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Author Topic: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned  (Read 38243 times)

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Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #25 on: August 18, 2016, 12:53:29 PM »
Should add also to my OP that dressing down a little for local travel (buses, taxis) is probably a good idea, i.e. non branded stuff as its a pretty poor country. Also, if you look too wealthy foreigner, some people charge more/try it on, taxi's, shops, stall holders possibly bars/restaurants - though if you want to impress in your surroundings then of course dress up. Pulling out a wad with a lot of money is also a no no for any thinking off taking the trip, normal wallets are too prone to this so travel wallets are a real good idea as you can hide a load of notes in zipped up compartment. Shielding any money you have with either when paying money is also a good idea without it looking too awkward/extreme.

Found a lot of WM out there (probably mostly American) go in for the branded T-shirt casual stuff and I think this is perhaps a little overplayed now and perhaps corny looking.

Other thing I learned is rarely I think is a Ukrainian girl going to swoon over at the sight of seeing a western man or hearing one. Some warm up quite quickly when dealing with you, others do not. I think a girl coming up to most WM may happen occasionally but more often than not is quite remote, it is the WM that will have to open up the communication, interaction is some form or another quite often. Just some points I learnt out there I thought others might gain the benefit of thinking over.



 
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Offline ML

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #26 on: August 18, 2016, 12:54:27 PM »
Thanks, lyndontom, I'm down south, near Bournemouth, have been since I was a child, how far up north are you?

There is a Private Message mechanism here for arranging 'bromances,' etc.  :-)
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Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #27 on: August 18, 2016, 01:00:26 PM »
Sorry Patagonie, but I disagree with most of the advice you have given Trenchcoat. Using PUA lines is not going to help TCoat find a wonderful, extremely high-quality, marriage-material woman. Sure, it might get him a few dates with some attractive women. But a long-term relationship with a woman who is beautiful on the inside? No sir, pick up lines from PUArtists are not the answer.

HounddaddyLee's advice is solid and right on the money "Going to large "Airport" cities and spewing PUA lines to women is not going to get you a quality woman. Being yourself and improving who you are will help you find a mate and also help you in life."  Bingo, I could not have said this any better than HDLee said it.

Myself, I have a lot of areas in my life I can improve on before I ask a woman to marry me. And I am actively working on those areas right now, improving myself in those areas. I think Trenchcoat, likewise, also has some areas in his life he can make some improvements on to make him a better catch for a wonderful, marriage-material FSU woman. TC and I (actually every RWD member who has embarked on this endeavor) both need to spend a lot of time bettering and improving ourselves, not wasting time listening to PUA gurus.

Lyndontom's advice is also phenomenal. I agree with everything Lyndontom said...perfectly, succinctly stated by Lyndomtom.

PUA techniques is not the way for TC to go Patagonie, I am sorry. He is much better off following the recommendations of HDLee and Lyndontom.

What about you TMD are you any closer to going out there to meet a women/check out the FSU, culture, etc? I found that by going out there you learn a lot, invaluable I think in helping on the search. ML looks to be a well traveled guy and I think it helps having traveled a bit as it makes you more confident is different surroundings. Improving oneself is an ongoing process at his stage for both of us I think, but there is nothing like getting out there in the field. Gym is good, but some gym guys concentrate overly in the gym I think as it is where they have a natural strength often and some say they neglect working on their personality as a result. So looking at the whole picture of oneself is good I think.
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Offline Patagonie

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #28 on: August 18, 2016, 03:37:42 PM »
Pat,


I actually know more about PUA than you think. I have done some reading and there was a TV show here a decade or so ago that featured a PUA "expert". I have read one of Roosh's books, again out of curiosity. My opinion is he (Roosh) is a sociopath. I guess we are lucky that his "thing" is scoring with women and not murdering them. If you have to lie and obfuscate to get a woman into bed all you will end up with is a conquest. Again, my opinion. Did you use PUA to land your wife, Pat? I hope it was your natural personality that did it and not PUA "game". I guess you come from the line of though that women are prey and men are the predators. I happen to disagree. I find the PUA "philosophy" to be misogynistic and views women as objects.


We will have to agree to disagree on this. I don't think PUA practitioners land "bad" women. I just think it is rare to land a keeper and not a one night stand. If Trenchcoat want so "plant his flag" in the FSU, then PUA will get him there. If he wants to find a wife/friend/lifelong mate, he should just be himself. I believe in the view that it is better to tell the truth because you won't have to remember each lie you have told.


Again, just my opinion. I have a wonderful women who loves me for who I am, not for some facade that I created to woo her.


HDL

Roosh is a sociopath and is not considered like a pua and not even a player.
Mystery is also a sociopath but he is a genius (you have probably noticed that many genius have also bad reverse sides, they are overtalented somewhere but inefficient in some other topics), roosh is only a compulsive sexual seeker using some hints from the community.
roosh has poor social skills accordingly to his ebook "bang in Ukraine".
Unfortunately you have come across the community with bad references and i notice that you have also no experience in the dating field linked to the game, except your natural personal ones.
I would better recommend to go through DeAngelo to get a better idea about what we are talking about. The only thing i don't like in him is the marketing side, but that a business for him and also the fact that, for the same marketing reason, he lets believe that you can get a 10 in two hours of his super courses, that's a lie of course.

The shade is not what you do with the dating science but is more about the goals you try to achieve. As the nuclear bomb, you can kill a lot of people like in Nagasaki and Hiroshima, but you can also give electricity to many people including hospitals. So the limits belong to you. It's like a knowlegde, you can collect ONS, you can collect short affairs, but inevitably you will finish in a LTR. My wingman is fiancee, DeAngelo is in a LTR, Neil Strauss married. The vast majority of the players will enter in a LTR, question of time. Because after some time you will find a quality woman who matches you.

Did i lie to the FSU women? In my profile? During the time i was meeting them? No never, i never lied to them.
But notice that many men, out of any pua knowledge lie. Generally they lie about their occupation, and especially about their social position, trying to let believe that they have a more important position, to get more interest from the women. That's especially true in the US or European dating profiles sites.
They lie about the fact that they are married. Women are more prone to lie about their weight.
Not all people are lying but it happens everytime.
I know that roosh is using lies, which only shows his poor skills. He also propose to bring her some alcoohol. I find all of this disgusting.

There is here this unbelievable belief that the game is superficiel, not natural and dishonest.
But here nobody ask himself what is really superficiel.
The superficial and hypocritical thing is the way our culture has educated us (in fact we have NO education) and therefore, for a vaste majority of men, let us with a extraordinary failure rate of dating, when you think about how many women you are coming along every year, and finally, at the end, how it is difficult to be an happy couple.
The men/women story is one of the biggest stake of the society and of our personal life. This forum is all about that.
The vast hostility i meet here come from more the culture that you have inherited which prevents you to imagine that there is perhaps some better way to meet and understand women quicker and easier. That's shocking and probably 80% of men are not accepting not only the fact, but not even the idea, that what they have inherited is globally inefficient.
This why so many people say "stay yourself", because they don't want to hear about something that will make them unconfortable and disrupt their beliefs.
A lot of people are resisting to the changes, that's well documented for companies that are restructuring. A lot of people would prefer to do the same job the same manner instead to change anything fearing the burden of the change and the loss of control. Even if they can do the job halving the time spent. That's human.

To answer to your questions.
Restructuring yourself is bringing new materials that nurtures your personality, beliefs and skills. When you learn russian, and even if you don't speak it for three years, it will stay for a large part in you. The same with what i have done, practiced, learnt. It has changed me, the quality of my life, relationships with women, joy with women, socials relationships. All of this has rocketed since i have met the "dating science".
So i don't think that my wife would have stayed with me and travelled 7000 km to get the necessary visas  to marry me if i had been Patagonie double personality :  the liar PLUS  his pua tricks panoply (as you continue to believe that is artificial and faked).
As you know you cannot hide yourself to a person who lives with you 24 hours/24 hours.
So? It means that my personnality, the one that have blossomed with the dating science is only one person at the end, the person that my wife was searching for.
In other words rather than to focus on the word tricks, i propose you to focus on the word IMPROVMENTS, KNOWLEDGE and UNDERSTANDING. That's really more reliable and exact about what the community is learning and passionated about.
So when i met my wife i didn't use "tricks" but i largely get benefit of my better attractiveness, the result of all the work done during the five previous years.

You said :
"I guess you come from the line of though that women are prey and men are the predators. I happen to disagree. I find the PUA "philosophy" to be misogynistic and views women as objects"

During any new cycle of learning, before mastering it you will swing between more and less till you find the right measure.
The wussy actual civilization teach us to put women on a pedestrial and put them over you. The community proposes to do something different. I have found their analysis more realistic and realism is the key of happiness in realtionships.
I don't know where you have found the word predators, but it's not the spirit of the community. However many guys needs to find their balls in their throusers (go to meet the lady) rather than to stay in the couch looking some porno. That probably what you want to mean.




« Last Edit: August 18, 2016, 03:48:18 PM by Patagonie »
"Je glissais through the paper wall, an angel in the hand, c taboy. I lay on the floor, surgi des chants de Maldoror, je mix l'intégrale de mes nuits de crystal, I belong to the festival.

Offline Patagonie

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #29 on: August 18, 2016, 04:31:07 PM »
+1 Boethius.

Patagonie, you have no idea how much or how little I or others here know about PUA. Before I decided I wanted to settle down, I read a lot of stuff. I read Neil Strauss, and have every ebook Roosh wrote until last year. I travelled the world and occasionally I got laid. What some people (his followers) fail to realise is that Roosh has descended into a characature that is purely controversial now for the sake of selling books, causing protests and generally trying to maintain some fame in the public domain.

You make broad generalisations about what women want. You are married and I can respect that but I'd be more interested to know what got and maintained your wife's interest and how much of that was down to you, PUA and exactly how that correlates to everyday life with you now. Is the reality, and your defensive nature towards PUA, simply something you try and pinpoint as being tangible in your becoming a more desirable man? PUA's are generally associated with trying to get sex; you can change your personality for a short time but anything beyond that and the facade will fade away.

I don't think anyone is saying someone who is socially awkward or struggles in certain situations should not try to change that. I am extremely comfortable around my friends and in social settings but I hate doing big presentations professionally in my work. Will I get better at them by avoiding them wherever possible? Of course not, that's simple common sense.

Getting confident and more comfortable in dating situations can come through practice, changing dress style slightly, getting in the gym more, career success, having a good haircut. Anything can improve that. Getting caught up in what essentially has become a 'game' industry is not something I personally think will help TC - however little you think we might know about it. Do I think using PUA techniques is more likely to help anyone land a higher calibrate lady? Not a chance. If you can't catch her and keep her anyway who are you trying to kid?



HDL is bang on the money in my book.

To know more about what i think about roosh, see my post to HDL.
I make generalisation about women because i try to show an example that's not appropriate for men STATISCALLY.
So when i say that the guys who are nervous and shy during the first meeting, i am not saying that they will not marry or getting a second meeting, i am saying that FOR SURE, in average, they will get LESS second meeting than a guy who shows confidence.
You are surprised that i could be married and keep a facade? So finally? The answer is simple: there is no facade, see my post to HDL.
Being a more desirable man? Yes of course, i would !!! Have you notice that FSU women spent probably a large part of their life to be more desirable? That the real power! To be desirable, to have people who want to spend time with you, to meet you, to speak with you.
If you hate doing big presentations at work, i would suggest you to make some course to improve it.
And after some time you will notice that the game is the same, but for dating.

Everything you have said here :
"Getting confident and more comfortable in dating situations can come through practice, changing dress style slightly, getting in the gym more, career success, having a good haircut.  "
is part of the training "pua" program.

"Do I think using PUA techniques is more likely to help anyone land a higher calibrate lady? Not a chance. If you can't catch her and keep her anyway who are you trying to kid?"

Are you insulting my wife, meaning that she is a lower quality woman? 
Who is alone?
And who has kept her fully happy more than three years?
« Last Edit: August 19, 2016, 02:11:16 AM by Patagonie »
"Je glissais through the paper wall, an angel in the hand, c taboy. I lay on the floor, surgi des chants de Maldoror, je mix l'intégrale de mes nuits de crystal, I belong to the festival.

Offline Patagonie

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #30 on: August 18, 2016, 04:35:18 PM »
I am here to support Pat.

I know nothing about PUA, have never read a book or seen any film clip about it.

However, I can get the general gist of it, and I think it can be very useful in a broad sense which is what I think Pat is trying to get across.

Actually, looking back, I could have probably benefited from knowing  something about it, even as I have no trouble in relating to women or talking to them.  But maybe knowing something along the order that Pat knows, my casual interactions could have been moved along further.

And, I don't look at the PUA as strictly trying to get into a woman's panties, although I realize the Roosh guy and others may be promoting that aspect.

Rather, I think the PUA knowledge could be useful in just meeting gals, moving the initial contact along to a second contact, etc.  At that advanced stage, then just the normal dating process ensues.

So look at PUA as just 'getting your foot in the door.'
Most men could probably benefit from this alone.

I applaud the open mindeness of ML.
"Je glissais through the paper wall, an angel in the hand, c taboy. I lay on the floor, surgi des chants de Maldoror, je mix l'intégrale de mes nuits de crystal, I belong to the festival.

Offline Slumba

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #31 on: August 18, 2016, 05:58:15 PM »
Big thumbs up to Patagonie and his explanation!
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Offline Boethius

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #32 on: August 19, 2016, 12:25:24 AM »
Should add also to my OP that dressing down a little for local travel (buses, taxis) is probably a good idea, i.e. non branded stuff as its a pretty poor country. Also, if you look too wealthy foreigner, some people charge more/try it on, taxi's, shops, stall holders possibly bars/restaurants

They will always know you are a foreigner, and you are almost always paying more than locals for that privilege.  I usually don't get too upset about it, it often only amounts to $1 or $2.  The better half, OTOH, is incredibly offended by this.  He does not consider himself foreign, he of course speaks the local language, he even has a typical FSUM short haircut, but his clothing is much better than that worn in Ukraine.  He will always barter down, as (a) it's his nature; and (b) he does it on principle.  Often, he will barter down to a price below what locals pay.  Seeing the tricks he pulls in markets is a wonder.

Quote
Other thing I learned is rarely I think is a Ukrainian girl going to swoon over at the sight of seeing a western man or hearing one.

Why would they?  Do British girls swoon over the sight of every foreign man or hearing one?
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Offline Patagonie

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #33 on: August 19, 2016, 02:08:40 AM »
They will always know you are a foreigner, and you are almost always paying more than locals for that privilege.  I usually don't get too upset about it, it often only amounts to $1 or $2.  The better half, OTOH, is incredibly offended by this.  He does not consider himself foreign, he of course speaks the local language, he even has a typical FSUM short haircut, but his clothing is much better than that worn in Ukraine.  He will always barter down, as (a) it's his nature; and (b) he does it on principle.  Often, he will barter down to a price below what locals pay.  Seeing the tricks he pulls in markets is a wonder.

Why would they?  Do British girls swoon over the sight of every foreign man or hearing one?
+1

Believing that you get a benefit with FSU ladies from being a foreigner is simply not working nowadays. FSU women have a largely better knowledge of the west than any westerners about the eastern europe (especially US).
The only thing is to know prices, check your bill and pay attention to be not tricked. YOu have to bargain when necessary. It's a difficult art in front of a local lady, but if she likes you she will not allow a local take advantage of you.
And even if you speak a good russian they will always detect you as a foreigner.
"Je glissais through the paper wall, an angel in the hand, c taboy. I lay on the floor, surgi des chants de Maldoror, je mix l'intégrale de mes nuits de crystal, I belong to the festival.

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #34 on: August 19, 2016, 02:36:59 AM »
4:30 AM, up for a nice 75 minute jog outside while it is still pitch black dark, silent as a church mouse, the entire neighborhood is still asleep. Heck, my two cats are still asleep on my bed. I ask myself sometimes, why do I kill myself by waking up at 4:30 AM to go for a 75 minute run. Then I think about my trip to the FSU, the wonderful woman I will soon meet, and realize all the pain is necessary, and worth it. But in the end, I need to "Send the Pain Below, Where I Need It."       




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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #35 on: August 19, 2016, 02:39:56 AM »
Patagonie, that is Bono from U2 in your avatar, correct Sir? Bono is a good man, he does a tremendous amount of charity work, I respect the guy very much.


Offline Patagonie

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #36 on: August 19, 2016, 04:19:09 AM »
Patagonie, that is Bono from U2 in your avatar, correct Sir? Bono is a good man, he does a tremendous amount of charity work, I respect the guy very much.





Yes that's my avatar, i like the music also.

you are courageous to wake up so early, i have never been able to train so early in the morning, i was more an afternoon or evening training guy.
"Je glissais through the paper wall, an angel in the hand, c taboy. I lay on the floor, surgi des chants de Maldoror, je mix l'intégrale de mes nuits de crystal, I belong to the festival.

Offline Jumper

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #37 on: August 19, 2016, 08:47:51 AM »
Quote
Do British girls swoon over the sight of every foreign man or hearing one?

Yes!
 :cheesy:

but the language barrier is worse than Russian or Ukrainian.
 :ROFL:
.

Offline ML

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #38 on: August 19, 2016, 08:53:28 AM »
Quote

    Do British girls swoon over the sight of every foreign man or hearing one?

Yes! but the language barrier is worse than Russian or Ukrainian.

I was once on a travel discussion website.

A person asked if there would be understandable English spoken in X country they were planning to visit.

A second person said they had been to 80 plus countries and only found one place where the spoken English could not be understood . . . and that place was parts of the UK.
A beautiful woman is pleasant to look at, but it is easier to live with a pleasant acting one.

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #39 on: August 19, 2016, 08:54:30 AM »

Are you insulting my wife, meaning that she is a lower quality woman?
Who is alone?
And who has kept her fully happy more than three years?


Far from it, Pat. It certainly wasn't an attack on you or your wife - we can have a difference in opinion here without stooping to that and I apologise if I wasn't clear; besides, I don't really have a horse in the race. My point was entirely that you won and retained the woman because of who you are, not what PUA techniques you used.

If you learnt some things and incorporated them into daily life, I'm interested to know it. I haven't dismissed entirely that taking elements of it can help a man better himself. Besides, by my reckoning I'm about 20 years younger than you so I have about 17 to catch up and keep a woman for 3 years ;) :P

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #40 on: August 19, 2016, 09:08:34 AM »


I doubt Pat dismisses other alternatives, because of French Pragmatism.


That is the impression I got based on the below passage of text, but I may have misinterpreted having re-read another paragraph later in the post.

So when a guy has some difficulties with women he has to make some progress and no other people than the pua stuff is qualified to help you in this topic. I have read tons of psychology, litterature, seen movies. THat's totally useless. Worse a lot of people who are writers and producers are more betas than the average. I have come along women and spent years to listen them about what they have to say about how a man has to deal with them. It never worked because they have no clue about the secret language that is exchanged between two lovers. They don't say what they think and they don't think what they say when it's about men and women.


To answer to your questions.
Restructuring yourself is bringing new materials that nurtures your personality, beliefs and skills. When you learn russian, and even if you don't speak it for three years, it will stay for a large part in you. The same with what i have done, practiced, learnt. It has changed me, the quality of my life, relationships with women, joy with women, socials relationships. All of this has rocketed since i have met the "dating science".
So i don't think that my wife would have stayed with me and travelled 7000 km to get the necessary visas  to marry me if i had been Patagonie double personality :  the liar PLUS  his pua tricks panoply (as you continue to believe that is artificial and faked).
As you know you cannot hide yourself to a person who lives with you 24 hours/24 hours.
So? It means that my personnality, the one that have blossomed with the dating science is only one person at the end, the person that my wife was searching for.
In other words rather than to focus on the word tricks, i propose you to focus on the word IMPROVMENTS, KNOWLEDGE and UNDERSTANDING. That's really more reliable and exact about what the community is learning and passionated about.
So when i met my wife i didn't use "tricks" but i largely get benefit of my better attractiveness, the result of all the work done during the five previous years.




Pat, this is the sort of info I suggest is useful. If it is about betterment then I have absolutely no issue with it, in fact I would encourage it. Like when a man learns a foreign language it becomes engrained in who he really is and not simply a superficial front. You're right in that there is a stigma attached and a darker side of things where PUA is concerned. Perhaps the stereotype has an impact, but I would still suggest that there are other methods of self-improvement not restricted to PUA 'techniques'. As I have said, I personally do not have an interest or feel a need for it at the moment, but I am open-minded enough for it not to preclude me doing some reading should the need or desire arise.


Offline Jumper

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #41 on: August 19, 2016, 09:19:36 AM »
Pat-
 Thanks for explaining your position on PUA better.

 I've often dismissed it ,because the limited amount of
  what I've seen of it was total  crap, and I speak easily with men or women anywhere.
Part of that is likely from unintentional training,or just comes naturally,
 I cannot tell you if it's a case of the chicken or the egg.
I've often been active and in front of a lot of people in both
 hobbies and professions. In my early twenties I was in bands
as a hobby, yet it was popular , and so playing /singing to fairly large crowds, sometimes tens of thousands. In profession was also interviewed occasionally  , in front of 30 thousand or greater.
In other walks of life did public speaking regularly to smaller groups
like 100 to 300 ,but still,  if you are required to hold their interest for 5 to 6 hours you learn how to do so, and you get over stage fright rather quickly. 
So, simply chatting up or flirting with a woman pales in comparison, and seems incredibly easy , and fun ;)

I know when training for physical/athletic competition, it's often best to
to make training days more difficult than the expected out put on competition day. It was the easiest day of the week physically ,but toughest mentally. That routine is used successfully by many.

I'd assume that could be applied to this as well?
I almost guarantee if a man who lacked in social abilities ,
 practiced them regularly in difficult situations(larger audience, more scrutiny) that then  talking to a random women at the gift shop would be easier and more relaxed.
 :ROFL:

 
 If more naturally relaxed and confident, he would approach more often, notice opportunities more often, and have more positive interaction more often.

 I'd assume a good PUA advocate (unfortunately i haven't seen any)
would preach this ,and show how to put yourself *out there* sincerely and honestly to learn your own best way of handling it.

.

Online 2tallbill

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English accents
« Reply #42 on: August 19, 2016, 10:11:06 AM »
A second person said they had been to 80 plus countries and only found one place where the spoken English could not be understood . . . and that place was parts of the UK.

Jerry Springer type show with incomprehensbile English



The Ragin Cajun on Joe Dirt



They don't actually speak English in Scotland it's just a vicious rumor.




« Last Edit: August 19, 2016, 10:18:47 AM by 2tallbill »
FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Just kiss the girl, don't ask her first. Tolerate NO excuses!

Offline Larry1

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scottish accents
« Reply #43 on: August 19, 2016, 10:31:29 AM »
My favorite scotsman:


Offline msmobyone

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #44 on: August 19, 2016, 11:53:25 AM »
Yes!
 :cheesy:

but the language barrier is worse than Russian or Ukrainian.
 :ROFL:

 :D

British lasses - esp. in London get to hear 80 plus languages on the Tube everyday .. !!

Many FSU women still firmly believe western men are more 'family orientated, fair-minded and loyal' .... 8)

Trench..

Boe has offered you great ripostes to some of your bizarre criteria re selecting women ...I particularly HATED the near to western routes airports...

My first wife lived in a city of 1 million people in Siberia and loads of blokes expected her to fly 5 hours to meet them in Moscow on their 'WMVM sex trips' and wondered why she declined ......

You've heard it once - here it is AGAIN ..

Choose the lady - not her location ...

Many guys think as you and you all end up in Ukraine - 'coz it's 'convenient' ....

Getting a Russian Visa is a cinch - but if it is 'convenient' you want - why not Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia?

The latter two have eth Russians [ those that are 'non citizens'  ] that can travel to Britain - but you'd still need to pay for a spousal visa if they choose you and the UK;)

Lithuanian lasses will have EU passports... which - for now - is no  'issue' for travel or settlement...

Then there's Belarus or the 'Stans...

To bring a an non EU wife to the UK and to get her residency is going to cost you nearly 6k GBP and she must pass an English test beforehand ... ;)


As for kids ..... Jeez man ... if the woman is special enough - bite on it and bring up her kid as if it was your own.







Please excuse the Curmudgeon in my posts ..he will be cured by being reunited with his loved one ;)

Offline Trenchcoat

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #45 on: August 19, 2016, 02:31:25 PM »
:D

British lasses - esp. in London get to hear 80 plus languages on the Tube everyday .. !!

Many FSU women still firmly believe western men are more 'family orientated, fair-minded and loyal' .... 8)

Trench..

Boe has offered you great ripostes to some of your bizarre criteria re selecting women ...I particularly HATED the near to western routes airports...

My first wife lived in a city of 1 million people in Siberia and loads of blokes expected her to fly 5 hours to meet them in Moscow on their 'WMVM sex trips' and wondered why she declined ......

You've heard it once - here it is AGAIN ..

Choose the lady - not her location ...

Many guys think as you and you all end up in Ukraine - 'coz it's 'convenient' ....

Getting a Russian Visa is a cinch - but if it is 'convenient' you want - why not Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia?

The latter two have eth Russians [ those that are 'non citizens'  ] that can travel to Britain - but you'd still need to pay for a spousal visa if they choose you and the UK;)

Lithuanian lasses will have EU passports... which - for now - is no  'issue' for travel or settlement...

Then there's Belarus or the 'Stans...

To bring a an non EU wife to the UK and to get her residency is going to cost you nearly 6k GBP and she must pass an English test beforehand ... ;)


As for kids ..... Jeez man ... if the woman is special enough - bite on it and bring up her kid as if it was your own.

How do you figure it would cost 6k to bring her into the UK?

The stuff you say may seem valid in internet common sense discussion but when you've experienced FSU society and culture there are certain things worth clueing into I think,  certain realities. For sure you can find someone with chemistry in Siberia or with a kid. I'm just saying it's making a hard task off it. Many expensive time consuming trips could be made chasing women that aren't culturally galvanised to meeting a WM and living in western society. It's merely staking your chips where the odds are best I think. A bit like investments you choose based on sound fundamentals rather than just take a punt.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline treadmilldude

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #46 on: August 19, 2016, 03:03:08 PM »
Moby, you have spent many years inside Russia's borders, and are married to a very sweet, loving, wonderful Russian woman. From what you know of current (as in today, circa 8-19-2016) Russian Women's (I am specifically referring to Russian women, not any other country from the FSU) attitudes towards Americans, do you agree with Eduard's assessment from about 2 weeks ago, that a large percentage of Russian Women today 8-19-16 hold US Men (not any other country from the West, ONLY US Men) in pretty low regard these days? Eduard made a pretty convincing case a couple weeks ago that US men like me are viewed by quite a few Russian women as losers and not very desirable as Husbands. I guess credit the Joseph Goebbels - like propaganda machine being run by the Kremlin for this low regard for American Men by Russian women.

I have no plans to visit Russia, and I have almost no knowledge of Russia, unlike Ukraine and Belarus. But even if I did want to visit Russia in search of my 2nd half, I would have pretty grave doubts about embarking on that journey because of the apparent success of the negativity towards US Men seen in Russian culture, at least from what I can glean from various sources.

Eduard
""Hello Patagonie, how are you? Good to see you too!
I guess the most noticeable change is in people's general attitude toward the USA and Americans. In the last few years this country lost respect in many parts of the world and now we are perceived as a weak, vulnerable giant headed toward self-destruction. Coupled with lots of anti-American propaganda in Russia - that doesn't make the US a very desirable place to immigrate to from Russia.
Interestingly the number of American men who contact me in regard to helping them find an FSU wife has dropped in the last couple of years, while the number of Western European men has gone up.
I's become a lot easier to get a RW's interest when I work with a guy from Denmark or Germany compared to a guy from the USA.

I'm sure that many of the guys who are searching right now realize that it's not easy to get attention from a RW these days. I know how to talk to them how to grab and most importantly keep their attention, but even for me  it takes longer to line up a few good prospects. I used to be able to do this in 2-3 months easily, now it takes 4-5 months for an average client.
Also I noticed that sites like fdating have a very limited selection compared to even a couple of years ago. I have used it a few months ago and found that all the women with very attractive photos who I contacted were fake profiles. Although it didn't take long for me to figure it out, still it was disappointing because I have been able to find good and attractive women on that site just a little while back.

Most RW are looking for a "domestic producer" as they refer to local RM.""


Makes me think Belarus, Kazakhstan or Ukraine are all better choices than Russia at the present moment. What is your take on Russia for an American, Moby? I absolutely defer to you, I consider you one of the smartest and most knowledgeable guys on this board, especially in regards to Russia. Thank you Moby.

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #47 on: August 19, 2016, 07:15:31 PM »
Patagonie, I think for myself, a much better method than PUA techniques, of improving myself for a loving, caring FSU woman is to study some basic math equations.........




Offline msmobyone

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #48 on: August 20, 2016, 01:39:26 AM »
How do you figure it would cost 6k to bring her into the UK?

That's conservative..

800 plus for ILR
1200-1500 for FLR
1400 for citizenship
plus the tests for English ability/ knowledge of Britain..  Yours and her Airline trips / accommodation, etc

prices in GBP ,,add 30 percent ( Thanks Brexit voting idiots for torpedoing our economy and currency)

The stuff you say may seem valid in internet common sense discussion but when you've experienced FSU society and culture there are certain things worth clueing into I think,  certain realities.

Having worn the t-shirt and travelled to more cities than the FSU than most W folks your having a 'larf, right ?   It applies in the real world ..

  For sure you can find someone with chemistry in Siberia or with a kid. I'm just saying it's making a hard task off it.


I see you ain't 'getting it', still


If you meet a women who is a match the 'hardness' will be negated by the rewards.. you'll be a team.

Many expensive time consuming trips could be made chasing women that aren't culturally galvanised to meeting a WM and living in western society.

Mately, you'll know pretty quickly if you're into each other and want to be a team.....  whether she can adjust to the different lifestyle is greatly down to our ability to provide stability.

What worries me is you keep bringing up the cost ... if cost is a factor ... get out of the game, now... It is much simpler to find a local lass - or even a FSU lady who is already here :))



It's merely staking your chips where the odds are best I think. A bit like investments you choose based on sound fundamentals rather than just take a punt.

For sure this endeavour is largely decided by luck - right dating site, right time, etc., but your criteria are deeply limiting
Please excuse the Curmudgeon in my posts ..he will be cured by being reunited with his loved one ;)

Offline msmobyone

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Re: New dating search Specification & what I've Learned
« Reply #49 on: August 20, 2016, 02:01:10 AM »
Moby, you have spent many years inside Russia's borders,

Many years in an out ..total time spend within - perhaps 18 months :)

and are married to a very sweet, loving, wonderful Russian woman.

I'm sure her boyfriend would be pleased to hear that ..as we are still technically married :)  SC and and await the termination of my existing marriage  ;)

From what you know of current (as in today, circa 8-19-2016) Russian Women's (I am specifically referring to Russian women, not any other country from the FSU) attitudes towards Americans, do you agree with Eduard's assessment from about 2 weeks ago, that a large percentage of Russian Women today 8-19-16 hold US Men (not any other country from the West, ONLY US Men) in pretty low regard these days?

I don't know when Ed was last in the Rodina - but I know many of SC's friends don't have an issue with US guys...but they are in their late thirties and forties

It's a little like saying many US guys aren't interested in Russian women, any more.

For sure, they know that the US has it's problems -economically and the Russian media make a big noise about Police violence, mass shootings, etc., ...but it is still a desirable place to say, 'I've visited'

One of SC's friends is touring the US., now and doesn't want to come back ...it has been her dream to live there..

Eduard made a pretty convincing case a couple weeks ago that US men like me are viewed by quite a few Russian women as losers and not very desirable as Husbands. I guess credit the Joseph Goebbels - like propaganda machine being run by the Kremlin for this low regard for American Men by Russian women.


A lot of w men [ not not Americans ] don't do others involved in the 'quest' any favours .... Most don't get on the plane ... keyboard romeos ..


I have no plans to visit Russia, and I have almost no knowledge of Russia, unlike Ukraine and Belarus. But even if I did want to visit Russia in search of my 2nd half, I would have pretty grave doubts about embarking on that journey because of the apparent success of the negativity towards US Men seen in Russian culture, at least from what I can glean from various sources.

This guy knows US citizens who are married and living in Sochi and would tell you that they could create a riot by turning up in a Moscow bar and have women surround them ... but that was 15 plus years ago :))


Simply being western won't get you a throng of interested women - but you'll still be intriguing.

As has been said upthread ... the women - not her location / nationality is important.


Many Russians are proud of their nation and think their President is cool - but would still happily leave Russia for a 'good man'

Ed, is correct in that 'anti-US' sentiment is stronger. It's a huge factor in the fall-off of interest from both ends...  I know SC would have had no problem if I was American ...
Please excuse the Curmudgeon in my posts ..he will be cured by being reunited with his loved one ;)

 

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