Am I being scammed?

[tjust]

I have corresponding with a 25 year old female from Ukraine for the last 2 months.  My whole approach to this process is hoping for the best but expecting the worst.  I have not seen any major red flags yet.  She said she wants to meet but is not confessing love or crazy stuff about a guy she has not met.  She has not asked for penny or does not have any sob stories. 

Last week I payed the agency she is with to get her personal information and she accepted.  I asked her to stop corresponding to me through the agency and just you her personal email.  I just received this letter from her "personal email" in Russian but I translated it.

Hello …. I’ve got your email, but couldn’t reply at once.
I have no internet at home, while at work we are not allowed to use it for personal needs. There’s even a special spy program, that monitors all actions at pc. That’s why it took me so long to reply you, internet café is far from my house and I have almost no free time after work.
For me it is better to write you via the agency, this way I get your translated letters and send mine for translation, I can also tell them my reply on the phone.
I would like to meet you a lot, I’ll be able to write at your email quite rarely.
Waiting to hear from you.


Now I wanted to stop using the agency because I wanted to stop paying to open her letters.  Now she is telling me she wants to go right back to the agency.  Most of the reasons seem valid though.  I am sure she gets a cut each I time I pay to open a letter.

Am I getting scammed?  Any Ukrainians on here have a better idea about the current internet access issues there?  She is from Sevastopol.  I have only put a small amount of money into this so far.  I am at a point now where I want to stop contact completely to be honest.  Any advice would be appreciated.

[ECOCKS]

Scammed? Maybe.

But Bud, she's just not that into you.

Tell her you understand and you're content to wait for her responses when she can make time to get to them.

In the meantime, cast your line again and see what nibbles you get. If you keep getting these gals, maybe you need to take another look at your expectations and how you are selecting them.

[Faux Pas]

Scammed? Maybe.

But Bud, she's just not that into you.

Tell her you understand and you're content to wait for her responses when she casn make time to get to them.

In the meantime, cast your line again and see what nibbles you get. If you keep getting these gals, maybe you need to take another looj at your expectations and how you are selecting them.

+1


You are not being scammed unless you are sending money. You are being played for a chump by the agency and most likely her. Unless she lives in some obscure village out in the boondocks, she has email availability besides the agency. If she was into you, you would in all probability by now be communicating outside of the agency.


My advice is to move on. Find a woman that is into you. This one isn't but, diesn't want to lose you as a customer

[Muzh]

tjust:
 
Congratulations, you are about to throw the baby along with the bathwater.
 
Your problem is that you are reading too many BS about scammers. As FP says, if you don't send money, you don't get scammed.
 
There is a very good possibility that she does not have a home computer. Did you have any problems getting her address from the agency? No? Why the scamming?
 
Take a deep breath and relax.
 
That a girl you have never met 7 thousand miles away is not confessing love to you is actually a good sign. In my book, she has some common sense.
 
Why don't you take your time to know her better and then come back, let's say in about 6 months after you have spent time getting to know her, and ask some more questions. Right now you'll hear what you want to hear.
 
It's up to you.
 
P.S. Is this the same way you would approach a local girl? Think carefully your answer.

[Mila]

Hi there,
it is a very basic situation, which happens to many foreigners who correspond with an agency translators. Of course they don't want to loose a client who brings money to the agency and translator answered you in a polite way, that a girl you talk to has no computer at home and it is not allowed to use Internet at work, it is not true, as nobody controls you at work. This is an excuse and it is so evident. My advice-don't write letters through the agencies. You can find a nice girl on a free web site and talk to her directly.

[Shadow]

As you have her contact data, ask her phone number and tell you will set up a three-way conversation with a translator (if needed Mila can do this).
Should she also not have any phone available, dump her.

[ECOCKS]

+1


You are not being scammed unless you are sending money. You are being played for a chump by the agency and most likely her. Unless she lives in some obscure village out in the boondocks, she has email availability besides the agency. If she was into you, you would in all probability by now be communicating outside of the agency.


My advice is to move on. Find a woman that is into you. This one isn't but, diesn't want to lose you as a customer

 Exactly. The "scam" is milking you for communications cost in this case.
 
 As FP and so many of us try to warn newbies, almost everyone has access to the Internet.
 
 Does she ride a wagon to the village market on Saturdays carrying a basket of eggs to trade for some salo and fish for the next week's meals?
 
 Just out of curiosity are you saying that her message back to you were based on someone else writing what she gave them in a phone call? Have you considered what the meaning of her statement really is saying?
 
 They got the per letter monies from you, the fee for passing contact info and now she is saying stay on a per letter fee arrangement because it's inconvenient to get to the Internet?
 
 How many letters and service fees are you going to rack up before you figure this out? What's your total to date?

[Mila]

Yes, I agree with Shadow to ask for her phone number is a good idea, but there is also a trick about it. They may give you a phone number of a translator instead and you will pay money to talk with a translator but not the girl. The only way out is to arrange a 3 way call with her with a web cam function, only then, you will know whom you are talking to. If you need my help, I'll be glad to help you. But, I doubt it will work, as agencies don't allow freelance interpreter to help. But, you can try. If she is serious about you, she will give her contact details for sure, if no, then she will find an excuse. I wish you luck!

[TheTraveler]

I agree with Ed's advice.
 
Like Ed, I'm not saying to necessarily dump her, but I wouldn't pay another dime to her agency.  Whenever you are paying money to an agency, you can never be sure of her sincerity.
 
There are hundreds of thousands of available girls in Ukraine and Russia that do have internet... girls that you will not have to pay per letter.
 
Her lack of internet is 100% her problem to solve.  My advise is to don't let it become your problem.  Also, I would spread a wide net and correspond with other girls to broaden your options and increase your chances of finding the best possible match.
 
Good luck!

[diverboy70]

I cant really say about your case, but I have found my own method of how to deal with correspondense, some of you may say that I am way too harsh and that Im loosing a lot of opportunities, but this is a way that works for me.
 
Its maybe not so much about scammers, today I think I can see 90% of them in the first two letters, but then again, Im maybe throwing out the baby.
 
I never send more than two or three letters, depending on the circumstanses, then Skype or phone or forget it. If the girl is interested in you she will give you her Skype id or phonenumber. I dont see the point in e-mails after the basic facts are settled. After that you have to try to find out if there is some potential between you. A couple of days of Skyping, either by chat or voice/cam will usually give you an idea if it something you want t proceed with.
After a while you will see in the first letter if she is for real or not, I avoid the word scammer here, because I nowadays never go that  far that I will find out.
So just for an example of how I go about it today: I met one girl on Russiancupid, saw her photos and info, sent a message, got an answer and we pretty soon went on to Skype, dont think it was more than maybe two letters. Today we are Skyping, sms:ing and also have contact on facebook and Vkontakte.ru daily, we are planing a meeting in Helsinki in November. She is from Moscow, highly educated has a good job, refuses me to pay for her hotel room, since she wants to be in control.
Another girl from SPB, same thing maybe two letters then facebook an ICQ, communicating a little every day but no immidiate plans to meet. Discussions are very much on day to day subjects with some indepth talks about life wievs now and then. She works for an multinational company and have been an exchange student in the US.
Both these girls I know for 100 % are real and who they say they are.
That is another of my rules, she has to be nearly fluent in English, if not the odds are too bad.
Im only using "dating sites" no agencies.
I have found out that these are the factors that works for me: Good English, Good ways of communications, willingness (from my side) to get on the plane in about 2 months from first contact.
I never get into long e-mail conversations anymore, it may work for some, but its not for me.
I try to get it down to as close as possible to local dating.
I dont know if this was of any use or if I was totally of topic here, but I hope it might have given the OP some food for thoughts.

[JohnDearGreen]

She said she wants to meet but is not confessing love or crazy stuff about a guy she has not met.  She has not asked for penny or does not have any sob stories. 

Tell her you don't like email, but plan to be there in person in 2 months.  Then see what she says.  Don't drop her if she interests you - if nothing else, you can always use ladies like this as backups or filler for your free time on your trip.

[Shadow]

I never send more than two or three letters, depending on the circumstanses, then Skype or phone or forget it. If the girl is interested in you she will give you her Skype id or phonenumber. I dont see the point in e-mails after the basic facts are settled. After that you have to try to find out if there is some potential between you. A couple of days of Skyping, either by chat or voice/cam will usually give you an idea if it something you want t proceed with.

The problem is of course that by not having a computer the girl in this case has already closed the Skype option. As her English language probably is told to be bad, direct phone communication without a third party is going to be difficult as well.

[Olly]

I think all what she said is not true.
1. She can not have a PC only if she live in the deep village but she said "There’s even a special spy program, that monitors all actions at pc. " it means she live in big town and work at good company. 
2. OK she have a PC but have not internet. it is possible but she have friends and internet cafe in city.
3. "I have almost no free time after work" - if she interesting - she will find time.

I think it is just agency's games for not loss client.

PS: sorry my english is not so good yet :-)

[ECOCKS]

You did very well Olly!

Very good that you noticed about the PC with spyware meaning a more advanced company.

My thought when I saw that was that it sounded like something an agency would say to justify why she was still communicating through the agency.

I agree with your logic, no company like that will have facilities in a small, backwoods village.

Thanks for your contribution!

[2tallbill]

You did very well Olly!

Very good that you noticed about the PC with spyware meaning a more advanced company.

My thought when I saw that was that it sounded like something an agency would say to justify why she was still communicating through the agency.

I agree with your logic, no company like that will have facilities in a small, backwoods village.

Thanks for your contribution!

The girl is from Sevastopol which isn't a back woods village and they have internet cafes.


I agree with your advice that she's just not that into him and I think he should probably move on.
He could send her a letter in Russian using Mila or one of the fluent translators here to her email
address suggesting a three way call with "his" translator. He will probably get another elaborate
excuse, but then he will know for sure.

[remiel6]

offer to get a third party translator, not connected to the agency. You then write the translator and have the translator call the girl to read the letter to her and get her reply and write back. I've never been to this city, but know many Ukrainians who do not have their own computer and whose personal schedules don't afford them the chance to go to the internet cafe every day.

[jackman]

wait a minute!   she has internet to contact the agency, but not to contact you!   
she is probably getting kickbacks from the agency for sending emails and chatting.

[jackman]

also you may want to stay away from any  woman who has no working knowledge of English.  even if she is no scam, and you meet her in person, you will have to have a translator present, which is like a total romance killer and invasion of intimate privacy ( I have done it and it is painful).  so either learn Russian or find one that can at least communicate barely enough in English.

[Eduard]

wait a minute!   she has internet to contact the agency, but not to contact you!   
she is probably getting kickbacks from the agency for sending emails and chatting.

actually it's very possible that "she" doesn't even know that the guy exists and the agency translator is writing all letters.

[Jumper]

He dint state what agency he met her through,but it isn't hard to guess its likely one of the Dream marriage, anastasia, HRB RLM etc styles.
 
I think the odds are she is working at the agency.
 
It may very well be the only internet she has daily or easy access to..
 
and yes,  they do have software that monitors if she opens her personal email or other websites,
and she is forbidden to contact him frequently in that way , even when he has bought her direct contact info.
 
It's just the big agencies, and their affiliates, usual game.
 
 They dont want to lose their income, and neither does she! Even if she is interested, she isn't going to risk losing a job that pays better than most anything else she can get in Sevastopol,for one of hundreds of men she communicates daily with around the world,who all say they like her and plan to visit.
 
She could be interested, or she could not have any interest at all.Yet the reply would be the same, because either way she's constrained by the circumstances in which they met, and those are not in his favor.
 
When using such agencies ,it's almost impossible to sort that out, odds are very high shes simply working,
 and why the advise is to avoid them.
 
The hook is *she* might be actually interested, and that keeps men coming back,
 the dream, the uncertainty ,the *what if*?
The only way he would know for certain is to travel there and spend time with her.
 
Since knee deep in it already, and paid for her contact information,  why not arrange a time to call or skype.
She should have some friends that have skype,
 or her own cell phone.
Her interest in persuing these other avenues , and how often she wants to talk, will tell you something.
 
 
Ultimately it's an impossible task without taking a lot of risks.
Risks you wouldn't need to take if meeting through other ways.
 
 

[Muzh]

actually it's very possible that "she" doesn't even know that the guy exists and the agency translator is writing all letters.

Ed, you are confusing the issue.
 
The women are scammers. There are no if, ands or buts about it. Plain scamers. Haven't you seen pages and pages of these conniving shedogs? 

[Jumper]

Ed, you are confusing the issue.
 
The women are scammers. There are no if, ands or buts about it. Plain scamers. Haven't you seen pages and pages of these conniving shedogs? 

I see the tongue in cheek..
 
 
but  in such agencies, a lot of women are indeed working,
and it's their primary source of income, and pays better than most regular jobs.
yet they (if single) would have genuine interest in meeting a good foriegn man.
 
So are they  out right scammers or no?
 
Does it only depend on their marital (or taken) status?
 
or are they morally  ethically challenged regardless?
Or would that in itself depend on what the various men actually wrote to them?or the mens motivations?
 
The world isn't as black and white as many like to paint it, certainly not in the FSU, and certainly NOT in most MOB agencies there.
 
If men want to play in those type of agencies,  accept the reality. Most women are working,
a great deal are actually single and would still entertain the idea of meeting a guy they found interesting.
 Some are married and have boyfriends, its just a job, but make no mistake in those type of agencies a huge percentage are indeed working.They will treat it as a job until something the man does makes him seem more real or serious, or more interesting to her, she still wont toss away a good job over a fleeting chance, so the risk will be his to take.
If he has nothing but time.. its his dime, ,,why not.
 
 
if he wants better odds , then most any other way of meeting ,
is better than through such agencies.
 
There are few good agencies out there, none of whom would be playing the games he is involved in..
 
 
 

[Eduard]

Ed, you are confusing the issue.
 
The women are scammers. There are no if, ands or buts about it. Plain scamers. Haven't you seen pages and pages of these conniving shedogs? 

you are right, all women are scammers! I just got scammed out of the last cookie by my daughter! 

[Hammer2722]

you are right, all women are scammers! I just got scammed out of the last cookie by my daughter! 

Those FSU girls can be very crafty. They learn at a very young age!!!! LOL

[Eduard]

I see the tongue in cheek..
 
 
but  in such agencies, a lot of women are indeed working,
and it's their primary source of income, and pays better than most regular jobs.
yet they (if single) would have genuine interest in meeting a good foriegn man.
 
So are they  out right scammers or no?
 
Does it only depend on their marital (or taken) status?
 
or are they morally  ethically challenged regardless?
Or would that in itself depend on what the various men actually wrote to them?or the mens motivations?
 
The world isn't as black and white as many like to paint it, certainly not in the FSU, and certainly NOT in most MOB agencies there.
 
If men want to play in those type of agencies,  accept the reality. Most women are working,
a great deal are actually single and would still entertain the idea of meeting a guy they found interesting.
 Some are married and have boyfriends, its just a job, but make no mistake in those type of agencies a huge percentage are indeed working.They will treat it as a job until something the man does makes him seem more real or serious, or more interesting to her, she still wont toss away a good job over a fleeting chance, so the risk will be his to take.
If he has nothing but time.. its his dime, ,,why not.
 
 
if he wants better odds , then most any other way of meeting ,
is better than through such agencies.
 
There are few good agencies out there, none of whom would be playing the games he is involved in..

this almost sounds like trying to find a wife going to strip bars trying to stand out so that one of the strippers would notice you and agree to see you outside her work invironment, doesn't it? Considering that more than 99% of single FSU women are not part of the mail order bride industry wouldn't it make a lot more sense to try to get noticed by those women instead?