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Author Topic: Trench's Questions and Philosophies  (Read 125259 times)

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Offline Sting23

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1100 on: April 25, 2018, 10:15:10 PM »
Well, this is how Trench thinks.  he's got no plan or foresight into what he's doing.  he talked about going to Russia then gave it up as soon as he found out you need a visa.  and you're right Poland has EU status so why the hell would any Polish girl need him. 

krimster you are well intentioned but sometimes a man's just gotta learn through life and his mistakes.  I just hope Trench ain't 50 by the time he's figured it out.

Online msmob

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1101 on: April 26, 2018, 07:58:51 AM »
We are apparently all at some point on the spectrum, lol, but no I am not autistic or suffering from Asperger's.

Fixed that for you...


He's defo not on the spectrum, as I see ZIP off the scale abilities in his posts - other than a total inability to read, properly - other than what he wants to hear / see ;)







Offline Boethius

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1102 on: April 26, 2018, 12:23:39 PM »
A girl wants to date a western guy but he is 'intruding' in her life if he wants to visit her home town?

Would sound to me like the girl is either unrealistic in what a relationship entails or she doesn't think that much of the guy.

The better half was in Kyiv not long ago.  A neighbour looking for a foreign husband (first marriage failed, no children) was mocked as an "American mattress".  Why?  She'd met a grand total of two foreign men, and had been seen by a neighbour with at least one of them in the centre of the city.

Yes, you are intruding, because at the point of meeting, or even dating, you are no one to her, just as she is no one to you.  The fact you don't get this suggests you are not thinking of anyone but you.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 12:27:31 PM by Boethius »
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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1103 on: April 26, 2018, 12:31:50 PM »
trench.. I have posted this before and I'll do you a favor by doing it again, try and UNDERSTAND what it illustrates this time..

Multitasking means screwing up several things at once.

Offline Boethius

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1104 on: April 26, 2018, 12:40:01 PM »
I will also add that Trench has posted he is looking for a woman who is "more traditional" and not a Western feminist.  Yet despite this, he is imposing his Western values on these "traditional" women, and ignoring the traditional attitudes of their culture.
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1105 on: April 26, 2018, 01:15:49 PM »
The better half was in Kyiv not long ago.  A neighbour looking for a foreign husband (first marriage failed, no children) was mocked as an "American mattress".  Why?  She'd met a grand total of two foreign men, and had been seen by a neighbour with at least one of them in the centre of the city.

Yes, you are intruding, because at the point of meeting, or even dating, you are no one to her, just as she is no one to you.  The fact you don't get this suggests you are not thinking of anyone but you.

Sure ok I accept this then, but does the same not also apply that woman wanting to meet a man in his home city may be intruding on his life?

Offline Boethius

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1106 on: April 26, 2018, 01:21:23 PM »
Don't be daft.  Nobody in the West cares about such things. 


If this is such an issue for you, then find a Western woman, for whom such things generally are a non issue.
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Online Nightwish

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1107 on: April 26, 2018, 01:24:37 PM »
Sure ok I accept this then, but does the same not also apply that woman wanting to meet a man in his home city may be intruding on his life?
Multitasking means screwing up several things at once.

Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1108 on: April 26, 2018, 01:28:58 PM »
Fixed that for you...


He's defo not on the spectrum, as I see ZIP off the scale abilities in his posts - other than a total inability to read, properly - other than what he wants to hear / see ;)

Cheers Mobers ;) Never thought you would be one to support me in such a discussion :D

I've looked up about the spectrum & Aspergers etc on the internet before as you hear about a lot if it these days. Something to do with people not reckonising obvious social cues and social boundaries,  appropriate social responses, etc though cases seemed to vary and even some doctors were not sure of what constitutes a dianosis or could diagnose. Some speculate that some people that state they have Aspergers make it up but to be honest I'm not even sure what if is. Some people I have met who are supposed to have Aspergers seemed normal & social enough to me with no obviouslyrics odd tenancies though of course I did/do not know them in depth.

Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1109 on: April 26, 2018, 01:31:51 PM »
Don't be daft.  Nobody in the West cares about such things. 


If this is such an issue for you, then find a Western woman, for whom such things generally are a non issue.

I guessing there a non issue for East European men also. Huh, seems like us men must dance to the lady's tune at all times.

Offline Boethius

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1110 on: April 26, 2018, 01:37:45 PM »
Why are you looking in a traditional society if you are not willing to play by a traditional society's rules??
« Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 05:27:53 PM by Boethius »
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Offline Boethius

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1111 on: April 26, 2018, 02:01:13 PM »
I will also add, you must have a certain flexibility when married to someone from a different culture.  There are going to be misunderstandings, and differences in some ways you approach things, particularly when it comes to raising children.  I encountered these things, and I know the culture, speak the language, understand most of the cultural cues, and am married to a man who is, for the most part, flexible in terms of culture.

If you cannot even compromise on this issue. let alone understand it (which you don't), which is a very small thing, there is no way you will navigate, successfully, a marriage to a woman from that culture.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 03:36:52 PM by Boethius »
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Offline treadmilldude

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1112 on: April 26, 2018, 02:55:15 PM »
When Mobyís Wifeís new kitten accidentally got run over by a car, why did you make fun of her and make fun of the accident, laughing at her and the dead kitten?

The Women in my life are important to me, I will die for them. Donít ever make a remark like that about any Female I know, love or care about.

You have no respect for Children or Women, you have no sense of decency at all to you.

There are certain Men who, because of their complete lack of empathy, have no business ever getting married to a Woman. You are such a Man Trenchcoat.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 03:35:24 PM by AnonMod »

Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1113 on: April 26, 2018, 04:01:36 PM »
When Mobyís Wifeís new kitten accidentally got run over by a car, why did you make fun of her and make fun of the accident, laughing at her and the dead kitten?

The Women in my life are important to me, I will die for them. Donít ever make a remark like that about any Female I know, love or care about.

You have no respect for Children or Women, you have no sense of decency at all to you.

There are certain Men who, because of their complete lack of empathy, have no business ever getting married to a Woman. You are such a Man Trenchcoat.

I think you are overstating it a little TMD, in all cases it was just a light hearted joke. Most of those in any case give as good as they get. I think you need to relax TMD and not take forums so seriously, guys mess about on them all the time.

Offline Sting23

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1114 on: April 26, 2018, 04:33:41 PM »
I think you are overstating it a little TMD, in all cases it was just a light hearted joke. Most of those in any case give as good as they get. I think you need to relax TMD and not take forums so seriously, guys mess about on them all the time.

A joke like when the video of the Georgian ski lift accident was posted, and people almost died, you were laughing and making fun of one of the guys who flew off the chair and crashed into the snow violently. 

Dude no one ain't gonna help you no more.  If you can't find a woman for the rest of your life then so be it. 

You might not be autistic but you are one of the most socially inept people I've ever come across.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 04:37:45 PM by AnonMod »

Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1115 on: April 26, 2018, 04:50:58 PM »
Why are you looking in a traditional society if you are not willing to play be a traditional society's rules??

Not an easy thing to explain. In part because I do not know what they are.

I know most of traditional societies rules in the west as they were but I don't know how they apply in the FSU, generally for me in Ukraine. As you know societies in East & West developed differently particularly under the Soviet Union as it became more closed of to outsiders.

So for example in the UK up to the early to mid part of the twentieth century women of any repute usually did not go into pubs they used to sit outside on a bench and wait for their man to come out. It was seen as in decent for them to go inside. Now does this traditional value apply in Ukraine today? Not as far as I have seen. So you see its knowing which traditional values apply and how they apply. Some may be applied differently while some traditional values might be entirely traditional to Ukraine/FSU or at least never a western traditional value.

So if I knew what they were, some I do it would be easier to play by them. The other issue is the girl if she wants to live in the west - society is no longer traditional or at least very few places are traditional in their values. As said before a salary in the West unless specifically high only is set up to pay for one person plus a child or two, or a bit of entertainment. I could support a FSW as well so long as she was not hammering the credit card constantly. Is there an alternative way to have it set up I don't know, what would you suggest?

Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1116 on: April 26, 2018, 04:57:28 PM »
A joke like when the video of the Georgian ski lift accident was posted, and people almost died, you were laughing and making fun of one of the guys who flew off the chair and crashed into the snow violently. 

Dude no one ain't gonna help you no more.  If you can't find a woman for the rest of your life then so be it. 

You might not be autistic but you are one of the most socially inept people I've ever come across.

People don't almost die Sting they are either dead or they are not dead. The lift accident was not really all that serious no one lost a limb or anything. Unless you personally are connected to any of those people you are getting overly concerned over people you don't know.

Offline Boethius

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1117 on: April 26, 2018, 05:10:04 PM »
Not an easy thing to explain. In part because I do not know what they are.

Yet when you are told what they are, you ignore them, because those values do not conform to what you desire.
Quote
So for example in the UK up to the early to mid part of the twentieth century women of any repute usually did not go into pubs they used to sit outside on a bench and wait for their man to come out. It was seen as in decent for them to go inside. Now does this traditional value apply in Ukraine today? Not as far as I have seen. So you see its knowing which traditional values apply and how they apply. Some may be applied differently while some traditional values might be entirely traditional to Ukraine/FSU or at least never a western traditional value.


Well, you would be mistaken about what you've seen.

Even in the early 1990's, there was a perception in Ukraine that if you were a single woman, you did not go to a bar, even a restaurant alone.  If you did, you were a slut. 

Last summer, our son was in Kyiv for a few days at the end of the summer, visiting family.  He stopped in a bar for a beer.  He overheard a conversation where a man told a woman who was alone in the bar that she was a slut, that women were home with their children, not in bars.  I had assumed such attitudes had changed, but they really haven't, overall.  Going to clubs in groups is fine, bars, not so much.

Quote
So if I knew what they were, some I do it would be easier to play by them. The other issue is the girl if she wants to live in the west - society is no longer traditional or at least very few places are traditional in their values. As said before a salary in the West unless specifically high only is set up to pay for one person plus a child or two, or a bit of entertainment. I could support a FSW as well so long as she was not hammering the credit card constantly. Is there an alternative way to have it set up I don't know, what would you suggest?

I honestly suggest you give up this idea.  You do not have a mentality that will mesh, long term, with an Eastern European, nor do you seem to have the flexibility to deal with the cultural differences.  I'm not saying this to be mean, or dismissive, or to discourage you, it is just an honest assessment of what I think your long term success rate will be, unless you are an absolutely different person IRL.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2018, 05:12:03 PM by Boethius »
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Offline Sting23

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1118 on: April 26, 2018, 05:17:05 PM »
People don't almost die Sting they are either dead or they are not dead. The lift accident was not really all that serious no one lost a limb or anything. Unless you personally are connected to any of those people you are getting overly concerned over people you don't know.

Dude you are an idiot...people can almost die and recover.  Not that serious, did you watch the footage?  The chair lift went in reverse at double speed and people flew out. if it wasn't snow and was concrete for sure they would have broken an arm or something.

You don't need to be connected to people to have concern for them.  Shows your general lack of empathy and probably why you don't succeed with women.

Not once have I heard you try to woo or romance a girl.  You literally don't know how to. 

Online Trenchcoat

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1119 on: April 26, 2018, 05:17:36 PM »
I will also add, you must have a certain flexibility when married to someone from a different culture.  There are going to be misunderstandings, and differences in some ways you approach things, particularly when it comes to raising children.  I encountered these things, and I know the culture, speak the language, understand most of the cultural cues, and am married to a man who is, for the most part, flexible in terms of culture.

If you cannot even compromise on this issue. let alone understand it (which you don't), which is a very small thing, there is no way you will navigate, successfully, a marriage to a woman from that culture.

I understand the issue now and thank you for that in helping me to understand. It's not easy to see at first when first faced with the problem. If a girl turns around to you and says after two weeks of dating that you cannot come to visit where she lives most western guys would be stumped I think and not have a clue why - I don't mean visit where she actually lives as in go inside just visit the city & stay in a separate place singly. Most WM would fathom that doing such would result in their girl being labelled a whore and being talked about. Most WM would expect to visit girl on her city as most would be oblivious to all these concerns. The girl I was with never have any explanation why I couldn't go she just kept repeating she visits me first then I visit her. Whether this would have worked out like that who knows. Does she then consider the prospect of me being with her ok once she had checked my out fully and believes there to be less chance of me being a dodgy guy that would just ruin her reputation? I can see she might not want to go through a few men turning up that might later fall through as in the example that you gave. Thing is I kind of feel that the girl didn't really think about how I would view her telling me I can't visit but she visits me. I am after all the guy who is footing the bill for what happens and when and generally I'm used to going where I please, lol. It must be said that there was never any willingness to compromise on her side I just felt like she thought I just back down all the time and everything is done her way or not at all.

Offline Sting23

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1120 on: April 26, 2018, 05:19:45 PM »
you don't understand nuthin'

Online msmob

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1121 on: April 26, 2018, 05:30:59 PM »
in all cases it was just a light hearted joke.

The Kitten 'joke' convinced me that you are a victim of  antisocial personality disorder.. 

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1122 on: April 26, 2018, 05:48:22 PM »
Yet when you are told what they are, you ignore them, because those values do not conform to what you desire.

Well, you would be mistaken about what you've seen.

Even in the early 1990's, there was a perception in Ukraine that if you were a single woman, you did not go to a bar, even a restaurant alone.  If you did, you were a slut. 

Last summer, our son was in Kyiv for a few days at the end of the summer, visiting family.  He stopped in a bar for a beer.  He overheard a conversation where a man told a woman who was alone in the bar that she was a slut, that women were home with their children, not in bars.  I had assumed such attitudes had changed, but they really haven't, overall.  Going to clubs in groups is fine, bars, not so much.

I honestly suggest you give up this idea.  You do not have a mentality that will mesh, long term, with an Eastern European, nor do you seem to have the flexibility to deal with the cultural differences.  I'm not saying this to be mean, or dismissive, or to discourage you, it is just an honest assessment of what I think your long term success rate will be, unless you are an absolutely different person IRL.

Still it is a little different to the example I gave, if a girl went into a bar in Kiev to meet her man sat inside from what I've seen nothing would likely be said of that.

IRL I am normally quite easy going but I am not willing to be played for a fool or a mug. If a girl comes out with stuff like the girl I was with did about not wanting to see me in her home town most guys who didnt know would be thinking something is dodgy here - that she is playing a game and not serious and/or playing the guy for a fool for what she can get. I'm pretty sure I would not be out of the ordinary of most WM that would think that.

Knowing more about this sort of stuff helps. I just about managed to sort out the cultural difference thing with the sauna but there is a point where you worry you are just not wishing to see what is going on and fooling yourself. Some of these cultural differences like the sauna one are preedy weird cultural differences - it's alright to cross this never to cross red line if... sort of thing.

I generally just went out there to find a girl, I had no idea cultural differences would stretch that far  I thought that all in the past like when Japanese people used to have a certain procedural etiquette to go through before they would deem you suitable to do business with. To me you just go out there meet said girl and if your into each other you both have an interest in getting it on wherever and whenever - what could be so wrong with that.

I am not put off this whole venture, I will just have to be a bit more nimble on how I do things.

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1123 on: April 26, 2018, 06:07:36 PM »
The Kitten 'joke' convinced me that you are a victim of  antisocial personality disorder..

If you were less condersending towards me on the first Mobe then I would not have made the joke.

Offline Sting23

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Re: Trench's Questions and Philosophies
« Reply #1124 on: April 26, 2018, 06:23:38 PM »
Trench it's pretty obvious that you haven't lived outside of the UK.  You don't know much about different cultures or how to interact with people. 

You were already played like a fool, you bought stuff for the girl and never heard from her again. 

So, you booked your flight yet?  Almost May now. 

 

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