Sex without love - American style?

[Nat]

There's something about American culture I don't quite understand, may be you could enlighten me on this topic
In the US series I'm watching now, a girl broke up with her boyfriend because he told her he loved her. Apparently, he put a lot of pressure on her saying things like that. As his friends explained him, he shouldn't have said such a thing so soon. The funniest part is that they'd been having sex for like several month before that.
That's not the first series or movie with such kind of plot - I've seen quite enough movies with such a storyline.
The thing I don't get is: is that a normal, common sequence of how relationship works in the US? Do Americans first start going out, having sex, and then (may be, which isn't obligatory) fall in love? Is having sex without love normal? Is falling in love considered to be some kind of weakness or undesirable behaviour? Or am I missing here something?

[Voyager36]

There's something about American culture I don't quite understand, may be you could enlighten me on this topic
.
The thing I don't get is: is that a normal, common sequence of how relationship works in the US? Do Americans first start going out, having sex, and then (may be, which isn't obligatory) fall in love? Is having sex without love normal?

Sometimes....

 Is falling in love considered to be some kind of weakness or undesirable behaviour? Or am I missing here something?
[/quote]

Maybe she just wanted the sex, but wasn't ready to make a more serious commitment to him. (Which he obviously wanted, as he told her he was in love)

[Nat]

Maybe she just wanted the sex, but wasn't ready to make a more serious commitment to him. (Which he obviously wanted, as he told her he was in love)

I thought seeing each other exclusively for several months and doing different stuff together every day is already a commitment 

[dbneeley]

Nat,

Often, American television and movies portray extremes of behavior more than typical, real-life circumstances. Sure, there are people like that--but they are in the minority.

In fact, a common theme among men seeking relationships in the FSU is that women here tend to be more expressive of their sexuality than are typical American women. Western men are often surprised at how ladies here are more ready and willing to engage in sex with men they are attracted to early in an acquaintance than typical American women are.

It is also a generational issue--with the younger people typically much more open to sex on a more casual basis than their older compatriots...in both places.

Whenever this subject tends to puzzle you, remember that the U.S. remains far more conservative on these issues than Europe is.

David

[Daveman]

Well people anywhere have sex for a variety of reasons -- pleasure, boredom, fun, revenge, whatever, and it's actually a different part of the brain from that which is activated for "love".

Love is a game of finesse... even with the words.. say the words too soon and it can screw up an otherwise healthy growing attraction (whatever you want to call it)...  or if one "loves" and the other just wants to have fun - well you get the idea.

There's nothing "American culture" about any of it really.  What you state here:

...
The thing I don't get is: is that a normal, common sequence of how relationship works in the US? Do Americans first start going out, having sex, and then (may be, which isn't obligatory) fall in love? Is having sex without love normal? Is falling in love considered to be some kind of weakness or undesirable behaviour? Or am I missing here something?

The bold part could be applied to the FSU quite easily and truthfully as it probably could be most anywhere.  Also the opposite can be true... waiting for love and and then have sex, or in some cases even waiting for marriage (though probably much more if not exceedingly rare).

Sexual attitudes vary by (descending order) individual values, family values, regional values, cultural values, of which religion may or may not play a part among other factors including but not limited to, the effect of alcohol and/or hormone levels at the moment  

What you watch on American TV shows or in movies is mostly fantasy based on some partial truth or situational reality... reality just doesn't exist in the same way, and if there is or does happen to be a carbon copy iteration somewhere that would be the exception rather than the norm (I'm sure somewhere "Sex in the City" must be real, eh?  or a group of "Friends" living in such a manner in an area of million+ flats). Just as every group of young Russian boys during peristroika created their own multi-million ruble "Brigada" entrepreneurial enterprise.

[possum]

Every guy's dream is to have a female friend with benefits, and although the concept isn't exclusive to the US or the West in general, it has become a cultural norm there.. Why bother with romance, feelings, and other emotionally demanding and time consuming distractions when you can get a quick bang every now and then while still being able to enjoy your new i-pod nano (Xbox, PS4, you name it)..

[Rutherford]

Often , life reflects art , that's where it starts  with some form of art  and the public picks up on it  and copies it .
I am sure that "Sex in the City " is something  that is more real now than before the show  was created .
It's our   TV shows , music  and so on , is why we have lost out traditions .

RR

[ECOCKS]

Every guy's dream is to have a female friend with benefits, and although the concept isn't exclusive to the US or the West in general, it has become a cultural norm there.. Why bother with romance, feelings, and other emotionally demanding and time consuming distractions when you can get a quick bang every now and then while still being able to enjoy your new i-pod nano (Xbox, PS4, you name it)..

Sorry Al, I might agree with it being "most" guys' dream but it was never mine nor applocable to a few of my other buds.

[possum]

Sorry Al, I might agree with it being "most" guys' dream but it was never mine nor applocable to a few of my other buds.

I was mostly referring to the younger generation that grew up on reality shows and tasteless comedies, such as American Pie and countless others..

[Steamer]

The thing I don't get is: is that a normal, common sequence of how relationship works in the US?

No.
It's a very common mistake to confuse television with reality.

[Muzh]

For all those of you that said it's TV and not reality, I say Not So Fast.

For an older generation it would be fantasy. For today's kids, it is the norm. A show of hands who have highschool kids? And they DO TALK to you?

A lot of these young kids have no clue what love is, however, ask them about sex.

[Shadow]

I guess reading the opinions of men, and taking a look in the trip report section would answer your question. 
However this is not limited to any country, age or gender. For some people sex is connected with love only, for others it is completely separate, many are somewhere in between.

[Boethius]

About half of all American teens leave high school as virgins.  Unless their attitudes about sex change dramatically during college, I doubt casual sex becomes the norm.

[Steamer]

For all those of you that said it's TV and not reality, I say Not So Fast.
For an older generation it would be fantasy. For today's kids, it is the norm.

That just says that kids can't tell the difference between fantasy and reality.
Adults "should" know the difference.
This is part of the reason why people outside the US get such screwed up ideas about the US. A lifetime of Bruce Willis movies, Sex in the City and Santa Barbara and then everyone's an expert on life in America.

[ECOCKS]

I was mostly referring to the younger generation that grew up on reality shows and tasteless comedies, such as American Pie and countless others..

True, there's certainly a seemingly more distinct than normal cultural shift as the new generation of adults come to grips with consequences and responsibilities. While my generation was supposedly raised and heavily influenced by television, it is clear that the Internet is messing around with the boundaries and definitions in our society. We see this in the new class of cyber-crimes and behaviors which are showing us undreamed of events and consequences in the areas of violence, publication, intellectual theft, dating, philosophy and increasingly easy access to information and organizations which was undreamed of 20 years ago. Now it seems to be all about gratification and simply switch to a new virtual zone whenever it seems like the bill is coming due.

[Shostakovich]

I doubt casual sex becomes the norm.

Love and lifetime commitment are increasingly confusing to people, young and old.  The sexual impulse, however, if anything, grows stronger, encouraged in so many ways.  It is true that the US is more conservative than Europe.  You'd never see the nudity observed on daytime TV in Europe in the US and it seems that every disco has a strip show, etc.  But the trend is towards the 'Brave new world' in the US too.

[IAmZon]

Excellent question and it leads to many more.

In the USA, people are alienated from themselves, and the society in general is undergoing enormous transformation. (If I was a Psychologist I would make a longer an more meaningful statement).  We are without norms, rituals, and mythologies that would show a man how to behave, and a woman how to behave.  So, we guess, and watch a lot of television that contains commercials that show us who we should become - and what we should buy.

When a person LOVES another with a commitment, that is a purchase (although an emotional one); and brings with it an associated "status" like what kind of car you drive.  So, people in the USA are very very very careful not to become associated too fast, or carelessly ( you want to make sure you are driving the best and most expensive car possible).

Sex is something I think most people understand they need.  In the interests of full disclosure, I have not had sex with an American woman for 3 years I think - but I remember it was rather unremarkable, and carried with it tons of errands and small obligations.

I have moved from being IN the USA society, to more of an OBSERVER ... I guess now I am a CRITIC.  I know this may seem overly extreme, but there are foundational truths here - good food for thought ... http://www.singularity2050.com/2010/01/the-misandry-bubble.html

Ciao for a while ...

[Blues Fairy]

As his friends explained him, he shouldn't have said such a thing so soon.

...because now, like an honest man, he has an obligation to marry her. 

I don't believe this is a reflection of American culture; just of a bunch of insecure kids who are scared of intimacy.  Usually, with maturity, this fear disappears unless people are seriously damaged. 

But neither is love a prerequisite to sex; I suppose it develops in parallel.

[Shostakovich]

Excellent question and it leads to many more.

In the USA, people are alienated from themselves, and the society in general is undergoing enormous transformation.

I have moved from being IN the USA society, to more of an OBSERVER ... I guess now I am a CRITIC.  I know this may seem overly extreme, but there are foundational truths here - good food for thought ... http://www.singularity2050.com/2010/01/the-misandry-bubble.html

Alienation is a global concern these days, it is just that the USA has lead the charge.  There are many excellent authors who have made this a theme of their work.  Erich Fromm comes to mind.   Materialism is the default philosophy, given strength through the decline of religion and a general confusion regarding what to make of the idea of a spiritual center in life.  In fact there are many in the US who understand this, and all its expressions that result from it: Hedonism, A stronger embrace of Fundamental doctrines of religion, Retail Therapy, New Age, even an over emphasis on the body with many expressions itself; hatha yoga, supplements, gym, etc., and, conversely, the fat problem.  Basically people want comfort as the primary thing; not a new idea -- Plato describes the majority as the appetitive.  In yoga they get the appellation, creaturely.  But the sacred requires sacrifice.  This is the interesting thing; people are less alienated when toiling in their traditional roles.   Given the time to explore life the only thing that happens is that they consume more and the identification with objects of pleasure grows stronger.  Thus a momentum of the mind becomes established that gradually defines all things, inanimate and not, according to the pleasure principal.  But objects have only a limited potential to satisfy and hence this orientation puts one on a treadmill that leads nowhere except to the roller coaster of satisfaction and frustration and the alienation described.  People are geared to seek comfort, they way they are wired to seek sugary foods.  But comfort is a stepping stone, not a destination.  The failure to see this is a human problem, not a US problem.  Our abundance has led us to a sink hole.  The truth is covered by a golden disk.  True words that have always played out on the canvas of life, though now with a somewhat different twist.  Much of our problems just resolve to the fascination with the golden disc rather than the truth that stands behind it.   

[JR]

That's not the first series or movie with such kind of plot - I've seen quite enough movies with such a storyline.

Exactly, you've seen movies, not documentaries. Everything imaginable happens...doesn't make it a norm. A woman having regular sex with one man and not developing close emotional ties is damaged. Or the guy was a jerk.

[Jooky]

About half of all American teens leave high school as virgins.  Unless their attitudes about sex change dramatically during college, I doubt casual sex becomes the norm.

Hmmm... strange comment. The first years of college is exactly when most people I grew up with changed their attitudes towards sex. Made sense to me, everyone getting away from home and being immersed in a very 'liberal' college environment.

[Jooky]

The thing I don't get is: is that a normal, common sequence of how relationship works in the US? Do Americans first start going out, having sex, and then (may be, which isn't obligatory) fall in love? Is having sex without love normal? Is falling in love considered to be some kind of weakness or undesirable behaviour? Or am I missing here something?

Where I'm from (San Francisco area) this was and is normal enough. Actually what goes on with the younger generations almost shocks me.

Have I known girls that dump guys that express their feeling too quick? Yup. Have I known girls that at the same time will relegate a guy to being 'just friends' when he won't put out early enough? Yup. Have I know guys afraid to say the dreaded 'L' word? Yup. Even after months or a year of dating? Yup. Have I know people that live and act like the retards on 'reality tv'? Oh yeah.

Sex without love, friends with benefits, talking about feelings being taboo ... pretty common here.

It's very interesting to read everyone else's comments on this. My observation is that these attitudes vary based on generation, location and the individual and that whatever a person's attitude is, they usually feel that they are part of the 'norm'. (Except for me, I've always been a misfit  )

[Boethius]

Hmmm... strange comment. The first years of college is exactly when most people I grew up with changed their attitudes towards sex. Made sense to me, everyone getting away from home and being immersed in a very 'liberal' college environment.

They may start having sex, but in my experience, most individuals do not change their 'core' beliefs. 

[Jooky]

They may start having sex, but in my experience, most individuals do not change their 'core' beliefs. 

Well, like I said above, different generations, different locations, different experiences.

I've seen plenty of youngsters influenced during their first year of college, changing their attitudes towards premarital sex, casual sex, bisexual experimentation, drugs, smoking, religion, you name it, and I've seen plenty of people change their attitudes towards these much later in life as well.

I just find it interesting that for some here, the attitudes Nat is asking about are 'only on tv'. That's how I felt about the Jerry Springer show until I tried online dating in Nevada. Life imitating art, art imitating life, both imitating crud? I dunno.

[Boethius]

Locations may make a difference, but minimal.  Generations also may make a difference, but again, likely minimal.  Kids in junior high were having sex when I was in junior high school, but most were not, and that is still true.  The only real difference I see is in the attitude toward homosexuality.  Kids now are far less homophobic, at least where I live, than they were when I was that age.