USA Tourist Visa Denied - any thoughts?

[ECOCKS]

Re-apply.

Wife's son's MIL was  denied the visa...re-applied and then got one.

[As I had suggested to them]

Yeah, this can happen more than most think.

It hurts but you can overcome it.

I had a client get an undergraduate student visa two weeks ago after a denial in January. Have a more challenging one now, denied 3 times in last 5 years.

Will see how it goes.

[JohnMI]

Update time ....  I wanted to wait until my mother-in-law returned from her Paris trip in the spring before we tried again, but (unknown to me) my wife insisted that her mother return to Kiev this month and apply for a tourist visa for herself only (leaving dad at home in Nilolaev). She went to her interview today and was denied again. When she returns to Nikolaev tonight my wife will tell her to stop wasting her money on these applications. Marta is very upset now, but I told her we can try again in the summer. So, at least in this instance, traveling as a single applicant was not helpful. Perhaps it was simply done too soon.

[JohnMI]

I should probably direct MIL to Mexico City with instructions to immediately purchase a sombrero and then begin walking north until she crosses the Rio Grande. Then she can visit her daughter free of any governmental harassment. 

[calmissile]

Update time ....  I wanted to wait until my mother-in-law returned from her Paris trip in the spring before we tried again, but (unknown to me) my wife insisted that her mother return to Kiev this month and apply for a tourist visa for herself only (leaving dad at home in Nilolaev). She went to her interview today and was denied again. When she returns to Nikolaev tonight my wife will tell her to stop wasting her money on these applications. Marta is very upset now, but I told her we can try again in the summer. So, at least in this instance, traveling as a single applicant was not helpful. Perhaps it was simply done too soon.

I am curious as to whether she was given an explanation as to why it was denied.  I was under the impression from posts on the forum that there is no explanation for denial given to the applicants.  A relative of my G/f in Kiev was denied a tourist visa yesterday.  She had used an incompetent agent to apply for the visa.  He did not even call her and when she called him, he could not explain why it was denied.  My G/F called another agent she knows and he apparently called the embassy and got all the reasons it was denied.  Some of reasons included..... the proof she submitted of money in her bank account was not in her name it was in her boyfriends name (US), and there was something about her passport having her married name rather than her current name or something to that affect.  It would seem to me that knowing how to get the reasons for denial is a key element in solving the problems.

Her 'new' agent has a plan to resolve the issues and reapply in about 30 days.  If unsucessful, he refunds the fee.  It will be intersting to see what happens.

Has anyone else that was denied, got the reasons for the denial from the embassy?

[JohnMI]

As I said upstream, no basis for denial was provided by the interviewer on either occasion, and on neither occasion did the interviewer ask to see any information my in-laws brought to the interview. When I directly asked Embassy staff the reasons, I received just a list of possible causes of the denial and a suggestion to be certain that the interviewer is aware of their connections to Ukraine - if the interviewer asks to see them.


Tomorrow I will take Marta to DC so she can fly to Nikolaev to be with her family for a week. $626 round trip via Moscow. Not a bad deal at all!

[ML]

My G/F called another agent she knows and he apparently called the embassy and got all the reasons it was denied. 
Has anyone else that was denied, got the reasons for the denial from the embassy?

I have many business friends in Russia/Ukraine;  some of which got visas to USA and some which didn't.

As I heard it,  there are never reasons given for denials,  other than a standard reference to the guidelines.

I hadn't thought of it before, but now that you mention it,  it seems plausible that a person (agent or some such) who deals with the Embassy a lot, might develop some personal relationships which allows for the transfer of some info as to the 'why.'

I would hope this doesn't expand further to the person being able to influence the issuing of a visa to clients.

But something must explain how all those FSU mafia types got into New York and other large cities.

[JohnMI]

Time for an update. About 18 months have passed since the most recent of our two failed attempts to secure a tourist visa for my in-laws can visit us. Following our first unsuccessful attempt, we limited the next try to MIL only, assuming that leaving a spouse of 37 years at home in Ukraine would sufficiently demonstrate MIL's need to return at the end of  her visit. Apparently the lure of Punxsutawney, PA is deemed to be too strong, however, and the interviewer just assumed MIL would not leave this paradise. 


We are trying again, and MIL has her interview on June 26. This time I visited Senator Toomey's office and spoke with the same staffer who helped us with Marta's K1. I provided her with the interview date, application number, name of MIL, etc. She indicated they have contacts in the State Department, and they will contact the same to see if they can help. I'll be visiting my Representative's office on Wednesday to ask for assistance also.


I'm really only updating this post because there was some prior discussion regarding the helpfulness or futility of seeking assistance from legislators with visa matters, and maybe my results will shed some light on the question.


Keep  your  fingers crossed for us!


 

[BillyB]

We are trying again, and MIL has her interview on June 26. This time I visited Senator Toomey's office and spoke with the same staffer who helped us with Marta's K1. I provided her with the interview date, application number, name of MIL, etc. She indicated they have contacts in the State Department, and they will contact the same to see if they can help. I'll be visiting my Representative's office on Wednesday to ask for assistance also.

Hey John, I'm surprised you're getting help from a Senator's office. Usually Senators refer you to your local Representative. I'm one of the few guys here that have successfully received help from my Representative to get my MIL a tourist visa. I didn't need to visit the office, just communicated with them by email and got it done. Got a letter sent to me in the mail my Representative stating it endorses my MIL coming over and MIL's interviewer in Kiev approved her easily.

Good luck

[ML]

Got a letter sent to me in the mail my Representative stating it endorses my MIL coming over and MIL's interviewer in Kiev approved her easily.

So Billy, how does this 'letter' thing work in actual practice?

The applications for Visas are now all completed on-line.

The interviewers usually make their decision based on this on-line application, before the person even shows up for the interview.

Oftentimes, the interviewer even declines/refuses to look at any supporting documents that the person brings to the interview.  This is often stated on VisaJourney, etc.

[JohnMI]

Billy, I was in Harrisburg (state capital) for a legal conference this week, and my wife came with me for a change of scenery and to sight-see and do some shopping with a colleague's wife so we both went to his office in person to deliver my letter plea. I thought it could only help if the staff met the people they would be trying to help.


With everything done online now I thought it best to give the staffer the interview date and time, along with the application number and MIL's name. I stressed to the staffer a phone call from the Senator's office to someone at State would be preferable, and more likely to be timely/have an effect, than a letter.


They promised to use his contacts to try to help. That is the best I can hope for.

[Faux Pas]

So Billy, how does this 'letter' thing work in actual practice?

The applications for Visas are now all completed on-line.

The interviewers usually make their decision based on this on-line application, before the person even shows up for the interview.

Oftentimes, the interviewer even declines/refuses to look at any supporting documents that the person brings to the interview.  This is often stated on VisaJourney, etc.

I too couldn't get any traction or movement on our K-1 a number of years ago. As a last resort I contacted my Senator's office and she had a Liaison that worked in her office for nothing else but dealing with the State Dept. I gave him all the pertinent info, he said he would locate the file and let me know what he finds. He called me a week later and said to expect a letter from USCIS. He was pretty vague but, said he had something put in the file that should clear the matter up. That same week a letter to me and the wife arrived with her interview info. I can't say either way if contacting the Senator's office is what did it as it was already delayed 13 months by that time but, it was moving after I did. He never confirmed it either way.

[calmissile]

After two refusals for tourist visa for my fiance, I contacted my congressman's office in person.  I supplied a letter from me, as well as copies of all her supporting docs.  The congressman's rep stated that congress has no direct influence over immigration and the State Department but would send a later and forward the info to the Embassy in Kiev.

The letter that was sent was quite brief and simple.  It basically stated that I was a constituent of his and they would appreciate any help the Embassy could provide.  The Embassy replied that they would do all they can within the laws and regulations.

She said that of the 30 or so women that were there for visa decisions, she believes she was the only one approved in the group. We can't say for sure that the congressman's letter made the difference, but it was the only thing different.  Note:  The congressman's letter was direct between his office and the Embassy in Kiev.

[ML]

Doug, two questions:

1) "The Embassy replied that they would do all they can within the laws and regulations."

Who did they 'reply to,' and did you actually see the reply?
What was the time frame between your congressman sending msg to Kyiv and receiving the reply?

2) Do you have any direct knowledge that the particular interviewing officer for your wife actually even saw the letter from your congressman?

[BillyB]

So Billy, how does this 'letter' thing work in actual practice?

My Congressman emailed me a form to fill out. I was asked questions about my MIL, her family back home, assets, and any other potential things that could be reasons she would not violate a tourist visa. My MIL has worked as a doctor and traveled for work and leisure in Libya and Europe and always came back home to Ukraine. My Congressman wrote a letter stating he recommends my MIL to get a tourist visa based on her strong ties to Ukraine and her reputation for leaving and coming home. I worked with a staffer. I think the only thing my Congressman actually did was sign the letter. The official letter with government stamp was sent to my home and I Fedex'd it to my MIL for her interview.

The applications for Visas are now all completed on-line.

Yes but evidence to an applicants questions must be brought to the interview. Bank records, deeds, etc...

The interviewers usually make their decision based on this on-line application, before the person even shows up for the interview.

Oftentimes, the interviewer even declines/refuses to look at any supporting documents that the person brings to the interview.  This is often stated on VisaJourney, etc.

100% true. My MIL's first two tourist visa rejections were instant. The interviewer refused to look at the evidence


In my return email to the Congressman, I stated that the letter they will give me may not work since the consulate interviewers didn't look at the evidence previously and I asked if my Congressman could call or email them the letter before my MIL was interviewed. I can't verify they did that. I was polite in my emails and never accused the consulate interviews of not doing their jobs.

[BillyB]

Doug,

2) Do you have any direct knowledge that the particular interviewing officer for your wife actually even saw the letter from your congressman?

My MIL's interviewer did see the letter. Just in case my Congressman didn't contact the consulate, I gave my MIL instructions to say "I have something for you" right after the interviewer says "hello", and to push the Congressman's letter through the window. The interviewer read the letter and approved her on the spot. The interviewer didn't even look at any other evidence.


Our elected officials can't break the law and tell interviewers what to do but I believe the interviewers prefer their boss not getting any calls from upset Congressman.

[calmissile]

Doug, two questions:

1) "The Embassy replied that they would do all they can within the laws and regulations."

Who did they 'reply to,' and did you actually see the reply?
What was the time frame between your congressman sending msg to Kyiv and receiving the reply?

2) Do you have any direct knowledge that the particular interviewing officer for your wife actually even saw the letter from your congressman?

1)  Yes, that is what they replied to my Congressman.   I think I have the correspondence.  I will send it to you in a PM.

2)  No, they do not divulge this kind of internal info.  However, she was interviewed be several interviewers and that is abnormal.  I have to read between the lines to surmise that the congressman's correspondence made a difference.  I will forward you all the correspondence in a PM.

Since the visa decisions are very subjective, I think they do not want a paper trail.  Therefore, they do not have to answer challenges to decisions.  Tourist visas cannot be appealed, and I was also told that all the documentation sent to support her arguments for the visa is destroyed.

[ML]

Doug, thanks but you don't need to sort out correspondence to PM me.

I am just always curious if something (e.g. letter from congressman) actually helped . . . or it is just coincidences when visa is approved after such a letter sent.

It appears hard to determine if there is an actual cause and effect.

[calmissile]

Doug, thanks but you don't need to sort out correspondence to PM me.

I am just always curious if something (e.g. letter from congressman) actually helped . . . or it is just coincidences when visa is approved after such a letter sent.

It appears hard to determine if there is an actual cause and effect.

In my mind, there is definitely a cause and affect.   You would need to read the correspondence I am going to send you to draw your own conclusions.  Me dealing with the consulate was a waste of time.  The correspondence directly between the congressman's office and the embassy in Kiev lead to success.

[calmissile]

Here are copies of the most important correspondence for anyone that is interested.

To answer ML's question, it appears that the embassy in Kiev responded to the congressman's letter the following day.

Note:  All of Larissa's supporting documents, including my letter of invitation were sent to the embassy directly from the congressman's office.

The last letter from the embassy to the congresman (not included) simply stated that the visa had been approved...... multi-entry, 5 year tourist visa.

I don't know if it had any significance, but Larissa told the interviewers that we had recently married and her husband was waiting for her outside the embassy in her car.

[GQBlues]

...We are trying again, and MIL has her interview on June 26. This time I visited Senator Toomey's office and spoke with the same staffer who helped us with Marta's K1. I provided her with the interview date, application number, name of MIL, etc. She indicated they have contacts in the State Department, and they will contact the same to see if they can help. I'll be visiting my Representative's office on Wednesday to ask for assistance also....

I'm astounded why this happens to folks.

From K-1, to having wife's entire family, with the exception of Baba (almost 90), acquire their visas so they can all join us when we got married. In-Laws had been back since, re-applied/granted multi-year visas. Never had any rejection for visa issuance not even once.

We've recently hosted one of her university friend who came over to visit us. PYT, employed, unmarried female with no child, never traveled outside of Russia - tourist visa, no problem. Stayed with us for two weeks. One other RW/AM couple in our circle have also had her Dad, Mumski, two sisters (one single) visit them all on their first applications.

I've yet to hear of anyone we personally know who've had friends or relatives get turned down for a tourist visa.

[BC]

Probably the most important is how the questions are answered in the online application.  After several applications for tourist visas I noted that the questions seemed to change depending on how they were answered...

but to reiterate:

be able to show own funding for the trip.  bank account, credit card statements, ownership of property and/or business, copies of tax returns.

we have applied for several, both to US and Canada.. all successful.. documents were quite similar to those provided for a K1/2

Take screenshots of the online application responses.. the problem might lie there.

[Wayne]

The rejection rate for Kyiv seems to be much higher than Moscow!

[GQBlues]

The rejection rate for Kyiv seems to be much higher than Moscow!

Wayne-

 Be careful with careless statements like this when evaluation anything that deals with numbers...

Note: Non-Immigrant visas: Separate K -1 visas from all others, like B1/B2...while both non-immigrant, each have their own criteria. K-1 approvals have partially/largely (more) to do with the petitioner than the beneficiary.

1. B1/B2 Visa Refusal Rate - 2013: Russia = 11%.  Ukraine = 26%
2. B1/B2, B1, B2 visa issuance ('06, '07, '08):
Russia = 73K, 85K, 110K;
Ukraine = 21K, 22K, 27K

3. Population: Russia 147 million. Ukraine 46 million (+/-)

Refusal rates statistic can be misleading. It doesn't cite how many times an applicant applied for, refused and eventually been granted visas. Additionally, and just as important, it doesn't denote the total number of applications. 11% of one million is  greater than 26% of 330,000 (difference in population ratio between both countries +/- 33% ).

To get a 'better' perspective of this process, one is better off citing acceptance/issuance rate relative to the country's population. In this exercise, one can easily see that Ukrainians, relative to its country's population, is neither better or worst than Russians.

[Wayne]

Unless I failed second grade math, 26% is much higher than 11%.

[GQBlues]

Who knows, but chances are you were completely lost in relative equation. To think, I even bothered to give you parameters.