Need advice from experienced sources

[Vaughn]

You won't like this - but here goes.

At age 45 I was divorced from my first wife of nearly 20 years. It was a rough one, with two
young daughters involved, aged 8 and 4. Within 7 months of that divorce I met a very nice
woman and we married 2 months later. The marriage lasted all of 9 weeks. That was in 1996.

Long story short - rebound marriages are among the most fragile. Yeah, I know, but you two
will be different. I proclaimed the same, and none of my best friends could talk me out of it.
One of those friends had lunch with me just last month, and that timeframe came up in our
conversation. He asked, "In '96 when you sprinted back into marriage, well, what
the hell were you thinking, dude?" We both laughed, Doc Rep - but I promise you,
it won't feel good to find yourself back in divorce court so soon after the first go 'round.


Odds are good - impatient as you are - this will be your fate. Deny it all you want, but I swear
you're the same nice guy I saw in my own mirror, looking for a quick-fix warm lithe body to cuddle.

Take it from me. Give yourself time, even if your ex-to-be is out having the time of her life.
I swore off all serious relationships for a period of five years - had a ball dating many ladies
- just for fun. It's good medicine after the curtain comes down.

Practice patience, and date, date, date - all you want.

As for a 2nd marriage, what's the big rush?

Vaughn



 

[Gator]

Doc,

As Vaughn and Kievstar wrote, slow down.

Psychologically you are in a "rebound" from a divorce.  In fact, you are just in the beginning stages.  This is a vulnerable period for a man, especially if he feels he was tromped upon by his ex-wife.  Men do not make the best decisions when in a rebound (and you do admit to marrying the wrong woman when your head was clear).

I suggest that you continue to plan your trip to L.  Meanwhile, write a couple of other RW and, most important, date some AW for "FUN."  

Although L still has her profile open, I doubt that she will have met another man before your next trip in November.  So just relax and see how it plays out.  If she finds a man who interests her more than you, so be it.  Better now than after you married.

It is important that you show confidence and leadership.  Do not show weakness by acting jealous about her profile.  I contend that most jealousy is the sign of a weak man, especially when no definitive commitment has been made between the two of you.  It makes you appear needy.  Be strong (and avoid big romantic decisions for at least a year).

[groovlstk]

Do not show weakness by acting jealous about her profile.  I contend that most jealousy is the sign of a weak man, especially when no definitive commitment has been made between the two of you.  It makes you appear needy.  Be strong (and avoid big romantic decisions for at least a year).

I tend to agree w/Kievstar, Vaughan, and Gator, but I'll add this:

I hope you're writing to other women. Your GF is clearly not ready for a commitment so why should you stay home on weekends? Deciding on exclusivity is a MUTUAL decision and you'll also appear weak to her if you act like a celebate puppy dog while she's still playing the field.

Some of the other guys have commented on your impending divorce, and how you should take your time in starting over. If you're a decent looking man, your finances are in order, and you are not looking to date women half your age, you'll be amazed at your dating options in Russia or Ukraine. Take advantage of it, have some fun.

[BillyB]

Doc, your not ready for marriage.  Get your divorce and do not get married for three years.  You need time.  No one should jump from one marriage to another that quickly.  Let three year pass.

It's hard to say whether or not if Doc is ready for marriage. He may have already been separated from his wife for years if not physically, emotionally. The best way to forget about a woman is with another woman.  If he's still emotionally hurt and needs 3 years to emotionally heal, he should not be looking overseas yet or even at home. Do the women you're dating a favor and don't date them. If he's emotionally ready, go for it.

[Doc Rep]

Okay now the divorce situation has taken over most of the posts. I will try to explain it as well as I can. First thing is I vowed a long time a go I will not rush in to an actual I do to quik again. I pretty much emotionaly and physically checked out of the marrigae while I was in Iraq. I have friends that will tell you about conversations we had there about it. I was brought up that divorce was not an option and I did not want to put my soon through it. So I held on as long as I could. I tried to "fix" things for almost two years. When the decision was made that it was over it was on a friday. We sit down together and before the weekend we had everything worked out. It has still been rocky but I vowed I would not make things messy due to my soon. As far as allowing more time, if I was to say rush things as kick of the k-1 paper work after the next meeting. You would be talking about 6 to 9 months time to get it taken care of. The next thing is under no way shape or form would I consider being a mule for the family. I have not been involved in that at all. L. has a younger sister that married a RM in May. So it is not a family thing to just try to get out of Russia. Once again thanks for all of the real advice.

[GregfromGa]

May I ask you - are you married on FSU woman?

I've been married to a lovely Ukrainian woman for almost 6 years come September 19th.

[JR]

Doc, your not ready for marriage.  Get your divorce and do not get married for three years.  You need time.  No one should jump from one marriage to another that quickly.  Let three year pass.

My marriage was over long before the divorce came around but looking back I do believe it would have been a mistake to marry without letting some time go by. I'm just passing the three year mark and I think that is a good number.

Waiting a few years is good advice. That doesn't mean you can't get your feet wet and scope out the territory. But remember, be honest about it. Don't talk of marriage and secretly wait out the years.

[groovlstk]

The next thing is under no way shape or form would I consider being a mule for the family. I have not been involved in that at all. L. has a younger sister that married a RM in May. So it is not a family thing to just try to get out of Russia.

Doc, I don't think many of the guys who ended up as mules did so willingly. They were duped by their fiancees/wives and their families and, ultimately, themselves. If you look back in the archives and read Maxx's or Gary's stories you'd be shocked at what some folks would do to get a greencard

[Vaughn]

Doc, I don't think many of the guys who ended up as mules did so willingly. They were duped by their fiancees/wives and their families and, ultimately, themselves.

And not all AMs are duped into being mules - it just transitions in that direction over time. A parent overseas dies,
leaving his/her spouse to fend for themselves...  a few years pass, and the Russian bride of seven years in Akron,
maintaining as close a relationship as possible, approaches her American husband with the idea to "bring over"
that survivor. Does that prospect break the deal as they approach Year Eight? In my case, I considered that my
MIL, already a pensioner, stood a very fair chance of winding up here eventually. She has visited us, has no
burning desire to live here despite the advantages - but may wind up with us should her health begin to fail
slowly.         

Some men marry older women whose children are grown and out the door, presumably
independent - and by virtue of their ages are ineligible to piggyback as K-3's.... still, they manage to arrive as
outlined by these two jb posts from three years ago:

once the RW spouse has her Permanent GC and/or American citizenship, she can independantly file an I-130 on behalf of an immediate family member, i.e., her own children.  I believe if you marry a RW with older children, sooner or later you will have the whole kaboodle with you.  A Russian mother will never abandon her children, nor will she ever give up on the hope of having her family close to her.  As the head of the family you will be expected to help these new immigrants get established in their new life in the USA.

Every man who thinks about marriage to a foreign national should consider this aspect carefully.  Once she gets her citizenship, she has prepared a landing strip for her entire immediate family,,, mother, father, brothers and sisters, even her aging babuska,,, and in some cases, her adult children.

It's something to consider.

[Jooky]

Hey Doc,

Regarding Elena's Models, what most of the guys have said is true. It takes just a few seconds for a woman to hide or unhide a profile. But...

Some of Elena's Models affiliate agencies exert more control over their clients and don't allow women direct access to their profile or the site's normal interface. Instead, all communication goes through the agency and the woman must go to the agency to check messages. Some agencies also require their ladies to respond to all expressions of interest and some send out expressions on behalf of their ladies.

If this lady checks her Elena's Models messages directly from home, nevermind what I just wrote (although she still might be required by policy to respond to all expressions of interest). If she goes to an agency to check messages, there might be some truth to what she's told you.

Some posters here say this woman is just 'not that into you'. I don't think relationships are that cut and dry. Some start with a bang and fizzle quickly. Some take time to develop. Most people don't decide to be exclusive after hanging out for just ten days, especially when there are extenuating circumstances, such as you still being married.

It sounds like you had a good time together, but she was caught off guard by your request for her to take down her profile. That kind of request shows insecurity as many here noted and it breaks the romance. She didn't check her profile for 2 months. That shows that she wasn't actively looking for more options. Then she updated her profile. That's a bad sign, but I don't think it's that she wasn't that into you. I think she's becoming less into you.

There could be many reasons for that: Your involvement in this mess between her mama and this other guy, things this other guy might have said, your divorce not being finalized, your showing insecurity over her profile, her wondering why you're looking on Elena's Models (checking up on her, or looking for other women, either way it's not a good sign to her), and other things that have come up as you both get to know each other over time.

Anyways, I agree with the others here. Take your time, and don't let problems that you had in your past marriage affect your current and future relationships. Good luck!

[Doc Rep]

Jooky, I really think most of what you said was right and to the point. You hit on or said some of the stuff that I was having a hard time explaining or knowing how to say it. If that makes sense. Thank you

[Misha]

Some posters here say this woman is just 'not that into you'. I don't think relationships are that cut and dry. Some start with a bang and fizzle quickly. Some take time to develop. Most people don't decide to be exclusive after hanging out for just ten days, especially when there are extenuating circumstances, such as you still being married.

I guess I do not fall into the "most people" category  :evil: To be honest, if I did not think there was a spark there at the outset, I concluded from my personal experience that life was too short and that it was better to move on. Sure, you risk losing perhaps one woman where something might have developed over time, but it helps IMHO in eliminating many more women who are not truly into you or where there was no true attraction. 

[Ade]

I tend to agree w/Kievstar, Vaughan, and Gator:

+1

Seriously dude, after a long marriage even when the divorce is amicable it can take many years to fully recover and leave the baggage behind. 5 years is a reasonable time to plan with - in retrospect that's about the time it took me to be truly ready to be married again although, when I was in the middle of that period, I would have sworn I was over it.

[ScottinCrimea]

After my first marriage of 18 years I didn't know how to handle being alone so I jumped prematurely into a marriage that lasted a mere 8 months.  Not learning my lesson, I became enamored of a RW and wanted to jump into yet another premature marriage.  All the talk of waiting x number of years was discouraging and not in line with my accustomed habit of having someone by my side.  The concept of living alone was strange and frightening to me.  Luckily, somewhere along the line I got some sense kicked into me because I waited three years before taking the plunge again.  The time that I thought would be difficult was actually a time to get my head together.

A rebound marriage has a much higher risk of failure.  Finish your divorce, take the time to get to know YOU and feel comfortable with yourself and then think about sharing this comfortable self with someone else. You will appear as a much stronger candidate for husband.  I know I hated to hear all of the advice about taking my time and how important it was, but having resisted the advice, I have learned how valuable was the the advice offered.  You have a long life ahead of you.  Don't compromise your long term objectives for a short term senes of uncomfortableness.

[myrddin]

JollyRats and ScottinCrimea made some excellent points about divorce.  Until it's totally over, it's not totally over. 

I'm not saying there's some specific time to wait (though three years seems like enough time).  I do know that, even though my marriage was over before the divorce was final, it was many months before I could really assess my own relationships.  Even though I *thought* I was ready to move on almost immediately, I was wrong....  At some point, I became truly comfortable as a single again, and that was when I was ready to seek something new.

[Gator]

Doc Rep,

You are getting many testimonies from men who have been in your shoes.  All are saying the same.  Not one has yet advised to go balls out.

The broken dreams from a divorce do hurt.  The newfound freedom rarely compensates for that pain.  I think the pain is better resolved by using this freedom for reflection and introspection (plus some dating to remind you that you are a healthy, desirable man).

Your "L" has done you a major favor by not wanting to progress to marriage on a fast track.  Enjoy your time with her.  See how your feelings and her feelings evolve.  Meanwhile, write some other RW.  And do date some AW for fun (beauty is just a light switch away).

[boaterguy]

I think as far as time to heal after a divorce varies from person to person and situation to situation.

My 1st marriage sounds has alot of similairities in that I stayed with the ex about 5 years too long because of my kids. Finally it became obvious that we were doing more harm to the kids than good by staying together. My 1st marriage was 22 years. Our interests just grew apart. I was divorced from my wife a good 3 years before we ever divorced...just living together plutonically. I was fully ready to enter into another relationship when my divorce was finalized.

I met my wife(in the flesh    ) about a year after my divorce was finalized and was married in less than 2!

[Doc Rep]

Some you have had some informative things to say. I am very thankfull for all comments and any help. I know that It was an interesting question that was one reason I asked it. Boaterguy, you hit the nail on the head. That is how I feel. I am not about to rush into any thing. I am going to take my time. She has also stated that is what she wishes. Doc Rep

[Show Time]

Doc,

I may have missed it in the thread, but how long were you and your soon to be ex married?

[Doc Rep]

My ex and I have been married 7 and a half years. I do not guess I said that.

[ambach123]

Everything has been said. This relationship if it ever was, no longer exists.

Move on.
Next time don't  date a woman under 30, that is about the time they become serious after they cross the age of 30 and the pool of men shrinks.

Also avoid doctor, lawyer types, they consider themselves God's gift to this world.  A lawyer at age 26 must think that she has got the world by the tail. A man in the process of divorce from USA is not her dream. It is quite elementary, my dear Watson.

She is into bigger and better suitors, I don't know how much more obvious it can be.
Use better judgment in the selection of the woman.

Nonetheless, most guys go for younger and prettier women; the results are obvious. JR here argued with my advice on another thread, that one must avoid very young and very attractive women from FSU; sure you can do it at your own peril.

What was the name of the beautiful young doctor from St. Petersburg whose marriage ended with her death? I saw it on TV. Of course nobody told him, that he should not marry a very young, and beautiful doctor, I don't think he would have listened any way. Now he has life in prison, she is dead. She was into beaucoup men.

I don't blame the OP for anything other than the wrong selection of woman. He is entitled to search even before his divorce is final. He is entitled to expect some exclusivity, if such was discussed.

[ambach123]

I hate to single out anyone but Billy B here has publicly described his trials and tribulations. Three years ago he found a very attractive woman who was then 24. Everyone congratualated as if he had won a lottery. Fast forward to now, she bolted after he got her a K-1. He lost at least 50G, three years and the emotional toll. He is a very nice guy, likeable and personable, but youth and beauty blinded him. He would probably do the same again expecting different results. How is that possible?

For the women under 30, their first choice is a man in Russia, they still have hopes. (Though some under 30 want a GC or gold or both, they end up in disaster anyway).
Also in FSU, women when they cross 30, most of them gain 10 to 20 lbs, probably more so than in USA. I don't know why that happens around 30 years, but that is my observation, sometimes from looking at the pictures of the same woman at 28, 30, 32 and so on. It is very common if not universal. It is at that stage, that they seriously look for a foreign husband and are willing to leave their country.

I see on the board that men are looking for 8,9,10 whatever; no wonder train wrecks are dime a dozen.
Mind it that finding someone and having a successful relationship are two completely different things.
One can argue that if to have a successful marriage one must marry someone over thirty, and average looks, why go half way around world and marry a stranger, with little or no job sills for USA? There are zillions of such women in USA. That is a very good question, I would ask that myself.

[ScottinCrimea]

One can argue that if to have a successful marriage one must marry someone over thirty, and average looks, why go half way around world and marry a stranger, with little or no job sills for USA? There are zillions of such women in USA. That is a very good question, I would ask that myself.

So why haven't you?

[Faux Pas]

One can argue that if to have a successful marriage one must marry someone over thirty, and average looks, why go half way around world and marry a stranger, with little or no job sills for USA? There are zillions of such women in USA. That is a very good question, I would ask that myself.

To a large degree most people marry strangers no matter if they marry within their country or not. I can state that without conviction because IMO, you don't know anyone until you've lived with them for a significant amount of time. I am still convinced that it doesn't matter from where you find your bride. If you don't marry within your league and with someone whom you share many of the same likes, dislikes and interests, chances are the marriage isn't going to last anyway. Without those commonalities and then a large age difference, the marriage is doomed for eventual failure. Sure there are exceptions but they are the exception and not the rule.

[Gator]

Also in FSU, women when they cross 30, most of them gain 10 to 20 lbs, probably more so than in USA. I don't know why that happens around 30 years, but that is my observation...

Most?!  Height of absurdity.  You need to improve your observational skills.

All women tend to gain some weight with age.  Metabolic and hormonal changes can alter fat storage vs. fat utilization as well as bodily distribution of adipose tissue.  This occurs more when they are in their 40s and particularly later as part of menopuase. 

Some RW are mere "sticks" in their teens and early 20s.  They naturally fill out as they age.  However, most RW do not start out as a stick.  So maybe you are looking only at stick women?