Older and Divorced and has kid(s) - Question for the Ladies

[BillyB]

-BillyB imagines me having sex with many foreign men who come to visit me on WOVO.

Incorrect Serebro, I imagine you being a "one man" type of woman but I was thinking along the lines of what you said here:

  I could have a child from someone I love and consider to be a very good person but he doesn't love me...

You are a WOVO to avoid sex tourists but if you have a child with a man who does not love you, certainly he is using you for sex and quite possibly a sex tourist. He will happily have sex with women he does not love and give the woman a baby but not take care of his own child. A good man will want to take care of his child and want his child in his life.

Serebro, it's best to wait for the man you love and the man who loves you no matter how long it takes. Some people make a mistake in judging that their partner loves them but to purposely engage in sex with a man who doesn't love you is not much different then having sex with a sex tourist. There's no serious relationship and there's no strings attached.

Serebro and other RW, could you adopt a child and fully love the child as your own? Could you fully love the children, from a previous relationship, of the man you may have a relationship with?

[Jazzyclassy]

I think at the moment  if I could not have kids to some health issues for example  or something else, I would be able to take somebody's child and love him/her as my own ,as women are like that they need to be Mothers that absolutely natural, every woman wants to be a mother! 

But at the moment I am not ready to raise somebody else's child , as I want my own one, frankly speaking

I love kids and I've always liked them and if my life turned the way that I had to raise the other kid I would do that , kids are very important and i consider life without them as just some crazy useless existence - My personal point of view!

[DKMM]

This thread should enlighten some as to the real motivations of younger RW seeking foreigner husbands.  Hint, its not economic anymore!

[Serebro]

Serebro and other RW, could you adopt a child and fully love the child as your own? Could you fully love the children, from a previous relationship, of the man you may have a relationship with?

If the child is a girl and she is under 5 yo yes, if it's a boy I am not sure.
When I was a  student I spent my summer holidays with my relatives in another town and my second cousin had 3 children-2 girls aged 7 and 8 and one girl aged 3.We had to spent a lot of time together.The older girls were busy  playing with their friends and with each other while I was looking after the youngest girl and we often went for a walk together and I liked cooking her favourite dishes for her and we even played different games and watched cartoons(I normally hate them) together and I enjoyed it. There were moments when I FELT that I was her mother and even her mother laughed that I loved her daughter more than she did.In August when I went home I cried because I missed that girl.I had more rest spending time with her when I did when we had students' parties.
Later I used to work in a camp and it was easier for me to work with very little children and with children aged 14-16...But I didn't feel myself to be a mother of 14-16 yo though I felt like one with little children.

[Makkin]

Hi,

  I've noticed that probably 95% of all women that exist tend to have at least one child in a lifetime but 95% don't get married and we all know that because of divorce there is maybe a 60% group that stays married???
  It has something to do with nature in that all women would like to have at least a child in there lifetime and the real clue for a man should be WHY the woman wants a child?
  If you examine the women in your area or country you will notice that all women tend to want to have a child at one point or the other so the man must be guarded and careful to not put himself into a "mule" situation and for personal reasons all women tend to follow in the unconditional love and attachment of a child?????

Makkin

[Makkin]

Hi,

  I'm guessing more than 50% get married and goofed when I put 95% dont get married...Just an opinion and my mistake on the previous post. All in all it is just opinion except for the fact that I believe 95% of all women that can have babies in a lifetime do at some point have one regardless of marriage or love of a partner???

Makkin

[I/O]

One of the more enlightening parts of this thread is that it demonstrates very clearly the "Loony Bin" of this domain ain't entirely a male haunt.

I/O

[Gator]

Serebro,

I admit to not reading the whole thread.  Nevertheless, what I did read does not make sense.

You are in your early 20s, yes?  If so, you have so much time.  Wait until you meet Mr. Right.  My ex-wife was 34 when our first son was born.   Most of the mothers at our sons' schools were around her age.  In America this is not uncommon and is widely acceptable.  What is frowned upon is a young woman having a baby with no father. 

It you do continue with this wild plan, please be very careful about the sperm donor.  Consult with your gynecologist about sources.

[Christian]

If the child is a girl and she is under 5 yo yes, if it's a boy I am not sure.
When I was a  student I spent my summer holidays with my relatives in another town and my second cousin had 3 children-2 girls aged 7 and 8 and one girl aged 3.We had to spent a lot of time together.The older girls were busy  playing with their friends and with each other while I was looking after the youngest girl and we often went for a walk together and I liked cooking her favourite dishes for her and we even played different games and watched cartoons(I normally hate them) together and I enjoyed it. There were moments when I FELT that I was her mother and even her mother laughed that I loved her daughter more than she did.In August when I went home I cried because I missed that girl.I had more rest spending time with her when I did when we had students' parties.
Later I used to work in a camp and it was easier for me to work with very little children and with children aged 14-16...But I didn't feel myself to be a mother of 14-16 yo though I felt like one with little children.

Serebro

One perspective too that you might want to consider is the influence you yourself would have upon the child(ren).  I can remember a camp counselor to this day who showed an interest in me that the other counselors did not and even some of his word's remain with me still.

The sociological aspect is real and to underestimate your own ability to heal or harm in another's life should not be underestimated.

If, however, you were only (barely legal) 18 yrs and married to a 75 yr old millionare, then doubtless, you would have problems relating to his 37 and 42 yr old son and daughter - much less his 20 yr and 22 yr old grandchildren.

Christian

[Christian]

Serebro,

I admit to not reading the whole thread.  Nevertheless, what I did read does not make sense.

You are in your early 20s, yes?  If so, you have so much time.  Wait until you meet Mr. Right.  My ex-wife was 34 when our first son was born.   Most of the mothers at our sons' schools were around her age.  In America this is not uncommon and is widely acceptable.  What is frowned upon is a young woman having a baby with no father. 

It you do continue with this wild plan, please be very careful about the sperm donor.  Consult with your gynecologist about sources.

I think Serebro indicated somewhere that she was 34 yrs.

Yes, as far as sperm donors go I often wondered what posterity could possibly gain from a guy who failed to stick it were it counted!  Are they all faggs? 

Now Serebro, please listen, that would be reprobate silver!

Christian

[Gator]

Returning to the original intent of the topic,

Interesting, as with I/O's wife, both of my RW fiancees had a child while unmarried and then terminated the relationship with the father.

Did this impair their prospects for marriage to someone else?

Short answer "No".    Elaboration below.

1.  The Cossack woman later married twice, both to RM her age, and both very wealthy (such men could have had almost any RW, a younger one without children).  She was "unlucky" with both marriages and neither lasted more than 3 years.  Incidentally, the divorces had nothing to do with having a young child fathered by another man.  Being a celebrity in her city, she never lacks for attention even at 43 with two children, one only 7.  Considering her history with men, I believe I dodged a bullet (but what a ride on a real thoroughbred!).

2.  My Moscow lady attempted at first to date RM but found them lacking in many ways.  Further, she had seen and experienced the Western world, and she wanted it, not Russia.  She became engaged to a Western man, without children, only 5 years older than her, good looking (Chippendales dancer in his early youth), and with more than adequate income.  She terminated her engagement because of a severe personality incompatibility and other issues that seemingly could never be resolved.

There is somebody for everybody, and if a girl "has got it", her prospects are not low, even with child.  

My Moscow woman and I have had some splendid times alone over 5 1/2 years.  Nevertheless, the times with the four of us together are just as wonderful.  Her children are frosting on the cake.

 

[WmGO]

Interesting thread.

To answer Dneid's question, yes it is correct that an FSUW with a child has
slim chances of finding an FSUM for marriage. As the FSUW here have pointed
out, the main two reasons are the patriarchical attitudes of FSUM, and also the
economic factor (BluesF pointed this one out). Also, the quoted opinions found and posted by Lily further expand on the thinking of  FSU men and women on this subject. And it is by no means limited to the Russian culture. For example I, an AM, would not accept a women with a male child. But I would accept a women with a young female child (in times past I would not have even accepted that).

The strong desire of Serebro to go ahead and have a child out of wedlock has become common in FSU with FSUW who are and are not seeking marriage abroad. Unlike some AW who seem to be able to have no such desire until they all of a sudden realize they have such a desire at ages 35-45, FSUW always have this desire. And when approaching 30, many FSUW come to the unfortunately realistic conclusion that life may just not bring them a husband, but at least they can still be a mother. So many thousands, perhaps more than that, in their late 20s and early to mid 30 are finding an intelligent non-alchoholic non-drug addict man to facilitate their motherhood. Successful beezneezmen and university profeesors are probably the main "beneficiaries".

The reasons for not doing so have been wisely enumerated for Serebro, but her desires and thoughts concerning the matter are perfectly understandable.

 

[Shadow]

Serebro, if you are seriously considering this, I will give you the pro's and con's.
First of all, if you are going to have a child without a father present, you will have to be sure that you will be able to give it all it needs. That means not only in material way, but also you will have to be able to spend time with the child. You might have to rearrange your working schedule or get help from people around you for a number of years.
The second thing is that it can be an extra hurdle on the way to meeting mr Right. There are a number of men who are looking for women without children, as they have no or limited experience of family life,and do not wish an 'instant family'.

If you are ready to give your attention more to your child than to anyone else, and understand that it might lead to living your life alone, then go ahead, if you are comfortable that you can bring up the child alone and can give all that it needs in love and material things.

When you are just lonely and want something near to comfort you while you try to find the right man, get a pet.

[Christian]

I did some googling on what RM say on the topic on Russian fora. Here is what I read:

'Her kid has his or her own biological father, and it is not I. That man is going to haunt me for the rest of my life with the woman'.

'Mother and kid make a strong biological unit. I don't belong to this unit. Instead I 'd feel like I am easily replaceable if I don't belong to the unit'.

'If I marry a woman with kids, I will feel like her primary intention is to use me to solve her problems. I don't like it to feel like I am a sort of problems solving tool'.

A woman says, ' There is nothing worse than a stepfather. No matter how much a man loves me, he 'd never be able to love my kid as he 'd love his own kid'.

A woman says, 'If I 'd be a single mom, I would look for a single dad. The man in a parent situation that is similar to mine'.

'It is a noble step to marry a woman with kid. But a man in love may not be able to see future problems. When your own child will be born, in any case you will love him more than a stepchild. Then the problems will start. Also, it is very sad to hear from a stepchild the words like 'you can not tell me what I should do, as you are not my father'.

An orthodox priester says, 'A kid is not an obstacle for a family creation. The main problem here is that a woman with kid will have problems finding a partner. In the family, a man has to assume responsibility not only for his future wife but also for the kid, for his life and upbringing. This is very much uneasy. Many men prefer it if her kid from another marriage would be somewhere in a remote location, so that her kid would not present a constant reminder of the fact that some time ago his wife was living with the other man and was not belonging to him. That is the main problem for a woman with kid who tries to get married again.'
A woman argues that children are a blessing per se. The same priester replies, 'That's right, but can you imagine how true, devoted and noble a man's heart and soul should be in order to be able to understand it? Not in mere words but really. Not many men are able to feel it.' The woman agrees that a number of such men is close to nil.

'A woman should be the wife first, and mother second. Women seem to think differently. If one marries a mother with kid, he is committing a sort of sactifice.I don't understand why woman are angry with this point of view. Why they just don't show an example? Why they don't marry handicapped or ill men? Also, any normal woman does not belong to herself after she gave birth. She belongs to her kid, he is her flesh, blood, her hopes and aspirations are now in the kid. There is no place for a man in her heart anymore. A man interests her only insofar he can provide for her and her kid. The woman can have lots of men, they are not of such unique value for her as her kid is. I was growing up without father, my mom was married several times, so I know the role of those men in her life. I would not want to be walking in their shoes...'

I also found many posts saying that her situation does not matter for men, but for the sake of the topic I just show the reasons against marrying a mother.

Lily,

I did want to ask you one other thing on this issue about RM and patriarchalism.  It seems that the definition is interpreted or understood by many RM in too narrow of a sense, while the priester indicated there is in fact no obstacle in the marriage of a RW w/child.  Any further thoughts - perhaps about broadening the perspective on this issue of RM?

Christian

[Lily]

Right observation Christian. May be this intolerance to the woman's past would be not patriarchalism but just an extreme maleism, closer to machism..

[Christian]

Right observation Christian. May be this intolerance to the woman's past would be not patriarchalism but just an extreme maleism, closer to machism..

Perhaps then, Lily, although the analogy may not be perfect, the concept of what machism entails is the difference between a body-builder and a gymnist?

At the theological level, perhaps the difference between the regenerated and the unregenerated; but this tendency may have some overlap and not be so clearly defined and demarcated.

Are there any articles that you might recommend esp. by Russian men or even women?

Christian

[WmGO]

Perhaps then, Lily, although the analogy may not be perfect, the concept of what machism entails is the difference between a body-builder and a gymnist?

At the theological level, perhaps the difference between the regenerated and the unregenerated; but this tendency may have some overlap and not be so clearly defined and demarcated.

We share the same faith, but you are now getting really silly...........

[Lily]

Perhaps then, Lily, although the analogy may not be perfect, the concept of what machism entails is the difference between a body-builder and a gymnist?

At the theological level, perhaps the difference between the regenerated and the unregenerated; but this tendency may have some overlap and not be so clearly defined and demarcated.

Are there any articles that you might recommend esp. by Russian men or even women?

Christian

By machism I'd mean mostly not physical things.
Agree, the analogies are not perfect.
So far no article on the topic would cross my mind, let alone in English language, sorry....