Divorced RW experience of dating in the US.

[GQBlues]

...blah, blah, blah about some sille bee story......

It's more of a business vacation trip.  I wouldn't be transacting any business, but it would be a tax write-off for business purposes.....

LOL.
 
Ahh, a little more honey truth comes out. So you're planning to hopefully be on a cross-pollination cruise with a couple, or a few, willing honey-bees and get the cost of that trip written off, okay! Now we're talkin'...
 
That may anger Obama, but dude, it's your money. I'm with you there.

Neither.  I haven't had been looking in churches.  I haven't really been looking period.  I keep my eyes open, but I don't go out searching to find someone.  It'd be great to find someone, but I've been single long enough that I'm not going to lose sleep if I stay single.

Oh...so you don't actually practice what you preach, I see. You just like giving out advise without actually knowing if it would work or not, right? You're lierally at the peak of your manhood and you're trying to convince normal folks that somehow it is YOUR choice to be dateless, desperate and home alone. Yeah, right. Like a silly bumble bee, all buzz no sting.
 

I see you have problems reading too. You thought wrong about what I am convinced of. Vasilisa wanted suggestions for finding a good guy, and I recommended a church as a place where she had a better chance of finding a good guy than on Match.com

No, no, no...I can read just fine. Matter of fact, I can even *read* people pretty well too especially a bumbling bee on a silly honey-hunt. Denying reality just doesn't get you anywhere. Your mere presence here despite your silly anti-dating antics you're spewing out confirms that Farmer. You shall soon understand the more you dare to be different, the more you'll simple become just like everyone else. LOL. Learn from that because you wouldn't want to be a MOB'er who tell folks when asked how you met your SO that you met at a church, or the seeming more popular choice - the supermarket - the honey section. It will never do justice both to you and your future partner if this is the road you choose to take. LOL.
 
Besides, you just bellow out a bunch of BS it's tough to sparse through your tripe and it's giving you the impression folks can't read. But I'm with you...
 

Seeing as how the word date originally meant an appointment with a prostitute, and seeing as how many male attitudes on here seem to view women as only sex objects instead of marriage partners, I think the answer to your question is rather self-explanatory. 

People have confused courtship for a marriage partner with looking at women as sex objects.

Really?!? So you're searching for a partner that will never temper the rod? Boil the eggs? or at least get the juices flowing? Farmer, Women WANT to be WANTED. Women WANT to be sexually DESIRED.
 
Of course the caveat there is - YOU have to be the right man. But sorry that reality hasn't worked out well for you so far...

I already answered that, but that would have required reading.   

The short answer - I'd rather be alone than to be miserable by being with someone who wasn't what I wanted.  I haven't yet found a compatible woman that I felt was serious about marriage.

In short, you're just a lonely guy who couldn't find anyone to play with and that's why you're planning a business trip. Farmer, here's a pretty good avice. Try reality sometime, you might just like it and feel so much better about yourself.

[lonedrake]

  Bee Farmer came in and gave some advice to Vasilisa......and she appreciated it.

  :welcome:Bee Farmer.

 
 I hope you stick around

[jone]

He's written so much that even a blind squirrel finds a nut occasionally.  If he could construct his thoughts and put them in one paragraph, I would certainly be more ammenable.

[newjason]

  Bee Farmer came in and gave some advice to Vasilisa......and she appreciated it.

  :welcome:Bee Farmer.

 
 I hope you stick around

She did? 
No where has Vasilisa commented on BF's BS.
I can't speak for her , but I know her personality well enough to be sure that she would have handed his behind to him on a platter by now.

Why do you guys just pull these delusions out of thin air ?

The only think that's happened here is this thread has been hijacked by Trolls.

[Lily]

Dear Moderators,
It seems to me that Vasilisa's thread has developed into some other discussion. Wouldn't it make sense to split the topic into two, and to give a new name to the other thread?

[Hammer2722]

Dear Moderators,
It seems to me that Vasilisa's thread has developed into some other discussion. Wouldn't it make sense to split the topic into two, and to five a new name to the other thread?

I agree with Lily. the thread has been hi-jacked! 

[jone]

Frankly, I wish the thread would stay on point and the idea of censure has it's appeal. 

[AnonMod]

Dear Moderators,
It seems to me that Vasilisa's thread has developed into some other discussion. Wouldn't it make sense to split the topic into two, and to give a new name to the other thread?

I agree with Lily. the thread has been hi-jacked! 

Frankly, I wish the thread would stay on point and the idea of censure has it's appeal. 

Done. Those of you that wish to continue Bee Farmer's verbal masturbation can find a new thread for accomplishing that pleasure. Please let's leave it off of this one and continue on topic 

[2tallbill]

Ok, now there is a question, what are these men hoping to get and what is the percentage of men
like that vs decent men on the dating websites, you guess?!

78% of statistics are made up on the spot!

Decent men are exactly 31.225% of all profiles


Nobody can accurately tell you what percentage of men are honest.

[ML]

Because the truth would lesson the chances of getting the gal to at least give you a shot.

If they find you an interesting date, some later discovered fibs on profiles will be overlooked.

[Trenchcoat]

Because the truth would lesson the chances of getting the gal to at least give you a shot.

If they find you an interesting date, some later discovered fibs on profiles will be overlooked.

That's very well said ML and true. I generally don't like to lie on profiles or stuff in general and generally I don't. I understand if a girl did it to me it would piss me off but if there was attraction there I wouldn't necessarily end it with her over it.

Instead I tend to put things in certain ways on my profiles, some might call being articulate others might say (upon reflection) that it's not being 100 percent upfront. Then again, 'what is the truth?' I have found in the past that girls can have a hang up over what job I do. Some have been messaging happily away and at least one of them as soon as I tell her the job I do all goes silent on her end and no further joy. Many girls have a crude understanding as to the way things are in the world. They think they can pigeon hole guys by the job they do to socioeconomic status. In the West that can be less true these days than in the past. Many girls can also view socioeconomic status in too important a light.

A lot of girls don't understand that a guy could chuck in what may be seen as a low economic status job overnight - let's say for example as a toilet cleaner (not what I do) and all of a sudden that guy is not a toilet cleaner, does that make him more attractive to women? Women so often tend to be obsessed with Status I think and it can be a very superficial thing. I could chuck in what they might see as a low status job tomorrow, I could buy a high prestige car the next day (used but relatively new perhaps) and the day after buy some fancy new clothes, go down the gym, etc. So if I had saved up a lot of money in a low status job perhaps by being single and working long hours I could perhaps do that then go get any other work if I needed to later, is perhaps I had won the lottery, come into inheritance, became a business partner with someone, etc, etc... All of a sudden within a week I am no longer being seen as a low status guy by many women but a guy who part runs a business, has a nice car, is well dressed, and is in good shape, etc. Truth might be though that in chucking in that low status job I might be worse off, the business I partner in might struggle to make much money but to a woman I look like I'm the man lol

As you have said ML women who are into you overlook it if there is attraction but if course you don't get to that if she strikes you off before meeting because of what you do which as said can be changed overnight like changing ones underwear 🩲 My own situation, if I wasn't with someone I could soon chuck in my job and live of independent income to a lot of these FSW I would all of a sudden look like 'the man' and be quite desirable. A bit like a guy who one week is covered in sh*t while he finishes building his own house while a few weeks later he finishes it and he is all of a sudden not a grubby looking builder but a guy in a nice posh house lol. Reality can really be quite fickle and women often attach too great an importance to how things seem at a given moment in time. I personally wouldn't say use that as an excuse to lie to them but don't sweat it too much about not laying it all out at the outset, if they walk away later over it they probably weren't the one for you anyway.

[Trenchcoat]

Of course if a WM went out to Ukraine at the moment even stayed there a while on a small independent income he could probably go from being a relative pauper to a prince lol. I think most of not all women want their prince but they just often only see what they see at face value. I often see them like bad pawnbrokers at a pawn shop, all that glitters is not gold. Even in the West side guys often young guys get badly into debt buying flash cards that they know will attract the local girls and expensive gear to look the part for them but they are financially worse off than the guy in the crappy old supermini and the everyday clothes.

[2tallbill]

Of course if a WM went out to Ukraine at the moment even stayed there a while on a small independent income he could probably go from being a relative pauper to a prince lol. I think most of not all women want their prince but they just often only see what they see at face value. I often see them like bad pawnbrokers at a pawn shop, all that glitters is not gold. Even in the West side guys often young guys get badly into debt buying flash cards that they know will attract the local girls and expensive gear to look the part for them but they are financially worse off than the guy in the crappy old supermini and the everyday clothes.

 
Hijacked thread alert! Hijacked thread alert! Hijacked thread alert! Hijacked thread alert!
Hijacked thread alert! Hijacked thread alert! Hijacked thread alert! Hijacked thread alert!
Hijacked thread alert! Hijacked thread alert! Hijacked thread alert! Hijacked thread alert!

The original thread was about Divorced RW living trying to date in the West. She also
asked about men lying and using inaccurate photos.

So naturally, you made the thread about you. You do have several threads that you started
that you can add on to, and many that the mods made for you to espouse/repeat yourself. 

You are still trying to justify your theory(ies) that you can live in some country and live large. Even
though you have close to zero language skills. Imagine if you took various pieces of my advice 9+ years
ago when you first came here. You would be close to fluent, you would be very fit and you would have a
workable plan. Right now you have a somewhat dubious dream/theory.

Is your remodel finished? Your dream theory is predicated on your finishing your multi year
remodel. Renting out your house and having nothing go wrong with your renters while you
live like a rock star in Ukraine (which you won't go to because there is a war on).

[2tallbill]

Frankly, I wish the thread would stay on point and the idea of censure has it's appeal.

We have a Trenchcoat. I woke this thread up recently after a decade of sleep

[olgac]

I think Vasilisa must have found a new husband by now But it's an interesting topic for me because my young Russian female friend is dating now and I hear all sorts of stories from her
She is not exactly complaining that men are lying in their profiles, but many men don't specify their job/profession and this is very important to her as she is looking for a guy who culd be a provider at least for the period of marriage when the kids are small.

I suppose the difference between her and a FSU woman who hasn't moved here yet is that she knows exactly what salary is needed for a man to meet her needs. She has a good professional job here herself (she won a greencard and found a job that brought her here) yet she can't imagine supporting an additional adult and child on her salary, so I helped her compute how much a couple needs to make approximately to live in our area and afford a house.

I tried convincing her that even meeting someone with the same income as her would work out because with double income you can live very well, afford a house etc. But she keeps telling me that she wouldn't feel "safe and secure" with a man who expects a wife to pay everything 50/50, and that she is sure she doesn't want to work when pregnant or kids are small.

Kind of hard for me to understand because I have always had good jobs, worked through pregnancy and then hired a nanny because we could afford it with 2 good salaries and we did very well, we could retire early etc. In fact I don't think my husband would have wanted a stay at home wife. But I am older than her, another generation. When I was growing up, most women in FSU worked along with their husbands. It seems the new generation of FSU women have watched too many instagram influencers who preach about a man needed to "take responsibility", "be a provider" etc etc.
So I guess this is wat my friend wants in a man.

We computed the man then needs to make at least 150K to support a family even in our LCOL area.
She is having a hard time finding such a man. Of course she wants a man she is physically attracted to, not much older than her. (Though I told her there are probably many more traditional men who make that much at least among say 45 year old men, btu for her they just look too old)

Would have been really helpful if men mentioned their education and profession in their profile.

So to get back on a topic, she had to stop talking to men (just like trenchcoat mentioned) several times once she found out what they do for a living. Not sure what is going to happen in the future. At 32 she has only so much time to get married and have kids, which is what I keep telling her.

My husband is 9 years older AND we made money together for 20+ years, and we are pretty happy, so I don't know... I guess young kids these days...

[ML]

Olga, you have a very good attitude regarding men-women roles and expectations.

You were a very good 'catch' for your husband !

[olgac]

Olga, you have a very good attitude regarding men-women roles and expectations.

You were a very good 'catch' for your husband !

Thank You So is Your wife! This is probably why both of us are married so long.
I told my friend that the problem with men who are "каменная стена" (meaning a good provider) is that at any time
they can become "каменная стена" for some other younger woman. And it's important for a woman to be selfsufficient.
I am teaching her some programming now

[ML]

And it's important for a woman to be self sufficient.

This should be taught in High School and even lower grades.

I remember some years ago that an important woman in USA (can't remember her name) often mentioned this in her speeches.

She even went further than (don't rely on a man) and said please don't become a burden on society (money wise).

My daughter, when she was in college, started dating a guy who had aspirations of becoming a high school sports coach.

I gently told my daughter that she had better be prepared to be the major earner in the family and be lonely most of the time.  She didn't like my comment . . . but she eventually did not continue with him.

- - - - - -

Another story:  A woman friend of mine told of complaining when hired about the company taking money from her salary for a required pension program.  She said: I don't need a retirement program because my husband has one.

After divorce . . . she was so happy that she was required to have the pension plan !!!!!

[olgac]

yes! Very good example!
This is what we had taught our daughter as well!

[2tallbill]

I think Vasilisa must have found a new husband by now

She probably did.

I have three sisters. One of my sisters ran a credit check on any man that she dated.
She had a swarm of men around her that she friend zoned. I repeatedly told her that
those young men were pining for her and that she should consider them romantically.

Some of them were excellent men that are successful and have happy families today.
My sister overlooked her friend zone for some tall fantasy man that never came along.

She is now in her mid fifties, makes excellent money was never married, single and
childless today. She had "over 6ft tall" on her list. None of her friend zoned young men
were/are 6ft tall. 

None of those friend zoned men are friends anymore. The future wives shut that down
as soon as they laid eyes on her.

My point is that the girl you are looking out for needs to consider men who are excellent
matches, but lacking in some physical attribute.

Tall girls flocked to me like moths to a flame (average and shorter girls did too). I found
my angel eyes and was done looking forever. My last Girl Friend was 180 cm and gorgeous,
but she was high maintenance and was rude to people she saw as lower status than her.
I could see that some day, I would be on the receiving end of that. So I cut it off.

My second point is that tall men (I am 2 meters tall) have lots of options, she doesn't
want to be the moth, she wants to be the flame.

There very, very many men in programing, some are or will be very successful. She could
easily be the flame for them.

The story of how I searched 9 years to find the best girl (for me).
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=3432.0

[olgac]

very good storyabout Your sister! My friend is actually only 5'4" so I hve no idea why it's so important to have a tall man!
For comparison I am 5'6" and my husband is 5'8" only. I even wear hills when we go out so when I dress nice I look taller than him!

Yes programmers make a lot! My husband and I are both develiopers, or I should say "were" as we retired early. Back when I worked for Google, Apple, etc. I had many male coworkers who were overweigt/geeky/not so good looking and yet all of them got married to a very good looking woman! As I am telling my friend, such men are in high demand and they can be picky. Yes she is good looking, but I think 6 feet tall and ready to pay for everything is taking it too far!

I have a feeling this sn't going to end well, so I am trying to do some educating.

[olgac]

The story of how I searched 9 years to find the best girl (for me).
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=3432.0

Wow! What a story! I guess it pays off to look so long and get experience to know exactly what You want!

[ML]

very good storyabout Your sister! My friend is actually only 5'4" so I hve no idea why it's so important to have a tall man!
For comparison I am 5'6" and my husband is 5'8" only. I even wear hills when we go out so when I dress nice I look taller than him!

I was 6' before my spine disks started wearing down as happens with aging.  My height now is around 5' 11".

My height criteria for woman was 5' 6" minimum and 5' 11" maximum.

As it happens, my Ukrainian wife is 5' 6 1/2" . . . before she starts to shrink !!
With her heels, we still look like a very well matched pair . . . height wise.

- - - - -

Olga, as a side note, my criteria were:
5' 6" to 5' 11"
At least bachelors degree (or first Diploma in FSU system).
Able to converse in English with never an interpreter required.
Working in professional job (but not as a hooker !).
Slender but not skinny or emancipated looking.  Let's say 8+ for body.
Above average looking in face   6+ or so.  In fact I wouldn't go for 9 or 10.
High interest in cultural events, music, ballet, museums, history, science, etc.
No children under age 16 and parents who didn't need support.
Age 35 to 50.
Complete non-smoker.
Light or non-drinker.
Adaptable to living in country side, small city or medium city, but comfortable with trips to huge cities.
Shows care in money I was spending . . . cautions me that something is too expensive or that we don't need it.
Never asked for any money or gifts and refused outright cash to help with her expenses.
Maybe some others that I can't think of right now.

I had first full dates (not just tea and cake) with around 150 FSU women over several month-long trips.

[ML]

I had many male coworkers who were overweigt/geeky/not so good looking and yet all of them got married to a very good looking woman!

Olga, as my wife and other FSU women have told me . . .

The man must have a wife that is better looking than himself.

And, in fact, my wife was/is disappointed when one of her close male relatives did not achieve this criteria.

[krimster2]

a woman's appearance is her main selling point
a man's earning potential is his main selling point

everything follows the rules of commerce and supply/demand
and determines what your exchange rate is in the market