The Russian Invasion of Ukraine-The Real Nazis

[AC]

He knows he is worth a lot in terms of propaganda value to the Ukrainian Government.
Any person in his position will try to bargain that for political asylum in an EU country and enough money to retire on.

Sorry bud, but you seem to know next to nothing regarding this situation.  He's not going to get much money.  His family back in Russia may be in grave danger.  He certainly will not be thought of as a hero, unless 99% of the information he gave was false, which is possible.  If he had any proper training he would have had a script of all false information to give out, and he would have done it with ease, which is what it looked like.

[Slumba]

Then he obviously does not believe in his mission.  He gave all the information with far too much ease.  Either he gave mostly false information, or he is not what they say he is, or he does not believe in the mission much at all.  I am inclined to think he does not believe in the mission.

However the ease with which he gave up the all the information is not at all congruent with somebody who would have had his training.  Something simply does not add up.

So, tell me what you know about SERE school?

[fathertime]

He is in captivity.  Like Steamer said, he is just trying to survive.  There is no dishonor in that.

What's the big deal?  According to your people, there is no war.  This man is not a soldier but a terrorist.  He will be tried in public in a court of law.  May the best post-Soviet legal code win

My impression is the W. Ukrainians could capture a Russian soldier anytime, being that there are 1000s there.  I don't see this particular incident as being very important. It would be interesting to know what Is being said behind the scenes between the two nations. 

Ukraine leadership may have decided this was the time to make a spectacle since not much else is working too good. 



Fathertime!

[lordtiberius]

My impression is the W. Ukrainians could capture a Russian soldier anytime, being that there are 1000s there.  I don't see this particular incident as being very important. It would be interesting to know what Is being said behind the scenes between the two nations. 

Ukraine leadership may have decided this was the time to make a spectacle since not much else is working too good. 



Fathertime!

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/10/russian-fighter-ukraine-motorola

[lordtiberius]

So, tell me what you know about SERE school?

AC is a SERE grad & a general in the Swedish navy

[sleepycat]

  If he had any proper training he would have had a script of all false information to give out, and he would have done it with ease, which is what it looked like.

His script doesn't appear to include the insistence that he is a volunteer over there on his own accord and not a Russian contract soldier. 

[calmissile]

His script doesn't appear to include the insistence that he is a volunteer over there on his own accord and not a Russian contract soldier. 

In fact he admits to being a normal, contract Russian soldier.

[The Natural]

Here's the real facts behind this propaganda show by the ruthless nazis kidnapping and torturing Russians in order to lie to the gullible fools who believe in them:

"Konashenkov explained that Aleksandrov and Yerofeev have both had combat training and at some point in their lives served in the army, but neither was still active in the military.

Kiev must put an end to its tactic of torturing detainees in order to force confessions, the ministry said. It also passed on a request made by the Veterans Association of Special Forces, urging Kiev “to stop SBU’s abuse of the wounded to get a favorable testimony.”

Hundreds of Ukrainian troops have been detained in Russia during the course of the Ukrainian civil war, noted Konashenkov, stressing that all were treated according to international norms, received medical help, and were allowed to return home to their families."

http://rt.com/news/259817-kiev-detention-torture-russia/

[sleepycat]

You're quoting RT???

 

[Slumba]

Here's the real facts behind this propaganda show by the ruthless nazis kidnapping and torturing Russians in order to lie to the gullible fools who believe in them:

I can't speak to the treatment of Ukr. forces by the Russians. 

However, those words sound pretty strange, considering what "Дядя Володя" , the uncle of a girl I visited in Krasnodar, who works for the FSB, told her.  He told her, "may you never end up in any of the floors below ground level at [the large FSB building where he works in Krasnodar]". 

Given what he rather clearly implied, about the way Russians treat other Russians, what is the basis for your belief that Ukrainian soldiers would be treated better than Russian security forces treat their own fellow citizens?

[Anotherkiwi]

Hundreds of Ukrainian troops have been detained in Russia during the course of the Ukrainian civil war, noted Konashenkov, stressing that all were treated according to international norms, received medical help, and were allowed to return home to their families."

Total and utter rubbish.  If it were true, Nadia Savchenko would be at home.

[sleepycat]

Gotta love all those silly putinists!
If their idol the midget president tells them the sun rises from the west they'll probably believe it...
 

[Muzh]

Here's the real facts behind this propaganda show by the ruthless nazis kidnapping and torturing Russians in order to lie to the gullible fools who believe in them:

"Konashenkov explained that Aleksandrov and Yerofeev have both had combat training and at some point in their lives served in the army, but neither was still active in the military.

Kiev must put an end to its tactic of torturing detainees in order to force confessions, the ministry said. It also passed on a request made by the Veterans Association of Special Forces, urging Kiev “to stop SBU’s abuse of the wounded to get a favorable testimony.”

Hundreds of Ukrainian troops have been detained in Russia during the course of the Ukrainian civil war, noted Konashenkov, stressing that all were treated according to international norms, received medical help, and were allowed to return home to their families."

http://rt.com/news/259817-kiev-detention-torture-russia/

Now I know your just trying to bust our balls.


That was a good one, Roy. 

[lordtiberius]

You're quoting RT???

 

Some people . . . .

[Boethius]

You need to broaden your reading from Russisan propaganda sources, Natural.
 
The prisoner was questioned from his hospital bed, after surgery to save his leg, which was badly injured when he was fighting in observing an area in Donbas.   As Russia allegedly has not sent combatants to Ukraine, this soldier is not protected by the Geneva Conventions on POW's.  However, that nazi fascist government in Kyiv not only attempted to contact the soldier's family (the one in the posted video) in Russia to advise him he'd been wounded (with no success), but also has provided the Red Cross access to both soldiers captured (both wounded, and both still in hospital in Kyiv).  Had they been tortured, is it realistic that the Red Cross would be allowed to visit them?   
 
Well, who knows?  Evil Banderites are tricky, after all, and the Western Red Cross likely is in cahoots with them.  Because those Kyiv Banderites and their Western conspirators are duplicitous evil fascists, unlike the Christ-like, straightforward Russians, who have done nothing but: (a) provide humanitarian aid to the purely motivated, besieged rebels, and (b) save Crimeans from mass slaughter at the hands of ruthless, marauding, barely civilized Ukrainians.  Right?

[Boethius]

Video of second soldier.  He also was injured, though less severely than the first soldier.
 

[Boethius]

The soldiers were captured by the Aidar Battalion.  You know, those genetically fascist, anti Russian forces that the rebels claim they shoot on site, because the Aidar Battalion "takes no prisoners".
 
The soldiers volunteers are visited in hospital by representatives of  well known fascist loving organizations, namely, the OSCE, Amnesty International, and the EU's monitoring mission -
   
http://www.hromadske.tv/society/do-likarni-z-rosiiskimi-viiskovimi-pribuli-tri-miz/

[The Natural]

Well Bo, you accuse me of Reading Russian propaganda and I you of Reading Ukrainian. But it's strange how you always ridicule my links but expect me to take Yours like it came from the Lord himself.

Truth is nobody here has the Whole story. I was merely showing what the accused side (Russia) had to say about it. But fair and balanced is apparently a big no-no here.

[Boethius]

RT is not "fair and balanced".  While the same can be said of Ukrainian sources, the fact that Ukrainian authorities have given the Red Cross, Amnesty International, the OSCE, and EU monitors access to the Russian soldiers suggests, logically, that they have not been tortured.  If any of the aformentioned organizations states otherwise and I read it, I will post that information. 

[The Natural]

I was talking about fair and balanced in context With members of RWD accepting opposing viewpoints to their own. That goes out the window once a subject like this (Russia/Putin is evil) reaches a Critical mass of YES supporters.

PS. Russia Today is a splendid News organization. That's probably why there's talk of bombing it 

[Boethius]

You mean like the "fair and balanced" approach you take in labelling the entire Ukrainian government "nazis"?
 
RT is a propaganda arm of the Russian government.  So no, it is not "splendid".

[The Natural]

You mean like the "fair and balanced" approach you take in labelling the entire Ukrainian government "nazis"?
 
RT is a propaganda arm of the Russian government.  So no, it is not "splendid".

Must have the last Word, right? So yes, RT is splendid and it's very popular With many westerners as well, who's tired of the constant one-sided Washington propaganda about Russia. Sorry, but facts do occasionally hurt!

[lordtiberius]

Natural, do you teach your kid this morally relativist crap or is this special punishment reserved just for us?

[The Natural]

Natural, do you teach your kid this morally relativist crap or is this special punishment reserved just for us?

The way you're following me around here suggest you're not feeling punishment, rather pleasure 

[Boethius]

You mean like this absolutely factual story? - http://actualidad.rt.com/opinion/karen-mendez/view/136298-centro-investigacion-biologica-eeuu-fort-detrick-brote-ebola
 
Then there is this story, citing another paper - http://russian.rt.com/article/44182
 
That paper refuted the RT claim - http://www.nst.com.my/node/21682
 
Then there was the claim of protests in Eastern Ukraine re child soldiers fighting for Ukraine, complete with a photo of protesters.  But, there was no protest, and the RT photo turned out to be of members of Russia's Public Chamber - http://rt.com/politics/177824-ukraine-child-soldiers-protest/
 
Then there was the story of the child crucified on a public square in Donetsk.  Reported as fact.  Removed, without correction, when proven false by Western media.
 

 
Then there was a report that MH17 was downed by a Ukrainian plane which actually, was looking to down Putin's presidential plane.  Reported as fact by that "great source", RT -http://russian.rt.com/article/41332
 
more than once -http://russian.rt.com/article/41334
 
Should I continue?