2nd Trip planning

[Trenchcoat]

I am going there for 21 days. Can't do all that with a carry-on.))

Just wear a pair of black pants and a couple of changes of shirt, few pairs of socks & underwear, no one ever really notices if you're wearing the same trousers since they're non-descript. The shirt more so but you can wash that as you go. If you're meeting more than one lady she will not know that your essentially wearing the same each day since most you'll only meet for a few days tops. Shower and spray whenever you can and should be fine. Also, a plain everyday jumper (or t-shirt in summer) for when needing low key travel. From my travels in the Ukraine that's how I would do it, you could pretend you're on the Simpsons - same clothes each day  

Girl I met in Kiev who traveled on a long train journey to see me just had a carry on, though that was just for a week. I get the impression she just kept it in the cabin since it was a small case. As someone said if you book the other cabin spot then there would be plenty of room for your case and increased safety which for $16 or so is a small price to pay. Other than that just handcuff it to luggage area if possible , but then of course the handcuffs and no guarantee's there either. My mind just wouldn't be at rest if I just dumped my luggage somewhere and left it.

[Trenchcoat]

'Multi-destination' trips are a PiA, but some of our mates like a challenge and seeing as many lasses as possible

True. but personally I would invite some from the more far flung to one major city rather than trek through lots urban sprawl. At the moment I am messaging a girl from Dnipro, which apparently is quite an industrial area, I've never been and for a first meeting have no intention of going, if it comes to it I will invite her Kiev, pay for her tickets put her up in a cheap hotel for a day or two and see her there, more to see and do and avoids me having to do all the travelling. Cost would be much the same it would just be her time spent travelling rather than mine (apparently many Ukrainians like to travel anyway).  The way I see it my time would be best served by meeting girls rather than spending that time travelling. If she turned out to be the one then I would be prepared to travel back with her, if not then I fly onwards, but at least hours of my time would have not been sucked up travelling. That and she cannot disappear easily if she travels to meet me, not that I would hold her to anything or want to be with someone who obviously didn't want to spend time with me.

p.s I know this girl is sound as she has the honest abruptness of a hard slap on the ass

[wallm]

As someone said if you book the other cabin spot then there would be plenty of room for your case and increased safety which for $16 or so is a small price to pay. Other than that just handcuff it to luggage area if possible , but then of course the handcuffs and no guarantee's there either.

Handcuffs? For luggage? In bed I would understand. I pity the ladies you are talking to.

This is a 4.5 hour journey. There is no sleeping car in First Class. I probably should have invited this lady to come to Kiev. Oh well. I will at least get to see Kharkiv. Staying at the Premier Palace Hotel. Seems like a nice one along the lines of a Hyatt which I like here.

[msmob]

True. but personally I would invite some from the more far flung to one major city rather than trek through lots urban sprawl. At the moment I am messaging a girl from Dnipro, which apparently is quite an industrial area, I've never been and for a first meeting have no intention of going, if it comes to it I will invite her Kiev, pay for her tickets put her up in a cheap hotel for a day or two and see her there, more to see and do and avoids me having to do all the travelling. Cost would be much the same it would just be her time spent travelling rather than mine (apparently many Ukrainians like to travel anyway).  The way I see it my time would be best served by meeting girls rather than spending that time travelling. If she turned out to be the one then I would be prepared to travel back with her, if not then I fly onwards, but at least hours of my time would have not been sucked up travelling. That and she cannot disappear easily if she travels to meet me, not that I would hold her to anything or want to be with someone who obviously didn't want to spend time with me.

p.s I know this girl is sound as she has the honest abruptness of a hard slap on the ass

Oh Trench,

V - my ex to be -  lived in the middle of Russia - a city of a million. There are few trip reports from there - it is a five hour flight from Moscow

She was regularly invited by guys 'visiting' Moscow - who could 'fit her in' for a couple of days .. 'strangely enough' she declined such offers - seeking a "serious man"...

I flew her to meet me in Cyprus for five days ...  We got on, OK and I then visited her in her city ..

My point ? You are eliminating ladies who aren't willing to be part of your WMVM plan .. 

[Trenchcoat]

Oh Trench,

V - my ex to be -  lived in the middle of Russia - a city of a million. There are few trip reports from there - it is a five hour flight from Moscow

She was regularly invited by guys 'visiting' Moscow - who could 'fit her in' for a couple of days .. 'strangely enough' she declined such offers - seeking a "serious man"...

I flew her to meet me in Cyprus for five days ...  We got on, OK and I then visited her in her city ..

My point ? You are eliminating ladies who aren't willing to be part of your WMVM plan ..

To be true four days with girl would look less suspicious, I would tend to start it as a VO and if she didn't work out then call up others.

I would simply explain to the girl beforehand in messaging the logistics of it all, I did this with the second girl I met in Nikolaev, she wanted guys to travel all the way to meet her - I did in the end as I was intrigued to see what this Nikolaev place I had been hearing so much about was like, it was indeed of interest to see the 'industry type of girls' walking about, etc. I wouldn't care to go again though unless I had real reason with a girl I was already seeing. When I take into account the travel time spent, taxi costs at either end, etc its a lot of bother.

Anyway, so yeah this girl I simply explained to her that I was putting myself out to travel to get on a flight to Odessa, spend X amount of hours to travel to flight, on flight then more time at other end to get to hotel. I also explained the cost (not specific prices of course) and organisation involved and how I would be knackered at the other end. Added to this I also explained how local travel in a foreign country would be easier for her to navigate than me. I also offered of course to pay for travel costs and hotel for her to come see me in Odessa. Once all this was explained to her she soon came around to my way of thinking i.e because she could now see the logic of it all. Until then she had the idea that a 'real man' would come visit her but had no idea as to what this actually entails for the guy. Many FSW on the other end of this search from what I see have a pretty naive idea of what a man has to do to meet them. They seem to think its easy (ok its not exactly a great epic ordeal) but they seem to thing a guy just books on a flight and all of a sudden he's there - almost like he's been beamed there star trek style. She just has to say come. Once its explained to them that its quite a lot more involving than that and you are putting yourself out already rather a lot and it would be little effort for her to come visit you on a bus/train journey then they start to see the common sense of such an approach.

Anyway, for Wall all is not lost, there is quite a fair bit of activity in Kharkiv from what I hear in the dating scene an although apparently industrial is a place that sounds interesting to me that I wouldn't mind checking out sometime if over that direction. I believe someone stated before that Mila can be worthwhile seeing to see if she can help you out at all Wall if this girl you are going to see doesn't work out. So could be an interesting visit.

[Trenchcoat]

V - my ex to be -  lived in the middle of Russia - a city of a million. There are few trip reports from there - it is a five hour flight from Moscow

So your married to a Russian girl but your getting divorced? How did that come about?

[msmob]

Short story:

 A unique set of circumstances - that fractured her trust...

All behind us and incredibly we live near each other - accidently - and get on, now- even though we have new partners.

[wallm]

Arrived in Kiev 3 hours ago. Fuk this 4th world country. As i had been saying for months they didnt shovel the outside of the apartment i am staying in. Fell on my ass and hit my head. Two natives walked by as if nothing happened. Made my way to Lifecell, got SIM card. Went to Silpo in the basement of Gulliver, bought some water, snacks, chinese dinner and settling in. A beautiful girl helped me translate the crew about what i wanted. I offered to buy her dinner. She said she has a boyfriend. I said perhaps tomorrow then. 

I may sound negative about this country. Perhaps because i made to trips when it snowed and weather is gloomy and miserable. I do not love this country except for the hotties, yet. And food.

[Bounder]

Arrived in Kiev 3 hours ago. Fuk this 4th world country. As i had been saying for months they didnt shovel the outside of the apartment i am staying in. Fell on my ass and hit my head. Two natives walked by as if nothing happened. Made my way to Lifecell, got SIM card. Went to Silpo in the basement of Gulliver, bought some water, snacks, chinese dinner and settling in. A beautiful girl helped me translate the crew about what i wanted. I offered to buy her dinner. She said she has a boyfriend. I said perhaps tomorrow then. 

I may sound negative about this country. Perhaps because i made to trips when it snowed and weather is gloomy and miserable. I do not love this country except for the hotties, yet. And food.

Hi Wallm. Welcome to Kiev! I think your sounding negative because you fell on your ass and hit your head. You'll come around in a bit. Good luck and enjoy your time there in Ukraine!  Try to roll with and just enjoy yourself. Of course, be careful on the ice - that will help with the enjoyment!

[Trenchcoat]

Arrived in Kiev 3 hours ago. Fuk this 4th world country. As i had been saying for months they didnt shovel the outside of the apartment i am staying in. Fell on my ass and hit my head. Two natives walked by as if nothing happened. Made my way to Lifecell, got SIM card. Went to Silpo in the basement of Gulliver, bought some water, snacks, chinese dinner and settling in. A beautiful girl helped me translate the crew about what i wanted. I offered to buy her dinner. She said she has a boyfriend. I said perhaps tomorrow then. 

I may sound negative about this country. Perhaps because i made to trips when it snowed and weather is gloomy and miserable. I do not love this country except for the hotties, yet. And food.

Wall, you weren't trying the old fake a fall over when a couple of hotties walk by to gain an early conquest were you Good for you on making the journey though, I'm glad for you and kind of wish it were me already, but I still got some extra work to do in that department and got an idea of what Kiev can be like in gloomy weather. As you know went for a few days there end of March and while most days were decent one day was a bit gloomy. Worst is probably when in hotel without company and the weather is a bit overcast (which I had at the beginning and end of trip) so getting to meet women soon is a good idea. Seriously though the reaction of the natives kind of stresses the way life is there I think, a kind of hard life which doesn't give a lot of room for compassion towards strangers unless there is love involved we hope  Which is why I think DK was right when he said girls from poor backgrounds in the Ukraine can be a problem as they can be too poor which can affect them so richer girls don't necessarily have that hang up. I know what its like when you get a sh*t start to the trip, had it in Odessa last year when my luggage was lost/delayed by the airline for a day (I presumed lost). Just keep pressing on and things usually get better

[GregfromGa]

Arrived in Kiev 3 hours ago. Fuk this 4th world country. As i had been saying for months they didnt shovel the outside of the apartment i am staying in. Fell on my ass and hit my head. Two natives walked by as if nothing happened. Made my way to Lifecell, got SIM card. Went to Silpo in the basement of Gulliver, bought some water, snacks, chinese dinner and settling in. A beautiful girl helped me translate the crew about what i wanted. I offered to buy her dinner. She said she has a boyfriend. I said perhaps tomorrow then. 

I may sound negative about this country. Perhaps because i made to trips when it snowed and weather is gloomy and miserable. I do not love this country except for the hotties, yet. And food.

Kiev in winter can be tough.

[wallm]

I am good now. Glad I avoided any injuries. I was wearing winter boots from Cole Haan that have nice soles for snow. It was not icy just matted down snow because they don't shovel or clean the side streets. One thing for sure, if somebody fell down near me, I would have gone to them to assist, even they happened to be those miserable fuking Liberals.

Looking forward to a great Valentine's Day dinner this evening with a spicy seņorita. 

[ML]

Looking forward to a great Valentine's Day dinner this evening with a spicy seņorita. 

So you took a quick flight to Spain or South America ???

[wallm]

So you took a quick flight to Spain or South America ???

Don't take this quite literally.

[BillyB]

Arrived in Kiev 3 hours ago. Fuk this 4th world country. As i had been saying for months they didnt shovel the outside of the apartment i am staying in. Fell on my ass and hit my head. Two natives walked by as if nothing happened.

Got to get tough to survive! Last week big snowstorm and freezing temperatures in the Seattle area. Based on traffic in the morning, only 15% of the people went to work. Most of those people work indoors. I work outdoors all day and I went to work.

[GregfromGa]

There's a great little eating place directly across the street from Obriens. I discovered it in 2002. At that time it was the only non smoking place to eat I could find. The food is good and it's cheap.

[msmob]

There's a great little eating place directly across the street from Obriens. I discovered it in 2002. At that time it was the only non smoking place to eat I could find. The food is good and it's cheap.

O'Brien's please ! Not to be confused with Obama..

[HoundDaddyLee]

There's a great little eating place directly across the street from Obriens. I discovered it in 2002. At that time it was the only non smoking place to eat I could find. The food is good and it's cheap.

Pretty sure all restaurants in Ukraine are non smoking now...

[ML]

Pretty sure all restaurants in Ukraine are non smoking now...

The rule is no smoking . . . but it is not enforced.

FSU people generally think that laws and rules are just suggestions.

[JayH]

The rule is no smoking . . . but it is not enforced.

FSU people generally think that laws and rules are just suggestions.

I agree in general terms -- but--there is a significant improvement and reduction . I still marvel at people standing outside in sub-zero temperatures to have a smoke !

The smoking ban is being taken seriously .

[GregfromGa]

I agree in general terms -- but--there is a significant improvement and reduction . I still marvel at people standing outside in sub-zero temperatures to have a smoke !

The smoking ban is being taken seriously .

You are correct. I never saw anyone smoking inside in anyplace the last few times I was there.It used to be rough. I hated it.

[Trenchcoat]

Looking forward to a great Valentine's Day dinner this evening with a spicy seņorita. 

So how did the date go last night? Tell all

[GregfromGa]

So how did the date go last night? Tell all

That's right. This ain't Vietnam there are rules here. You cant just show up here and spout off about a first date and then disappear.

[wallm]

On the train to Odessa. Near me is a Pom in his 60s i think yapping about Yanks, trump, wall, how us yanks arent going to protect Europe anymore....ugh...do i need to listen to this for hours? He cant possibly be Moby, can he?    i do not want to engage this wanker in a conversation. 

[wallm]

So how did the date go last night? Tell all

it was a good date. Second time meeting her. Good food, good conversation, some smooching. I applied 2tallbill's philosophy. Do i see myself as her future husband? Probably not. Next. Met Elena again. More of the same. I didnt view her as my future Mrs. So, moving on.