I smell a rat ... (be careful about posting detailed TRs)

[missAmeno]

I don't recall if I mentioned this before to RWD.  Soon after returning from Ukraine, Tim came to our home and brought some champagne to bribe the Cossack woman and her daughter for advice.  They both told him that he should disclose the nature of his business including his specific services for the adult entertainment industry.   They also suggested how he should followup with Irina.  He replied that he would no longer pursue Irina.  So it was over between them a long time ago.

Gator, its non of my business of course but some how what you stated above didnt sound logical to me.

Riv came for advice. Girls gave advice. Riv replied its over long ago. So why did he seek advice?

I understand that its more likely not at all the way it have been, just its sounded so to me when reading your post above.



Riv, I am kind of surprised with the choice of word "rat". I understand that you may feel that person who submarined you was unfair and gone behind your back but thats exactly what you was doing to Irina. Your crime was far worse off then the one committed by submariner.

[Turboguy]

Riv, I am kind of surprised with the choice of word "rat". I understand that you may feel that person who submarined you was unfair and gone behind your back but thats exactly what you was doing to Irina. Your crime was far worse off then the one committed by submariner.

When you are talking about "crime" are you talking about his profession ( which is not illegal), or are you talking about him having hidden it from her (which might have been a poor decision but also is not illegal)


I do think Riv's profession may make the search for a wife more difficult.  Having spent the first 20 years of my life in sales and having read about every book on selling ever written I think the rules that apply to selling apply to Riv's situation.   He would be far better discussing his profession with someone during the first meeting or early in the relationship.   If he says something like "You seem really nice and there is something about my background that may bother you.  I always went to be honest so I want to tell you this now and if it does bother you then at least I won't waste any more of your time"   I think most women will admire him for his honesty and he would have the best shot at having it not be an issue and if it is an issue for someone both will save time and avoid disappointment.

[missAmeno]

When you are talking about "crime" are you talking about his profession ( which is not illegal), or are you talking about him having hidden it from her (which might have been a poor decision but also is not illegal)

I should have used brakets for word crime as I didnt mean literally it. It was to do with him hiding information from Irina. He was the one who was hiding, submariner just revealed to girl what have been known to others.   

[Belvis]

Riv knows the name of the RWD member who squealed.  ...
To the rat:   I wonder if you are man enough to explain your actions and motives.  Your absence here suggests not.   While I will not reveal your name, keep in mind that we can presume Tim told a few others.  So your name will come out eventually.

If two men know everybody will know soon
I would propose to rush forward and don't pay much attention to recent past (if it is the past indeed).

[IAmZon]

This place is like stepping in a big mound of chewing gum - it is hard to get it off.

EDIT: I did a simple search and found this  http://www.complaintsboard.com/complaints/for-him-dating-c583256.html
Seems you are at it again Riv.
What the hell is wrong with you ?
Just put and end to all this drama once and for all please.
You went onto a complaints boards and posted a bunch of stuff about the guy who introduced you to your girl.  What the hell did you expect to happen?
Get some help man, seriously.

(I am happy I went to Ukraine and Eastern Europe for that matter.  There is a different kind of corruption and suspicion at work than in South America)

I suppose you think I wrote that complaint?  This is just ONE MORE example why people should withhold judgement, and certainly not act in the real world to harm another.   IN FACT I DID NOT WRITE THAT!  You presume I did.  Many people presume here.  (More and more I see this place as nothing but a voyeuristic game show whose audience is 90% losers).  I know Alex, and think he is FANTASTIC.  I am sure there are some people that have other views. Is it possible to please 100 customers out of 100 customers?   Not in the world I live.   

[LiveFromUkraine]

Riv knows the name of the RWD member who squealed.   The rat's motives can only be guessed.
 
I still believe Tim should disclose the name of the rat if the rat does not come forward soon.  For sure it will create controversy, but no more than what Tim  fomented during his trip. 
 
To the rat:   I wonder if you are man enough to explain your actions and motives.  Your absence here suggests not.   While I will not reveal your name, keep in mind that we can presume Tim told a few others.  So your name will come out eventually.

While I believe people should stay out of relations, I think this whole thing is BS. 

How about Riv either put up or shut up?  Post the proof or stop creating drama.   

I am a little surprised at Gator for calling someone else out.  It isn't Gator's business either. 

Riv should have been upfront from day one so no one would be able to mess with his relations.  Of course that probably won't change, he will just keep it all private.

[newjason]

This place is like stepping in a big mound of chewing gum - it is hard to get it off.

(I am happy I went to Ukraine and Eastern Europe for that matter.  There is a different kind of corruption and suspicion at work than in South America)

I suppose you think I wrote that complaint?  This is just ONE MORE example why people should withhold judgement, and certainly not act in the real world to harm another.   IN FACT I DID NOT WRITE THAT!  You presume I did.  Many people presume here.  (More and more I see this place as nothing but a voyeuristic game show whose audience is 90% losers).  I know Alex, and think he is FANTASTIC.  I am sure there are some people that have other views. Is it possible to please 100 customers out of 100 customers?   Not in the world I live.

As I said before,  I was mistaken.  I apologize for the mistake.
I removed my posts. 
Sorry I was the gum this time dude

[ML]

How about Riv either put up or shut up?  Post the proof or stop creating drama.   

I am a little surprised at Gator for calling someone else out.  It isn't Gator's business either. 

I am a disinterested third party looking in.

As such, just curious this idea of 'calling someone out.'
What is your sentence one above?

[LiveFromUkraine]

I am a disinterested third party looking in.

Trolling more like it.

As such, just curious this idea of 'calling someone out.'
What is your sentence one above?

How about you start a new thread and I will be glad to answer your "question".

[ghost of moon goddess]

You are the only one of us who passed a simple detective test.  The rest of us evidently rely on emotions rather than facts and analysis.  I find that both hilarious and insightful.

It's unfair to me    I passed it too! 
If one carefully read the posts I have quoted from the Green and Red flags thread, one would grasp the idea   

[IAmZon]

I have stepped back a good distance on many things over the past couple months - a fresh perspective can be achieved this way. 

Most importantly, I found RWD when I was looking for information.  I met maybe 5 - 10 members through the years - excellent people.  The content served as examples to what might be possible in my life, if I decided to take action.  I appreciated the TRs and the journals of Kuna; Tubro; MichealAngel lo; The Traveler, and many others.  They helped me form my views and preferences.  I thought I would add my experience as well, just to create a larger body of information for other to draw upon.

NEVER did I think RWD was some kind of club!  Indeed, its current narrative sounds more like the island of misfit toys.

A couple of points:
- I do not want to stimulate dialogue with a group of people that are too quick form opinions and judgements - their is no positive purpose.
- Why do some people think my LEGAL association with the adult industry is a "Crime"
- Why can't most of you get it through your head that my interests in the adult industry do not define me ( last year, less than 40% of my income was made through my various interests in adult related traffic sources; and took less than 10% of my time)
- Why do most of you think that this is a DEAL BREAKER for most women.   I have not found it to be true
- Why do all of you seem presume that I was UNTRUTHFUL.

(and here is where this group could generate another 50 pages of dribble!  No I did not tell  her grandmother that I made X amount of money on penis enlargement pills, for example.  I said I market and sell legal and financial services, and other products including "supplements.") BEFORE all of you start to discuss my personal business AGAIN, please understand that I am already developing many other things in different content categories - its a waste of time, and more than a little strange.)

BUT HERE IS THE THING: 
1, The rat simply revealed that I was talking publicaly about her. 
2, The rat echoed negative opinions for his own purposes, and communicated using a negative frame of reference.   
3, The rat somehow came into possession of personal photos that I shared with 10 - 20 friends (all very tasteful), and send them back to the woman.  This gave the rat credibility. The entire episode was understood to be a form of betrayal (which in retrospect it was) with more than a little "appearance of impropriety" thanks to the rat and his well-intentioned legions of witch hunters here.

So, BE CAREFUL with your posts gentlemen.  None of us are immune to this type of thing, and if you look around - especially here - all of us have one or more enemies that have too much time on their hands.

[Faux Pas]

It's unfair to me    I passed it too! 
If one carefully read the posts I have quoted from the Green and Red flags thread, one would grasp the idea   

It was pretty evident to most that have been around the boards a little while. Even I called newjason out on the information he posted. riv IMHO is a definite scum bucket but, I didn't think he was that particular scum bucket 

[GoodOlBoy]

3, The rat somehow came into possession of personal photos that I shared with 10 - 20 friends...

Not somehow dude.
One of your own "buddies" ratted you out!
What is that saying.... Oh yeah, bird's of a feather!

GOB

[Anotherkiwi]

...riv IMHO is a definite scum bucket...

Your opinion is NEVER humble! 

[Faux Pas]

Your opinion is NEVER humble! 

And it's the same whether in person or on the internet too 

[missAmeno]

A couple of points:
- I do not want to stimulate dialogue with a group of people that are too quick form opinions and judgements - their is no positive purpose.
- Why do some people think my LEGAL association with the adult industry is a "Crime"
- Why can't most of you get it through your head that my interests in the adult industry do not define me ( last year, less than 40% of my income was made through my various interests in adult related traffic sources; and took less than 10% of my time)
- Why do most of you think that this is a DEAL BREAKER for most women.   I have not found it to be true
- Why do all of you seem presume that I was UNTRUTHFUL.

Riv, please try to wake up from delusion that only your opinion is correct.
I already explained above that I didnt use word "crime" in legal meaning and it wasnt directed at your association with adult industry. What you refusing to understand is that it was your choice to associate or not with adult industry. And nothing wrong with that, its all correct but other people have the right for that choice as well. By hiding your involvement with adult industry from girl, you deciding for her, you making her choice. Somehow because you are associated with it by yourself, you are unable to accept/realize that far not everyone will be OK with such association.
And if your association with adult industry isnt a deal breaker why you had no guts to tell her about it?
I cant speak for all, but the reason why I see you as untruthfull is that in my understandings withholding information knowing that its important is dishonest (and please dont try to justify it with delusion of thinking maybe its not important).

BUT HERE IS THE THING: 
1, The rat simply revealed that I was talking publicaly about her. 
2, The rat echoed negative opinions for his own purposes, and communicated using a negative frame of reference.   
3, The rat somehow came into possession of personal photos that I shared with 10 - 20 friends (all very tasteful), and send them back to the woman.  This gave the rat credibility. The entire episode was understood to be a form of betrayal (which in retrospect it was) with more than a little "appearance of impropriety" thanks to the rat and his well-intentioned legions of witch hunters here.

Well if submariner was your friend telling nice things to you and ugly things behind your back then yes, betrayal fits description. But is it actually what happened? Or its just someone who disliked what you been doing and wasnt hiding his view on it?

[GQBlues]

Dude - GROW UP! Who gives a *rat's* arse about a pimp having another night with pain in his heart at bedtime!? If you were a girl, you'd be a classic attention wh*re.

How can anyone torpedo you with someone who's supposedly no longer relevant in your life anymore? Are you that insecure?

Ride another 'ho and get on with your life, man.

[Shadow]

This seems to be more and more in a way for Rivadco to slander the membership here due to them not applauding him.
Which makes his story less and less credible.

The "rat" may or may not be someone who is a member here, as nobody has stepped up nor has Rivadco had the courage to name him (or her). However the story turns more and more in to attempting to slander the members here.

If you post anything on a discussion forum you are bound to get all kind of opinions based on what you posted. The more detailed advice you want, the more accurate you will have to be. If you just want people to support you, lock your topic so no negatives will be found.

I respect almost every member here and am certain that meeting them in real life would be a great experience. Even the ones that I have been fighting on some subjects with over the years. To see someone (whom I nevertheless still respect for having the honesty to say what is on his mind) trying to slander this group in to a "voyeuristic club" is something I feel is unjustified.

[Muzh]

This seems to be more and more in a way for Rivadco to slander the membership here due to them not applauding him.
Which makes his story less and less credible.

The "rat" may or may not be someone who is a member here, as nobody has stepped up nor has Rivadco had the courage to name him (or her). However the story turns more and more in to attempting to slander the members here.

If you post anything on a discussion forum you are bound to get all kind of opinions based on what you posted. The more detailed advice you want, the more accurate you will have to be. If you just want people to support you, lock your topic so no negatives will be found.

I respect almost every member here and am certain that meeting them in real life would be a great experience. Even the ones that I have been fighting on some subjects with over the years. To see someone (whom I nevertheless still respect for having the honesty to say what is on his mind) trying to slander this group in to a "voyeuristic club" is something I feel is unjustified.

Well said.

[noelscot]

I have stepped back a good distance on many things over the past couple months - a fresh perspective can be achieved this way. 

Most importantly, I found RWD when I was looking for information.  I met maybe 5 - 10 members through the years - excellent people.  The content served as examples to what might be possible in my life, if I decided to take action.  I appreciated the TRs and the journals of Kuna; Tubro; MichealAngel lo; The Traveler, and many others.  They helped me form my views and preferences.  I thought I would add my experience as well, just to create a larger body of information for other to draw upon.

NEVER did I think RWD was some kind of club!  Indeed, its current narrative sounds more like the island of misfit toys.

A couple of points:
- I do not want to stimulate dialogue with a group of people that are too quick form opinions and judgements - their is no positive purpose.
- Why do some people think my LEGAL association with the adult industry is a "Crime"
- Why can't most of you get it through your head that my interests in the adult industry do not define me ( last year, less than 40% of my income was made through my various interests in adult related traffic sources; and took less than 10% of my time)
- Why do most of you think that this is a DEAL BREAKER for most women.   I have not found it to be true
- Why do all of you seem presume that I was UNTRUTHFUL.

(and here is where this group could generate another 50 pages of dribble!  No I did not tell  her grandmother that I made X amount of money on penis enlargement pills, for example.  I said I market and sell legal and financial services, and other products including "supplements.") BEFORE all of you start to discuss my personal business AGAIN, please understand that I am already developing many other things in different content categories - its a waste of time, and more than a little strange.)

BUT HERE IS THE THING: 
1, The rat simply revealed that I was talking publicaly about her. 
2, The rat echoed negative opinions for his own purposes, and communicated using a negative frame of reference.   
3, The rat somehow came into possession of personal photos that I shared with 10 - 20 friends (all very tasteful), and send them back to the woman.  This gave the rat credibility. The entire episode was understood to be a form of betrayal (which in retrospect it was) with more than a little "appearance of impropriety" thanks to the rat and his well-intentioned legions of witch hunters here.

So, BE CAREFUL with your posts gentlemen.  None of us are immune to this type of thing, and if you look around - especially here - all of us have one or more enemies that have too much time on their hands.

I was tempted to post pictures of ladies I met on RWD, but I have a policy of making the assumption that people do not want their pictures shared unless they give their explicit consent. My general policy is to be like North Korea, and keep everything secret. The price of privacy is eternal vigilance.

[Patagonie]

When you are talking about "crime" are you talking about his profession ( which is not illegal), or are you talking about him having hidden it from her (which might have been a poor decision but also is not illegal)


I do think Riv's profession may make the search for a wife more difficult.  Having spent the first 20 years of my life in sales and having read about every book on selling ever written I think the rules that apply to selling apply to Riv's situation.   He would be far better discussing his profession with someone during the first meeting or early in the relationship.   If he says something like "You seem really nice and there is something about my background that may bother you.  I always went to be honest so I want to tell you this now and if it does bother you then at least I won't waste any more of your time"   I think most women will admire him for his honesty and he would have the best shot at having it not be an issue and if it is an issue for someone both will save time and avoid disappointment.

             I respect your opinion but i don't share it, perhaps only if you are really light about what you say, and begin to speak about the past. I cannot imagine one sec a girl telling you such thing : i must tell you right now that something can bother you : 30% of my income are from prostitution; strip show.... I cannot imagine a girl telling you this honesty. It doesn't work like this with women. They will tell you perhaps, but in time.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             

[Gator]

It's unfair to me    I passed it too! 
If one carefully read the posts I have quoted from the Green and Red flags thread, one would grasp the idea   

Yes you did, by juxtaposing the complaint with Riv's RWD posts.  Clearly a different man wrote the complaint. Jack, others and I also made the same comment.  Yet such evidence debatable.   In contrast, the compelling evidence was in front of our noses and we missed it, i. e. the complaint was written in January and Riv did not go to Ukraine until June.

[BillyB]

 
Lots a drama here and the same guy who admitted to pushing his late wife around in Aloe's thread called me a creep. Ouch.

 
Guys, your wives and girlfriends have slept with other men and they gossiped this information to their friends. Girls, many of your men have slept with women in the commercial sex industry and they've gossiped this information to their buddies.

 
Everybody has a story past and/or present that could upset you whether told or untold.
 
 
Riv, I haven't kept up with your story but you didn't have a strong enough bond with the gal to get through this. I also notice some people are upset with what you wrote in the past and are happy you're in pain. To improve relations may I suggest offering those penis enlargement pills at wholesale prices to your critics. You may not want to help those who don't like you but think of it as helping FSU women who will directly benefit from the results.
 
 

[GoodOlBoy]

Lots a drama here and the same guy who admitted to pushing his late wife around in Aloe's thread called me a creep. Ouch.

To be more accurate, I referred to you as a "sick creep".
Because of your propensity for contacting underage (minor) girl(s) on the internet.
 
GOB

[Mod2]

GOB,


Lets leave it at that and go no further.