Donetsk Airport: Has it finally fallen?

[AC]

Yep, within hours of the original genuine accusation by Kiev the Russian media, paid trolls and affiliated western sympathizers were flooding the internet with bogus stories claiming in some cases the opposite of the original report but with the same narrative.

It's all garbage of course and adds to the credibility of the original events  as laid out by the Ukraine military.

Brass

Right out of the script of the NKVD.  Didn't they kill a bunch of Polish officers somewhere in Russia and completely deny it?  Then the Germans found hundreds or it may have been thousands of corpses of Ukrainians murdered in Vinnitsya by the NKVD.  But I believe the Russians tried to convince the World that the Germans had commited those specific attrocities (we all know the Germans were found guilty of other attrocities).

[fathertime]

If there was a gas attack, why aren't there pictures?

It is a legit question....if there isn't any proof who is going to believe the people who have every incentive to demonize the Russians more?  Where are the pictures, video, dead bodies to be examined for signs of poisoning...live bodies with gas related injuries....physical evidence........nothing to this point. Why?  Still not seeing any stories in major outlets...and this would be BIG news for the major news carriers if it were true.   






Fathertime!   

[Brasscasing]

It is a legit question....if there isn't any proof who is going to believe the people who have every incentive to demonize the Russians more?  Where are the pictures, video, dead bodies to be examined for signs of poisoning...live bodies with gas related injuries....physical evidence........nothing to this point. Why?  Still not seeing any stories in major outlets...and this would be BIG news for the major news carriers if it were true.   

Fathertime!

Wonderful. So we've established that if the Ukrainians come forward with an after action report containing forensics you'll be convinced, is that correct?

Brass

[fathertime]

Wonderful. So we've established that if the Ukrainians come forward with an after action report containing forensics you'll be convinced, is that correct?

Brass

Absolutely NOT!  But it would at least be something instead of nothing, right now the media isn't even convinced enough to run a story...yet.


That said, if the report was convincing I might be...for example I begrudgingly tend to agree more or less with the western account of events regarding the downed flight...as the excited Russian voices over the radio are rather damning.


Fathertime!   

[AC]

Wonderful. So we've established that if the Ukrainians come forward with an after action report containing forensics you'll be convinced, is that correct?

Brass

Ft, Belvis and Doll, no matter how much evidence there is of a chemical weapons attack, will deny it and say it was faked or somehow staged.  Just look at their absurd denials regarding MH17.

Doll even denies Mende has been in the war zone.  If he took a picture she would say it was photoshopped.  If he had two or more associates sign an affadavit, she would say the signatures were faked.  When dealing with loonies this is to be expected. 

Mostly I think they know the Soviets and now Russia under Putin completely fabricate the news, so they figure if Russia does it, why not the West?  Catch 22.

[Larry1]

Wonderful. So we've established that if the Ukrainians come forward with an after action report containing forensics you'll be convinced, is that correct?

Brass

No, the pro-Russian fanatics like Fathertime! will never, ever admit that Russians are behind this war on Ukraine. Unless, maybe Bad Vlad himself says on his website, "we have attacked Eastern ukraine..."

[fathertime]

No, the pro-Russian fanatics like Fathertime! will never, ever admit that Russians are behind this war on Ukraine. Unless, maybe Bad Vlad himself says on his website, "we have attacked Eastern ukraine..."

Who is this 'larry' character who is mislabeling me as a Russia fanatic?  I'm pro-US, in my own way....which doesn't include all of our foreign policy decisions.


Fathertime!   

[fathertime]

Ft, Belvis and Doll, no matter how much evidence there is of a chemical weapons attack, will deny it and say it was faked or somehow staged.  Just look at their absurd denials regarding MH17.
 

First you must not have read the post above yours regarding views I have....second at this point there is NO NEWS OUTLET covering this chemical weapons 'story' so that tells me there is no evidence at all....so far just a lot of conjecture here.


Fathertime!   

[Brasscasing]

Absolutely NOT!  But it would at least be something instead of nothing, right now the media isn't even convinced enough to run a story...yet.


That said, if the report was convincing I might be...for example I begrudgingly tend to agree more or less with the western account of events regarding the downed flight...as the excited Russian voices over the radio are rather damning.

 I didn't think so.

Tell you what though if you're interested in balanced reporting try this...



In this vid they report Toxicologists haven't confirmed if gas was deployed. No crazy hoopla as we see in the Russian versions, right? One might deduce from this they're actually running tests, yes?

Now for the Russian soldiers in Ukraine doubters. Take a look at this report...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-ts=1421914688&v=WJvB_aLYNQk&x-yt-cl=84503534

At 23 seconds of the news report...You see buddy comrade with the AK 103? Well that ain't no Donetsk People's Republic flag sown on to his flak vest, is it?

Now you see that green 'K' hanging off his right epaulette? Well that 'K' stands for Cadet, as in student, Russian Army Staff College. So you figure he's a separatist or a Russian Regular?

Brass

[Brasscasing]

Who is this 'larry' character who is mislabeling me as a Russia fanatic?  I'm pro-US, in my own way....which doesn't include all of our foreign policy decisions.


Fathertime!   

FT, meet Larry our Russian fanatic labeler. FT, Larry, Larry, FT...

Hiya Larry.

Brass

[fathertime]

FT, meet Larry our Russian fanatic labeler. FT, Larry, Larry, FT...

Hiya Larry.

Brass

haha...very good....but you should have put 'mislabeler'. 


and thanks for the video clip...interesting...although not much at this point.


Fathertime! 

[Steamer]

Mostly I think they know the Soviets and now Russia under Putin completely fabricate the news, so they figure if Russia does it, why not the West?  Catch 22.

RT and CNN are both full of crap, equally.

[lordtiberius]

Even in this age of instant viral news, in the middle of a fire fight gagging on an unknown airborne substance the average soldier might not have time or the motivation to stick his arm up over the barricade he's hiding behind with the ol' apple iphone  and snap a selfie and I doubt there was media inside the complex from either side for obvious reasons.

You've gone through the gas hut, you know this.

Brass

Syria had a gas attack.  They posted pictures.  If Katernya Kruk is questioning the credibility of her MOD we should too.

[lordtiberius]

It is a legit question....if there isn't any proof who is going to believe the people who have every incentive to demonize the Russians more?  Where are the pictures, video, dead bodies to be examined for signs of poisoning...live bodies with gas related injuries....physical evidence........nothing to this point. Why?  Still not seeing any stories in major outlets...and this would be BIG news for the major news carriers if it were true.   






Fathertime!

Why would anyone demonize Russia?  They are the good guys right FT?  Look at how they treat their prisoners . . .

[lordtiberius]

Who is this 'larry' character who is mislabeling me as a Russia fanatic?  I'm pro-US, in my own way....which doesn't include all of our foreign policy decisions.


Fathertime!   

You are pro-US?  How?  You even root for the other team in the Olympics.

[lordtiberius]

First you must not have read the post above yours regarding views I have....second at this point there is NO NEWS OUTLET covering this chemical weapons 'story' so that tells me there is no evidence at all....so far just a lot of conjecture here.


Fathertime!

He is just using FT's own words against FT.  Brass asked you if there was evidence that there was a gas attack would you believe it.  You said no.

Are you sure you don't do drugs?

Still maintain that Russia is not in Ukraine?  Who shot down MH-17?

[mendeleyev]

FT, soldiers on both sides claim gas was used. It was Russian TV that showed one photo of old WWII era gas masks when making their claim again Ukraine.

[lordtiberius]

And yet there is a media blackout.  Why?

[mendeleyev]

If you happen to be inside Ukraine and find yourself captured by the Russian separatists, or pro-Russian terrorists, Russian Army regulars, Putin's "little green men" or whatever they are calling themselves, for God's sake please be sure to die rather than taken captive.

We thought that this sort of thing was against International laws for treating prisoners, but apparently that does not matter. "New Russia" TV wanted to show viewers how locals treat Ukrainian soldiers who are captured, so they brought this captured Ukrainian "Cyborg," a term Ukrainians give to their soldiers defending the Donetsk airport, to the scene of a bus that had been hit by stray shelling.

"В честь полоненого Кіборга"

Ти йшов, як Він, смиренно так ішов,
 свого Хреста ніс на свою Голготу.
 В глибоких ранах запеклася кров
 під камуфляжем, що змокрів від поту.

Й тобі юрба кричала: Розіпни!
 за те, що боронив свою Вкраїну.
 А ти ішов проклятий без вини,
 слова і камені летіли вслід у спину.

Не впадь, рідненький, під тяжким хрестом,
 бо мусиш до кінця пройти страшну дорогу.
 У відповідь на зло, не варто - злом,
 в душі тихенько змов Молитву Богу.

...Ти так смиренно ніс свого хреста.
 Юрба хотіла хліба і забави.
 Це їх дорога, їх страшна ганьба.
 Для тебе це була дорога - СЛАВИ!

ИРИНА ГУЛИЕВА

A new question has opened up: was it a license plate registered to the Russian Ministry of Internal Affair on the green car that drove away with the prisoner? We do not know, but it is an intriguing question.

[mendeleyev]

And yet there is a media blackout.  Why?

I did not know that there was one. Russian media are reporting that there was gas from the Ukrainians.

Western media would want more evidence, and so far, I have not yet see any.

[fathertime]

You are pro-US?  How?  You even root for the other team in the Olympics.

He is just using FT's own words against FT.  Brass asked you if there was evidence that there was a gas attack would you believe it.  You said no.

Are you sure you don't do drugs?

Still maintain that Russia is not in Ukraine?  Who shot down MH-17?

What a couple of silly, desperate, and twisted posts!  No I don't do drugs but I'd say  either you do or you need to!


Fathertime!   

[fathertime]

FT, soldiers on both sides claim gas was used. It was Russian TV that showed one photo of old WWII era gas masks when making their claim again Ukraine.

Interesting...nothing yet in any of media I, or the mainstream would  normally view here in the states.   


Fathertime!   

[lordtiberius]

What a couple of silly, desperate, and twisted posts!  No I don't do drugs but I'd say  either you do or you need to!


Fathertime!

 

[pokerintherear]

Mendy

Do you have any reports of how big the separatist units are? How many are involved in the fighting at the airport? What kind of weapons are in use or available?

Its aggravating to read reports of a rogue army taking an international airport and turning it into rubble. Most military "minds" are looking at this situation and wondering whats wrong with the Ukrainian army? Are the commanders incompetent? 

Right now the airport is demolished so its a lost cause. The Ukrainian forces need to retreat to a safe distance and allow the invaders to congregate at their captured real estate. When all are gathered the carpet bombing needs to begin. Essentially turning the airport into a parking lot.

[Belvis]

We thought that this sort of thing was against International laws for treating prisoners, but apparently that does not matter. "New Russia" TV wanted to show viewers how locals treat Ukrainian soldiers who are captured, so they brought this captured Ukrainian "Cyborg," a term Ukrainians give to their soldiers defending the Donetsk airport, to the scene of a bus that had been hit by stray shelling.

Ukrainian "liberators" face locals in Donbass. Pretty mild treatment taking into account they have killed about 5,000 locals. Mendy, have you seen interviews of captured rebels about how they were treated in Ukrainian captivity?

A new question has opened up: was it a license plate registered to the Russian Ministry of Internal Affair on the green car that drove away with the prisoner? We do not know, but it is an intriguing question.

Just for reference. No intrigue here, just bad work with Ukrainian and Russian sources  The license plate is registered in Ekaterinburg region and belongs to a man working for Akhmetov as a promoter. What Mendy called  "registered to the Russian Ministry of Internal Affair" in reality means spare plates for regions, but he told obsolete info, now it is Ekaterinburg.