Moving and living In Ukraine

[GatoMoon]

The lady whom I have been correspondence, lives in Kiev.  She would prefer I live with her should things work out with her.  I haven't met her yet - but things might not work out with her, or might.  I just want to know before thinking further .....

So, let assume things work out very well, and she wants me to move and live with her in time.

I'm sure some of you did the same - moving to Ukraine/Russia from UK/USA.  Were you willingly to give up your lifestyle, friends, family, better paid jobs to be with your woman?  Did you struggle with adapt to life in the ladies' countries?  What good ion change did you make apart from to be with her?

[Olena55]

if you want to learn ask directly the woman about it. For the woman with Ukraine to live in the country these are less problems for it, but it is more for you. But usually always the man solves where he will live with the woman and speaks about it. You ask a direct question of possibility of moving of the lady to you. If theoretically it not against, is simpler to realize a task joint decisions. If  it categorically against then already you make the decision how to arrive in this situation.
Be not afraid to ask questions to the woman. It better than to think and assume something

[GatoMoon]

if you want to learn ask directly the woman about it.

My question is really for men who had experience the change.  Not the other way round.   I can only ask women about women moving to other countries.  My question is about men moving into woman's.

[Boethius]

I've known a lot of men who moved to Ukraine, almost all were from the Ukrainian diaspora, and spoke Ukrainian fluently.  Most had no intention of settling there full time, and all but one, who has a cushy government job, have, in fact, returned.


Their views are that it's a tough place to live, in many respects, as much as they loved the people.  It's a dead end if you are young or still at a working age.  If you were near retirement, and had a Western level income, it may be a different story, however, medical care there is not up to the standards of most Western countries.

[BillyB]

I wrote to many women and stopped writing to women who wanted me to live in their country. Some of them may have been great women but there are great women who would want to live with me in America too.

[ML]

I've known a lot of men who moved to Ukraine, almost all were from the Ukrainian diaspora, and spoke Ukrainian fluently.  Most had no intention of settling there full time, and all but one, who has a cushy government job, have, in fact, returned.


Their views are that it's a tough place to live, in many respects, as much as they loved the people.  It's a dead end if you are young or still at a working age.  If you were near retirement, and had a Western level income, it may be a different story, however, medical care there is not up to the standards of most Western countries.

Yes, I would say that the medical issue is the single biggest drawback for a western man thinking about living full-time in Ukraine.

For a USA man, eventually he will be eligible for Medicare and will pay for it whether he uses it or not.

But Medicare pays zero for health incurred expenses outside the USA.

It is possible that a European man might be willing to travel back to home country for medical care, but even that wouldn't be possible for long-term situations that most will face eventually.  So at some point for virtually every man; he and his woman will be forced to move to the man's home country.  Might as well do it up front so she can have a career there.

For USA man, the distances and costs are just too great for regular care.

[Slumba]

I wrote to many women and stopped writing to women who wanted me to live in their country. Some of them may have been great women but there are great women who would want to live with me in America too.

I agree with BillyB on this.  If you can live in Ukraine, great!  However it shouldn't be expected or be a requirement, simply as a practical matter.

[oso]

I will try to give you some information.

 First off you will be under the 90/180 rule. Meaning you can only stay here 90 days out of 180 days. I know that people will tell you about there "overstays" and paid the 800 UAH fine and everything is okay...This is no longer true, yes you will pay the fine but you might encounter a re-entry problem. Also IF you want to stay here legally you will not be issued a "D" visa because you broke Ukrainian immigration law. Plain and simple.

I have premium health care insurance that my wife provides to me from her employment and it is required by law for my residency. The cost is $55 USD per year and has a 70,000 UAH cap per incident. It also allows me to use privet Drs and Hospitals ( not the stinky dark government run facilities ). It also covers dental and vision. I have met several people that have come for " medical tourism ". I wouldn't come here for brain surgery, but I would consider less complicated procedures. Dental is great here though, for example to have a complete dental rebuild in the U.S. is about 40k, here it is about 4k and high quality.

As for living here, first you have to be crazy. Life here is tough in many ways and quite challenging. For the many reasons I live here it has been a challenge to say the least. I must say, it is starting to get easier to live here as each day comes.
 
At first it was all I could do to maintain my sanity. Being from the USA everything was a$$ backwards. It smelled, everything is old and behind times, people are rude, food tasted different and very few people speak my native language. It was a bitch for me to go to the market by myself and I bought many "mystery foods"

All in all, it has been a huge learning curve and I am getting quite comfortable with my new surroundings. I find things to do every day for a challenge. Today I will go back to the mall and try to exchange some stockings I bought my wife yesterday....I am going to find some pleasure in this task I know my a$$ will go through the mill, but it will be fun trying. For me getting interactive with my surroundings and people have been a blessing.

One thing I have to be thankful for this adventure , is it gave me time to truly understand my woman. What a great way to have a "spark test" and it gave us unlimited "face time". It also gives me first hand the issues and problems my wife will have if we so choose to move to the USA.
So you can see I am not a big fan on "one trip wonders"

Ask me if I would do this again?......Yes, in a New York minute:)

[AkMike]

I'm still planning on retiring there next year to be with my wife's family. I've been working towards this for years now getting rental units for continued income there. And this summer I bought a wonderful home there. Slowly but surely the plan is coming together.

 Looking on down the road is fine but it's way too early for this if you've yet to meet this lady.

[oso]

I'm still planning on retiring there next year to be with my wife's family.

Thats because you are one of the crazies 
Are you leaving Tanya at home? and just going to be with her family...LOL

I'll have a cold beer waiting for you next week....Have safe travels, and we'll see you when you get here

[mendeleyev]

I will try to give you some information.

 First off you will be under the 90/180 rule. Meaning you can only stay here 90 days out of 180 days. I know that people will tell you about there "overstays" and paid the 800 UAH fine and everything is okay...This is no longer true, yes you will pay the fine but you might encounter a re-entry problem.

I have premium health care insurance that my wife provides to me from her employment and it is required by law for my residency. The cost is $55 USD per year and has a 70,000 UAH cap per incident. It also allows me to use privet Drs and Hospitals ( not the stinky dark government run facilities ). It also covers dental and vision. I have met several people that have come for " medical tourism ". I wouldn't come here for brain surgery, but I would consider less complicated procedures. Dental is great here though, for example to have a complete dental rebuild in the U.S. is about 40k, here it is about 4k and high quality.

As for living here, first you have to be crazy. Life here is tough in many ways and quite challenging. For the many reasons I live here it has been a challenge to say the least. I must say, it is starting to get easier to live here as each day comes.
 
At first it was all I could do to maintain my sanity. Being from the USA everything was a$$ backwards. It smelled, everything is old and behind times, people are rude, food tasted different and very few people speak my native language. It was a bitch for me to go to the market by myself and I bought many "mystery foods"

All in all, it has been a huge learning curve and I am getting quite comfortable with my new surroundings.

I agree with much of the above, however it is really hard and many expats burn out after several months and elect to go home. Imagine being the primary breadwinner in a land where you do not speak the language, and do not have legal residency. Even "work from home" types find the intermittent Internet and layer upon layer of regulations to be overwhelming.

Our home is in Russia, but I get to lots of spots across Eastern Europe and Asia due to my work. Unless you apply for and receive a work permit, in Russia you're subject to the 90/180 rule. That means that you cannot live in the country more than 180 days of the year, and normally those 180 days are split into two 90 day non consecutive cycles. Russia, Ukraine, and the other CIS states take the attitude that no foreigner is allowed to hold a job that could be performed by a local citizen. There are exceptions (with time limits) for critical skills and situations where a foreign worker can gradually train his eventual replacements.

This place is rough at times, certainly no picnic. But goodness it has come a long way since the days of the fall. Now there are products, plenty of stores, etc, but prices can be high on certain items. I recall a time when it was an all day chore to find film for my cameras, or even paper for a printer. Today, SD cards have replaced film and they are plentiful. But, the quality can be bad; many are pirated and relabeled, and expensive as heck. I still shop on Amazon, etc, and either pick them up when in the US, or when a family member travels this direction. Lots of products, from batteries to condoms to foods, are pirated low quality knockoffs.

You will always be a foreigner, and will be treated as one, no matter how long you've lived here and no matter how much your language skills have improved. By and large, most people are hospitable, but at times when the West is not popular, you will be made to feel it.

As to health, everyone is required to have socialized coverage (OMC), and that is valid primarily in the region where you are registered. It is paid for by payroll deduction and it is steadily improving in the large cities while remaining crappy in the outer regions. Russians who can afford private clinics and doctors flock to them instead of waiting for days, only to be told to come back tomorrow and hope that a doc will be available. The government has started to phase out nationalized medicine for the general population (holding onto it for the elderly), but the transition has stalled with all the economic hits. Each year the government allocates less and less to the national plan. Russians can buy private insurance (DMC), but many cannot afford it.

Most "expats" purchase plans from companies like CIGNA and Integra Global which have international plans. Several of the Western hospitals and Clinics offer "memberships" which function almost like insurance, but have very small "in-Network" possibilities. More info here: http://www.expat.ru/phonedir.php?cid=31

Unfortunately, many expats are stuck with a mandatory Osamacare policy (worthless outside the USA), or paying fines for not having one, yet at the same time paying for both government plan here and a private plan too. The ACA (OsamaCare) exempts expats who are legal residents in the country where they live. The problem is that nations like Russia have strict rules and limits on who can be a legal resident, and thus most expats working for themselves, or working for a company not approved to offer legal status to foreign workers, end up being in violation of the American law--even if they buy insurance locally. UK citizens have an agreement between Russia and the UK, but many of my UK friends also purchase a local private plan due to quality issues.

[GatoMoon]

Thank you very much for the interesting postings.

About "working home" part, I am used to it as I am currently working at home, so it will give me slightly advantage 

As I am from United Kingdom, I can easily travel back and forth, as it is only 2 1/2 hours flight and she lives in Kiev (central) unless of course I met different woman who lives in rural area.

However, I won't sell my home but happy to rent out.

About eating arrangements, I will get used to it in time.  I can easily adapt to life.

 

[zooble]

Lol I remember thinking about it when viewing certain profiles on dating sites where they write "not willing to relocate". She looks worth it... 

Moving to FSU is definitely something I'd consider, but probably wouldn't do it if I/she didn't have a western salary there (not necessarily as much as back home) or equivalent from other income streams. Also, if it was planned well in advance I'd probably save up a ton of cash before quitting the local job.

I'd still want to take 1-2 major holidays a year (visit home/other country) so there would need to be income for that.

If you plan to have children you have to consider whether they should be educated there or back home. Since having them educated back home will throw a spanner into the works.

The cold winters is nothing like what I have here either so that might be hard to get used to.

For me, it would have to be a major city too, I couldn't live long term in a small village/town no matter what country it was in or how quaint it was.

I'd probably miss having steaks (especially with sanctions  ) and eating good produce. Some restaurants are pretty good so there is that.

Internet would be a must...

Returning home permanently out of need or want would always be tucked away as plan B...

[AkMike]

Thats because you are one of the crazies 
Are you leaving Tanya at home? and just going to be with her family...LOL

I'll have a cold beer waiting for you next week....Have safe travels, and we'll see you when you get here

 That's the plan! 

[GatoMoon]

Internet would be a must...

Slow connection would certainly drives me crazy though ........

[Maxx2]

In 13 days and 4 minutes I am on my way to an expat life in the Republic of Georgia. The visa process is an automatic 1 year stay and a border jump across to Armenia or Turkey and back for another year long renewal. They government there makes it easy for expats and businessmen. A business can be opened in an afternoon. A bank account in a hour. ATMs and bill pay kiosks everywhere.

[Noch1]

If you have enough money to live with out income, then it can be done.
To work or survive in any real sense will take time, Learning the language
and local life. The shine will wear off and then you will see the work ahead.
Can it be done, of course. Is it easy, not likely, I am sure it is different for each person who does this. The more money you have, the easier it will be.
If your living tight, then expect it to be more difficult.

[Chicagoguy]

You haven't even met her yet or visited her and you are thinking of moving there ?

[GatoMoon]

You haven't even met her yet or visited her and you are thinking of moving there ?

Not thinking of moving there, but I am having an open minded about future possibilities if things go very well.  Before looking for a serious relationship, we all really need a life plan.

One of the biggest failure is that people (men and women) do not have a life plan especially when comes to looking for distance relationships. 

[BillyB]

They government there makes it easy for expats and businessmen. A business can be opened in an afternoon. A bank account in a hour. ATMs and bill pay kiosks everywhere.

As fast as they giveth, someone can taketh. You've been around long enough to know that can happen in the FSU Maxx. But I hope things go well for you.

[zooble]

Not thinking of moving there, but I am having an open minded about future possibilities if things go very well.  Before looking for a serious relationship, we all really need a life plan.

One of the biggest failure is that people (men and women) do not have a life plan especially when comes to looking for distance relationships.

It's a good plan

Back when I was writing to girls on dating sites I initially presumed it would be a her move to me deal. Didn't really think of it much.

Then you hit it off with girls 'not interested in relocating' (wrote them too for more chances of success) and give it more thought... such as the plan would be to convince them to move 

But then that might not be possible and the only choice left is to relocate yourself. Then it's pretty much weighing up all the pro and cons like everyone has above. Because really... if you met the woman of your dreams would any of the rest matter? 


I never got anyone near relocating myself but this guy did... and he's got 1 hell of a reason to move
http://www.chinasmack.com/2014/stories/chinese-mans-life-with-beautiful-ukrainian-wife-envied.html

[GatoMoon]

I never got anyone near relocating myself but this guy did... and he's got 1 hell of a reason to move
http://www.chinasmack.com/2014/stories/chinese-mans-life-with-beautiful-ukrainian-wife-envied.html

Great to read about this Chinese man!  He originally thought Ukraine is in Africa LOL

[ML]

Great to read about this Chinese man!  He originally thought Ukraine is in Africa LOL

When everyone knows it is near Argentina.

[GatoMoon]

When everyone knows it is near Argentina.

Some people do confuse Ukraine with Uruguay     By the way, I was in Uruguay last May for the day - a ferry trip from Buenos Aires to Colonial del Sacremento.   Very peaceful, quiet place!   I wouldn't mind living there

[mendeleyev]

Someday if allowed to be the dictator of the world, I will arrange all countries on the map alphabetically. 

Then, I'll do the same thing for the condiments continents. Lakes and rivers would then be next. Of course, I will not allow a river to be named after a bookstore, so the cutesy folks who tried to bring attention to their jungles will have to rename the Amazon to something more original. The Ganges will be moved to Georgia, for example, since both start with G. I do expect some push-back, as most Georgians are very clean people and at first might not fully appreciate a river that serves as one long sewer being rerouted through their country. But, that is what dictators do--we snap our fingers and make things happen.

Now that I think of it, there are too many countries in the world--close to 25 or 30, maybe even more. That is unmanageable for any worldwide dictator so we'll merge some of them. For efficiency, we'll merge smaller nations like Albania and Cameroon. There is no reason they should remain separate. Finland and French Guiana both start with the letter F, so tell me that isn't a merger that should not have happened centuries ago! The new name will be "Guianaland" a combination of the two. Citizens will be happier if they have some "skin in the game," so to speak.

Of course, the Canada needs postal code reform: somebody was smoking some serious weed when they adopted that H3Y7P9X2 gibberish. Just give them a string of unrelated numbers to make it easy on everyone. Mongolia has for too long tried to brand themselves as some sort of BBQ chain, and it is time for that to stop.

Australia is big but nobody lives there, so we'll merge Madagascar, Tibet and Malta into the fold. Give them cross-border visa-free rights and watch the tourism boom! In fact, Australia is big enough to host those Madagascar races. Talk about marketing potential!