The single most important thing I've learnt so far!

[Kuna]

I'll post this outside of my trip report because I don't want to divert too much from "the story"...  BUT, I thought I might post this because I've been thinking about it this afternoon.

For the guys that haven't been here yet you'll hear people constantly saying "Just get on a plane and go!"

I have to say...  RWD was a GREAT place for research but NOTHING can prepare you for interacting with RW/UW than getting on the ground and talking with them.

Today has been a real education.

In short, and in general, I'd say:

1. Women in Kiev love attention;
2. Women in Kiev loath attention;
3. If you give them attention they expect more;
4. If you have given them attention in the past and don't at the moment they demand it;
5. When they get attention again they pretend they don't want it.
6. At times they actively do things to get your attention.
7. If you give them the attention they wanted, you may not be sure if they're happy they have it.

Sound confusing???  It is.  I think it's probably more the young ones or the "ultra hot" ones but damn today has been funny.

I would say to everyone to use your first trip as a learning exercise and once you get your feet on the ground you'll realise that RW/UW ARE indeed different to AW... or at the very least the process of coureting is VERY different!

OK, OK, let's not start that debate again but the process of flirting here IS without a doubt different to the process at home.  It's not a language thing... it's a cultural thing (IMHO).

Kuna

[Michelangelo]

In short, and in general, I'd say:

1. Women in Kiev love attention;
2. Women in Kiev loath attention;
3. If you give them attention they expect more;
4. If you have given them attention in the past and don't at the moment they demand it;
5. When they get attention again they pretend they don't want it.
6. At times they actively do things to get your attention.
7. If you give them the attention they wanted, you may not be sure if they're happy they have it.

You are learning fast, Kuna!  LOL

I remember one girl on one of my trips who secretly loved attention but got mad anytime you gave it to her.  She was also the girl who was smart enough to "call me" when I was on dates with other women.  But when I was with her, she pretended to be NOT that interested in me.

Women...   ???

[Kuna]

hahaha... I'm writing todays installment of my trip report at the moment and will describe an "interaction" I had today...  It was funny/weird/strange...

 

[IAmZon]

I am living with FSU ladies this whole week  (don't think a TR ought be posted if a real trip abroad is not a part).  I too have noticed a cultural difference - many infact.

I find myself having an internal monologue BEFORE saying, or doing.  I have found that often miscommunication can create problems that are not real ... they are just miscommunication. 

Most importantly, I have begun to find how to be myself within this cultural disconnect.  It is not a technique, or phrase.  One must have the CONFIDENCE of how a statement, or action will be received.  And enforce it to be received that EXACT way. 

It is interesting that this confidence and manly assertion is very rewarded - much more so that in AW relations.  This is certainly a part of the "strong man" term.

Great reports Kuna!

[Cold Warrior]

Once you start paying too much attention she assumes she has you eating out of her hands and you are perceived as "weak". Tell her to get lost and she will love you.

[Jazzyclassy]

Wow what can I say these things are all true in this or that way:)

But wait a second guys, do not tell its all about culture, its all about women's psychology .
God all women love attention even me , cos they are women you gotta accept this and yes they want this attention to be strictly an initiative of a man , women love to be adored and it is just some of them treat calmly to this aspect and some of them are really damn crazy about being deprived with attention.....

well ok will write more when I have time ))

[ScottinCrimea]

Show a woman attention who is not used to it and she will eat it up.  Show attention to a woman that is used to it and she will say, "So what else is new?"

[El Rock]

When I was in Kiev last week , I had women follow me around  the supermarket ,  checking me out , being  very secretive  about it, coy  , always when leaving the building , giving me one more  glance as if to say that they approve .

I love the under ground  mall , beneath  the city center , streets
I always get lots of looks from them ,  they sure  know how to hid it , so they think .
Rock

[Jooky]

Ummm...

What you describe above sounds to me like women from anywhere. Actually it sounds most like high maintenence women from anywhere, which is probably why you are encountering this with young, hot women.

How is flirting different in Ukraine than your homeland?

[Kuna]

How is flirting different in Ukraine than your homeland?

Hmmm... of course not always but it would usually go something like this:

Step 1: Boy shows interest in girl;
Step 2: Girl shows interest in boy;
Step 3: Boy pulls back and shows interest in other girl;
Step 4: Girl 1 walks bye and sees, and makes it obvious she sees;
Step 5: Boy talks to Girl #1 again;
Step 6: Girl #1 plays "A LITTLE" hard to get;
Step 7: Boy goes and flirts with girl #3;
Step 8: Girl #1 comes up to Boy and says something like, "Get over yourself, are we going home or what?"
Step 9: Boy goes back to girls #2 and #3 to get phone numbers and leaves with girl #1 knowing he won't have a good time.

That's basically it...  a LOT different to the intensity of the pushing and pulling here.  I like it here!

Kuna

[Jooky]

Really strange Kuna, but I'll take your word for it. I've never been much of a game player with women myself. What you describe sounds like a nightclub bar situation to me (it can't possibly work with women you meet at work, school or through friends, right?)

The nightclub party party situation I've typically seen is:

Step 1: Boy shows interest in girl, girl shows interest in boy, in no particular order. The magnitude and ease of interest increases with the quantity of beers, especially if the girl shows interest first.

Step 2: Boy and girl leave and have a good time. That's all.

If girl doesn't show interest in boy, nothing's going to happen. Boy always shows interest. 

My questions are: Why would you take Step 3? And why the hell would you take Step 9 if you know you won't have a good time? What about girls #2 and #3? Are they alright or are they dogs and you're feigning interest? Do you have to flirt with girls #4 and #5 for girls #2 and #3 to really get interested in you?

Seriously, I do know women who get excited over a man who is taken or disinterested but I have never seen your typical situation played out in my life.

The push and pull you describe regarding Ukrainian women sounds exactly like the same push and pull you play with local women to me. What's your end result? With Ukrainian women you gave them the attention they wanted (after some push and pull) but you're not sure if they are happy with it. With local women you take girl #1 home (after some childish push and pull) and she's not happy with it. Where is the happy ending?

The only difference I can guess that you're getting at is that local women are more aggressive (so she comes back to you in Step 8, knowing that you are playing a game but pissed off about it so the end result sucks, and not in a good way).

I really don't get. I'm glad you're having fun on your trip though.

What I have seen is that when you meet a woman that you've met online, regardless of where she's from you do have a factor that works against you that neither of you is exactly as imagined and a factors that works for you that you've already established some sort of attraction and there is much excitement in the first face to face meeting. These factors becoming exaggerated when dating a Russian woman because of the distance and usually the time spent before the first meeting.

Good luck!

PS: Dude! Where do you get the time to write your stories? You're on vacation! You should be spending your time with the ladies!

[Bruno]

Step 9: Boy goes back to girls #2 and #3 to get phone numbers and leaves with girl #1 knowing he won't have a good time.

one variant :

Step 9: Boy goes back to girls #2 and #3 to invite them at a home party and leaves with girl #1#2#3 knowing he will have a vey good time. 

[Nat]

In short, and in general, I'd say:

1. Women in Kiev love attention;
2. Women in Kiev loath attention;
3. If you give them attention they expect more;
4. If you have given them attention in the past and don't at the moment they demand it;
5. When they get attention again they pretend they don't want it.
6. At times they actively do things to get your attention.
7. If you give them the attention they wanted, you may not be sure if they're happy they have it.

Have you ever seen cats in March? She-cat runs away, he-cat follows her. When he is close, she turns around and uses her claws. When he is falling behind, she stops and waits for him to get closer. It’s the same! And it’s definitely not our Ukrainian feature, it’s international way of flirting

[Dar]

« Reply #6 on: Yesterday at 09:52:59 AM » Quote

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Show a woman attention who is not used to it and she will eat it up.  Show attention to a woman that is used to it and she will say, "So what else is new?"

That's right!

Actually, as Nat wrote, the way of flirting is international! of course, there is not one way
U probably not experienced with that yet. And attention loves not only a woman, a man too. It's just a different kind of attention. Want to be successfully with lady? Here is something for u:

1. During a first meatting show ur interest but don't give a lot of attention (because next time u'll have to give not less then u gave already).
2. Next stage depend from ur intention: flirt, just sex, relationship or marriage.
3. Let's take a flirt. Remember, when u flirting u have to keep her always wondering "what happen next". So don't give everything in one day. Its like a game in Cat and Mouse. In this case important the game of "words and gestures".
And, as were told above, its more the matter of woman's psychology. Seem that ur lady was young because for matured woman this type of behavior in not typical.

[Gator]

Dar wrote,

Seem that ur lady was young because for matured woman this type of behavior in not typical.

Bingo! 

(I wonder if this expression translates correctly.  If not, it means that your conclusion says everything and eliminates the need for further discussion.)

[Dar]

My english still not perfect, sorry...
Improving my mistakes: Ur lady is probably very yuong. Its explanes the way she behaves. For a mature woman this type of behavior is not typical. That's what I meant.

[Kuna]

Dar,

it's OK...  I knew what you meant but she's not so young.  She's 30 and I'm 38 so the age gap isn't huge.

We spent more good time together today and a lot of the barriers have come down.

I've made a HUGE post elsewhere in here but may it was because I was tired.  I'm heading upstairs now but want to thank you for your posts and contributions.

Cheers!

Kuna

[Jazzyclassy]

You know sometimes it is better not to think about woman's every step what she said, what she thought, oh my god what she will think about this or what will happen if I do this or something like that, you make your life much more complicated by these empty thoughts , sometimes it is necessary to just be in love and to feel that harmony and try to be understanding, cos with all those questions you might spoil all your relations,

You know we all can debate and think and search for an ideal person but that will be only talks , no real relations that is why it is necessary to value the person you are with at the moment , cos she might be the one you are searching for and all those little details about her wanting attention, God we all need attention , Boy simply give that to her:))))))

[Gator]

Jazzy wrote,

You know sometimes it is better not to think about woman's every step what she said, what she thought, ....sometimes it is necessary to just feel that harmony and try to be understanding ... to value the person you are with at the moment , cos she might be the one you are searching for ...God we all need attention , Boy simply give that to her:))))))

Beautiful words, beautiful advice.