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Author Topic: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?  (Read 101653 times)

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Offline Anotherkiwi

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #300 on: June 29, 2016, 09:35:12 PM »
When you combine the statements, with the govt-recorded immigration stats, there is no illogic to be found.

The URL: http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/mf/3412.0/

quote:

"At 30 June 2015, 28.2% of Australia's estimated resident population (ERP) (6.7 million people) was born overseas. "

28% of the population is more than enough to modify election results.  Stupid git!

No, Slumba - YOU'RE the stupid git!  Nowhere in either of those quotes was there any reference to elections.  They were simply statements of hope for the future of their country, something which so many people in the USA will never be able to understand because of the deep divisions which appear so entrenched in your society.  Many countries with smaller populations are far more likely to be able to get past that mindset (obviously not every country!).

I reckon that JayH's analysis would be pretty close to the mark:

90% of that 28% will have assimilated quite well
7%+  will still be in transition
3%  - are in the category of wait and see.Of that 3%-- 3%  will be potential trouble makers!

Australians are generally proud of out history of multiculturalism and integration of different races and cultures . Is it perfect- no .

However, the situation in Australia (and New Zealand) is vastly different from the scenario which you've quoted:

In the USA, 20% of Hispanics vote Republican - 80%, Democrat.  That is why California is almost entirely Democrat from local to regional to statewide offices.

In Brexit, you can spot the differences quite easily - only 30% of Muslims were Leave ; Hindus and the Chinese voted similarly. 

Like I said, "mass immigration is the State electing itself a new populace".

I know immigrant couples where one is a vehement National supporter and the other is equally strident in support of Labour.  Another difference here is that we have several other parties represented in Parliament, and there are many different viewpoints expressed on various issues (even including within one or other of the major parties), so the total duopoly which exists in your Congress and Senate has been a non-issue here for many years.

As for the foreign-born gangs, it's almost a complete zero here (unlike Australia).  The only problems we have are with an occasional flare-up between different Chinese organisations - and even that is a rarity.

Offline Brasscasing

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #301 on: June 29, 2016, 10:00:41 PM »

That could be because they are urban and well educated, and work in the global economy, rather than because of their ethnicity.

They are urban for the most part but as far as the Muslim population goes on average they are not well educated or gainfully employed (I also observed this to a degree while in the UK) ...

Muslims in Britain: What figures tell us

◾20% are in full-time employment (compared to 35% of the general population)

In terms of education, Muslim communities in 2011 are doing comparatively better than in 2001 but lag behind Sikhs and Hindus. Looking at Muslims over the age of 16, 24% have qualifications of Level Four and above (degree level). For the general population this is 27%, for Hindus 45% and Sikhs 30%.

Dr Ali said there were many positives from the report "but also many challenges". 46% of the Muslim population lives in the 10% most deprived local authority districts in England and this has increased since the 2001 census.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-31435929

I'd also add they are Patriarchal society. If the Patriarch decides (or Imam advises) he's voting Remain/Leave then chances are the immediate and extended family will all vote the same way. Conceivably you could have 10 votes representing one actual opinion.

Brass



« Last Edit: June 29, 2016, 10:04:36 PM by Brasscasing »
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Offline Slumba

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #302 on: June 29, 2016, 11:01:26 PM »
No, Slumba - YOU'RE the stupid git!  Nowhere in either of those quotes


Next you will plead innocence to having any knowledge of the Coudenhove-Kalergi plan. A few posts later you will tell me that you have known about it for years.
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Offline Anotherkiwi

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #303 on: June 30, 2016, 12:00:29 AM »
Next you will plead innocence to having any knowledge of the Coudenhove-Kalergi plan. A few posts later you will tell me that you have known about it for years.

Yes, I will cheerfully plead innocence of this plan.  Having looked it up, and become queasy after reading just a few paragraphs of the first Google link, I'm now pissed off at you for ruining my afternoon!  :(

Seriously, though, what does that have to do with the quotations from the two eminent Australians?  Australia (and New Zealand) are far away from Europe, both geographically and in terms of potential world domination.  The extreme right-wing views of the various neo-Nazi type organisations in Russia and Germany, for example, find very little traction in this part of the world.  Of course there are a handful of people with these views anywhere you go - but you won't find any sympathy at all for those views amongst the general population.

This is also one reason why the Muslim leaders within our countries are always amongst the first to decry any atrocities committed in the name of Islam.  As I've posted time and again (probably ad nauseam), this side of the world is generally peaceful when it comes to race relations, and most people get on extremely well with their fellow citizens, whatever colour or religion they may be.  I'd like to think, in general terms at least, that we lead the world in the tolerance stakes.  Some Maori radicals may disagree, but I prefer to treat people as I find them, and not prejudge them simply because they're a different colour or religion from me.

Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #304 on: June 30, 2016, 12:03:58 AM »
My understanding is that the muslim man does not have to follow sharia matrimonial law...only the women do... :crackwhip:  crack that whip



Proves the limit of your 'understanding', thanks...
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Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #305 on: June 30, 2016, 12:08:58 AM »
After days of the left wing media screaming and wailing from the roof tops about the world markets there has not been a word of this on the news this a.m....


Brass,

1/ the referendum was not about left / right   :deadhorse:

2/ tell us about the 'rebound' of the GBP

3/ or the rebound of the FSTE 250


http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/don-t-misled-ftse-250-104444543.html

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Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #306 on: June 30, 2016, 12:11:37 AM »
Live from Ukraine and FP


You DO know that Switzerland - like Norway and Lichtenstein  - are members of the EEA - which means they pay to be part of the EU club - must obey it's rules- but cannot vote to control /influence....

I was corrected about this......Switzerland is NOT in the EEA..but it has access to the single market in return for obeying EU Directives, such as the right of freedom of movement for EU citizens ...but has NO say in policy / votes / running of the EU
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Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #307 on: June 30, 2016, 12:15:09 AM »
When has The City not gotten what it wants, on any matter it cares about?

June 23rd

Keep on demonstrating  your deep understanding

The city is bricking itself about handing it's mantle to Frankfurt  ..

Vodafone stating it will move it's HQ outside the UK if it's employees cannot be hired from any EU nation...

« Last Edit: June 30, 2016, 07:18:19 AM by msmobyone »
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Offline Slumba

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #308 on: June 30, 2016, 04:49:57 AM »
June 23rd

Keep on demonstrating  your deep understanding

The city is bricking itself about handing it's mantle to Frankfurt  ..

Vodafone stating it will move it's HQ outside the UK if it's employees cannot be hired from any EU nation...

I'm talking about the Square Mile.
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Online Gator

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #309 on: June 30, 2016, 06:18:56 AM »
I was corrected about this......Switzerland is NOT in the EEA..but it has access to the single market in return for obeying EU Directives, such as the right of freedom of movement for EU citizens ...but has NO say in policy / votes / running of the EU

Ah ha!  Another nation having a unique deal with the EU. 

Does UK want completely "out" or a better deal, something specific to their situation, values, etc.?   Negotiations in many parts of the world start with a knowingly unacceptable position and work towards the middle, intending to receive something better than the middle.  Iran comes to mind.  Trump does it that way if you have not noticed.  The American press refers to it as "work it backwards."

Online Faux Pas

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #310 on: June 30, 2016, 06:40:46 AM »
I was corrected about this......Switzerland is NOT in the EEA..but it has access to the single market in return for obeying EU Directives, such as the right of freedom of movement for EU citizens ...but has NO say in policy / votes / running of the EU

Yet you are still denying it as proof that there is life outside of the EU for European nations? It would appear Moby that it is you that are afraid of change. You've been in the EU so long that you know nothing else?

Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #311 on: June 30, 2016, 07:21:18 AM »
I'm talking about the Square Mile.

The square mile is largely situated 3 miles down river to the east, now.... ''Canary Wharf''

Slumba, you might be better to ask questions - your 'expertise' as to things British and the status of posters - who could vote in the referendum -   seems lacking
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Online 2tallbill

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #312 on: June 30, 2016, 07:32:53 AM »
I've read a number of articles many of which are semi-alarmist about the future.
This one shows some of the various layers that they Europeans have.

After Brexit



read about it here
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2016-06-30/after-brexit-here-s-what-s-next-for-europe
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Offline tfcrew

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #313 on: June 30, 2016, 07:52:08 AM »
Proves the limit of your 'understanding', thanks...

 


What's your problem today?





Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #314 on: June 30, 2016, 08:11:59 AM »
My 'problem' is posters who think 'BREXIT' has anything to do with Islam....

But thanks for demonstrating the depth of your 'knowledge'
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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #315 on: June 30, 2016, 08:35:50 AM »
My 'problem' is posters who think 'BREXIT' has anything to do with Islam....

But thanks for demonstrating the depth of your 'knowledge'

Islam has been a player in the Brexit. Deny it if you wish. Many of the Brits are fed up with their culture taking a back seat to the Islamic immigration. I heard it voiced before and after the vote. Many folks want their England back

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Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #317 on: June 30, 2016, 08:48:47 AM »
Many folks want their England back

..And they will get their wish.... with Scotland leaving to become independent ...I suggest you look up 'little englander'

If you are 'learning' about Britain from the likes of the Express / Mail - then your 'deep understanding' is now understood  :D

A little exercise to prove your 'knowledge'..

Please explain how any Brexit will halt immigration from nations who are 'Muslim' ?

Which EU nation is majority 'Muslim' - or even 10 percent ..?

You DO realise that the EU has no say on UK immigration policy from nations outside the EU  ?

 :deadhorse:

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Offline LiveFromUkraine

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #318 on: June 30, 2016, 09:05:41 AM »
I was corrected about this......Switzerland is NOT in the EEA..but it has access to the single market in return for obeying EU Directives, such as the right of freedom of movement for EU citizens ...but has NO say in policy / votes / running of the EU

It looks like Merkel is trying to get the UK to allow freedom of movement, including the right to work for EU citizens, if they want to continue trade with the EU.   I don't see it happening.  If I were UK, I would just sit back and watch the EU fold onto itself. 
« Last Edit: June 30, 2016, 09:12:52 AM by LiveFromUkraine »

Offline Slumba

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #319 on: June 30, 2016, 09:06:11 AM »
..And they will get their wish.... with Scotland leaving to become independent ...I suggest you look up 'little englander'

If you are 'learning' about Britain from the likes of the Express / Mail - then your 'deep understanding' is now understood  :D

A little exercise to prove your 'knowledge'..

Please explain how any Brexit will halt immigration from nations who are 'Muslim' ?

Which EU nation is majority 'Muslim' - or even 10 percent ..?

You DO realise that the EU has no say on UK immigration policy from nations outside the EU  ?

 :deadhorse:

It's one thing to be in political disagreement with others, but being deliberately dense is something else. Not been reading the news the last year? How many millions of Muslims have been let into  EUrabia by Merkel?
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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #320 on: June 30, 2016, 09:10:22 AM »
Quote
So this is something important and many women, when they realize the high position they hold in Islam, they like it because they are treated like a queen.
http://www.justaskislam.com/56/one-husband-4-wives/


 

   



Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #321 on: June 30, 2016, 09:11:46 AM »



It looks like Merkel is trying to get the UK to allow freedom of movement if they want to continue trade with the EU.

NO...

Merkel made it clear - no access to the single market without complete  freedom of movement for EU citizens
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Offline LiveFromUkraine

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #322 on: June 30, 2016, 09:13:45 AM »
NO...

Merkel made it clear - no access to the single market without complete  freedom of movement for EU citizens


You agree with what I wrote yet said No.  Moby, are you actually reading what is written?   ;D

Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #323 on: June 30, 2016, 09:15:27 AM »
It's one thing to be in political disagreement with others, but being deliberately dense is something else. Not been reading the news the last year? How many millions of Muslims have been let into  EUrabia by Merkel?

The problem is, Slumba, you don't read the 'right news' ..

The UK was NOT a signatory to the EU Directive that said EU states should share the load in a migrant crisis.

So, please explain the 'risk' to the UK ?

Such nonsense was the fear-mongering - very successful - but totally untrue -  of the brexit camp
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Offline msmobyone

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Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #324 on: June 30, 2016, 09:19:43 AM »

You agree with what I wrote yet said No.  Moby, are you actually reading what is written?   ;D

I HAVE re-read what you said ..... It was not clear what you meant ...

You meant TARIFF-free trade, sticking to the EU designated standards .... ''single-market''

Supporters of Briexit seem to think that the UK can cherry-pick ... we can't

My apologies for any misunderstanding
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