Visa and work permits in the EU for FSUW

[GreenoMan]

I work in academia and as a postdoc you go to different universities for a few years at a time. I am writing new job applications at the moment and hoping of ending up at a great place. While chasing a lady, it struck my mind that, if I find her, I have to find out how to bring her to me some time in the future. I will be moving in a couple of months so this is a great opportunity to avoid countries that are dismal when it comes to long visa processing duration or strict work permits.

Canada does not have a fiance visa, only spouse visa. For example, the processing time is 12 months for the Ukraine (http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/times/perm/fc-spouses.asp). Does Canada have a language requirement? This should not be a problem since many RW and UW learn English first of all.  What about Quebec?

The US K-3 visa takes >6 months to process (http://www.rosebrides.com/visa-and-immigration.html), the K-1 visa 100-150 days (http://www.visajourney.com/content/k1historical).

Regarding EU+Switzerland countries, it seems to vary a lot. There is no easy way to get an overview of all EU countries. All of them offer some sort of fiance visa and spouse visa. I get the impression that these laws regarding visa are fragmented and there is no simple way to move from A to Z without getting stuck in the bureaucracy along the way. Consequently, visa processing duration estimates are not easy to obtain.

Switzerland
Various ways of spouse immigration are outlined here: http://www.switzerland.isyours.com/e/immigration/marriage/partner_question.html. I cannot find any information about processing times though. The cantons determine immigration requirements, so any visa application has to be filed there. I reckon that any language requirement would be locally determined as well.

Germany
Germany by tradition has got an efficient bureaucracy, so a fiance or spouse visa application process is fast, I would think. Germany has got strict language requirements though and a language test must be passed before immigration of a spouse http://www.expatica.com/de/essentials_moving_to/essentials/How-to-move-to-Germany-legally_-visas-and-citizenship_13866.html?ppager=0.  No information about duration anywhere.

France
France has got requirement of passing of a language test before issuance of a visa http://www.consulfrance-montreal.org/Visa-for-the-spouse-of-a-French, just like Germany.

[Shadow]

While each country has its own extended regulations, they have to comply with the general regulations set by the EU.

General regulations are:
- proof of relationship
- enough income to support (120% of social support level)
- will not become dependent on public funds
- no threat to pubic health or safety

Apart from this the following varies per country:
- knowledge of language
- obligation of marriage within a defined period of time
- knowledge of culture

Regarding the obligation of marriage, according to EU law a registered partnership should be treated equally to marriage, meaning that in principle it should be possible to cohabit without being married for unlimited time.
However depending on de country this has not yet been taken in to national law.

One interesting point here is that if you are EU citizen living in another country as your country of nationality, the EU laws apply instead of the local laws. This can make it more simple to acquire visa.

[GreenoMan]

I have been studying various visas to inform myself of all possibilities.

Generally, there are four routes for a man to bring a woman (spouse, fiance or cohabitor) into a resident country from another country (home country of the woman).

• Spouse visa. Get married in the resident country or a third country and bring the partner into the resident country. If the marriage is old and neither the man nor the woman reside in the resident country, apply for a spouse visa before moving (not relevant in the MOB business).
• Fiance visa. This is an unofficial term, the official term being different in each country. Bring the partner into the resident country, get married there. In some countries, the woman must return to her home country and apply for a spouse visa from there.
• Tourist visa. If the woman moves to the resident country and they get married, they then apply for permanent residence for the woman. The authorities in most countries hate this, so the woman has to move back to her country and apply for a spouse visa (a mistake committed by some people). Use a fiance visa instead.
• Common-law partner. The man and the woman must have been living together not in the resident country for some time (e.g., Canada 12 months) and are not married. This must be backed up by bank statements, bills, etc. In the case of a MOB, this only works if the man moves to the woman's country, or a third country (both having residence permits here) first before both moving to the resident country. (It sounds unlikely.)

Each type of visa has got relative advantages in terms of travel costs, cost of visa, the total time duration, how much time the couple can spend together throughout the entire time duration, etc.

The spouse visa or the fiance visa are what I am looking for. Fiance visas sound nice if the woman does not speak the language of the resident country, because then she could spend some time learning it while staying in the resident country (at the cost of the man) before moving back to her country to apply for a spouse visa. This is relevant in the case of France and Germany. A fiance visa often does not result in a work permit during the temporary visit in the resident country. In the case of Germany, a spouse visa is only issued after the woman passing a language test.

Shadow, a common-law partner visa is only relevant if a WM and a RW met in the woman's country or a third country. Everything that you have mentioned concerning general regulations is relevant.

Of course, it happens that a man moves to a woman's country sometimes.

One interesting point here is that if you are EU citizen living in another country as your country of nationality, the EU laws apply instead of the local laws. This can make it more simple to acquire visa.

Never heard of this. I cannot confirm or deny, but I think that it is wrong.

[Shadow]

Greenoman, you can trust me that I am spot-on with regard to EU laws.
A decent amount of people use them to get better chances of obtaining visa.

However I wonder why you are researching the laws of Germany or France when you are living in Sweden.

Just to give a quick summary (more entensive can be given if you can point the exact circumstances).

1. Spouse visa
For residents (5 year card or more)  of an EU country who apply in their country, after marriage the spouse has to apply in her country of origin.
For non-residents (up to 3 years) the law is that they have the right to let their spouse join them after immigration. For this only a marriage certificate and proof of income is needed.

2. Fiancee visa
This is treated equal to spouse visa for residents. For non-residents it depends on de common-law regulations. In countries where common-law and marriage are treated equal, proof of relationship and proof of income is enough for EU residents who are not residents of the specific country.

3.Tourist visa Marriage after tourist visa is treated separate in each country, and indeed many countries require the spouse to return. This is often circumvented by moving temporary to another EU country, see point 1.
However if you read the arrival to her husband of Aloe you will find that Belgium does allow giving residence permits when married on a tourist visa.

4. As mentioned, it depends on how far the equality of common-law partnership and marriage is taken in to national law. Countries like Holland and Belgium have full equality, which means marriage is not a requirement to obtain residence and work permit. Other countries vary, for instance Spain has no common-law regulations.

As far as meeting, I consider it usual that the man travels to the woman's country for a meeting, and from this a common-law relationship can be proven even if the actual face-to-face time is short.

For example. I met Mrs Shadow in Moscow in March 2005, we started the procedure in May 2005 and she arrived in the Netherlands in August 2005 on a 'fiancee visa'. Without any problem we lived as common-law partners until July 2008. From July 28 2008 we have been married, which had more to do with our plans to change country as with the arrival in 2009 of ShadowJr and 2010 of ShadowJr 2.0

We recently moved back to Holland, and as Dutch citizen the only thing required for Mrs Shadow is proof of continuing marriage.

As I have to inform the authorities at time of the correct regulations (most smaller communites are not completely informed) I make sure to follow them.
If you need any specific information for your situation just let me know and I will see what I can dig up on Sweden.

[GreenoMan]

Greenoman, you can trust me that I am spot-on with regard to EU laws.
A decent amount of people use them to get better chances of obtaining visa.

However I wonder why you are researching the laws of Germany or France when you are living in Sweden.

OK, OK, Shadow. I started with the assumption that, if an EU citizen wants to live together a non-EU citizen, then the laws that apply are those of the country of residence in the EU, not those laws of the origin of the EU citizen. I will be moving soon, probably to another European country. As a scientist, I can look for work in many countries. That is why I was looking up so many countries to see if there were any legal situation that could turn out to be a pain in the ass. Like Forrest Gump said: "Mama always said life was like a box of chocolates. You never know what you're gonna get."

If you are right, it would save me a whole lot of trouble. Swedish legislation is not particularly Kafkaesque. Nor does Sweden make a distinction between marriage and common-law partnership.

Is this the Swedish legislation that I am looking for: http://www.migrationsverket.se/info/flytta_en.html after replacing Sweden with some other EU country as the country of residence?

Good luck with your #1 and #2 in the Netherlands. If Greenland starts living up to its name, maybe that you should consider relocating. 

[Shadow]

The page you showed is correct if you are Swede, or have a residence permit in Sweden. As mentioned, the moment you move to another EU country you can make use of the less strict EU laws.
As for our current residence, the water from Switzerland poses more of a danger as the sea, as does the Supervolcano in the Eifel.

But who knows we may move to Sweden, as I heard they give good support to new startups and houses are cheap. Just we would need to learn production of Samagon.

[GreenoMan]

But who knows we may move to Sweden, as I heard they give good support to new startups and houses are cheap. Just we would need to learn production of Samagon.

As a teenager in Sweden, I used to buy small container for brewing beer. It contained a sugar solution (and some other ingredients depending on the flavour and type of beer) and some yeast stored separately in a small piece of paper. I had a big 20 l barrel where I mixed the sugar solution, yeast and water. The barrel was sealed and the fermentation process took about a week. After that period of listening to wonderful bubbles popping, it was time to empty the container. About 20 l of wonderful beer could be obtained. It is illegal to add extra sugar to the container, but it is hard to enforce that law. I really enjoyed my teenage years in Sweden.

Shadow, you would be so welcome to Sweden. Maybe that we could open up a pub and serve prime Belgian abbey beer to customers (even if you are Dutch). 

I managed to find this great site where you can discuss visa issues (any country, any nationality): http://www.expatforum.com/expats/france-expat-forum-expats-living-france/4915-all-those-coming-france.html. There is also information about particular countries. In the link, it is France.