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Author Topic: Brexit good, bad or indifferent?  (Read 205557 times)

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Online Trenchcoat

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« Reply #2550 on: December 02, 2019, 10:19:06 AM »
Poor 'ol Trench

10 days to go  and you'll be proven wrong - AGAIN

My only hang up is the 10 days that have to pass to finally get to see you eat your humble pie Mobers. It is at least within smelling distance now for you :)
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« Reply #2551 on: December 02, 2019, 12:31:49 PM »
IF - and I seriously doubt I'll be needing to 'eat any humble pie' ... Ill be as gracious as you in accepting previous 'predictions ' ..  :popcorn:


We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

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« Reply #2552 on: December 02, 2019, 11:44:54 PM »
..and it starts!

   Good choice, Beel !


Moby,

I just posted a few articles, I didn't comment on any of them. I chose that
photo because it wasn't too wide for the page. I don't have a horse in this
race. I was more interested in your opinion of their polling method.

« Last Edit: December 02, 2019, 11:48:19 PM by 2tallbill »
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« Reply #2553 on: December 04, 2019, 12:18:37 AM »
Moby,

I just posted a few articles, I didn't comment on any of them. I chose that
photo because it wasn't too wide for the page. I don't have a horse in this
race. I was more interested in your opinion of their polling method.

That were already out of date ...  'excuses, excuses', Beel
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« Reply #2554 on: December 04, 2019, 06:09:36 PM »
That were already out of date ...  'excuses, excuses', Beel

Do you think that the polling method is better than other models
or that the model is over rated? The article said that this model
was more accurate.

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« Reply #2555 on: December 04, 2019, 06:24:50 PM »
Couldn't ignore this one.   Who in the world would want to give oratory in front of a pink back-drop?



The Times of London, in a massive poll, constituency by constituency, have the Tories winning 359 seats.   Hmm.

But a snap, YouGov Poll, after the recent debate, gave a statistical tie as to who won it.   Of course that is of the people who actually watched the debate......   Kinda like Tulsi Gabbard as the winner at a debate recently and the Drudge poll afterword.

If the Tories fall below 7% advantage, it is likely that it will be a hung parliament.    Which could happen.  Great theater.
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« Reply #2556 on: December 04, 2019, 07:50:54 PM »
Couldn't ignore this one.   Who in the world would want to give oratory in front of a pink back-drop?



The Times of London, in a massive poll, constituency by constituency, have the Tories winning 359 seats.   Hmm.

But a snap, YouGov Poll, after the recent debate, gave a statistical tie as to who won it.   Of course that is of the people who actually watched the debate......   Kinda like Tulsi Gabbard as the winner at a debate recently and the Drudge poll afterword.

If the Tories fall below 7% advantage, it is likely that it will be a hung parliament.    Which could happen.  Great theater.

The latest BBC tracker poll puts Labour up one on 32 percent and the Tories on the same at 42 percent. So the lead has narrowed slightly from 11 to 10 percentage points difference. Further down the page they show a break down of many of the polls, You Gov and the rest. Most of these have the Tories leading by a comfortable margin, the You Gov one is quite favourable to them.

There's only just one week to go now before Election night. Many votes would have already gone in by post. I can't see the Tories losing their lead now substantially to being it down to 7 points or less ahead of Labour. That would take a major stuff up and I think Boris is playing this one safe as he knows he's pretty much got it in the bag so no need to take risks.
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« Reply #2558 on: December 05, 2019, 03:11:54 PM »
Trench,

I can understand some contributors thinking the percentages give proportionate results...but YOU should know better..

Wales, Scotland and N.Ireland will hopefully screw Boris

I am not in the UK and gave my vote to a like minded proxy )

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« Reply #2559 on: December 06, 2019, 01:50:09 AM »
Trench,

I can understand some contributors thinking the percentages give proportionate results...but YOU should know better..

Wales, Scotland and N.Ireland will hopefully screw Boris

I am not in the UK and gave my vote to a like minded proxy )

Mobe, those areas typically provide few MP's due to their size & population, 10 MP's Northern Ireland, etc.

So is your proxy a Green or a Lib Dum?

Anyhow, this article shows us the potential threat the EU is to our way of life:

http://agenda.ge/en/news/2019/3317?fbclid=IwAR1nTrQzAyo703p0dFTY38NiO3rMZXRl39FMTEh0YgRcmNtHNfngh-s0hwo

If they get what they seek then we're down to just Russia. Fortunately us leaving the EU might help scupper the above happening.

Must be said also that us leaving the EU will help us avoid hordes of Ukrainians, Moldovans & Georgians arriving in this country en-masse, that's one 'liberty' we can do without!
« Last Edit: December 06, 2019, 02:42:28 AM by Trenchcoat »
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« Reply #2560 on: December 06, 2019, 06:50:54 AM »
Trench, you are SO full of it...

Those EU citizens from poorer EU nations that could come are LEAVING..

Our 'overstretched' NHS actually relied on the younger workers and they were are net benefit from a Tax and operational perspective..

You are the very epitome of the Sun reading racist thicko.. perpetrating bollox stats and 'news'.,

'agenda'...now there's a clue for you....

My Proxy will vote Green or Labour to try to keep out the Tory Candidate.




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« Reply #2561 on: December 06, 2019, 08:16:31 AM »
Trench, you are SO full of it...

Those EU citizens from poorer EU nations that could come are LEAVING..

Our 'overstretched' NHS actually relied on the younger workers and they were are net benefit from a Tax and operational perspective..

You are the very epitome of the Sun reading racist thicko.. perpetrating bollox stats and 'news'.,

'agenda'...now there's a clue for you....

My Proxy will vote Green or Labour to try to keep out the Tory Candidate.

So you could go from voting with the queers to a Corbynista, who would have thought a former Tory supporter like you could potentially end up a Corbynista Mobe! :D

Well the idea is controlled immigration, you allow in preferably on a temporary basis at least at first those that are needed as Nurses, etc.

Odds are that once things are straightened out very little if this will be needed as there is no reason with our education system that we can't supply people ourselves from this country, we really shouldn't be looking to deprive these people from countries that likely have more need of them than ourselves and less resources to supply them.

The current system of open door immigration is just irresponsible and creating BIG problems in housing and employment for our population as well as cohesion in society. If Ukrainians etc were just allowed to walse in then large numbers would come here and Ukraine would no longer be an option for guys looking on here.

The more exclusive a country is to be in the greater it's worth and attractiveness to be in. Brexit will give this country it's value in the world back again :)
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« Reply #2562 on: December 06, 2019, 01:50:06 PM »
The very 'threat' of 'brexit' has been damaging for those with a clue  :cluebat:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50693537

Another principled civil servant resigns over 'brexit' BS she cannot stomach

A UK diplomat in charge of Brexit at the British embassy in the US has quit.

In her resignation letter, seen by broadcaster CNN, Alexandra Hall Hall said she could no longer "peddle half-truths" on behalf of political leaders she did not "trust".
« Last Edit: December 06, 2019, 02:01:38 PM by msmob »
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« Reply #2563 on: December 06, 2019, 11:05:52 PM »
I was reading Pat's thread on Ukraine and dating and checked the visitor numbers of Russians over six years plummeting over six fold...oh and many more Turks arriving..

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_policy_of_Ukraine


What REALLY grabbed my attention was the possible removal of Visa at the airports for UK citizens - in any 'brexit' - as Ukraine is upset at the UK's inordinately high refusal rate for visas from UA nationals ...

Poor 'ol Trench really IS that Turkey voting for Christmas ... he might very well be needing a Visa for his long weekend trips on how NOT to date ..



"Ukrainian government considers the possibility of introducing visa regime with the United Kingdom.[68][69] This was a reaction to the absurdly high level of denials of visas for Ukrainian citizens in 2017-2018. In 2005 Ukraine introduced visa-free regime for European Union as a whole, without specifying every country of the union, thereby British citizens will lose visa-free entry to Ukraine the moment when the United Kingdom leaves the EU. After Brexit, Ukrainian government is going to negotiate with British government the resumption of visa-free travels to Ukraine for British citizens in exchange for visa-free travels to UK for Ukrainian citizens, or at least an easier procedure of getting a visa."


 :deadhorse:


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« Reply #2564 on: December 09, 2019, 02:38:03 AM »
I was reading Pat's thread on Ukraine and dating and checked the visitor numbers of Russians over six years plummeting over six fold...oh and many more Turks arriving..

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_policy_of_Ukraine


What REALLY grabbed my attention was the possible removal of Visa at the airports for UK citizens - in any 'brexit' - as Ukraine is upset at the UK's inordinately high refusal rate for visas from UA nationals ...

Poor 'ol Trench really IS that Turkey voting for Christmas ... he might very well be needing a Visa for his long weekend trips on how NOT to date ..



"Ukrainian government considers the possibility of introducing visa regime with the United Kingdom.[68][69] This was a reaction to the absurdly high level of denials of visas for Ukrainian citizens in 2017-2018. In 2005 Ukraine introduced visa-free regime for European Union as a whole, without specifying every country of the union, thereby British citizens will lose visa-free entry to Ukraine the moment when the United Kingdom leaves the EU. After Brexit, Ukrainian government is going to negotiate with British government the resumption of visa-free travels to Ukraine for British citizens in exchange for visa-free travels to UK for Ukrainian citizens, or at least an easier procedure of getting a visa."


 :deadhorse:

Well good to see this site up and running in time for Mobers General Election humiliation :D

Thing is Mobers apart from stuff I've said on this the other site regarding the greater risk of Ukrainians not returning home and the greater economic nclout the UK has there are also other factors. Factor in the ongoing civil war in East Ukraine, the UK has contributed to aiding to training the Ukrainian military forces and other technological assistance. The Ukrainian government won't be wanting to jeopardize our assistance or support there. Especially not withe the Russian threat at the door, an adversary to which Ukraine band the UK are much on the same wavelength on.

Add onto that the necessary money brought into the country by UK citizens visiting Ukraine, that is very much sought upon as Ukraine's economy is so bad. Were that to go their economy would be worse of for it and their currency would drop further. We're probably one of the few income streams keeping Ukraine and many Ukrainians afloat at the moment.

End of the day Mobers the UK won't be wanting to do an EU and give out tourist visas to Ukrainians who won't be coming for tourism but instead use it to get in the country for work. It always comes down to the likelihood of the citizen returning to their home country and the liability of them not. That liability is greater for Ukrainian citizens than UK citizens. The Ukrainian government will fold at the end of the day and carry on the same visa free regime to UK citizens, they have too much at stake to worth the risk of losing over something they stand no chance of getting anyway.
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« Reply #2565 on: December 09, 2019, 03:10:51 AM »
The very 'threat' of 'brexit' has been damaging for those with a clue  :cluebat:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50693537

Another principled civil servant resigns over 'brexit' BS she cannot stomach

A UK diplomat in charge of Brexit at the British embassy in the US has quit.

In her resignation letter, seen by broadcaster CNN, Alexandra Hall Hall said she could no longer "peddle half-truths" on behalf of political leaders she did not "trust".


Another Remoaner trying to use her position to grind her axe not that anyone would care what her position is, especially as she's not anyone of importance.
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« Reply #2566 on: December 09, 2019, 03:22:04 AM »
Latest BBC Poll Tracker out with just three days to go before Election night! I'll soon be dishing up Mobers the humblest of pies :D

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49798197

Latest poll has the Tories up one from 42 to 43 percent. Labour and the rest are on the same with the exception of the Lib Dums who have lost yet another point crashing down to 13 percent. Clearly feeling the backlash from the Electorate over their undemocratic Brexit stance and dope pushing policies.

These are pretty good poll ratings for the Tories and odds are as they are made up of several polls are likely underestimating Tory support. The Electorate is fed up of all of the arguing for the sake of arguing in Parliament and just want Brexit done. Boris's EU Brexit Deal looks like it is now good enough to do the job, get people back together and move on from this, all apart from Mobers and a few other embittered Remoaners off course ;D
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« Reply #2567 on: December 09, 2019, 05:31:37 AM »
Well good to see this site up and running in time for Mobers General Election humiliation :D

Thing is Mobers apart from stuff I've said on this the other site regarding the greater risk of Ukrainians not returning home and the greater economic nclout the UK has there are also other factors. Factor in the ongoing civil war in East Ukraine, the UK has contributed to aiding to training the Ukrainian military forces and other technological assistance. The Ukrainian government won't be wanting to jeopardize our assistance or support there. Especially not withe the Russian threat at the door, an adversary to which Ukraine band the UK are much on the same wavelength on.

Add onto that the necessary money brought into the country by UK citizens visiting Ukraine, that is very much sought upon as Ukraine's economy is so bad. Were that to go their economy would be worse of for it and their currency would drop further. We're probably one of the few income streams keeping Ukraine and many Ukrainians afloat at the moment.

End of the day Mobers the UK won't be wanting to do an EU and give out tourist visas to Ukrainians who won't be coming for tourism but instead use it to get in the country for work. It always comes down to the likelihood of the citizen returning to their home country and the liability of them not. That liability is greater for Ukrainian citizens than UK citizens. The Ukrainian government will fold at the end of the day and carry on the same visa free regime to UK citizens, they have too much at stake to worth the risk of losing over something they stand no chance of getting anyway.


Lots of silly words ..

Ukrainians are moving  freely in the Schengen Area  ...I 'missed' when this gesture has been so abused as being  'threatened to be removed' ..

I really hope the Ukrainians DO remove the current Visa at the airport for the UK citizens - as the UK govt is appeasing idiots
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« Reply #2568 on: December 09, 2019, 05:37:36 AM »
Arithmetic lessons

Tories 43

Labour 33

  +

Lib Dems 13

= 46..

TheBrexitParty.com are no-where ( 4) and the others are all pro REMAIN ..6 percent

I make that 52 ( Remain / another referendum)   to 48 percent ( 'leave')  ...sounding familiar , Trench ?   



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« Reply #2569 on: December 09, 2019, 05:54:40 AM »
Trench,

I realise facts are a little beyond you..

But..

I keep telling you... Boris is lying ....  ANOTHER leaked govt document shows he is clueless about hs deal and how it will effect N.Ireland and open a back- door to corrupt business and immigration practices that will make him look STUPID


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50711868




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« Reply #2570 on: December 09, 2019, 06:24:19 AM »
Arithmetic lessons

Tories 43

Labour 33

  +

Lib Dems 13

= 46..

TheBrexitParty.com are no-where ( 4) and the others are all pro REMAIN ..6 percent

I make that 52 ( Remain / another referendum)   to 48 percent ( 'leave')  ...sounding familiar , Trench ?

You know it won't work out like that Mobers, the first past the post system will likely give more seats to the Tories making a majority very likely.

The Brexit Party aren't standing in 317 seats the Tories last held. That makes it very likely that they will win those 317 seats again. They only need to gain another 9 seats to bring them to the 326 seats for a majority.

Labour are looking weaker this time and not picking up the support needed so there is a good chance of the Tories getting their majority. Failing that as long as they got around the 317 mark they could form a minority government and still get the Brexit deal passed as they would no longer have the Remain rebels in their party like they had in the last Parliament. Whilst some Labour MPs are still likely to vote with the government on it.

Three days Mobes and it's all going to be over for you :D
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« Reply #2571 on: December 09, 2019, 08:16:21 AM »
Trench,

I realise facts are a little beyond you..

But..

I keep telling you... Boris is lying ....  ANOTHER leaked govt document shows he is clueless about hs deal and how it will effect N.Ireland and open a back- door to corrupt business and immigration practices that will make him look STUPID


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50711868

Boris is just trying to get us to where we need to be. I don't believe he is an outright liar but in many situations in government coming out and telling all upfront causes problems that otherwise can be overcome more delicately along the way.

The stuff in this report is hardly a big deal, if it ends up taking a bit longer it's not the end of the world. The 'fact' of the matter is that no matter how much estimating and planning no one really knows how long a project will take until they are a long way into that project, everything is a guess - an estimate based in what we think it could be.

I've no doubt that in the long run we will be much better off as a result of Brexit.

The impasse there has been on this to date is what makes it intolerable, hopefully that will soon end.
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« Reply #2572 on: December 09, 2019, 08:24:06 AM »

Lots of silly words ..

Ukrainians are moving  freely in the Schengen Area  ...I 'missed' when this gesture has been so abused as being  'threatened to be removed' ..

I really hope the Ukrainians DO remove the current Visa at the airport for the UK citizens - as the UK govt is appeasing idiots

Are they going to remove visa free for US citizens also? Despite the US not letting Ukrainians in willy nilly to return the favour???

No of course not, the UK is on a par with the US so the same deal will be done/kept. The UK may have less population overall than the the US but it is densely populated and much nearer Ukraine than the US. Ukraine can not afford to p*as off the UK. This current talk is just Ukraine testing to see if it can get any more out of the UK. I doubt they are that bothered by the UK wanting to keep the present arrangement. Ukraine will look at the situation and likely decide it is losing enough of its population to the EU. It doesn't need to lose any more of its citizens as it will struggle with a very low population and areas being decimated of people. You will see them come around Mobers ;)
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« Reply #2573 on: December 09, 2019, 08:28:36 AM »
Boris is just trying to get us to where we need to be.

If you mean:

1/ Worse off

2/ Businesses quitting the UK

3/ Labour shortages in healthcare


Then what's SO 'great' about that ?

I don't believe he is an outright liar but in many situations in government coming out and telling all upfront causes problems that otherwise can be overcome more delicately along the way.

Need some examples ?

1/ Nov 2018 - told the DUP conference that any PM trying to do a deal like Mrs May was 'insane' - then introduced a 'bill' - that would never get through the house in it's original form -  that is FAR worse for N.I

2/ Proroguing Parliament was not illegal .. Ooops - YES .. it was ...

3/ The NHS is and has been on the table in any post 'brexit' trade talks with the US ... hence 'Trampu' was told to STFU


The stuff in this report is hardly a big deal, if it ends up taking a bit longer it's not the end of the world. The 'fact' of the matter is that no matter how much estimating and planning no one really knows how long a project will take until they are a long way into that project, everything is a guess - an estimate based in what we think it could be.

Facts aren't a 'big deal' to YOU, may be ..


I've no doubt that in the long run we will be much better off as a result of Brexit.

'We' are already FAR worse off ( according to Tory Chancellors' predictions v reality )

How long will it take to get back what we've lost, let alone will lose ?    You are too thick to GET that this is not really about you or me .. it's about VERY rich people avoiding upcoming tax laws - that will make it MUCH harder to hide


The impasse there has been on this to date is what makes it intolerable, hopefully that will soon end.



There has been no 'impasse' ... Boris and Mrs May just kept losing

We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Online msmob

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Brexit good, bad or indifferent?
« Reply #2574 on: December 09, 2019, 08:31:55 AM »
Are they going to remove visa free for US citizens also? Despite the US not letting Ukrainians in willy nilly to return the favour???

THIS thread is about the UK's stupidity ...  stop deflecting

I really DO hope you'll need  a visa before you go to Ukraine and I'll be going to RU on a E-Visa ..;)   


You'll 'get' the folly of your vote ..


Thursday is my wedding day - as well as the UK vote ... ;) 
We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

 

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