Lawsuit Against Anastasia Date I Believe I Can Win

[mies]

Wow!  This topic has moved on so quickly since my earlier post.  However, I think that this is worthy of a reply/rebuttal.
I agree about the lack of definition of the age of consent but, if you drill further down into Wikipedia, you will find http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Europe#Ukraine
 
The age of consent in Ukraine appears to be 16, although it is not specifically set in any one statute.
 
Article 155 states that sexual intercourse with a sexually immature person shall be punishable. Immaturity is irrefutably presumed in those under 14 {Art. 120CC and court rulings}. Those under 14 are considered children in Ukrainian law, additionally those under 16 are considered minors (generally read from all articles and court rulings).
 
However, sexual acts with those under 16 that are considered debauchery can also be prosecuted under Article 156.
 
Article 155 – Sexual intercourse with a sexually immature person
 
1. Sexual intercourse with a sexually immature person, – shall be punishable by restraint of liberty for a term up to three years or imprisonment for the same term.'' 2. The same actions committed by a parent or surrogate parent, or where they caused sterility or other grave consequences, – shall be punishable by imprisonment for a term of three to five years.^[74]
 
Article 156 – Debauchery of minors
 
1. Debauched actions committed in regard of a person under 16 years of age, – shall be punishable by arrest for a term up to six months, or restraint of liberty for a term up to three years.'' 2. The same actions committed in regard of a young child, or by a parent or surrogate parent, – shall be punishable by restraint of liberty for a term up to five years, or imprisonment for a term up to three years. ^[74]
 
My only comment here would be that these maximum sentences seem incredibly lenient compared with those in the West.  Maximum of three years for child rape?  Here you would get life.

I still disagree. The "de facto" age of consent in Ukraine (although such term is no where legally specified) is when person stops being a minor. Person becomes a major in Ukraine at 18yo. Also, young people in Ukraine can only marry when they are 18yo or older. For anyone younger than 18yo (but older than 16) a special court ruling (and parental approval/consent) is needed to allow them get married. And a special medical commission is formed by court to decide whether it was "OK" to have sex with them.

According to the family code of Ukraine, article 6, a person has legal status of the child until reaching the age of majority (18yo). There are 2 subgroups in this category: 0-14 - "малолітня", 14-18 "неповнолітня." Legal status "a child" implies limited ability to "decide for oneself." This is why the laws about "age of consent" are so vague in Ukraine. Because on one hand, a 16yo-17yo-17.5yo is a child, they cannot get married, cannot vote, cannot get drivers license and do many other things. On the other hand, if a 17yo child has sex with an older guy, then it's up to the medical commission  to establish whether the child has reached sexual maturity. If they did - then their sexual partner is "off the hook." The child still can't marry but will not get their sexual partner into jail. If the child is declared sexually immature - then their partner is in trouble.

Sex with teenagers younger than 14yo = sex with children, most severe punishment.
Sex with teenagers of 14-16yo - article 156 "Debauchery with minors", punishable by up to 5 years of prison term.
Sex with teenagers of 16-18yo is a gray zone, and decision on possible prosecution is made on the basis of "sexual maturity of a minor." - their ability to have intercourse, bear a fetus, give birth and breast feed an infant- all without any negative consequences for physical (and emotional) health. To decide whether a minor is sexually mature - a special commission of medical experts is created by court order. If the minor is found "sexually immature" - then sexually mature/adult person who had sex with a minor can be facing up to 3 years of prison term or probation term (depending on the severity of the case).
If a female sexually immature minor loses ability to bear a child as a result of such sexual activity, man who had sex with her is facing up to 5 years of prison term.

Any of the above activities performed after coercing a minor (by a major) (verbally or physically, or using incapacitated state of a minor), may/do qualify as rape.

Please, do not write here that age of consent  in Ukraine is 16. Firstly, it's not true, secondly you will attract all sort of creeps to Ukraine with a tempting promise to have "fully legal" sex with hot 16yo Ukrainian bombshells.

*****
P.S. Interestingly, the article 154 of the Criminal Code says that Russian Maxim from the thread in "anything goes" can face up to 6 months of jail term for coercing his subordinate.

[mendeleyev]

Kyiv is a very rich city

I'd be tempted to take you on a tour of Kyiv someday and let you see how the average citizen lives. By the way, I'd happily sit down at their tables, share my life with them while we enjoyed tea and vodka after dinner but as for you, it is clear that you'd be too uncomfortable in such a sitting.

Hint: Hersey's chocolate isn't unknown in Ukraine but if a gal was doing something to you with Hersey's, she was definitely going cheap.

[mies]

I'd be tempted to take you on a tour of Kyiv someday and let you see how the average citizen lives. By the way, I'd happily sit down at their tables, share my life with them while we enjoyed tea and vodka after dinner but as for you, it is clear that you'd be too uncomfortable in such a sitting.

Hint: Hersey's chocolate isn't unknown in Ukraine but if a gal was doing something to you with Hersey's, she was definitely going cheap.

or perhaps the OP was cheap for bringing Hershey's to his gal. Could have at least brought Godiva, or See's, for crying out loud.

[mendeleyev]

or perhaps the OP was cheap for bringing Hershey's to his gal. Could have at least brought Godiva, or See's, for crying out loud.

I hope he saved his Hersey's receipts for the lawsuit. More proof that he was scammed. 

[TomT]

The fellow wrote that he had a bank account "worth a half mil."

[GQBlues]

...Gee...whatever happened to double jeopardy?...

Hardly. Two separate jurisdictional entities.

...I would be happy to agree here, if the good ol' USA wasn't (yet again) trying to impose its own morality on the rest of the world....

Yeah, well...if you pullout that USA rod for a while, you'd understand the virtue of having such a law within our judicial system. Plus you'd feel better. I swear 

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/08/us/us-is-now-pursuing-americans-who-commit-sex-crimes-overseas.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

...Indeed, some countries in Southeast Asia and Latin America are now seen as havens for molesters, turning a blind eye or even tacitly welcoming such tourists to promote their economies, experts say. Against that backdrop, agents for the Bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement, within the Department of Homeland Security, have mounted an aggressive effort with their new power. Investigations number in the dozens, officials said, with targets in Cambodia, the Philippines, Thailand, Sri Lanka, India, Russia, Mexico, Costa Rica and elsewhere.

American agents are careful to open investigations only with the cooperation of host countries, said Michael J. Garcia, who oversees immigration and customs enforcement. In Cambodia, for instance, the police have in several cases charged Americans under local ordinances, then held them for extradition in close coordination with American officials.

And in the Washington suburbs, several analysts at the immigration agency's cybercrimes unit now peruse the Internet and follow tips about sex tourism networks abroad.

The government's expanded legal authority to pursue molesters abroad comes as part of a 2003 federal law known as the Protect Act, a package of child-protection measures best known for the creation of the Amber Alert for missing children. A more obscure provision eliminated an obstacle for prosecutors seeking charges against Americans accused of molesting children abroad.

Previously, prosecutors had to prove that a suspect left the United States ''for the purpose'' of molesting a child, a standard that authorities said made it almost impossible to bring charges. The Protect Act eliminated that and imposed a 30-year sentence for a conviction.

''The big change here,'' said Charles A. Ray, the American ambassador to Cambodia, ''is that we can actually take aggressive action against these people and see results.''

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PROTECT_Act_of_2003

Surely, you wouldn't want a pedophile from anywhere communicating, and eventually meeting, your underage daughter for some 'loving' now, would you?

... If that "minor" is above the age of consent (whether defined by statute or simply recognised as a de facto age) in the country where the sexual acts take place, and is a willing participant, then any other country should butt out - it is none of their business.  I am NOT an apologist for rape (of anyone, not just a minor) - anyone who commits those sorts of crimes deserves to be punished to the full extent of the law.  That, however, is totally different from people "getting it on" for fun with someone who just happens to be under 18....

'sway it is. I'm not surprised however your country seem to be cool with NZ boyz romping around the globe doing whatever they want.
 

...She's 18 - end of story!...

Sez who? The Stooge or AnastasiaDate?

...Even so, I'm sure there are dozens (or hundreds) of members on here who lost their virginity long before they got to the magical age of 18.  Are you going to admit to committing a crime if the age of consent in your state was 18 (or older) at the time?...

You seem to be widely missing the point. It's one thing if a boy 16 had consensual sex with a girl 15. Quite another if a 40+ year old man releasing the Kraken on same, no?

But who knows...being from NZ you may not agree (?)
 

[mies]

Cbstogner, so what did your Odessa friend do in Odessa, when you first met her? Was she a student? A high-school student? Unemployed? Employed?
I'm somewhat curious.

[Anotherkiwi]

Hardly. Two separate jurisdictional entities.

So what?  We punish the errant American tourist, and then you have another go when he gets back to the USA?  For the purposes of this exercise, he (or she) has only been charged with one minor crime.
 

Yeah, well...if you pullout that USA rod for a while, you'd understand the virtue of having such a law within our judicial system. Plus you'd feel better. I swear 

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/08/us/us-is-now-pursuing-americans-who-commit-sex-crimes-overseas.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

...Indeed, some countries in Southeast Asia and Latin America are now seen as havens for molesters, turning a blind eye or even tacitly welcoming such tourists to promote their economies, experts say. Against that backdrop, agents for the Bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement, within the Department of Homeland Security, have mounted an aggressive effort with their new power. Investigations number in the dozens, officials said, with targets in Cambodia, the Philippines, Thailand, Sri Lanka, India, Russia, Mexico, Costa Rica and elsewhere.

American agents are careful to open investigations only with the cooperation of host countries, said Michael J. Garcia, who oversees immigration and customs enforcement. In Cambodia, for instance, the police have in several cases charged Americans under local ordinances, then held them for extradition in close coordination with American officials.

And in the Washington suburbs, several analysts at the immigration agency's cybercrimes unit now peruse the Internet and follow tips about sex tourism networks abroad.

The government's expanded legal authority to pursue molesters abroad comes as part of a 2003 federal law known as the Protect Act, a package of child-protection measures best known for the creation of the Amber Alert for missing children. A more obscure provision eliminated an obstacle for prosecutors seeking charges against Americans accused of molesting children abroad.

Previously, prosecutors had to prove that a suspect left the United States ''for the purpose'' of molesting a child, a standard that authorities said made it almost impossible to bring charges. The Protect Act eliminated that and imposed a 30-year sentence for a conviction.

''The big change here,'' said Charles A. Ray, the American ambassador to Cambodia, ''is that we can actually take aggressive action against these people and see results.''

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PROTECT_Act_of_2003

 
New Zealand has the same arrangement with some of these countries.  You and I are actually on the same side here - I also want to see these people off the streets forever.

Surely, you wouldn't want a pedophile from anywhere communicating, and eventually meeting, your underage daughter for some 'loving' now, would you?

Of course not, but the difference you seem unable or unwilling to grasp is that which I'm making between a paedophile (or sex tourist) and someone who wants to have consensual sex with someone who is legally old enough to decide for themselves whether or not to have such a relationship (even if said "relationship" lasts for only an hour or a night).

You seem to be widely missing the point. It's one thing if a boy 16 had consensual sex with a girl 15. Quite another if a 40+ year old man releasing the Kraken on same, no?

But who knows...being from NZ you may not agree (?)

No, I'm not missing the point.  Again, for the purposes of this exercise, I'm referring to people above the legal age of consent.  15 is below that limit here, although it's interesting that the age of consent in a lot of European countries is actually 14.  I would definitely be worried if a 40 year old tried the same thing with a 15 year old here, because it's illegal (even if they both DO consent, the girl is still deemed to be legally unable to consent).  I might be perturbed if someone that age got together with a willing 16 year old but, if it's legal, it's not my business (or yours, or the US Government's).
 
As for the OP - he's young, he found himself a hot younger girl, and eventually it turned to custard because he's an immature dickhead.  Despite the ridiculous way he's behaved, that doesn't give you or anyone else the right to jump to any conclusion about the age of his girlfriend.  He got her date of birth (as distinct from just stating that she was 18 when they met) and checked it as well as he could, he's met her family, etc, etc, etc.  I would imagine that there would be plenty of male relatives around ready to exact some sort of revenge if the OP had defiled their "under-age" cousin/niece/grand-daughter.

[Anotherkiwi]

I still disagree. The "de facto" age of consent in Ukraine (although such term is no where legally specified) is when person stops being a minor. Person becomes a major in Ukraine at 18yo. Also, young people in Ukraine can only marry when they are 18yo or older. For anyone younger than 18yo (but older than 16) a special court ruling (and parental approval/consent) is needed to allow them get married. And a special medical commission is formed by court to decide whether it was "OK" to have sex with them.

According to the family code of Ukraine, article 6, a person has legal status of the child until reaching the age of majority (18yo). There are 2 subgroups in this category: 0-14 - "малолітня", 14-18 "неповнолітня." Legal status "a child" implies limited ability to "decide for oneself." This is why the laws about "age of consent" are so vague in Ukraine. Because on one hand, a 16yo-17yo-17.5yo is a child, they cannot get married, cannot vote, cannot get drivers license and do many other things. On the other hand, if a 17yo child has sex with an older guy, then it's up to the medical commission  to establish whether the child has reached sexual maturity. If they did - then their sexual partner is "off the hook." The child still can't marry but will not get their sexual partner into jail. If the child is declared sexually immature - then their partner is in trouble.

Sex with teenagers younger than 14yo = sex with children, most severe punishment.
Sex with teenagers of 14-16yo - article 156 "Debauchery with minors", punishable by up to 5 years of prison term.
Sex with teenagers of 16-18yo is a gray zone, and decision on possible prosecution is made on the basis of "sexual maturity of a minor." - their ability to have intercourse, bear a fetus, give birth and breast feed an infant- all without any negative consequences for physical (and emotional) health. To decide whether a minor is sexually mature - a special commission of medical experts is created by court order. If the minor is found "sexually immature" - then sexually mature/adult person who had sex with a minor can be facing up to 3 years of prison term or probation term (depending on the severity of the case).
If a female sexually immature minor loses ability to bear a child as a result of such sexual activity, man who had sex with her is facing up to 5 years of prison term.

Any of the above activities performed after coercing a minor (by a major) (verbally or physically, or using incapacitated state of a minor), may/do qualify as rape.

Thank you for the clarification.  However, what's your opinion on the maximum sentences?  As I stated above, I think that three years' jail for child rape is ludicrous.

Please, do not write here that age of consent  in Ukraine is 16. Firstly, it's not true, secondly you will attract all sort of creeps to Ukraine with a tempting promise to have "fully legal" sex with hot 16yo Ukrainian bombshells.

Fine, I won't write any more about this.  However, it wasn't me that brought up the potential illegality of the OP's relationship.  As for the second part - I don't think that there is the slightest risk of such a thing happening.  Can you really see that sort of person being interested enough to dig this far into a thread on a forum that, by its very nature, surely has little interest for that type of person?

P.S. Interestingly, the article 154 of the Criminal Code says that Russian Maxim from the thread in "anything goes" can face up to 6 months of jail term for coercing his subordinate.

Again, a ridiculously light possible sentence for what he did.

[mies]

Thank you for the clarification.  However, what's your opinion on the maximum sentences?  As I stated above, I think that three years' jail for child rape is ludicrous.
 
Fine, I won't write any more about this.  However, it wasn't me that brought up the potential illegality of the OP's relationship.  As for the second part - I don't think that there is the slightest risk of such a thing happening.  Can you really see that sort of person being interested enough to dig this far into a thread on a forum that, by its very nature, surely has little interest for that type of person?
 
Again, a ridiculously light possible sentence for what he did.

I fully agree with you that 3 years for rape is ludicrous.

I agree that if the OP met the girl when she was 18 - legality wasn't the issue. I am not yet sure he first met her when she was 18. He says "he birthday is 1992, it says so on her VK page." My VK page says I'm 99yo, would you believe it? I also think it's a sign of certain character peculiarities when a mature guy intentionally seeks a teenager "as young as it is legal" for sexual relationship. 

Again, agree about the light sentence. That goes back to my discussion with Olga when she tried to convince me that all rape and harassment victims can find justice in FSU if they try hard enough. I think this isn't justice for a victim.

[cbstogner]

Cbstogner, so what did your Odessa friend do in Odessa, when you first met her? Was she a student? A high-school student? Unemployed? Employed?
I'm somewhat curious.

Now that I think about it, I am pretty sure she took a year off after high school to work foreign men to get enough money to move to Kyiv and attend the University. Makes sense. I was wondering how she got the hell out of Odessa. When I met her, she was nothing more than a cheerleader for a Ukraine soccer (excuse me football) team. I didn't ask alot of questions. She was also a cheerleader for the Ukraine national team (if that wasn't already the one she was cheering for while in odessa) in the World Cup in Kyiv 2012. I've seen pictures of her down on the field. She's an ambitious woman, ain't she?

[cbstogner]

hahah and what's this talk about child molestation? I stated her birthday was [deleted] and that she was 18 at the time of Jan 2011, and I repeated that quite a few times. Further signs that you all are nothing but a bunch of jealous haters........

[Faux Pas]

hahah and what's this talk about child molestation? I stated her birthday was [deleted] and that she was 18 at the time of Jan 2011, and I repeated that quite a few times. Further signs that you all are nothing but a bunch of jealous haters........

Really? What's to hate or be jealous of? You banging a pro-dater, getting clipped by ADate or your 3 trips of drunken debauchery? Your 30 years old dude and you still have a lot of growing up to do. You think you are bragging and making yourself look cool, suave and hot when in fact, you are only making yourself look stupid. I think there is a little piece inside of you that realizes this but, you won't let it out. Sure, you can continue the sex tourist act as long as the money holds out or, you can start learning to grow up a bit and hopefully learn that thinking with your penis usually only ends with splooge all over yourself.

[mies]

Now that I think about it, I am pretty sure she took a year off after high school to work foreign men to get enough money to move to Kyiv and attend the University. Makes sense. I was wondering how she got the hell out of Odessa. When I met her, she was nothing more than a cheerleader for a Ukraine soccer (excuse me football) team. I didn't ask alot of questions. She was also a cheerleader for the Ukraine national team (if that wasn't already the one she was cheering for while in odessa) in the World Cup in Kyiv 2012. I've seen pictures of her down on the field. She's an ambitious woman, ain't she?

and what's your estimate, how much did she earn during this year "off school"?
How much did she earn that year from you individually?

[TS]

The OP mentioned his girl was a Ukraine cheerleader for Euro 2012.  All those girls were sex escorts and got the job if they slept with the team and certain politicians. Seems the OP was dating an escort.
 

[cbstogner]

Really? What's to hate or be jealous of? You banging a pro-dater, getting clipped by ADate or your 3 trips of drunken debauchery? Your 30 years old dude and you still have a lot of growing up to do. You think you are bragging and making yourself look cool, suave and hot when in fact, you are only making yourself look stupid. I think there is a little piece inside of you that realizes this but, you won't let it out. Sure, you can continue the sex tourist act as long as the money holds out or, you can start learning to grow up a bit and hopefully learn that thinking with your penis usually only ends with splooge all over yourself.

Then what's with all the talk about child molesations when there clearly wan't any... retard.

and what's your estimate, how much did she earn during this year "off school"?
How much did she earn that year from you individually?

She didn't earn much from me and there is absolutely no way for me to know how much she earned that year. I didn't file her taxes.

The OP mentioned his girl was a Ukraine cheerleader for Euro 2012.  All those girls were sex escorts and got the job if they slept with the team and certain politicians. Seems the OP was dating an escort.

Do you have any evidence? She has been cheering since she was 10 - not to mention is is a fully figured bombshell.. She showed me videos of her cheering when she was younger. Sounds like your hatin because they clearly would want the best for the world to see, not one night of sex..

[sleepycat]

As much as it is fun to read this thread and listen to the OP making a fool of himself, can the Moderator please lock this thread...

It seems that the OP is constantly describing his imaginary sex life, in order to feed on the attention he gets when other forum members respond to his silly posts.

[cbstogner]

Wow, exactly what I should have thought to expect. Nothing but a bunch of loser dudes seeking a foreign bride because they can't get laid at home due to their age, weight, net worth, and a personality that couldn't make a gurl laugh if he tried.

Then you have the Ukrainian and Russian guys and gals getting upset over a young, rich american guy with a good personality that is rubbing one off on their women at the rate of 1 new lady per night, because he's upset that he got scammed and seeks revenge leaving them nothing to gain but enough drinks to get them drunk and a cold from the long, early morning walk back home after being shown the door.

I think I'm an American hero!

See, you all got jealous and started to immediately start attacking.. Wasn't this post about proof of the Anastasia scam? Not child molestation, or anything else you losers brought up.

[cbstogner]

[Muzh]

Really? What's to hate or be jealous of? You banging a pro-dater, getting clipped by ADate or your 3 trips of drunken debauchery? Your 30 years old dude and you still have a lot of growing up to do. You think you are bragging and making yourself look cool, suave and hot when in fact, you are only making yourself look stupid.

LMFAO

Can you say Narcissist?

Five pages of this nonsense. Wow.

Hey Loverboy. Please, by all means sue Anastassia Date.

You can use the guys here as character references.

This should be interesting.

[cbstogner]

Quit speaking my language, you posers - AMERICA OWNS THE WORLD!

[Hammer2722]

Uber- Troll!!!!

[Muzh]

                                       

[cbstogner]

Don't hate me because you ain't me

[Faux Pas]

Then what's with all the talk about child molesations when there clearly wan't any... retard.

C'mon man really, retard? That is sooo 3rd grade. Haven't you anything even semi/quasi mature or intellectual? I bet you do, let's see it. It would be a first for you.

I didn't say anything about child molestation. Can you quote me where I did?