Protesters in Ukraine remind us of the priceless benefits of being EU members

[Ranetka]

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[Ranetka]

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[Ranetka]

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[missAmeno]

However ethnic minorities especially born in the country should be protected. I for one seen enough in the 90s to support Putin's actions. Regardless of historical reasons or geopolitical issues behind the actions any movements towards protecting interests of Russian minorities is good in my books.

Well Ukraine have been protecting Russian minorities and what did it get in exchange?
Do Russia bother to protect interests of Ukrainian, Estonian, Gergian or other minorities?

[fathertime]

And you are welcome to it. As I am mine. From many of your remarks on these issues you seem to opine a lot based on very little factual information. I'm just attempting to help you out where I can 

I'd say the ONE solid fact is that Russia is now in Crimea...practically everything else is bologna...I've seen a lot of absolute statements on the topic turned to mush.   


I see that even old Argentina is publicly calling us and England hypocrites (which we are).  At least part of their basis is the Falkland Island issue...I don't know if that is a good example though since those few Falklanders did want to stay with England.


I still tend to believe that we (the USA) should keep pretty quiet about the whole thing...Obviously Russia is no angel but we have commented some pretty blatant offenses ourselves., so what is good for the goose is good for the gander.


I am still seeing this annexation as a ....drum roll......WIN WIN!   


Fathertime! 

[JohnDearGreen]

You will reap what you sow lady

LT, don't be so rough on ranetka.  She is one of the few RW who seems to be commenting during this Crimea issue.  Most of the others have kept quiet.  Also strange that mendeleyev hasn't posted since Feb 14.

[Ranetka]

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[jone]

I tend to think that the upside for US is to do nothing.  Putin has very loudly stepped over the line.  If the US gets involved, then it is a US/Russian thing.  Right now the Eastern European countries are scared shitless that they are going to be next, especially with the statements made today regarding Russians in Estonia.

If it is Russian/Ukrainian thing then Russia takes all of the heat.  US can come in on the back end (you would be surprised how fast - 8 hours - that we can engage the troops on the ground anywhere in the world) if necessary.

[cc3]

When?  Now or in 25 years?  What do you think? Many here think this is the beginning of a long march toward Kiev or even worse.  I don't think so.  At most, perhaps a few more border cities, but I think even that doesn't seem likely. 

Easy for you to say, but my fiancee lives in one of those border cities. It's not a minor threat to hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions, of innocent Ukrainian citizens. Putin's modern day employment of Hitlerian fascist aggressive strategies needs to be more universally condemned by what, in the 21st century, is becoming a shrinking and atrophying 'Free World'.

[Belvis]

I tend to think that the upside for US is to do nothing.  Putin has very loudly stepped over the line.  If the US gets involved, then it is a US/Russian thing.  Right now the Eastern European countries are scared shitless that they are going to be next, especially with the statements made today regarding Russians in Estonia.

If it is Russian/Ukrainian thing then Russia takes all of the heat.  US can come in on the back end (you would be surprised how fast - 8 hours - that we can engage the troops on the ground anywhere in the world) if necessary.

US has already stepped over the line supporting the coup in Ukraine. I have to disappoint you, hawks, the war is out of question. Your dreams will never materialized though you can play Warcraft III to calm down.

[missAmeno]

There was no issues before changing of Government.

No issues for who? And/or who had issues after Government changed?
And just to be sure we are on same page ... Government that was changed (or lets better say run away because had no guts to answer for own actions) was in first place Government only because that is who Putin wanted Government to be.

Protecting Georgian etc minorities it's their government problem.

Why Russia should expect russians in other countries to be protected if not willing to protect other countries minorities living in Russia? Because its bigger? have more oil? somehow better from rest of us?

I do not doubt Ukrainian character, if people (in crimea) did not welcome Russian troops there would be proper bloodshed.

Wow

[Faux Pas]

I'd say the ONE solid fact is that Russia is now in Crimea...practically everything else is bologna...I've seen a lot of absolute statements on the topic turned to mush.   


I see that even old Argentina is publicly calling us and England hypocrites (which we are).  At least part of their basis is the Falkland Island issue...I don't know if that is a good example though since those few Falklanders did want to stay with England.


I still tend to believe that we (the USA) should keep pretty quiet about the whole thing...Obviously Russia is no angel but we have commented some pretty blatant offenses ourselves., so what is good for the goose is good for the gander.


I am still seeing this annexation as a ....drum roll......WIN WIN!   


Fathertime!

FT, politically I am a libertarian with strong isolationist beliefs. So were are not far apart on the issue that the U.S. should mind our own business. I understand minding our own business comes with many pro's and con's. I've never subscribed that we need to spread democracy or overthrow dictatorships or any other forms of government. IMHO, democracy doesn't work everywhere and certainly requires it to be earned to be appreciated. IMHO, our involvement anywhere else on the globe should be limited to humanitarian aid and comfort.

Russia in Ukraine wasn't an annexation, it was an invasion. At least call it what it was

 

[jone]

TO BEVIS,

Please explain yourself.  You are not following logical discourse.

I say that the US should do nothing.  You say: Because the US supported?  How?  The Coup?  What coup?  That the majority of the Rada voted out the President?  His own party?  And the US is responsible?

Then I explain that if Russia invades, and Ukraine asks for help we could be there anyway, without getting involved now.

I can't say I see your logic, but I am happy to listen.

Russia is on a war footing, marching troops around in circles on the border of Ukraine.  They are fighting a war, but no one is stepping up and shooting guns at them.  I advocate that the US should not humor them. 

So you call us all people who dream of war?  Please explain yourself.  And put down the Kool-Aid.

[Ranetka]

Easy for you to say, but my fiancee lives in one of those border cities. It's not a minor threat to hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions, of innocent Ukrainian citizens. Putin's modern day employment of Hitlerian fascist aggressive strategies needs to be more universally condemned by what, in the 21st century, is becoming a shrinking and atrophying 'Free World'.

[GQBlues]

...
I tend to think that the upside for US is to do nothing.  Putin has very loudly stepped over the line.  If the US gets involved, then it is a US/Russian thing.  Right now the Eastern European countries are scared shitless that they are going to be next, especially with the statements made today regarding Russians in Estonia.

If it is Russian/Ukrainian thing then Russia takes all of the heat.  US Blackwater can come in on the back end (you would be surprised how fast - 8 hours - that we can engage the troops on the ground anywhere in the world) if necessary.

There. Fix that for you.

[GQBlues]

Excuse me, Hitlerian strategies were destroying villages, burying and burning people alive. So far there was one casualty. As sad as it is it is not compareable.

P.S. remind me how many Iraqi civilians died during 7 years of bringing democracy to Iraq?

Well, fair is fair so don't bring Iraq into the discussion cuz then I'll need to remind you of UN Resolution 687 and the oil-for-corruption grab bag scandal considering Russia was THE biggest beneficiary of that looting party.

[Ranetka]

No issues for who? And/or who had issues after Government changed?
And just to be sure we are on same page ... Government that was changed (or lets better say run away because had no guts to answer for own actions) was in first place Government only because that is who Putin wanted Government to be.


Why Russia should expect russians in other countries to be protected if not willing to protect other countries minorities living in Russia? Because its bigger? have more oil? somehow better from rest of us?

Wow

Because in 20 years you as a country were chosing one bad leader after another. May be if in 20 years you did not blame all your troubles on Russia you would also had improved lifestyle, stronger military and no need for a foreign aid or revolution. And may be then your Crimea would be happy to stay with you.

[Ranetka]

Well, fair is fair so don't bring Iraq into the discussion cuz then I'll need to remind you of UN Resolution 687 and the oil-for-corruption grab bag scandal considering Russia was THE biggest beneficiary of that looting party.

[GQBlues]

If Russia was the biggest beneficiary then my respect for Putin goes even higher....

LOL. That actually wasn't a complimentary nudge, but ok...

...The question is, who is responsibility for starting the mess and death of thousands of people?

That would be Russia, France, Germany, the UN, etc....mostly the usual suspects when talking about blood money.

[Ranetka]

LOL. That actually wasn't a complimentary, but ok...

That would be Russia, France, Germany, the UN, etc....mostly the usual suspects when talking about blood money.

[cc3]

US has already stepped over the line supporting the coup in Ukraine. I have to disappoint you, hawks, the war is out of question. Your dreams will never materialized though you can play Warcraft III to calm down.

War not out of the question if Adolph Putin is foolish enough to invade our Baltic and east European allies:
http://news.yahoo.com/us-expands-military-support-poland-baltic-states-042654687.html
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/03/19/us-ukraine-crisis-nato-rasmussen-idUSBREA2I25D20140319

[GQBlues]

Sorry I do not get it. Is Iraq was now Russia's fault too?

May be Obamacare's Putin's fault as well?

Too much on your plate right now, Ranetka. Maybe another time when things get a bit slower. You should read about it sometime.

[jone]

The Real US Attitude towards Russia and Ukraine:

There is none.  The people on this forum are the 1% of 1%.  We give a sh&t. 

But to the average American, we think that Obama is the great evil in the world.  Russia ranks down there with Athlete's Foot Fungus.

Whenever I am over in Eastern Europe, I always hear how much things in the USA are impacting the lives of every day Russians.  Our country is blamed for everything.  Certainly if you listen to the rhetoric lately, it is that the US staged a coup in Ukraine.  That the US is Jew baiting and bringing military forces to bear. 

I have news for you, this doesn't even rate one of the top stories in the US.  Your country doesn't appear on our radar except as a matter of casual interest.  While you may think we are bad, we think you don't exist.

The havenots are always blaming the haves for their own problems.  You know what I see as the problems of Russia?  1.  Lack of economic growth   2.  Lack of population growth  3.  Lack of infrastructure

As a Russophile, I love the Russian people.  But I see Russia for what it is.  Still in the 80s while the rest of the world is in 2014.

[Ranetka]

Too much on your plate right now, Ranetka. Maybe another time when things get a bit slower. You should read about it sometime.

[Ranetka]

The Real US Attitude towards Russia and Ukraine:

There is none.  The people on this forum are the 1% of 1%.  We give a sh&t. 

But to the average American, we think that Obama is the great evil in the world.  Russia ranks down there with Athlete's Foot Fungus.

Whenever I am over in Eastern Europe, I always hear how much things in the USA are impacting the lives of every day Russians.  Our country is blamed for everything.  Certainly if you listen to the rhetoric lately, it is that the US staged a coup in Ukraine.  That the US is Jew baiting and bringing military forces to bear. 

I have news for you, this doesn't even rate one of the top stories in the US.  Your country doesn't appear on our radar except as a matter of casual interest.  While you may think we are bad, we think you don't exist.

The havenots are always blaming the haves for their own problems.  You know what I see as the problems of Russia?  1.  Lack of economic growth   2.  Lack of population growth  3.  Lack of infrastructure

As a Russophile, I love the Russian people.  But I see Russia for what it is.  Still in the 80s while the rest of the world is in 2014.
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