Latest info re immigration from Trump

[GQBlues]

Like asking me how many no-go zones in London ? ..Or suggesting UK media is 'controlled' ?

There are NO - no-go areas in London, Birmingham, Manchester or even Belfast, these days..  I believe it was Fox News that suggested such 'bollox' and we had a good laugh at such ignorance

Some might think the BBC is 'controlled' ...The left say the right control it and the right say the Beeb is populated by lefties ... so I'd say this confirms some sort of balance

Riiiight!

Just like what Mayor Yvan Mayeur of Brussel said in response to Donald's assertion how Brussels is a hellhole (alluding to Islamic extremism), "Mr. Trump doesn't know what he's talking about! He's been away for too long. Maybe he should come by and see how peaceful and wonderful our city is for himself!"

In less than 2 weeks....

[Boethius]

Perhaps the Poms should have a few million of these scum roaming London. Yes, sign another petition begging the dinosaur (er..her majesty) to decree that a few million be brought in. Couple those with islamic extremists...

Her Majesty does not have the power to decree who can or cannot enter the country.  Britain is a constitutional monarchy.  So, that power belongs to Parliament, although regulations are made by Order in Council (i.e., the Privy Council).  Moreover, I would say that despite her age, Her Majesty keeps a gruelling schedule, and every prime minister of the UK has commented on the wise counsel she has given him/her.  There is something to be said about being a monarch for over six decades and having seen 12 prime ministers, and their different approaches to the issues that have rocked the country.

[Boethius]

Really? But you failed to provide your help on what I'd like to know most .....
HOW TO GET FREE STUFF !!!

I would like to ask one thing...why can't the UK get something besides a mealy mouth, wishy washy, flip flop prime minister?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theresa_May
 
Like saying a communistic-capitalist [not to be confused with a capitalistic-communist]

not dictating policy

Nope.  A conservative liberal means someone who is fiscally conservative and socially liberal.  It's common in most of Europe (and Canada - even the conservatives here were "progressive" on most social policies).

[wallm]

It seems having wonderful kids from of those unions doesn't count ? )

Wonderful kids? good for you. Be proud.

You are wrong about everything else.

[Boethius]

What we have is the Democrats acting like they are an opposition party in the third
world, similar like they did in secession during the 1860's.

Trump needs to realize that you can't make deals or appease radicals. He should
immediately fire 100% of the lingering Obama cabinet positions which haven't been
replaced yet because of foot dragging by Dems.

He needs to get the GOP house and senate to produce a bill allowing him to fire
unhelpful and foot dragging federal employees, starting with the 900 state
department officials that signed a protest memo. They are part of the problem
not part of the solution.




About 900 State Department officials sign protest memo: source
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-dissent-idUSKBN15F2KP

From what I have read, the protest is because those state department officials who are, after all, experts in their fields, believe the policy they were protesting will harm US interests abroad.  Isn't that what federal employees are paid to do?   Dissent has been used in the past, in 1992 IIRC, and in 2003.  No one was fired.

Now of course, the US can "sovietize" and only hire employees who swear absolute fealty to the current elected "king".  But if you know your history, or have ever travelled to the FSU, you'll see how well that turned out.

[fathertime]

So you do agree that H1B visas are not about skills shortage (as they claim) but strictly about depressing wages that we Americans earn. Did I just read a lib make a salient point? Hard to believe. There is a first time for everything.

WIth all due respect, $130 an hour in 1998 perhaps was a wage that could use a bit of deflating.  I have doubts that companies could compete globally while paying that wage to their workers.  In which case you would be at $0 an hour without companies that could compete. 




Fathertime!

[fathertime]

The biggest users of H1B visas are indian consulting companies such as Infosys. They supply companies with these "skilled" indians with fake resumes and fake skills.

So how do these companies compete in the marketplace if they aren't providing the service that you claim you are able to do so much better than the Indians you are bemoaning? If they compete with proper service, and do it for less, isn't that what the consumer demands?


Fathertime! 

[fathertime]

Fair enough on the story alone not showing my point.  When you add in how the people react to those stories, ie... *crickets*...  you start to see a pattern. 

I don't see any protests like we see FOR the behavior that leads to criminals being let go.

Well I don't know why you aren't protesting then.  Usually it takes quite a bit to motivate people to get into the street. 


I don't agree that it is crickets when people hear about violent criminals getting released and committing more violence, liberals are probably as angry as anybody else.   Of course if blame must be assigned lets not forget  it has been conservatives trying to criminalize lifestyle choices regarding drug use and setting up stings for 'Johns'  that has helped to clog our prisons  and criminal courts.  So in that sense, they need to look in the mirror as to why some prison systems are in a position where they have to release violent offenders earlier than the public would like. 


Fathertime! 

[LiveFromUkraine]

Well I don't know why you aren't protesting then.  Usually it takes quite a bit to motivate people to get into the street. 

You're right, you don't know anything about me or what I have done.

I don't agree that it is crickets when people hear about violent criminals getting released and committing more violence, liberals are probably as angry as anybody else.   Of course if blame must be assigned lets not forget  it has been conservatives trying to criminalize lifestyle choices regarding drug use and setting up stings for 'Johns'  that has helped to clog our prisons  and criminal courts.  So in that sense, they need to look in the mirror as to why some prison systems are in a position where they have to release violent offenders earlier than the public would like. 


Fathertime!

We are talking about violent illegal immigrants and refugees.   They shouldn't be released but deported.  That is the whole point which you failed to address because it conflicts with your anti-conservative spiel.

You can thank liberals for setting up sanctuary cities and allowing these violent offenders to continue their ways with fellow American citizens.  They push for that behavior to happen.  To say they are against the very thing they protest for is contradictory.

[fathertime]

You're right, you don't know anything about me or what I have done.

What are you implying here?  Are you saying you have gone to the street to protest criminals being released too soon?  If you are expecting others to get in the street for the issues that rile you up, you are expecting too much.  I've protested in the past, and would consider doing so in the future, but probably only if I felt extremely strong about an issue or injustice.   

We are talking about violent illegal immigrants and refugees.   They shouldn't be released but deported. That is the whole point which you failed to address because it conflicts with your anti-conservative spiel.

No it doesn't, you have created a strawman once again.  I happen to agree that violent illegals should be deported and if that is somehow not feasible then imprisoned for as long as they have earned, and then deported.  I certainly wouldn't want one of these individuals to simply be deported without serving time, and released in their home country. 

You can thank liberals for setting up sanctuary cities and allowing these violent offenders to continue their ways with fellow American citizens.  They push for that behavior to happen.  To say they are against the very thing they protest for is contradictory.

2 different issues. 


1. Violent criminals
2. Sanctuary cities.


We have already discussed the violent criminals.  Insofar as sanctuary cities, I don't see how these cities push for violent criminals to commit violent acts.   Given the totality of circumstances, I can see the need for a sanctuary city, but that should not extend to illegals that commit violent acts.  That is a group that nobody should want to run free in the country. So your theory that liberals want that isn't factual. 


Fathertime! 

[msmob]

Riiiight!

Just like what Mayor Yvan Mayeur of Brussel said in response to Donald's assertion how Brussels is a hellhole (alluding to Islamic extremism), "Mr. Trump doesn't know what he's talking about! He's been away for too long. Maybe he should come by and see how peaceful and wonderful our city is for himself!"

In less than 2 weeks....

??

You referred to 'no go' areas - which of course there aren't any ... Your 'response' ?  Suggesting that shootings and bombings make for 'no go' areas ?

Based on THAT premise, New York, Boston, etc., are 'no-go' areas ... )

[msmob]

Wonderful kids? good for you. Be proud.

You are wrong about everything else.

I'm going to take that post in the jocular style I interpret ... and proceed accordingly

[LiveFromUkraine]

What are you implying here?  Are you saying you have gone to the street to protest criminals being released too soon?  If you are expecting others to get in the street for the issues that rile you up, you are expecting too much.  I've protested in the past, and would consider doing so in the future, but probably only if I felt extremely strong about an issue or injustice.   

I didn't imply anything.  I stated you have no clue about what I have done.  Frankly, it isn't germane to this discussion and none of your business.

You did make my point.  Illegals killing American citizens isn't important enough to protest yet we see many protest wanting to continue with the behavior that allows those criminals to come here and commit crimes.  That has been my point.  You don't promote behavior if you're against it.  Simples.


There was a protest on the very things I'm talking about.  It was called the Presidential election.

No it doesn't, you have created a strawman once again.  I happen to agree that violent illegals should be deported and if that is somehow not feasible then imprisoned for as long as they have earned, and then deported.  I certainly wouldn't want one of these individuals to simply be deported without serving time, and released in their home country. 

I'm seeing a theme here.  You continue talking about your own feelings and that is somehow proof that all liberals feel the same.

If liberals were tough on crime we wouldn't have a Trump.

2 different issues. 


1. Violent criminals
2. Sanctuary cities.


We have already discussed the violent criminals.  Insofar as sanctuary cities, I don't see how these cities push for violent criminals to commit violent acts.   Given the totality of circumstances, I can see the need for a sanctuary city, but that should not extend to illegals that commit violent acts.  That is a group that nobody should want to run free in the country. So your theory that liberals want that isn't factual. 


Fathertime!

You're being obtuse. 

If cities let criminals go then what do you think will happen? 

Same issues.  While we are at it, we can also add the criminals that do finally get deported have been coming back multiple times to commit even more crimes against citizens. 

Who is against building a wall and better border control?

Lastly, since you bring up the concept of facts...  Stating what you think, as an individual, isn't proof of anything.  All I need to do is look at what is allowing the violence done by immigrants/refugees and see who is promoting that behavior.

As they say, actions speak louder than words. 

You obviously don't get it and there is no point in continuing.  I imagine if I were talking about conservatives you would be agreeing.  It is the same logic that makes me think many Republicans are war-hawks.  You jump on the agreement train for that.

[fathertime]

I didn't imply anything.  I stated you have no clue about what I have done.  Frankly, it isn't germane to this discussion and none of your business.

If it is none of my business or germane, then why did you bring it up to begin with? If you feel strongly then by all means protest. 

You did make my point.  Illegals killing American citizens isn't important enough to protest yet we see many protest wanting to continue with the behavior that allows those criminals to come here and commit crimes.  That has been my point.  You don't promote behavior if you're against it.  Simples.
 

No, that isn't the point.  Who is promoting murderers (Who are illegals) to commit crimes and then walk free?  Nobody is.  That is the strawman you continue to construct. 

I'm seeing a theme here.  You continue talking about your own feelings and for some reason that is somehow proof that all liberals feel the same.
 

You are creating your own theme.  I would never lump 'all liberals' in the same category.  I feel safe saying, that by and large, liberals like anyone else would not be for releasing violent criminals.  So when you make a statement stating that liberals like/want this, I will have to object and point out that isn't factual. 

If liberals were tough on crime we wouldn't have a Trump.


You're being obtuse. 

If cities let criminals go then what do you think will happen? 

Same issues.  While we are at it, we can also add the criminals that do finally get deported have been coming back multiple times to commit even more crimes against citizens. 

Who is against building a wall and better border control?

Lastly, since you bring up the concept of facts...  Stating what you think, as an individual, isn't proof of anything.  All I need to do is look at what is allowing the violence done by immigrants/refugees and see who is promoting that behavior.

As they say, actions speak louder than words. 

You obviously don't get it and there is no point in continuing.  That is fine.  I imagine if I were talking about conservatives you would be agreeing.  We can disagree on this. 

Who wants to release violent criminals?  Who is promoting that?  Neither liberals or conservatives are.   If people are protesting the steps Trump has taken or may take going forward, that doesn't equate to the people wanting violent felons to be released, that is a big step beyond the truth.
Yes, we can disagree on how/what the steps should be.  I imagine if we narrow the issue and not include 'most liberals' or 'most conservatives'  we could mostly agree. 


Fathertime!

[LiveFromUkraine]

If it is none of my business or germane, then why did you bring it up to begin with? If you feel strongly then by all means protest. 

Dude, you asked me why I didn't protest.  You brought it up... try again.

No, that isn't the point.  Who is promoting murderers (Who are illegals) to commit crimes and then walk free?  Nobody is.  That is the strawman you continue to construct. 

Yes, that is my point.  People can say whatever they want.  Truth is in the actions.  If you back behavior that allows this to happen you are not against that behavior.    No straw man argument.  I don't know why you have a hard time understanding it.

You are creating your own theme.  I would never lump 'all liberals' in the same category.  I feel safe saying, that by and large, liberals like anyone else would not be for releasing violent criminals.  So when you make a statement stating that liberals like/want this, I will have to object and point out that isn't factual. 

You group Republicans together whenever you have the chance. 

Everyone wants the same thing yet no one is stopping it from happening.  Crazy!

Who wants to release violent criminals?  Who is promoting that?  Neither liberals or conservatives are.   If people are protesting the steps Trump has taken or may take going forward, that doesn't equate to the people wanting violent felons to be released, that is a big step beyond the truth.
Yes, we can disagree on how/what the steps should be.  I imagine if we narrow the issue and not include 'most liberals' or 'most conservatives'  we could mostly agree. 


Fathertime!

Who is letting these criminals go free if everyone wants the same thing?  Why are these criminals coming back to wreck havoc if everyone wants the same thing? 

[fathertime]

Dude, you asked me why I didn't protest.  You brought it up... try again.

hehe, yes I did bring that up.    I mentioned that I've protested in the past (against Obama policy actually). My idiot face was evened pictured and published which I preferred didn't happen. 

Yes, that is my point.  No straw man.  People can say whatever they want.  Truth is in the pudding.  If you back behavior that allows this to happen you are not against that behavior.  No straw man argument here.  I don't know why you have a hard time understanding it.

Ok then, what behavior specifically are you saying is being back by liberals and lets see if we can narrow the issue a bit. 

You group Republicans together whenever you have the chance. 

Yes, lets just say certain hypocrite conservatives, since republicans is too broad! 

Everyone wants the same thing yet no one is stopping it from happening.  Crazy!

Who is letting these criminals go free if everyone wants the same thing?  Why are these criminals coming back to wreck havoc if everyone wants the same thing? 

I'd venture that the issue is more complex and multi-faceted than we think, nevertheless It seems clear to me that nobody wants violent criminals released into society.   So if that is the starting point, I'm pretty sure a solution can be had. 


Fathertime! 

[LiveFromUkraine]

Ok then, what behavior specifically are you saying is being back by liberals and lets see if we can narrow the issue a bit. 

You can't be for illegal immigration and wash your hands of all bad things that come with illegal immigration.   Nor bringing in 1,000's of refugees without proper vetting and say you're not responsible for any bad things that come with that decision.

People blow off the bad things by saying stuff like "Only a small percentage of immigrants/refugees are bad."  That small percentage can create a lot of destruction and ruin lives.

That is what I am talking about.  Maybe I wasn't clear enough.

I don't think people are going to say they want violent criminals.  I do see people marginalizing the violence when it does happen.

Yes, lets just say certain hypocrite conservatives, since republicans is too broad! 

Right, and I would happen to agree with many of the things you say.  It's hard to think someone is against war if they keep voting for war-hawks. 

[GQBlues]

??

You referred to 'no go' areas - which of course there aren't any ... Your 'response' ?  Suggesting that shootings and bombings make for 'no go' areas ?

Based on THAT premise, New York, Boston, etc., are 'no-go' areas ... )

Well, it's become obvious you didn't even know the term to even make any objective comment to this subject.

No-Go Zones: *No-go zones can be defined as Muslim-dominated neighborhoods that are de facto off limits to non-Muslims due to a number of factors, including the lawlessness, insecurity or religious intimidation that often pervades these areas.*

European No Go Zones Citation: http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5177/no-go-zones-britain

If you can't take the time to read, here's a video for your viewing pleasure. Enjoy...

Supporting Documentary:



Shootings and bombings, in reference to what happened in Belgium, a planned terror plot by Islamic extremist cell inside Belgium's heavily Muslim populated sector, commonly referred to now in Europe as 'no-go' zones.

Resistance is futile. Best you start reading your Quran.

[fathertime]

You can't be for illegal immigration and wash your hands of all bad things that come with illegal immigration.   Nor bringing in 1,000's of refugees without proper vetting and say you're not responsible for any bad things that come with that decision.

People blow off the bad things by saying stuff like "Only a small percentage of immigrants/refugees are bad."  That small percentage can create a lot of destruction and ruin lives.

That is what I am talking about.  Maybe I wasn't clear enough.

I don't think people are going to say they want violent criminals.  I do see people marginalizing the violence when it does happen.

ok that is better, a point we can discuss. 


We got all these people here already, we (Govt and business) winked/nodded/lured them here.  By and large they can't be shipped out now for various reasons.  Legalize most of them through a rigorous process.  Violent adult felons if not already imprisoned are not legalized and sent back to home country.  I don't see why we should support violent felons, especially those that aren't here legally.


New potential arrivals can be dealt with differently.  If Trump wants to prevent further arrivals, then I'm somewhat supportive depending on exactly how he is proposing doing it, he will need to create more than one barrier and some of the barriers will be to American business. It might wind up being more harmful than we realize, but so be it, if that is what the american people want.   


Fathertime! 

[alex330]

No-Go Zones: *No-go zones can be defined as Muslim-dominated neighborhoods that are de facto off limits to non-Muslims due to a number of factors, including the lawlessness, insecurity or religious intimidation that often pervades these areas.*

European No Go Zones Citation: http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5177/no-go-zones-britain

I have mentioned this here before, but since some people don't understand I will bring it up again.

My wife is a corporate flight attendant. They have what they call handlers in each city. The handlers arrange transportation, security, sometimes accommodations, etc. They meet the girls and pilots at the FBO.

Paris and London are two very common destinations for private aircraft. Both cities have no go zones for the women. They are told not to visit these areas under any circumstances.

Besides Caracas these are the only two cities they fly to that have these rules.

To deny they exist or there is danger is plain just ridiculous.

[Boethius]

"No go" zones are just ghettos.  In Paris, they are suburbs tourists wouldn't visit in any event.  Furthermore, they are not unsafe.  A woman walking alone, for example, will be propositioned, but she won't be attacked.

I've had Londoners tell me there is no such thing as a "no go" zone in London, at least, not for the people.  For police, it may be a different story. 

I have been to one of the so called "no go" zones in Paris, but under my new policy on personal information, I won't share why or my experiences there, other than it was perfectly safe.

[HoundDaddyLee]

So how do these companies compete in the marketplace if they aren't providing the service that you claim you are able to do so much better than the Indians you are bemoaning? If they compete with proper service, and do it for less, isn't that what the consumer demands?


Fathertime!

FT, You would be shocked at the number of companies that keep going back to the "cheap" well and have failed projects. I have been working with offshore/H1B teams for close to 20 years. It is so painful, that paying a qualified candidate a higher rate would be a win. But the bean counters (and stock holders) demand low cost/high profits. And trust me, there are many American IT workers that are very under paid due to this issue.


I spend countless hours keeping my skills current, but my pay is trending flat because companies think they will get twice the effort from two or three cheap H1B workers, instead of what they get from my knowledge and long experience. (Look up "Mythical Man Month for explanation that you do not get linear scale with people).


I don't know if you are in the IT field or were ever involved in it, but Americans are being priced out of the market. Raising the minimum pay for an H1B can only benefit American IT workers.


HDL

[alex330]

Furthermore, they are not unsafe.  A woman walking alone, for example, will be propositioned, but she won't be attacked.

They are very unsafe. That is why they do not allow single women to visit those areas. They chance of a rape or attack is much higher. That is why it is company policy as well as the local security firms and handlers policy.

[GQBlues]

"No go" zones are just ghettos.  In Paris, they are suburbs tourists wouldn't visit in any event.  Furthermore, they are not unsafe.  A woman walking alone, for example, will be propositioned, but she won't be attacked.

I've had Londoners tell me there is no such thing as a "no go" zone in London, at least, not for the people.  For police, it may be a different story. 

I have been to one of the so called "no go" zones in Paris, but under my new policy on personal information, I won't share why or my experiences there, other than it was perfectly safe.

LOL. Sure. And Somalia/Iraq are vacation hot spots.

[alex330]

FT, You would be shocked at the number of companies that keep going back to the "cheap" well and have failed projects. I have been working with offshore/H1B teams for close to 20 years. It is so painful, that paying a qualified candidate a higher rate would be a win. But the bean counters (and stock holders) demand low cost/high profits. And trust me, there are many American IT workers that are very under paid due to this issue.

I spend countless hours keeping my skills current, but my pay is trending flat because companies think they will get twice the effort from two or three cheap H1B workers, instead of what they get from my knowledge and long experience. (Look up "Mythical Man Month for explanation that you do not get linear scale with people).

I don't know if you are in the IT field or were ever involved in it, but Americans are being priced out of the market. Raising the minimum pay for an H1B can only benefit American IT workers.

HDL is on the money. I have hired, sponsored, and worked with offshore talent for many years as well.


The last H1B worker we hired volunteered to work for us 2 weeks with no pay. The sponsoring company let him go shortly after he arrived. We let him go the first week.


We have hired numerous Indian devs and teams. We always lose money. We pay our current guy a bit more but he runs circles around the last team of six guys that worked for us. And we no longer have servers with logins like admin/123456 or sloppy code that breaks, no documentation, etc etc etc