yet another reflection on Photoguy's K-1 experience

[Son of Clyde]

Personally, it may be the luck of the draw. TG has met many women of all ages and he unfortunaly brought the wrong one over. I know he is sincere in his intentions of marrying a RW. Some of these women are great actresses and perfectly capable of deceiving someone by gaining their trust. I think Larisa was naive but I don't think she deceived PG. We expect women to think the USA is a garden of eden once they arrive and for some it is just another country in the east. I was sooo worried my family would become Americanized and it never happened. They are proud of Ukraine and in many ways see America as a country of excess. Which is very true.

[KenC]

Personally, it may be the luck of the draw. TG has met many women of all ages and he unfortunaly brought the wrong one over. I know he is sincere in his intentions of marrying a RW. Some of these women are great actresses and perfectly capable of deceiving someone by gaining their trust. I think Larisa was naive but I don't think she deceived PG. We expect women to think the USA is a garden of eden once they arrive and for some it is just another country in the east. I was sooo worried my family would become Americanized and it never happened. They are proud of Ukraine and in many ways see America as a country of excess. Which is very true.

Clyde,
The highlighted portion of your post is an important point. Too many guys rely on the allure of America (insert any European country and Australia) to land their RW. What they forget is that if their big selling point to a RW is the location of their residence, they are just "another" American once the RW arrives. She doesn't "need" him any more because she is already here. He will be in great danger of her dumping the mule for a BBD.
KenC

[KenC]

It is fairly easy for a college aged girl to get a work visa to the USA for summer employment.  There are different agencies which pay for the girls round trip ticket and give them employment in various sleep away camps and girl scout camps which also pay the girls a small stipend of money as well.  There are other agencies that the Russian student would pay a small fee plus said round trip airfare that will help them process the visa and find them employment in the USA (I think it is about $1600 dollars, so the girls have to work and save or have rich parents for this).  My wife's sister is coming on the second program this summer.  This program enables them to earn alot more money.  The resort jobs / Disney world type jobs are premium for this type of worker so they go fast.  My wifes sister went to work in a girl scout camp when she was 19.  Now she will be working for an insurance company this summer at age 21.  If you think about it, even with minimum wage on a 40 hour week they earn about $250 per week - so in three weeks they get $3000.  Usually they are able to come home with at least $500 in their pockets.  Some of the girls hustle and work Friday nights through Sunday waiting tables, bar tending etc. to earn even alot more. If they do not like their employment they are allowed to switch to other employment but I believe according to their visa they have five days upon entry to the USA to begin working.  I am not sure of the class of visa but I could find out in early June when she gets here.  She is lucky because we will host her ie. she has no room and board worries.

Bruce,
We had a house guest last year from Tver who came over on such a work program. The young single RW had a deal to work in a tourist area of Virginia that provided her with a small salary and room and board. I really don't know the specifics of her visa, but her parents are rather well to do. She wasn't too keen on her job of waiting tables and her living conditions were less than stellar. I don't know if she cut some corners of her visa or not, but she did end up spending a few weeks with us in San Diego and another couple of weeks with people she met in Virginia that lived in the Bay area of Northern CA. She has plans to do the same this summer too.
KenC

[Turboguy]

Ken,

I believe you are on to something....

Which gives us to wonder,,, since a turbo is something driven entirely by it's own exhaust gasses, if TurboGuy is operating on his own exhaust gas, is it there any question why he has been so unsuccessful?

(just yanking your chain, T/G)

As far as the .....guy thing I have some other friends who's gals also went back who did not have .... guy in their handle.   The funniest was the one who found his gal was doing naked webcam with about 20 guys from AdultFrienedFinder while he worked.

I think making visa's easier to get would help solve the problem a lot.  This week I have company again.  The gal who visited me in LA for 11 days and who I later visted in Rostov is here for the week.   There is more to the story that I will post later but it is nice just to be able to date normally and not have to worry about rushing into any decisions. 

As far as if photo guy broke the law, I think he did no worse then most guys and I would bet there are not too many of our lawmakers in DC who do not break the laws in a much worse way.

[Zhena]

Yes I know about the hundreds of college age Russians who come to the US and work at the resorts in summertime.
I think they may have all been sponsored by a corporation that is in the business of providing cheap labor. Maybe these young people will work a lot cheaper than Americans of the same age. Maybe they are here on student visas also.
It was my understanding that a single female cannot just decide she wants to tour the US or come here to find a job. She needs to be more specific. It is not easy for these people without a sponsor or company sponsorship. Americans can cross the pond to the UK anytime we choose. We can spend months there with no problem, maybe even work part-time. We do not need a sponsor to go to UK, parts of Europe, Canada or Mexico. Why is a young Russian woman not allowed to come to the US on vacation? I know there are rare instances it is allowed, but what is the criteria?

Yes! For certain.

[David1963]

Don't mean to get this back on topic, sort of.

I know of a lady who did a K-1 with an AM and her sole purpose is to check out America and see if it is a place she wants to move to.  They are married and I don't know what plans she has for the future, I do know that she doesn't love him and talks bad about him to her RW friends.

I don't think the 20 year age difference has anything to do with it though or her making fun of 'The old man she married' to her friends.

He seems happy and is clueless.  I'm sure he's enjoying his hot young thing and showing her off to his friends.

It will be interesting if I can stay in the loop and find out what happens.

This could be the same thing PG just went through, you never know unless your on the inside know.

[Turboguy]

I am sure that happens more than most people realize.  When my former fiancee was here, her one friend was a gal, Oxana she met in English Classes.   Oxana told Luda that her husband was a good man but she did not love him.  When they were together they were falling all over each other seemingly in love but I know it was just an act on her part. 

Is it that big a deal if her acting is good enough that he believes it and if their life is good enough that she stays.  BTW They did not have a big age difference, perhpas 10 years or so.

[tim 360]

Bruce and others are correct about the ease of obtaining work visas for employeess from the FSU. There are quite a few agencies which specialize in this and recruit students for 6 month jobs in the USA. Just go to any resort this year and they will be there working and getting a certain view of the USA. Disneyland, DisneyWorld, 6 Flags, ski resorts, beaches...everywhere that needs workers for a short term. Fast food, restaurants etc.

These agencies make a good buck. They charge the employee and the employer for their service. I live in a resort area and all the businesses get contacted. 5 years ago only the biggest companies used this, now it has grown. 

No comment on PG's reflections.  Indeed, what ever is there to say? :noidea: But, whenever I hear Sinatra sing "My Way" I'll remember Doug.  Cheerio, Tim360  ..." I did it all and I stood tall and did it, mmmmmyyyyyyy wwwwaaaayyy

[ConnerVT]

The funniest was the one who found his gal was doing naked webcam with about 20 guys from AdultFrienedFinder while he worked.

Why was he surfing AdultFriendFinder while he was at work?   

[Photo Guy]

David wrote:
Don't mean to get this back on topic, sort of.

I know of a lady who did a K-1 with an AM and her sole purpose is to check out America and see if it is a place she wants to move to.  They are married and I don't know what plans she has for the future, I do know that she doesn't love him and talks bad about him to her RW friends.
I don't think the 20 year age difference has anything to do with it though or her making fun of 'The old man she married' to her friends.
He seems happy and is clueless.  I'm sure he's enjoying his hot young thing and showing her off to his friends.
It will be interesting if I can stay in the loop and find out what happens.
This could be the same thing PG just went through, you never know unless your on the inside know.

David, yes Larisa wanted to check-out America and my way of life, the desert climate, and
our chemistry, of course. Checking out America was not her sole purpose. Larisa did not say bad things about me, behind my back. She was quite respectful. I am currently friends with one of the RW friends she made and she is very open about Larisa and conversations they've had.  Larisa was very direct with me. When she was unhappy with me or a cultural thing, she would tell me directly, in a way that RW do well.

Tim wrote:
No comment on PG's reflections.  Indeed, what ever is there to say? I Have No Idea But, whenever I hear Sinatra sing "My Way" I'll remember Doug.  Cheerio, Tim360  ..." I did it all and I stood tall and did it, mmmmmyyyyyyy wwwwaaaayyy

Tim, LOL, yes...the independent/unconventional traits are associated with Sagittarius- myself, Sinatra, and others.

[tim 360]

Well, yes PG I do agree. In fact I can't understand why anyone bothers to take their time and energy to attempt to tell you anything. By now they should all realize you are not going to listen to anybody. Myself? I have nothing to say since I am enjoying the comedy. I don't give advice to my cows while I milk them and I am sure not going to give you any. Like my cows---you know everything. I don't quite put you in the company of Sinatra, but in Doug's world?...you should read more.  Ever read The World According to Garp? Anyway Doug,  I was not even talking to you. I was addressing the accuracy of Bruce's and JB's (I think) remarks about FSU college girls working in the USA.

Doug you are great entertainment.  Keep it coming.  Absolutely no one on the internet has provided me with more laughs. Ever think about TV, like maybe Desperate Russian Housewives or maybe...Doug...can you sing? I'm thinkin' "My Way" on American Idol...whattcha 'tink?


Anyway,  there are plently of them. You really don't have to travel so far to meet them. And these are nothing like agency or MOB girls. Most are quite smart and no BS. I have met and known a dozen or 2. Many re-up for the following year and save their $. Like one girl from Sophia told me...she will do this for 5 years and go home and have alot of $.

Thats it. Time to check the cows and corn. And sing, ...despite it all, I took the fall aaannnddd did it mmmyyyyy wwwwaaaayyyyyy.
Ciao

[KenC]

Tim,
 
"despite it all, I took the fall aaannnddd did it mmmyyyyy wwwwaaaayyyyyy."
The key words there are "took the fall!"
Thanks for the laugh.
KenC

[Photo Guy]

This is why some come here to RWD, ..for the sophisticated humor! <wink>!!!

[KenC]

Photo,
You're the funniest bus driver since Ralph Kramden! :zappedhim:
KenC

[PeeWee]

Photo,
You're the funniest bus driver since Ralph Kramden! :zappedhim:
KenC

Ralph Kramden? Now you're dating yourself, Ken.

Peewee

[Markus]

I hope some newbies read this thread. I will display the folly in the expert opinions. If my post seems long to folks, I think the words will be like an interesting novel (I do have to poke fun at myself now and then).

Photoguy,

Are you one of those middle aged men who targeted a young 20ish year old girl? After reading your story, I could not ignore my thoughts in that I was seeing Kenc who was also a middle aged man who targeted a young lady. In his case, he was 45 and she was 20.  I realize you are older than he was at that time, but I don't know the exact age of your girl, but from the information in this thread, I know shes 20ish.  Perhaps Kenc is feeling somewhat as a leader of middle aged men who target young FSU girls and he's expressing his disgust because your situation didn't work out. You did not follow in Kenc's footsteps, except for the middle age guy going for a young lady. The fact is you and Kenc have something in common; You both, in your middle age status, targeted young FSUW. I'll deal with his simple thoughts soon. But, first, I want to address BC who has made a good point on the off-topic subject (Off topic subjects are usually interesting. That's a statement to Moderaters to allow off-topic subjects. And, I guess Dan is only person who moderates).

BC, I like your thoughts about getting rid of the K1 and only providing the K3. In your words, the K3 could imply, "Putting your money where your mouth is." I married in Russia where all of my wife's family could be involved. If a lady who has never been married agrees to a K1, is the man "robbing" her from the experience of her "first wedding" with her family? Do men think that a K1 gives them the right to think only about themselves, but, forget about the lady being married for the first time? Or, if a lady who has never been married agrees to a K1, wouldn't that put up a red flag blowing in the wind with flapping sounds that says, "Hey, dude!" I'm not implying that all K1s mean that because some FSUW in this process have been married before. I cannot explain in words the experience of my marriage in Russia with her family.  And the good-bye dinner was even better. So, do K1s rob FSUW from the experience with her family in the FSU?  And, is a K1 an avenue that shows doubt and really is a "testing" time for the man? I agree with AJ in that a K1 should confirm what's known in advance. But, I also agree with BC; Get married in the FSU and follow through with what you think is right (K3).  

Now, on to the simple subject.

Photoguy,

I can attest to the fact that asking questions or exposing personal situations will attract the "know it alls" who, from what I have experienced, are more concerned with their opinion than the poster. From your original post, the selected parts that were repeated here, Kenc thinks he is empathizing with you, but, empathizing with anyone is impossible. He responded in his opinion as if he was really you, which is why you received the extreme thoughts from him. Let me explain myself. If I win a seven million dollars, you cannot empathize with me. As a possible fact, you probably would initially experience jealousy. But, if you knew me, you might say, "I'm happy for you." But, there's no way you could "feel" my feelings or could you mentally know what I'm feeling. Empathy is factually defined wrong in the dictionary. It's an impossible word by definition.  

Now, your situation did not work out. Does that mean you are doomed to find an FSUW? You asked this same question in a similar rhetorical question, and, of course, Kenc would lead you or any newbies to think that the answer is yes. Kenc's justification is his 7 years of marriage with that huge age difference. Hopefully Kenc didn't do what Paul McCartney did in taking a chance with such an age difference without a prenup (I bet Kenc did, what a doubter). Just read the news and be glad you are not Paul. It's when men who take a chance on large age differences and age to be around the age of Paul that reality sets in. So, Photoguy, I am not only saying this to you but to folks who go this route. You should not "quit" as Kenc has implied, although not verbatim. You experienced a relationship that didn't work out. Should you continue? Well, what is Andrew from Finland doing? He lives next door to the FSU, is an expert on FSUW, has many opinions on other men's endeavors, yet, he himself had a relationship that didn't work out. Andrew has also stated that "He's one of those guys who is with your lady while she's waiting for her visa; His admission shows what kind of guy he is, even if he lives next door to the FSU. The fact is, Andrew cannot find a wife. Perhaps Andrew should quit hanging out in bars to try and find an FSUW, yet, expresses what he has learned from bar women as experience and tries to apply his knowledge to the good ladies that men seek.

I'm my previous posts, I had jb, who disagreed with what I stated and responded with words such as, "that was really bad." I hope that any disagreements, which I like, will not be intellectually inept such as jb's response. If you want to step up to the plate, step up to the plate. I'm not interested in only opinion with "that was really bad;" I want to know in words why "it was really bad." Most of the know it alls refrain because they know their emotions are driving their thinking and I will show the folly in their response, something I like to have fun with. Also, don't use words that I need to look up in the dictionary (I hope somebody has a sense of humor on this board).

Let's analyze Kenc's thoughts. ken, did you think you could avoid having your opinions dissected by a man who whom you criticized in the same manner 2.4 years ago, yet, it's working for me?  You would really like for me to "go away", but I present a challenge to your opinions, because I can prove to anyone who wants to know that your opinions are "smoke in air" blowing to and fro and eventually are invisible. Why do you want to taunt people who are trying to achieve what you have, which is finding a wife from the FSU? I advise you to learn how to convey your disagreeing thoughts in a manner that is intellectual and in a manner where a person can take your thoughts and apply them to their life (I don't advocate most of ken's thoughts here).  Perhaps you should read the book, "How to Win Friends and Influence People." Now, I will show your folly. If you will go back and read my first post here, I stated that I am here to deal with opinions such as yours. You did respond in that "I never talk about my wife." I had to laugh inside, knowing that the next thread by me was all about my wife.

I'll provide Photoguy's statements in bold and underlined and kenc's responses in bold an italics:

I wish this topic had stayed locked. Now I have to defend
myself against untrue bull***t statements that mis-characterize who I am.
For example Andrewfin writes that I didn't have the time or money
for a second visit. Completely untrue. She talked me into coming to
the US. She was enthusiastic about seeing America.

So should we look at Larisa as a scammer? She scammed you for an all expense paid 90 day vacation in America. How could a "mature" man of 52 allow a 20 something year old girl talk him into such foolishness? Where was your head? (The one that is supposed to be on your shoulders)

ken, I will ask you, because the situation didn't work she's a scammer? So what if Photoguy chose not to sit on the sidelines but made an attempt to find a wife. It was a situation that didn't work. Do you have any experience at being scammed? I do. Just because a situation doesn't work out doesn't imply the lady is a scammer. Perhaps it's the age difference that bothers you.

In retrospect,
our second meeting should have been in her home town. I admit to
that mistake.
Oh, you mean us geezers got something right?

Photoguy is admitting to a mistake. Why pat yourself on the shoulder? Oh wait, that's the intent of why you post. When you reach Paul's age (the beatle), I will feel sorry for you, not make statements that I can pat myself on should about later.

The second mis-characterization, is the whole idea that
this sequence of events was something horrible. Haven't any of you
dated a woman and then broke up?
Not after being engaged to her, NO! You play both sides of the fence on this one. On one hand you sincerely wanted to marry her, but yet on the other hand, it was just a casual "dating thing." Make up your mind, because it can't be both.

So, the intellectually justification from ken is that since he has never experienced "it" it's wrong. Now, that justification falls into the "That was really bad" thought pattern. This response was very well thought out, a mentally lazy response with the hope of being "correct."

The next statement I agree with Ken and I'm too mentally lazy to post it.

Another bull***t
statement is that I had fallen in love with a photo. A total crock.
I agree with you. You fell in love with the idea of being in love. Larisa was just the necessary missing piece for your fantasy

ken, it's too easy for you to agree with a statement you fabricated. Let me ask you a question ken, Do you know my fantasies? If so, then I agree with you, otherwise you are full of horse hockey. But, you should prove your abilities in stating verbatim the fantasies of everyone responding in this post. Otherwise, again, you are full of horse hockey. I like showing folly, but this is too easy.

I am tired of this crap. I relate my experiences for the good of
everyone, and I have to deal with character assassination? I have never
been married, so that's twisted into the idea that I'm a naive idiot
who just fell off the turnip truck.
I don't ever recall anyone questioning your character. But your foolishness shows clearly through your actions. And yes, the turnip truck seems rather close to your current location

ken you are welcome to determine if a man's actions are foolishness or not. But, show a person's fantasies and then I will believe you can know a man's foolishness. Otherwise, it's all opinion and smoke in the air. I dare you to admit it. But, there is an admission floating in the air that you want to admit but can't.

Although it may have not worked out, I am happy I pursued Larisa and
spent time with her...   Yes, you can choose a woman who is not a challenge,
a woman who is in love with you from DAY 1 (or even DAY14), but in that case
you better beware of GCG's and ultra-desperate types.
How about choosing a woman that "likes" you? One that might not mind a kiss or two from you? How about a woman that you can actually talk to? If not that, maybe a woman that is interested enough in you to learn your language?

ken, how can you argue with a man who is happy he pursued a lady and the situation didn't work out? Is your nickname "Monday Morning Quarterback?" Do you like to call the calls after the situation is finished? Even if you "called" it, your emotions and life are not involved. We know how you ranted about me and you still haven't stepped up the plate to admit your folly. How in the world does a man choose a lady that "likes" him? It's time together or correspondence that dictates that result. And as you know, after Sep of this year it will be 3 years for me. So, for some men it doesn't take that long. But, in your case, being a 45 year old man going for a 20 year old kid, I think a few more visits than mine would suffice. Oh wait, I visited 3 times before I married, but did the K3.

Actually the goal should not be 'a successful and happy marriage',
This might be your single most stupid statement ever!

I agree with Ken on this one, but I would have worded it different.

but
the goal should be to discover who she is.
Excuse me? Shouldn't you "discover who she is" before you get engaged to be married?
That process will take longer
than a few weeks. After that process(sometimes years), comes the 'happy marriage' goal.
If you discover that you are not right for each other, move on, look elsewhere.
You will have succeeded in discovering you are not right for each other.
That discovery process should not be underestimated and minimized in favor
of a view that only looks at marriage/success- separation/failure. That is way
too simple. The discovery/dating process often does not result in marriage
and that's actually okay, not some shameful failure, that opens us up to
demeaning put-downs from puffed-up authoritarians.  

I thought photoguy was advocating "discovering who she was." Why would ken ask a question about what was already stated and then give an explanation? But, Kenc, you do refer to (sometimes years). Would you care to expose how many years? Step up to the plate sir.


Ken concludes with a part of several statements such as, "How someone in your position, can still insist that he attained some level of success, is beyond comprehension. ken's statement reminds of a man who has never learned "anything" from something that did not result in the goal. If I used Ken's thought pattern and applied that to investing, I would never invest again after my first sale at a loss. Ken can have this opinion because he has a wife and doesn't understand the process of investing time involved in this process when the result is not what was expected.  Ask Maxx and Richard if they understand ken's statement. If a window closes another window will open; that subsequent window depends on the man's willingness to continue. ken is not in a position to give advice on an FSUW relationship that didn't work and either am I, but, to ken there will never be another open window, to me, there's always an open window. But, I'm relaxing in the comfort of having an FSU wife so my open window thoughts can be interpreted anyway by the reader.

I would advise you Photoguy to avoid the 20 year old girls.

Mark

[BC]

1Week,

Thanks for the well written critique.  I really don't want (or have the time) to really go through all the items you mentioned and surely don't need to step up to the plate for others here, but one aspect you should be aware of is that Photo's story here started long ago.  I assume since you recently registered here you were not along for the whole ride. IIRC we are talking about well over 80 pages of posts in addition to his first 20 or so page trip report that is no longer unavailable.. a huge, incredible amount of posts to sort through to even get a basic idea of what really happened.

A few 'recollections' I might mention:

Although the age difference was mentioned from time to time it was never really presented as a 'deal killer' and usually mentioned as an additional hurdle.. on top of a huge pile of others.

Photo was given overwhelmingly good, sound and hard advice.. admittedly some bad and unnecessary quips along the way too. Unfortunately like many others I believe he got into the 'but my situation is unique' rut and reacted with emotional defense that tended to up the volume level step by step.

There were several long breaks when it got too loud. Photo departed and during these breaks very little was discussed.  Several times he came back 'for more' when the topic was long gone and almost forgotten.  I really don't know what motivation was involved, especially since he had not returned to visit Larissa and really had little new experience to share but instead dwelled on philosophical thoughts and romanticism.

When Larissa arrived, they were given quite a few well wishes and that was it.

A couple interim threads ensued about the good life, then that maybe things weren't so hot.

I cannot count how many many times members here expressed "I wish you no ill.. We would love to see you succeed.. etc etc throughout all the threads.

Then this last round announcing she had returned to her home.  I applaud his effort, believe he has learned a good bit but think even this effort was a 'tainted' by the desire to over rationalize the experience into positive light, maybe to us, maybe to himself.. I really don't know.

A "Well it didn't work out, learned a bit, had a little fun but we're both ok" kinda statement would have sufficed quite well. If it were so I bet this thread and a couple others would not exist.

You really had to be there in 'real time' to understand it all.  There was very little monday quarterbacking involved.

Just trying to put things into context so that you might better understand the responses that will surely be forthcoming.

Cheers!

[Jooky]

Does that mean you are doomed to find an FSUW?

 

[Ste]

1WW, to be fair to KenC I don't think he TARGETTED younger lasses, just that's the way it turned out. Like me, I'm 44 Nadia is 23, we happened to meet and the rest is history. In fact she had a boyfriend back then...

Let's be fair to Paul McCartney too, he's given Heather a Plane as part of the divorce settlement. She's going to stay with the razor on the other leg of course...

Ste

[Son of Clyde]

Let's be fair to Paul McCartney too, he's given Heather a Plane as part of the divorce settlement. She's going to stay with the razor on the other leg of course...

Ste

BTW, Paul is 64 this year, and his soon to be ex does have a leg to stand on.

[tim 360]

One week, Nice synopsis. Unfortunately you must have missed alot. Especially the deleted posts. It is like you walked into a movie but missed the first hour. I do not recall ANYBODY pointing out an age gap at all.

That said, with age one must first compare apples to apples.

And the quality of said apple as perceived by women,  who afterall really are the judge. Guys varying opinions really have zero to do with it, you guys can type it to death. But the women decides. Not you.

I know of guys 35 or 45 years old that no 25 year old girl would have anything to do with. Would not be caught dead with the guy.

But, I also know guys the very same age who many 25 year old girls find extremely interesting. They would jump at the chance.

It all has to do with the quality of the apple as perceived by the female. And not all apples are the same. Neither are all females. Agriculture 101.

[PeeWee]

1WW, to be fair to KenC I don't think he TARGETTED younger lasses, just that's the way it turned out. Like me, I'm 44 Nadia is 23, we happened to meet and the rest is history. In fact she had a boyfriend back then...

Let's be fair to Paul McCartney too, he's given Heather a Plane as part of the divorce settlement. She's going to stay with the razor on the other leg of course...

Ste

Ste, funny stuff. You lads must be having a time now with all of the Paul/Heather flap going about now in the UK.

Regarding your supposition about an older man "targeted" an younger woman I will disagree. Target might be a stronger word but I do think both Ken, Doug, and you did "seek out" or add to your various search criteria those women who fell within a certain age range. Meeting via agency or via friends are not by chance meetings. The only way a by chance encounter can occur is if two people literally run into one another neither having up to that moment in time any forethought or preset idea or notion of the other. Otherwise some forethough of critera influnced both Ken and your meetings. Otherwise you had to have "targeted" a woman whose age fell within a range. I am not exempt from this. My last search "targeted" women who fell between 35 and 42. Women who were taller than 5 feet 5 inches and whose weight was not more than 125 pounds. Those who spoke fluent English. I think we all "target" to a certain extent, lad. So I'm fairly certain that you and Ken both "targeted" younger women. Am I wrong?
 

Peewee

[KenC]

Ste, funny stuff. You lads must be having a time now with all of the Paul/Heather flap going about now in the UK.

Regarding your supposition about an older man "targeted" an younger woman I will disagree. Target might be a stronger word but I do think both Ken, Doug, and you did "seek out" or add to your various search criteria those women who fell within a certain age range. Meeting via agency or via friends are not by chance meetings. The only way a by chance encounter can occur is if two people literally run into one another neither having up to that moment in time any forethought or preset idea or notion of the other. Otherwise some forethough of critera influnced both Ken and your meetings. Otherwise you had to have "targeted" a woman whose age fell within a range. I am not exempt from this. My last search "targeted" women who fell between 35 and 42. Women who were taller than 5 feet 5 inches and whose weight was not more than 125 pounds. Those who spoke fluent English. I think we all "target" to a certain extent, lad. So I'm fairly certain that you and Ken both "targeted" younger women. Am I wrong?
 

Peewee

Yes, Peewee, you are wrong,
I never searched for a woman as young as Lena. In fact I overlooked her profile and video interview that was supplied by the agency. As I have told in the past, the agency highlighted a handful of women that you could phone call directly. I was intrigued by this and made a phone call out of curiosity. I guess you can say that I "bumped" into Lena on the website. We hit it off with phone calls and became friends. On my first trip to Russia, Lena was the only woman I met of that age. "Target" is too strong a word, but of course OWW has been told that many many times.
KenC

[KenC]

OWW,
BC's post is right on the money. You really have missed much of the story here. There is no "Monday morning quarterbacking" in this saga except maybe on Photo's part. Photo got lots of compitent friendly advice that he choose mock when it didn't fit his own personal agenda. He originally got much positive encouragment, but the whole thing turned a bit ugly after he "bit the hands" that were trying to feed him good sound advice.
KenC

[Turboguy]

OWW,
BC's post is right on the money. You really have missed much of the story here. There is no "Monday morning quarterbacking" in this saga except maybe on Photo's part. Photo got lots of compitent friendly advice that he choose mock when it didn't fit his own personal agenda. He originally got much positive encouragment, but the whole thing turned a bit ugly after he "bit the hands" that were trying to feed him good sound advice.
KenC

Damm, I missed that.  All that reading and somehow that part escaped me.   Was that before or after the part about her being ugly and lower than trailer trash or before of after the part about Doug being a second class person who did not deserve better, or the comments about his intelligence or his financial worthyness.

You know the pickle barrel guys could be a good advertisment for why you should not marry an FSU woman.   Since those guys are the ones with long marriages and a good many come of as nasty hurtful, rude, inconsiderate, opinionated and a few more undesirable things, someone could get the opionion that after a few years of marriage to an FSU woman that is what you  become.

The fortuante thing is there are examples of the opposite things such as Dan who is very thoughtful and considerate as are Vaughn and many others and as another example of the opposite is Andrew who has become that without marriage to an FSU woman. 

I really think everyone means well.  I just think and have always said that things could be worded with a little more tact, a little more kindness and that if the ideas were expressed in a more gentle way you might do a lot more good.