Kharkov

[lonedrake]

I just don't buy the hype about the food,

 I am waiting to board plane in Kiev and I agree with you 100%. We stopped at a farmers market two days ago and picked up some fruit. Strawberries.....man they looked good.....and the ones on the top were...but those on the bottom of package.....just ok. I love strawberries....but you can get the same back home in any decent supermarket. Picked up three pears. Not quite ripe and many on stand had more of a brown color instead of that soft yellow color when properly ripened. These pears were just ok. Could get better ones at any decent supermarket anywhere in MN.
 Four oranges were just ok. I threw part of one away because it was disgusting. Could get equal or better oranges anywhere anytime in MN. The potatoes we picked up were great.....but no different that one I can buy anywhere in MN.

 The bacon. Sure it was leaner....but so salty it was difficult to eat much of. There is a huge selection of bacon in US that I much prefer.

 We did buy some corn in a can.....and not what I would call excellent. Maybe fair.

 Did not find any bread anywhere that comes close to what I prefer. I like the Dakota 12 grain bread.

 Anyways...for some to say the food is better in Ukraine...is a stretch and just mostly what you prefer or grew up with.

The best meal I had over there? We went to Dominoes one afternoon. The hawiian pizza was excellent,but no different than a USA Dominoes.

So facetrock....how did your date/dates go? And how good was Milas' service?

[Vasilisa]

I am waiting to board plane in Kiev and I agree with you 100%. We stopped at a farmers market two days ago and picked up some fruit. Strawberries.....man they looked good.....and the ones on the top were...but those on the bottom of package.....just ok. I love strawberries....but you can get the same back home in any decent supermarket. Picked up three pears. Not quite ripe and many on stand had more of a brown color instead of that soft yellow color when properly ripened. These pears were just ok. Could get better ones at any decent supermarket anywhere in MN.
 Four oranges were just ok. I threw part of one away because it was disgusting. Could get equal or better oranges anywhere anytime in MN. The potatoes we picked up were great.....but no different that one I can buy anywhere in MN.

 The bacon. Sure it was leaner....but so salty it was difficult to eat much of. There is a huge selection of bacon in US that I much prefer.

 We did buy some corn in a can.....and not what I would call excellent. Maybe fair.

 Did not find any bread anywhere that comes close to what I prefer. I like the Dakota 12 grain bread.

 Anyways...for some to say the food is better in Ukraine...is a stretch and just mostly what you prefer or grew up with.

The best meal I had over there? We went to Dominoes one afternoon. The hawiian pizza was excellent,but no different than a USA Dominoes.

So facetrock....how did your date/dates go? And how good was Milas' service?

Resume: so far everything in the former USSR is either worse, or the same (not food part only), so how come there are so many guys that are ready to cross the ocean 20+times to get the women that according to logic have to be either the same or worse quality than AW?
lonedrake, people like you make the worst category of husbands for potential RW that look for a RELATIONSHIP, not a life that would be better economically. You come to pick up a woman for a serious relationship, but you can't enjoy the culture and are not ready to absorb it or a part of it. If the woman is looking for a relationship she is loking for a union, not become an average AW and copy her lifestyle.
Look at what Mendeleev or Gator say, they make great advisors.

[Gator]

The reason I didn't go to a market in Kharkov for fresh veggies is because it was early May. Nothing is ripe and that equals nothing for sale.

That makes sense, and so does your comment about American farmers selling vegetables in the summer, especially recently picked sweet corn (and nothing in Russia is comparable to such corn).    If buying produce not grown locally, the American products will probably be better simply because it is fresher due to better transportation.
 
If you are similar to most Americans and appreciate red meat, there is no comparison.   I would be doubtful about eating medium rare meat in Russia, and I understand why Russians boil their beef.  American beef wins hands down.
 
Even with these pluses for American foods, I believe you are wrong with regard to many other food items.  For example, dairy products are superior in Russia, with a greater variety of kefir, sour cream, farmer's cheese, etc. at reasonable prices. Russia's standard store milk is similar to our expensive organic milk.   Russian cakes are superb and are not kept on the shelves for more than a couple of days.  And the ice cream!!!!
 
Also, the fresh markets in Russia serve a few food preparations that have no comparison in America, not just in  presentation.   I don't know the names of these  Russian items (and sometimes I have no idea of what they are other than "animal, vegetable or mineral").     Even items similar to American items, such as wild garlic that reminds me of "ramps" in Tennessee,  seem better.      Suffice it to say the Ruskie markets IMO offer more variety than what American stores typically stock in open containers.

And then there are the pickled and salted fish.  Much better than what we can buy (if you appreciate such tastes).
 

I just don't buy the hype about the food, or the women for that matter. Maybe that's why I haven't married anyone.

 
 
Maybe you have been going to the wrong fresh market for RW.  There are some fine RW "products." Although you can taste them before taking them home, there are some differences with AW regarding traits such as determination and mindset that can not be discerned much less appreciated with a  quick taste.   

[Gator]

If the woman is looking for a relationship she is loking for a union, not become an average AW and copy her lifestyle.

Golden!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Lonedrake,
Vasilisa was tough on you, yet she has a point (and illustrates RW directness).  The sincere RW will want to bring her culture with her to America, just like those hard working Norwegians who settled in your state a long time ago.    It is important that you and she adopt the best of both the FSU and the American cultures, and that will not happen quickly.   You must keep an open mind and be flexible, and the same goes for the RW you select.
 
 

[Vasilisa]

 The bacon. Sure it was leaner....but so salty it was difficult to eat much of. There is a huge selection of bacon in US that I much prefer.

Salty bacon?! You probably ate SALO, that's the way bacon is prepared, lol.And it's not eaten the way you eat bacon in the US
You can get fresh one with no salt and cook  it the way you want.

[GQBlues]

....Just got home.
JayH. Your right Jay. I do get an attitude after 8 trips over here and no matter if its Russia' Ukraine or Moldova I hear the same thing over and over. I hear our food is no good, not as fresh, and full of chemicals by a bunch of people who haven't been within 3000 miles of where I live.

I've forgotten how many farmers markets and supermarkets I've been to in Tver, St. Pete, Saratov, Rostov on Don, Dnep, Kharkov Chisinau and a few others I forgot about. You know what I've learned. They aren't any different than what is available here and they don't taste any better. I just don't buy the hype about the food, or the women for that matter. Maybe that's why I haven't married anyone.....

Yeppers. I couldn't agree more. Women are women, as there's no more beautiful women in USA as there are in FSU. The only seeming difference is, average US Joe (and the SRMs unfortunately) can get dates in places like the FSU and other MOB regions because of economic disparity - that they otherwise cannot in USA and other affluent regions. Heck, Russia is a great sampling of that fact. Good economy equals less MOB.


For food, I agree with you, too. Folks rave about things I just can't understand. I never ate anything in Russia that knocked me over because it was either good or fresh. Sometimes I just chalk this up to the limited view and experience of the author. I do like Uzbek food.


Anyway...good reporting. You still have the flair of writing as you did with your classic 'Writing to a Known Scammer'. Did ScottJay ever do anything with that piece?

[Shadow]

For food, I agree with you, too. Folks rave about things I just can't understand. I never ate anything in Russia that knocked me over because it was either good or fresh. Sometimes I just chalk this up to the limited view and experience of the author. I do like Uzbek food.

Fortunately, tastes differ. Some enjoy to eat the food at Bocuse because of its refinement, others feel it is overpriced for what it offers.

Personally I always prefer to blend in to the local kitchen wherever I am. Sampling the things locals enjoy does not only guarantee it is fresh, but also that it has been prepared correctly.

Salo is one of those things. When we bought the German-prepared copy I ate it but did not enjoy a lot. However when MrsShadow returned from Moscow with a leftover, it was a totally different matter.

[Belvis]

Resume: so far everything in the former USSR is either worse, or the same (not food part only)

I hear our food is no good, not as fresh, and full of chemicals by a bunch of people who haven't been within 3000 miles of where I live.

Two sides of the same medal, lol.

[Gator]

Salo is one of those things. When we bought the German-prepared copy I ate it but did not enjoy a lot. However when MrsShadow returned from Moscow with a leftover, it was a totally different matter.

Salo!  At first I thought it simply bacon without meat.  Then smelled it and had a little taste, and thought better of it - seasoned lard.       Later, on one very cold day of walking around a UA city, I went inside a restaurant, removed five layers of clothing, sat down and had fresh bread with salo.  It was delicious.   Not sure of what wine I would pair with it.    

[GQBlues]

...Salo is one of those things. When we bought the German-prepared copy I ate it but did not enjoy a lot. However when MrsShadow returned from Moscow with a leftover, it was a totally different matter.

First time I encountered Salo was in Poprad's suburbs at a friend's family's chata. All weekend long people would come and go in groups to stop by and say hello - it was a weekend-long party round-the-clock. I suppose this was one of the ways the younger generation spent their university break, like spring break is for us.
 
Anyway, a guy comes by and have drinks with all of us and he pulled out something wrapped in plastic. I can see it was a thick slab of 'fat' and he cut a few 'square' portion and started handing them out. Tasted great with borovicka. Reminds me of folks from home who likes to eat those deep fried pork rinds when sitting around drinking beer, or chips and salsa here at home, etc...
 
I was told, and not sure if true, what is used to smoke these things have a great deal to do to how it'll ultimately taste.

[Gator]

Andrew Zimmerm goes to Russia, in three parts, 15 minutes each.  Well worth the 45 minutes to watch.  Foods such as bear meat, salo, "beer for children," mushrooms, "ammoniated"    pickled blood sucker (which clearly ranked among his worst foods of the world, etc.
 
The trip trough the food market will focus on different delicacies that the average American would miss on his radar screen. It starts at the 3:00 minute mark of Part One.  If you watch just one piece, watch it.

I like how he presents it both as a gourmand and from the perspective of the Russian rather than how Americans would perceive it.  It might help newbies understand Vasilisa's comment upthread.  You will learn about dacha, banya, food markets, roadside stands, fast food Russian style, etc.
 

 
Part One: 

Part Two:   

Part Three:   
 

[facetrock]

 I did use Mila. One way to describe her is smooth as in the sense everything goes smoothly. She is on time. Very professional. Another thing is she loves her job and it shows. The impression I got from her is she really does want you to succeed. Not just show you some women and collect money from you.
  The best way IMO when dealing with an interpreter is to pay her at the end of each day. Its fresh in your mind what services she performed for you so you wont wonder 4 days later what you really did. Mila never asked about this and she wont. I just made sure I did it that way. Worked good and I always knew where I was at.

[Shadow]

Kvass is much more than beer for children.... it is a natural and refreshing soft drink that has proven to be almost as effective as water.

It roots back to times when the water was not safe to drink, and while it is closely related to beer it is not.

For those who want a chuckle, here is a review of our favourite brand, unfortunately to be found only sporadic in our area.
http://beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/440/43111

For those who know only beer it will give an idea of what it tastes like.

[Tulip]

I love strawberries....but you can get the same back home in any decent supermarket. Picked up three pears. Not quite ripe and many on stand had more of a brown color instead of that soft yellow color when properly ripened. These pears were just ok. Could get better ones at any decent supermarket anywhere in MN.
 Four oranges were just ok. I threw part of one away because it was disgusting. Could get equal or better oranges anywhere anytime in MN. The potatoes we picked up were great.....but no different that one I can buy anywhere in MN.

Lonedrake, two different countries have a lot of differences. And in tastes too. But, anyway, I believe that to try something new is good. As for vegetables and fruits - they are not Ukrainian ones. Ours are in blossom now. Our strawberies will appear only in June. Pears in July. And even potatoes will appear in two weeks at least. So, all fruits you tried are import ones, not Ukrainian. Come here later and you will try Ukrainian fruits and vegetables. And oranges - we don't grow them. But, anyway, you tried Ukrainian borshch, cooked by your girl? 

[facetrock]

 I agree with Gator about some dairy products being better in the FSU. Most dairy products are made of milk. So, if the dairy products taste better in the FSU is it because their milk is better? IMO no. Same with bread. Is their wheat better? Nope. Just baked different in some cases which equals a different flavor.

 I'm old enough to remember how the USA dairy industry was almost systematically destroyed in the press because it was bad for you. Butter was bad for you. Cottage cheese was bad for you. Now we are told that fluffy yellow colored artificially flavored vegetable oil based garbage replacement for butter was and is really far worse for you than real butter.

 All the old guys who used to make butter a more natural way are dead and gone including my grandfather. There's little tricks to every trade and most of those tricks were buried with them. But like I said the milk is the same.

However, in the last ten years I've noticed the butter section in the supermarkets getting larger and larger. The choices are bigger and now I see some mom and pops entering the market. The oleo section is shrinking. Thank God.

Another thing about row crops in Ukraine. By row crops I mean corn, wheat, soybeans. Ukraine has very good soil. Some of the best in the world. The farmer in Ukraine knows the farmer in the USA can consistently crack out 200 bushels of corn per acre year after year and rising. Not a big secret. Do you think he would like the same? It takes minimal effort to harvest 200 bushels instead of the 50 to 100 he gets. He wants it too and he will eventually get it. Way to much money not to be making. Its coming and no one can stop it.

I've never asked for anything from the USA government. But now I do. I demand a fair trade!! We want a bunch of Ukrainian butter makers to come here and show us all the old tricks we forgot so long ago. In return we will send a fleet of John Deere tractors and Iowa farmers to show them how to crank it up. With  Ukraine's soil the Iowa farmer wouldn't be happy till he cranked out 250 bushels of corn per acre. Its not a fantasy. It will happen. My way would just speed things up

[mendeleyev]

 

If buying produce not grown locally, the American products will probably be better simply because it is fresher due to better transportation.

Still true Gator, but that is consistently improving.

My first year in the FSU was a reminder of how things had been when I was a child in the USA. Food was very seasonal and you ate things like strawberries, corn and melons in their season. Today in Omaha you can enjoy fresh seafood caught in off the coast of Maine and picked up by local chefs at the airport just hours later. In Orange City, Iowa you can enjoy fresh strawberries in January that were picked the day before yesterday in Mexico because of the genius of the American food transportation system.

There was a time when lines would que at Moscow sidewalk fruit kiosks in order to buy the last watermelon of the season, and they still do to some extent. One of my wife's paintings "Last of the season" was a watermelon we picked up the last week that a nearby kiosk was open in autumn. Even most supermarkets didn't carry melons afterward.

Today that is changing as fewer fruits and vegetables are delivered by open bed trucks and more often by refrigerated trucks that deliver items fresher to city markets. It also gives the ability to take produce further out to smaller towns and village markets that formerly had no such delivery system.

We have a journalist friend who retired with his wife in a village about two hours outside Peter and their village benefits from a refrigerated truck that comes once a week. There is no market so the truck pulls into the village, opens a small table to collect money and they sell produce and meats out of the back. A few years ago that was almost unheard of in such spots but now folk come from various rural spots to meet the refrigerated truck. It also gives them a sense of empowerment because they can request specific items to be delivered in future weeks.

[mendeleyev]

Another thing about row crops in Ukraine. By row crops I mean corn, wheat, soybeans. Ukraine has very good soil. Some of the best in the world. The farmer in Ukraine knows the farmer in the USA can consistently crack out 200 bushels of corn per acre year after year and rising. Not a big secret. Do you think he would like the same? It takes minimal effort to harvest 200 bushels instead of the 50 to 100 he gets. He wants it too and he will eventually get it. Way to much money not to be making. Its coming and no one can stop it.

Agreed. It will boost jobs and the economy as that happens.

The only thing stopping it now are shoddy politicians who burden the ability to make productive changes by demanding their personal cut every step of the way.

[Boethius]

First time I encountered Salo was in Poprad's suburbs at a friend's family's chata. All weekend long people would come and go in groups to stop by and say hello - it was a weekend-long party round-the-clock. I suppose this was one of the ways the younger generation spent their university break, like spring break is for us.
 
Anyway, a guy comes by and have drinks with all of us and he pulled out something wrapped in plastic. I can see it was a thick slab of 'fat' and he cut a few 'square' portion and started handing them out. Tasted great with borovicka. Reminds me of folks from home who likes to eat those deep fried pork rinds when sitting around drinking beer, or chips and salsa here at home, etc...
 
I was told, and not sure if true, what is used to smoke these things have a great deal to do to how it'll ultimately taste.

With salo, it's all about your source.  My MIL buys salo only from one guy, who makes the trip to the market from Belarus.  He feeds his pigs only potatoes.  I am not a salo fan, but even I have to admit, that salo was really tasty, and no beer/spirits/alcohol of any kind was involved, only black bread and garlic.

[Ooooops]

So, all fruits you tried are import ones, not Ukrainian.

What???   No way!!!   

[Ooooops]

 Italian Lardo is very similar to Russian salo - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lardo   And it is very easy to make at home, btw.   But it's no good without good black bread and that's problematic to find lots of time....

[GQBlues]

With salo, it's all about your source.  My MIL buys salo only from one guy, who makes the trip to the market from Belarus.  He feeds his pigs only potatoes.  I am not a salo fan, but even I have to admit, that salo was really tasty, and no beer/spirits/alcohol of any kind was involved, only black bread and garlic.

Just had a thought...I would bet salo would taste good with Kim Chee (cabbage or zuchinni) - as pork bellies do...yum!

[JayH]

Lonedrake, two different countries have a lot of differences. And in tastes too. But, anyway, I believe that to try something new is good. As for vegetables and fruits - they are not Ukrainian ones. Ours are in blossom now. Our strawberies will appear only in June. Pears in July. And even potatoes will appear in two weeks at least. So, all fruits you tried are import ones, not Ukrainian. Come here later and you will try Ukrainian fruits and vegetables. And oranges - we don't grow them. But, anyway, you tried Ukrainian borshch, cooked by your girl? 

I am pleased you pointed all this out!! The strawberries in season( a short season) are incredible.

[SANDRO43]

Italian Lardo....

A highly prized variant here is "Lardo di Colonnata" from a small village of the same name in the Apuane Alps near Carrara, prepared in marble vats where strata of pig lard alternate with salt flavoured with pepper, coriander, rosemary, sage, cinnamon and cloves.

[Ooooops]

A highly prized variant here is "Lardo di Colonnata" from a small village of the same name in the Apuane Alps near Carrara, prepared in marble vats where strata of pig lard alternate with salt flavoured with pepper, coriander, rosemary, sage, cinnamon and cloves.

Mmmmmmm....   saaaaaaaaloooooooooo....        I'm not sure which one I was buying in that tiny Sicilian grocery in Hong Kong, but it was darn tasty!       Although, traditional Russian (well, it is Ukranian origin) salo doesnt' have much in a way of seasoning - just salt and garlic (and even garlic is optional).

[SANDRO43]

The strawberries in season( a short season) are incredible.

Even more incredible IMO, but hard to obtain, are our small fragoline di bosco (fraises des bois, wild strawberries):