was the opposite.  Prior to getting married, Larissa was denied a tourist visa.  She made no hint of having a boyfriend or any other detrimental reason for denial.  Almost no one was approved that was in the same interview session at the US Embassy.  Women were crying after multiple denials, etc.

The lines for US tourist visas are long...really really long. If a lady is young and pretty, chances are they're not coming back.

K1s don't have to wait in that line.
   

[ML]

Quote from: odba on September 08, 2016, 07:35:07 PM

    Moreover it is virtually impossible I would think to get a Visitor visa these days and then do AOS like this thread talks about.

Virtually yes. There are always cases that fall into the cracks.

TF, I clearly laid out the current situation in my post.

There is NO PROBLEM at all doing AOS from Tourist Visa (or Student Visa or Work Visa) for those who marry USA citizen.  It is not 'falling through the cracks.'

Are you disputing this ??

Yes, the Tourist Visa is the difficult part for many persons in some countries.  But NOT the AOS.