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Author Topic: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?  (Read 129211 times)

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Online msmob

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #700 on: December 16, 2018, 08:09:12 AM »
Skim read but the article doesn't seem to say they will vote against her in a vote of no confidence just vote against her Chequers/EU deal.

I don't see her getting her deal through. She would need a substantial number of Labour MP's to do that and I don't think they'll be swayed by time pressure. They are still the opposition after all and AND against key components of her deal even the Remain Labour MP's.

TC, I realise I must spoon-feed you info - until it is in small enough parcels to 'digest' ... So, I've made them smaller, still - just for you ...

1/ Indeed Mrs May is hoping for a miracle re selling her 'deal' or hoping the clock will run down ... neither will happen

2/ The brextremists know there's a chance she will 'cave in' to a people vote and cannot risk it...
No to Brexit, Yes to a People's Vote on Brexit, THEN a General Election

Online msmob

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #701 on: December 16, 2018, 08:22:26 AM »
Sadly, your spectral learning hasnít taught you much seeing how pig headed you are. So you keep saying yet you constantly demonstrate how extremely to the left your views are. So much so that Iím going to call you MomentumMoby. Whatís there to agree?

Typical, 'JG'  long on the verbal - short on any substance or valid 'riposte' - given a VERY clear explanation a to the utter STUPIDITY of his constant 'suggestion' of my  supporting Corbyn

Now, this thread isn't about " 'JG' knows Moby's politics better than Moby" - it's about 'BREXIT' and I suggest your lazy response prove you are unable to put your opinion in a cognitive fashion...

Being in favour of staying in the EU is not 'lefty' - given the last Tory MP - in my UK voting area ( narrowly defeated by a 'Euro-septic' Labour candidate ) is landed gentry, an international businessman  - not a career politician - like his successor

I preferred Major to Thatcher, Clarke to Tebbit  and so on - but if you seriously think I'd ever forget 'The winter of discontent' or forgive Brown for taxing my savings - you are more deluded than I thought

 

 

No to Brexit, Yes to a People's Vote on Brexit, THEN a General Election

Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #702 on: December 16, 2018, 09:23:54 AM »
Well this article today appears once again to restate that a second referendum is not on the table :)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46582705

It looks also that Labour is more united now, brought together somewhat in opposing Mrs May's Chequers/EU deal. I think JC is certainly getting an easier time of it than a few months ago when the withdrawal bill, etc was being passed. I would say all in all a 'No Deal' Brexit is the logical conclusion to be had here :D
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Online msmob

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #703 on: December 16, 2018, 09:38:38 AM »
Well this article today appears once again to restate that a second referendum is not on the table :)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46582705

It looks also that Labour is more united now, brought together somewhat in opposing Mrs May's Chequers/EU deal. I think JC is certainly getting an easier time of it than a few months ago when the withdrawal bill, etc was being passed. I would say all in all a 'No Deal' Brexit is the logical conclusion to be had here :D

Once again, I've been proven right that the Irish border question would stop a 'hard brexit; and I see nothing that will change that.

The clamour for a second referendum will grow as the MPs prevaricate - wait and see..

 
No to Brexit, Yes to a People's Vote on Brexit, THEN a General Election

Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #704 on: December 16, 2018, 09:57:00 AM »
TC, I realise I must spoon-feed you info - until it is in small enough parcels to 'digest' ... So, I've made them smaller, still - just for you ...

1/ Indeed Mrs May is hoping for a miracle re selling her 'deal' or hoping the clock will run down ... neither will happen

2/ The brextremists know there's a chance she will 'cave in' to a people vote and cannot risk it...

Mobers the Brextremists as you call them are not going to jump the gun (at least I hope not) and call for a vote of no confidence/vote against her in one unless she has signalled for a peoples vote. To date she has not and I don't think is likely to. In any case Brextremists would have little to gain as if the Tories won a GE they woukd still be stuck with May and if they lost they would get Labour gov and everything they feared.

The only reason they might vote against May on a no confidence vote was if she was not rowing their way nor likely to AND the General Election would pass the 31st March, thereby paralysing anything happening in the meantime and hence No Deal Brexit coming in by default :)
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Online msmob

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #705 on: December 16, 2018, 10:53:48 AM »
Mobers the Brextremists as you call them are not going to jump the gun (at least I hope not) and call for a vote of no confidence/vote against her in one unless she has signalled for a peoples vote. To date she has not and I don't think is likely to. In any case Brextremists would have little to gain as if the Tories won a GE they woukd still be stuck with May and if they lost they would get Labour gov and everything they feared.

The only reason they might vote against May on a no confidence vote was if she was not rowing their way nor likely to AND the General Election would pass the 31st March, thereby paralysing anything happening in the meantime and hence No Deal Brexit coming in by default :)

Duh, she ain't 'rowing their way' ...   No wonder you suck at dating - you don't assimilate the most basic of data and they probably think you don't listen 
No to Brexit, Yes to a People's Vote on Brexit, THEN a General Election

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #706 on: December 16, 2018, 12:27:54 PM »
Duh, she ain't 'rowing their way' ...   No wonder you suck at dating - you don't assimilate the most basic of data and they probably think you don't listen

When has she said she won't do 'No Deal', I don't believe she has. She may have kept quiet on it but she has never really came out with a definite no. She has said that she is pushing for her deal as the only way forward, but when that fails as it looks certain to do? She simply doesn't have the numbers to get it through parliament and I can't see that changing. The opposition parties are dead set against seemingly regardless of time pressure, the DUP at the moment also they look unchanging but who knows with them. The Tory Brexiteers particularly the 'No Dealers' are never going to come around as it plays right into what they want. The No Dealers on top of the opposition parties are enough to sink it alone never mind the DUP.

After her bill is defeated Mobers if she ever brings it back to the commons the only way left to her is 'No Deal'. She could try for a pointless and arduous referendum but that solves nothing - the equation in Parliament is still the same. She is also unlikely to be able to pass a referendum bill in time. She has also categorically stated many times she is dead set against any second referendum. She won't call a General Election also as apart from again being short on time it is unlikely to do her any favours.

So you see Mobers in the end she will start to row the way of No Deal or be very grateful that it times out that way and she is relieved off the whole burden of it all :)
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #707 on: December 16, 2018, 06:59:56 PM »
And as if Theresa is reading my posts on here :D

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46586673

Backs up just what I have been saying, no second referendum Mobe :)
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #708 on: December 16, 2018, 08:22:15 PM »
Odds are the CTA and the no border check policy under the Good Friday agreement will be suspended by the UK government in the event of No Deal Brexit pending any withdrawal by the Rep of Ireland from the EU. I'm guessing they will deem the Rep of Ireland in the meanwhile to have joined/be a part of another organisation i.e the EU which makes it incompatible with these previous agreements. Kind of like if the Rep of Ireland joined the EU and the UK was never a member of the EU. Better start making your way to the border now hey Mobers ;)
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Online msmob

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #709 on: December 17, 2018, 12:58:50 AM »
))))

Never going to happen...

With the deal at a seeming impasse, the clamour is growing in some quarters for a second referendum. Theresa May, though, will tell MPs later that holding one would "do irreparable damage to the integrity of our politics". Lead Brexiteer Boris Johnson agrees with her for once - he writes in his latest newspaper column on Monday that a second vote would "provoke instant, deep and ineradicable feelings of betrayal".

Boris and Teresa demonstrating how out of touch they and you are with reality...
No to Brexit, Yes to a People's Vote on Brexit, THEN a General Election

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #710 on: December 17, 2018, 02:57:18 AM »

With the deal at a seeming impasse, the clamour is growing in some quarters for a second referendum.

Yep a growing clamour amoung Remoaners, carry on Remoaning Mobers, you've only got three months left in which to do so now :D

Meanwhile, in the minds of the decision makers of this country there is no clamour in their minds whatsoever. The fact that Theresa & Boris are coming together on this show you which way May will move when the time comes Mobers.
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Online msmob

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #711 on: December 17, 2018, 03:03:15 AM »
Yep a growing clamour amoung Remoaners, carry on Remoaning Mobers, you've only got three months left in which to do so now :D

Meanwhile, in the minds of the decision makers of this country there is no clamour in their minds whatsoever. The fact that Theresa & Boris are coming together on this show you which way May will move when the time comes Mobers.

Once more, TC .. you are mistaken and delusional ..IF there's 'another referendum - the clock re Article 50 will stop 

There will not be a hard border with Ireland
No to Brexit, Yes to a People's Vote on Brexit, THEN a General Election

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #712 on: December 17, 2018, 07:30:06 AM »
Once more, TC .. you are mistaken and delusional ..IF there's 'another referendum - the clock re Article 50 will stop 

There will not be a hard border with Ireland

The clock can't just be stoppes Mobers, it is a date enshrined in Law as under the withdrawal bill. Another bill to change the date would be needed to be put before parliament for that as well. Mat has already said we WILL leave the EU on the 31st March so she's going to find it hard backing out of that one. Plus with two bills needed, one to change the date and one for a referendum there isn't really time for it either. That and the electorate has heard enough on this issue now they won't want it prolonged with another referendum.

Don't worry Mobers you'll soon get used to the new Irish border crossing regime ;D
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Online msmob

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #713 on: December 17, 2018, 07:36:46 AM »
The clock can't just be stoppes Mobers, it is a date enshrined in Law as under the withdrawal bill.

WHAT are you talking about?

Missed the recent ECJ Court Decision ?

Don't worry Mobers you'll soon get used to the new Irish border crossing regime ;D

I won't be getting used to what will not happen - care to wager a bet ?

Let's say 50 quid as you are so poor ..

Moby says there'll be no 'hard border'


Put up - or shut up time, TC ..This is going to be the easiest £50 ever earnt ..I should ask for it in Euro but the £ will recover when this luncy has passed into history

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Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #714 on: December 17, 2018, 07:23:28 PM »
I won't be getting used to what will not happen - care to wager a bet ?

Let's say 50 quid as you are so poor ..

Moby says there'll be no 'hard border'


Put up - or shut up time, TC ..This is going to be the easiest £50 ever earnt ..I should ask for it in Euro but the £ will recover when this luncy has passed into history

I won't gamble as I hear FSW don't take well to it Mobers, plus when you get stuck in the Rep. of Ireland you'll need all the money you can get ;D

Even the ECJ ruling would take time in Parlimant and would be differnt than altering the leave date.

As the ruling says it is possible, of course it is to revoke Article 50 it down to the gov so no big win for Remoaners.

I really don't see much clamour for it in Parlimanet though, the people want an end to uncertainty now not more of it. They are fed up of the matter being wanted to be dragged out by those that just want to win the political argument for their side. Its something the Brisitsh people are not up for, just Remain politicians, its really time for Remain politicians to give over.

In any case recent articles have shown that Theresa is not in favour of any more, referendums, delays, etc. It is in her and her party's best interest to remain in power, that is what their concern is. Going all around the houses or passing power away does nothing for them.

JC meanwhile is playing the same game as Theresa, he is playing out time on the clock. He doesn't want the EU issue to land on his doorstep as he knows it is a headache that will cause big devisions in he's party and risk splitting it apart. Plus he is a closet Leaver, he just can't come out as one because of all the remainers in the party.If JC gets into power he wants to spend it on Labour issues, not EU issues so the Tories leaving the EU with No Deal puts that matter safely to bed for him.

With the vote due to return to the commons in mid Jan you'll see Mobers that there will be a shift over to No Deal soon after with only a couple of months of remaoning left in which to object :) 
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Online msmob

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #715 on: December 17, 2018, 10:16:35 PM »
I stopped reading when I read your kop out...

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #716 on: December 18, 2018, 09:38:00 AM »
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #717 on: December 18, 2018, 11:56:26 AM »
Mobe,

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46600850

 :D

Yes, mentions they are notifying companies to be ready for a hard Brexit.  That is already costing companies a bunch and those that have reorganized won't change back even if there is a deal.  So UK is losing big time already and any optimistic stragglers will be jumping expensive hoops to get ready (which in actuality is 'do it now').

The advantages no longer add up and will take a decade or more to try and catch up.  Doesn't look rosy, nor smells like roses.

Some might say 'we're already losing so might as well hit bottom and try to get back up'.  With GBP in the dumps and foreseen to go parity, might be good for tourism, but wait.. airfares went up and yeah... would we need to apply for visas?  Remembering that visa 'overstays' will be another downside.. 

I see no win at all for UK.  All this was not presented to voters correctly, I doubt any expected the current quagmire and if so should be allowed to vote fully 'informed'.


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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #718 on: December 18, 2018, 01:12:53 PM »
Yes, mentions they are notifying companies to be ready for a hard Brexit.  That is already costing companies a bunch and those that have reorganized won't change back even if there is a deal.  So UK is losing big time already and any optimistic stragglers will be jumping expensive hoops to get ready (which in actuality is 'do it now').

The advantages no longer add up and will take a decade or more to try and catch up.  Doesn't look rosy, nor smells like roses.

Some might say 'we're already losing so might as well hit bottom and try to get back up'.  With GBP in the dumps and foreseen to go parity, might be good for tourism, but wait.. airfares went up and yeah... would we need to apply for visas?  Remembering that visa 'overstays' will be another downside.. 

I see no win at all for UK.  All this was not presented to voters correctly, I doubt any expected the current quagmire and if so should be allowed to vote fully 'informed'.

With 3 months to go a No Deal Brexit is the clearest direct solution that clears up the matter nice and tidily. It will stop the matter rattling on for years and deliver on the referendum. Then we can see what the results really are once we experience freedom from the EU. Getting back our nation again as a free sovereign power is already feeling good and we're not even there yet :)

It really does look like the whole cabinet is now swinging behind a No Deal Brexit. Add the cabinet to existing Brexiteers and there seems to be real consensus now appearing amoung the Government to unite behind Brexit :)

I think this is really a good chance for the UK to be strong and to make its way in the world once again. We are in a strong position to really make a go of it!

I know one businessman interviewed today was upbeat about the business peospects ahead. He noted that the cheaper pound more than outweighed any WTA tariffs about four fold. I think the Pound will go up a little with the return of certainly but will still place the country in a better place as a result of this whole Brexit situation.
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #719 on: December 19, 2018, 12:32:45 PM »
TC is still posting his 'theories' and refusing to accept my Fifty Quid bet ...

Shows how much faith he has in his convictions ;)

FACT: the govt has always guaranteed to continued operation of the near 100 year old CTA (Common Travel Agreement) with Ireland

Only clueless people - that included Trench - still think a 'no deal' brexit can happen ))



 



No to Brexit, Yes to a People's Vote on Brexit, THEN a General Election

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #720 on: December 19, 2018, 01:14:47 PM »
TC is still posting his 'theories' and refusing to accept my Fifty Quid bet ...

Shows how much faith he has in his convictions ;)

FACT: the govt has always guaranteed to continued operation of the near 100 year old CTA (Common Travel Agreement) with Ireland

Only clueless people - that included Trench - still think a 'no deal' brexit can happen ))

Well looks like the EU today has thrown in the towel and are preparing for a No Deal Brexit their attempt at making thd UK a vassal state staring defeat in the face :)
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #721 on: December 19, 2018, 02:21:32 PM »
Well looks like the EU today has thrown in the towel and are preparing for a No Deal Brexit their attempt at making thd UK a vassal state staring defeat in the face :)

There's no win here Trench.

EU is implementing no deal contingencies, such as allowances for freedom of movement of UK folks in EU, transportation considerations, etc.  The bare bone basics for a fixed period.  You can bet reciprocity would apply should UK attempt to limit any of these considerations on their side.  Want to start controlling borders, limiting free movement? Expect the same in return.

Quite generous actually.. leaving the ball squarely in the UK side of the court.  The problem remains that UK doesn't know what to do with it...

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #722 on: December 19, 2018, 03:38:43 PM »
There's no win here Trench.

EU is implementing no deal contingencies, such as allowances for freedom of movement of UK folks in EU, transportation considerations, etc.  The bare bone basics for a fixed period.  You can bet reciprocity would apply should UK attempt to limit any of these considerations on their side.  Want to start controlling borders, limiting free movement? Expect the same in return.

Quite generous actually.. leaving the ball squarely in the UK side of the court.  The problem remains that UK doesn't know what to do with it...

Quite happy with the same in return since the general UK population loses out more with uncontrolled borders & free movement of people.
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #723 on: December 19, 2018, 04:40:15 PM »
Quite happy with the same in return since the general UK population loses out more with uncontrolled borders & free movement of people.

...and 'how' they lose out has never been explained.  Maybe you can tell me?

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #724 on: December 20, 2018, 12:27:45 AM »
...and 'how' they lose out has never been explained.  Maybe you can tell me?

If you haven't noticed we are rather short on housing here. Polish workers can also be a bit over eager in taking on too much work as their currency is a lot cheaper than ours. Level playing field I think not!

End of the day we don't want our country flooded with god know who we want some idea that the person has earned the right to be here. I also find other EU Member states lax immigration regimes pretty disrespectful of whether we would want to have admitted those persons that they have as since the have we have that decision as a nation taken out of our hands, ridiculous really.
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

 

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