This Forum (Scammers . . .) - What Role to Play ?

[Admin]

I am running a 7-day poll to collect your feedback on whether or not this particular forum for Scammers and Suspect Agencies is adding value (other than entertainment) to RWD.

When we first started RWD, this forum for Scammers did not exist. It was my belief that a Scammers forum is too much like a Blacklist site, and our core values will not allow us to gravitate toward becoming a blacklist venue.

After some major arm-twisting, I relented and decided to create the forum, with some strong language (still exists, found here -- http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=52.0) to encourage people to ONLY post based on solid facts.

I was also persuaded that for RWD to be a venue for the free and open exchange of information, the bad has to flow with the good - and there can be no doubt there is plenty of corruption to be reported. In this regard, and for this purpose, I still see potential value.

The challenge in 2005 (and prior) was the same as it is today. While there are plenty of blacklist sites out there - Jim's and Saul's and Elena's and numerous others - none have a vetting process to insure no injury to the innocent. Without such a process, I cannot endorse any of them. If anyone feels there is a site somewhere that has a demonstrably fair process for insuring only legitimate scammers/scam agencies are listed, please post here and let us all know about it. I would consider RWD endorsement of such a site - FWIW.

Of all the forums at RWD, this is the one that is the most contentious, and has caused me the most concern. Between the fact that definitions of scamming activity are murky and lack clear boundaries, and the fact that jilted people sometimes seek retribution for the simple fact they were rejected and had their feelings hurt, and the fact that some agencies/sites seek to gain advantage through nefarious claims of wrongdoing by their competitors - there is just too much opportunity for garbage claims that are fallacious.

So what do you all think? Keep this forum as-is. Delete it. Change it into something more in-line with RWD values - and if so, what would that look like?

- Dan

[tfcrew]

Hello Dan & all..
Just me [an old married man] but I would say leave as is.
Let the reader discern.
If a member posts that Miss A/or agency B is a scammer then so describe and if she/they pop up again then be really wary.
Sometimes vengence slips between the slats and it is easily seen......

Karl

[facetrock]

  Hello Dan. I would say there are probably tens of thousands of dollars that havent been sent to FSU scammers because of this section. And probably the same amount to agencys that are obviously dishonest.
  How many times have we seen men come her and wonder if the woman is real or the agency is honest and to the experienced members it is an obvious scam.
  Would they get the same information here if this section was deleted? I dont think so. I say keep it.

  Sometimes it does get comical when a man refuses to believe the obvious.

[Wraith]

Newbies like myself come to this section for a reason - to see if others have had experience with agencies or sites I may very well be looking into. While there will always be differences of opinion, just knowing some of others past experiences help when it comes to making a decision about whether to use a particular site or service.

[groovlstk]

I would vote to modify it so that people can discuss the dangers and particulars of how guys who are new to this can get fleeced.

As far as being a way to report specific scammers by name or agency, I'd say it's absolutely worthless. Look back at most of the original posts and it seems to me most of the guys who come here with sob stories never return after posting their experience.

[ECOCKS]

Maybe it needs to be broadened to not just be for Bad Agency activity but include all Agency comments and/or practices discussion?

That way it [hopefully] wouldn't be a bag the agencies thread and could include both positives and negatives?

[Wraith]

That's good idea.

[Admin]

Yeah - maybe the scope of this forum was/is too broad. We have topics in here that include all the following:

* Individual scammer reports
* Sandro's expose on "Double Dealers"
* Agencies reported to be scams
* Sites attacking other sites

And sundry other topics all dealing with the rather massive underbelly of these businesses and this pursuit.

Please keep the comments coming.

- Dan

[jdk1963]

Yeah - maybe the scope of this forum was/is too broad. We have topics in here that include all the following:

* Individual scammer reports
* Sandro's expose on "Double Dealers"
* Agencies reported to be scams
* Sites attacking other sites

And sundry other topics all dealing with the rather massive underbelly of these businesses and this pursuit.

Please keep the comments coming.

- Dan

I think you're correct about not wanting to become a "blacklist".  I do think it is important to have a forum if you're having doubts about or problems with an agency.  In addition to assisting someone in avoiding a scam you might also be helping a guy not blow-off a great lady because of a misunderstanding with the agency.

The only thing that concerns me is a complaint about an agency turning into a pissing contest. 

[Wraith]

I think you're correct about not wanting to become a "blacklist".  I do think it is important to have a forum if you're having doubts about or problems with an agency.  In addition to assisting someone in avoiding a scam you might also be helping a guy not blow-off a great lady because of a misunderstanding with the agency.

The only thing that concerns me is a complaint about an agency turning into a pissing contest. 

I am in agreement with JD here. Some folks here are very opinionated and can take the agrument to the extreme. It is enough to state their negative/positive experience in a way so as to inform the reader "this is what happened to me doing such-and-such with so-and-so agency" and leave it at that knowing they have aired that experience and the reader can make his own decision based upon what is read.

[Shadow]

Most of the blacklists have are useless, as by the time the mail and name are to be found in Google the scammer has already made three new ones.

However the section is good to show the current pracctices of scammers and scam agencies, to keep new guys informed on how they are ran.

Regarding pissing contest in a case of dissatisfied customers, this is bound to happen. And most times it is for the good, as it will give an impression that is less black-and-white and show that not all customers have a bad experience.
In the best case, the agency owners will participate so they can defend their point of view. This has in the past led to huge pissing matches, but also to very interesting read.

Come on, who does not love the bit of Jerry Springer-type scandal now and then ? 

[Sculpto]

It was the scammer forum that brought me here in the first place.

these sites are usefull

http://www.delphifaq.com/

http://www.hoax-slayer.com/

http://www.cheboksaryrussia.net/    (edit) I just checked that site and they are no longer taking scam reports..

[GoodOlBoy]

I was also persuaded that for RWD to be a venue for the free and open exchange of information, the bad has to flow with the good - and there can be no doubt there is plenty of corruption to be reported.

Between the fact that definitions of scamming activity are murky and lack clear boundaries, and the fact that jilted people sometimes seek retribution for the simple fact they were rejected and had their feelings hurt.....

Dichotomy?

Look back at most of the original posts and it seems to me most of the guys who come here with sob stories never return after posting their experience.

Very true.

In the best case, the agency owners will participate so they can defend their point of view.

I am NOT a big fan of agencies (hand holders), BUT...I think any agency owner should be ENCOURAGED, (by RWD MANAGEMENT) to come on here and rebuke any false allegations offered up by one our "beloved" members.

Silence is NOT always golden.


GOB

[jdk1963]

Personally I would like to see more detailed agency reviews.  Good and bad.  I been to the reviews section and nobody seems willing to say anything.

Where can I put my experiences so far with a particular agency?

[myrddin]

 I'd definitely prefer to see this section remain. I don't think there needs to be a major policy change, just vigilance as to unfounded claims.  There needs to be a place to discuss this stuff. 

I discovered this board while I was in the process of setting up a profile at Anastasia International.  For some reason I happened to look back in my Google window and noticed RWD.  (Never went back to AI, but I've been getting a couple emails from them every week ever since.  Recently it's jumped up to several a day.  I guess economic crises hit scammers, too.)