taking out-of-the-country vacations

[ECOCKS]

Lots of guys take out of the country trips or at least head down to Crimea for a long weekend with their GF's while building a relationship. While I don't believe in the first trip vacation meeting it was my thought that our trips to Zakopane and Prague before getting married where beneficial in developing our relationship (along with the travel history development).

So, how about some mini-TR's from the places you visit(ed) along with another round of how effective you found this to be in developing your relationship with the lady?

Great short haul trips from Ukraine:

Bulgaria - I found Sozopol to be fantastic and near-perfect in size. It is small enough that you can walk from one end to the other in about 40 minutes or so yet still has some clubs (for most all tastes) and a variety of restaurants and places to explore. The beaches are big enough to hold a few hundred people but you don't get thronged with foot traffic above the beach or in the cafes along the shore. English is common due to the influx of Brits buying retirement and vacation homes. We rented a 3 room apartment for about $400 for 10 days which worked great for the MIL, step-son, wife & self. About 5-8 minutes walk to the beach, four restaurants that I could hit with a rock from my balcony. To get there, fly to Varna and take a bus/car to Sozopol or you can find bus tours going that way. Think the train also runs there from Kyiv but may have to make a connection in Odessa or Pest.

Poland - Krakow was another excellent trip offering a fantastic castle (huge) to explore, the walled Old Town, shops with knick-knack/souvenirs, decent food (I liked the fish place off the main plaza best), decent hotels at reasonable prices (we stayed out a bit and rode in on the trolley. Warsaw was more disappointing although we stayed next door to the Presidential Palace. We were so close the guard detail patrols the hotel as well as the Palace. The rest of the town is rebuilt since WW2 and includes a section where they have rebuilt the castle and an "old" section in a replica attempt. Zakopane - Ski resort town although nothing to compare to most US resorts in terms of lifts, restaurants, rentals and after-hours joints. Trains and buses run to Krakow and Warsaw on the overnight runs. You can bus to Zakopane in about 2-3 hours from Krakow.

Czech Republic - Prague and Karlovy Vary are both well-known, prestige destinations among FSU citizens. We did Prague and had a great time. The metro makes FSUW feel "just like home" and it seems to make a really good milestone in shifting their attention westward. Prague is much more European in the downtown area and, like most European cities offers a castle, a couple of palaces, museums and a dozen or more truly spectacular cathedrals. You can find a dozen classical music concerts every night in those cathedrals and the prices are still pretty reasonable although a step up from the prices of the FSU. The plazas have plenty of kiosks and my wife particularly enjoyed eating under the portable gas heaters on Christmas Eve and enjoying a cup of hot, mulled wine while strolling all around the town. Prague is a late-rising town so if you're an early bird plan on strolling a bit before breakfast. Karlovy Vary is a spa town with world-renowned hot springs. They also have a pretty well-regarded film festival which has given the town a bit more sophistication than one might expect. Prague is a simple flight from Kyiv and Larlovy Vary is on both train and bus routes along with renting a car options.

Aside from having a great time, hitting spots like these adds Shengen visa stamps to your wife's passport, building a progressive travel record which gives her a favorably-viewed history when looking for a US or the more difficult to get travel visas.

[Turboguy]

Personally I think spending time together is more important than where you spend it.  I will agree that the first visit should be to her home town where you can meet her friends and family and get some kind of an idea what her life is like.  It is very possible that you could meet a woman who behaved well around her friends and family but was nasty or demanding when on a vacation and around people she knows she will never see again.  I have heard several tales from friends who went on a vacation with a woman who complained non stop because they were staying in a 4 star hotel and not a 5 star.  If they had only visited her in her city there is a side of that woman they may never have seen.

Our travels were well documented on RWD at the time.  After our original meeting in her city we went to Egypt, Thailand, Sochi and then spent the biggest part of the Summer together in Grenada and Barbados.  Frankly I liked not having to get a Russian Visa, not freezing my fanny off in the Siberian Cold and being able to relax together.   I don't think it kept us from getting to know each other a bit.  Our time in the Caribbean was more like living together anywhere than being on a vacation.  Sure we went to the beach a little but really it wasn't the kind of live most would associate with a vacation. 

As far as how we liked those places, Egypt was interesting but my wife did not care for the harrassment from the natives very much.  Thailand was great, almost too hot but nice.  Grenada had little to do but was still our favorite, and Barbados had a lot to do but was very crowded.  Sochi was OK.  I would not have much desire to go back there.

[Gator]

I voted Important.  I disagree that it is "quality time alone to learn each others foibles."  Maybe follicles, dependent upon the use of the razor.   

Life on a "holiday" is not the same as living together.  My ex-wife and I were 100% compatible travelers, never having a serious disagreement in our traveling together over six years.  All of our trips with and without the kids were a joy.    In fact, she was the best ever traveling companion.  [ed. The present incumbent will surely pass her upon achieving fluency in English.]

It is a different matter to live together - the  stimuli of traveling (entertainment, exploration and discovery, dining, new bed, etc.) are replaced by the mundane.   I am not implying that ordinary life is boring.  It isn't if with the right woman.  If with the wrong woman, "things" will emerge.  The two situations are not apples and apples.

A vacation together is fine.  It requires much planning and communication , so that will reveal something.  Also, conflict resolution will be tested.   Yet, a more comprehensive indicator of compatibility is to shack up at her place or yours while working. 

[ECOCKS]

It strikes me that it is educational to see how the gal responds to/copes with a changed environment, how they treat people, getting a visa (perhaps for the first time or first Shengen), how they travel and a different perspective on spending money.

[Gylden]

I voted not that big of a deal, although I have to this day never been to her city or seen where she lived or met any of her friends or family other then her kids, who have lived with us from the beginning.
We traveled to Warsaw for our initial and third meeting, she came to visit/live with me all of the rest of the times we were together, as I felt it was more important for her to get a feeling/idea about where she would be moving to and exactly what life would be like here. To get to know each other, I don't believe it is so important to travel as it is to get to know one another.
I will say that we have traveled extensively since getting married and have enjoyed every bit of it!

[dbneeley]

Interesting that this came up today. My wife asked me this afternoon if I'd like to take a week in Turkey this coming April. That surprised me, but she has it all worked out how we might accomplish it all as well as get the new flat renovated after we return.

The only travel we've done together has been within Ukraine so far--and she is a joy to be with on those trips.

Should be fascinating! I've never been to Turkey, but the packages from Ukraine are incredibly cheap and convenient.

David

[I/O]

The present incumbent

And......................you say I have a "way" with words. Transiency implied?

[Gator]

And......................you say I have a "way" with words. Transiency implied?

Not the best choice of words.   There is nothing constant in life but change.  Carpe diem.

[I/O]

Carpe diem.

Whilst expousing Latin, perhaps the entire pursuit is best summarised with the phrase "caveat emptor"?

[Blues Fairy]

expousing Latin

= espousing + exposing? 

[Gator]

= espousing + exposing? 

 

I thought I/O was remarking about my exspousing.

[Chicagoguy]

It strikes me that it is educational to see how the gal responds to/copes with a changed environment, how they treat people, getting a visa (perhaps for the first time or first Shengen), how they travel and a different perspective on spending money.

I agree 100% for all the same reasons. We took a group trip to Turkey out of Moscow and she was splendid. But since her English was not that good we did stay at an all inclusive Russian resort with side tours. It was not that expensive.

[ECOCKS]

From a vacation and life experience perspective I support the going to Turkey and other locations which offer new experiences for both of you. Your relationship could probably use some shared memories which are not colored by nationalism, previous visits with others or non-mutual enjoyment. Finding a site and agreeing to gol, making plan and arrangements is a good relationship-building exercise for the both of you.

[Al_C]

A lady I once spent time with (not Elena; a proor lady) had  a large family and insisted that we take time away from them so we could get to know each other without any family butting in.

Although that particular one did not work out for other reasons, her idea worked out quite well for us, as we we able to focus on each other.

When Elena was here the last time, we took a week to go to a resort in the country for the same reason, to get away from my huge family.

So, yeah, it is a good idea.

One caveat:  If you are going to Russia, you usually have a single entry visa, so don't plan on taking her to another country and then re-entering Russia.

[Partizan]

Took my ex/gf (RW) to Egypt for 8 nights back in early October and in my own experience, it was a waste of my time and money so voted accordingly.

[ECOCKS]

One caveat:  If you are going to Russia, you usually have a single entry visa, so don't plan on taking her to another country and then re-entering Russia.

Good point to remember during planning. IF I had done this I'd like to think I'd have planned it as meeting her there then going home with her or visiting her home then going somewhere like this on the way out.

Of course, if you have a real relationship, then meeting here there and both returning home is normal too.

For those who consider Ukraine this doesn't apply. Come and go as you please due to the visa-free situation.

[Turboguy]

Took my ex/gf (RW) to Egypt for 8 nights back in early October and in my own experience, it was a waste of my time and money so voted accordingly.

I took my then fiancee (wife now) to Egypt as well, but enjoyed it.  Reading your post does raise a few questions in my mind.  Was it spending time in Egypt that was a waste of time or spending time with someone who was not the right person.  I have had a few guys take vacations with a woman and find things they didn't like about her and then ended up dropping the woman.  However, is that a waste of time if you find out you are not right for each other?  To me it could be a great savings of money, time and heartbreak. 

There is the old saying, "It is not where you are that is important, it's who you are with."

[ECOCKS]

I took my then fiancee (wife now) to Egypt as well, but enjoyed it.  Reading your post does raise a few questions in my mind.  Was it spending time in Egypt that was a waste of time or spending time with someone who was not the right person.  I have had a few guys take vacations with a woman and find things they didn't like about her and then ended up dropping the woman.  However, is that a waste of time if you find out you are not right for each other?  To me it could be a great savings of money, time and heartbreak.  

There is the old saying, "It is not where you are that is important, it's who you are with."

+1 X 2 - TG

[LAman]

Took my ex/gf (RW) to Egypt for 8 nights back in early October and in my own experience, it was a waste of my time and money so voted accordingly.

Took my ex/gf (UW) to Egypt for 7 nights back in early October 2009 and in my own experience, got to see her in a light I did not see in her hometown, you see, we were with each other 24/7........... not just most of day or into a late night meeting or she was at work...there IS a reason the 'ex' is there.......

[Jumper]

No matter how you dice this, it  comes down to more face to face time in various situations. The more, the better? It certainly doesn't hurt.

In these scenarioa where you both are not  dating in your hometown,with perhaps a common group of friends or associates over some time.

It seems best to try to mimic the  situations as best you can ,with time in her home town,perhaps sharing a flat, hopefully meeting friends and family , and time on vacations together 24/7.
She is learning about you as well. the more you communicate daily ,and of course the more face to face time the better.I feel the more varied the situations the better as well.

I would think varied is better than the options of only  meeting in her home city ,or
only  meeting in exotic locales.

As Ed mentiomed ,life experiences together that may bond you more, or help in understanding compatability ,or
 what you each truly enjoy.


For example a trip to Egypt ,
do you both really enjoy and want to go on excusions to the ruins? to the museums?
, shopping ?, try the new dining experiences ?
perhaps some snorkling or diving? or simply lay  on the beach
Maybe all of it , maybe not.


Yet to say in your flat ,. or on email-

 "yea i'd like that "
verses the real experience together ,may prove quite different and revealing to both.

[Rubicon]

I don't really want to go to Egypt because I've heard the locals really harass foreigners for handouts, etc.

I am thinking of Turkey.  is it a pretty safe place to visit??

[LAman]

I didn't feel the locals were harassing anyone. MY gf was paid attention too though, she was constantly asked if she was Shakira? Guys treated me nice also. I can see if girl( many are russian speaking) was wearing sexy provacative clothing in town there would be many catcalls!!!!
Nice thing is the warm season in egypt is much longer than turkey's.

[Jumper]

I don't really want to go to Egypt because I've heard the locals really harass foreigners for handouts, etc.

I am thinking of Turkey.  is it a pretty safe place to visit??

FWIW-

In my post it was just an example country, any other would have various activities that might provide each other with insights into compatability.

As far as Egypt, was never harrassed.
If you were a RW , you might get a few Svetlanas, Tatiana, Olga names called out after you..
That's about it.


 

[Anotherkiwi]

For those who consider Ukraine this doesn't apply. Come and go as you please due to the visa-free situation.

Not quite right - those of us from New Zealand and Australia require a visa for Ukraine, Belarus and Moldova as well as for Russia.

The point about visas being single-entry seems slightly naive - why not get a double-entry visa?  I did on my last trip, because my entry and exit point was Moscow and I went to Ukraine as well.

[ECOCKS]

Not quite right - those of us from New Zealand and Australia require a visa for Ukraine, Belarus and Moldova as well as for Russia.

The point about visas being single-entry seems slightly naive - why not get a double-entry visa?  I did on my last trip, because my entry and exit point was Moscow and I went to Ukraine as well.

True, my bad.

Sorry Kiwi's....