How to handle this one?

[JayH]

Depending on the legal hoops you have to go through.  I thought that various people had posted over the years that foreigners were not allowed to own property in Ukraine, or that there are very severe restrictions?  Isn't that why Wayne's beautiful house in Crimea is in his wife's name (assuming that it hasn't been repossessed by Russian authorities)?

While it may be a great idea, not all of us have Ukrainian wives in whose name the property could be bought if necessary. 

On Wayne situation --mmm -- some things do not stack up --mmm

There is nothing preventing 'foreign" ownership of property. There are some restrictions of farming properties -- but that is not as difficult as it was 3 years ago.

"Can foreigner purchase apartments in Ukraine?
Ukraine law does not distinguish between property rights or right of ownership in regards to non Ukrainian citizens versus Ukrainian citizens.  Foreigners purchase real estate using the same process. However, non Ukrainian citizens are at the moment not allowed to purchase land."

"Can a foreign corporation purchase real estate in Ukraine?
Both foreign individuals and foreign corporation can purchase real estate in Ukraine. However, the process is considerably more complex if a foreign corporation is making the purchase and more documents are required than for a purchase done for an individual. It can also be somewhat complex to register a corporation with city utility services, however, " it is possible

There is a thread on forum on investing in property & property prices  in Ukraine.
Is this a good time? I think as Ukraine finds stability and direction property prices will rise. I would buy in Kyiv on that basis -- and by way of comparison -not in Moscow real estate.!!

[southernX]

Are you trolling?


If you are serious, which would leave me a little shocked, I would say, change your attitude.  With this attitude, you will never have a long term successful relationship.

best answer !!

SX

[Trenchcoat]

Elena was primarily talking about new apartments which are better than most old Soviet apartments. The brand new unfinished apartment I bought for 19k in Ivano Frankivsk is in an elite building and the apartment is superior to the old apartment my MIL lives in.


Ukraine is being destabilized by Russia. Ukrainians have little money to spend. Consumer confidence is low. Overbuilding apartments happened and not enough buyers causing developers to sell at a cost to break even. Western currency is strong in Ukraine. There may never be a better time to buy an apartment in our lifetime than now.

Thank you, this is what I was trying to get across to this forum before but I got all the bs that they are really quite wealthy out there, like us, lol.

Buying an apartment is probably a good move at the moment I agree, though I would favour as near to the city centre of either Kiev or Odessa as I think they would become particularly wealthy  in the future. An apartment near girls family in a nice area makes sense also for more family reasons I think.

[Anotherkiwi]

...Foreigners purchase real estate using the same process. However, non Ukrainian citizens are at the moment not allowed to purchase land."

That's probably what I was incompletely remembering.

[Anotherkiwi]

Thank you, this is what I was trying to get across to this forum before but I got all the bs that they are really quite wealthy out there, like us, lol.

You really do have problems with reading comprehension, don't you?  Nobody, but NOBODY, has ever suggested this.  You persist in reading between the lines of every single post when, in most cases there is no space there to fit anything at all!  It's the same way that you think everybody in Ukraine is out to scam you of your hard-earned cash.

Buying an apartment is probably a good move at the moment I agree, though I would favour as near to the city centre of either Kiev or Odessa as I think they would become particularly wealthy in the future. An apartment near girls family in a nice area makes sense also for more family reasons I think.

Sounds nice in theory, doesn't it?  But look at the reality.  Supposedly, only about 5% of those men who start looking for an FSUW actually get their feet on the ground there (so, congratulations - you're one of the few).  Of those 5%, 99.9% (or more) never get any further than maybe getting their end away once or twice and thinking they're in love.  So - why on earth would someone bother buying property in a place they're never going to visit more than once in their life, especially with all the red tape involved, and where all transactions are in a language they don't speak?

[Boethius]

Thank you, this is what I was trying to get across to this forum before but I got all the bs that they are really quite wealthy out there, like us, lol.

Buying an apartment is probably a good move at the moment I agree, though I would favour as near to the city centre of either Kiev or Odessa as I think they would become particularly wealthy  in the future. An apartment near girls family in a nice area makes sense also for more family reasons I think.

People have been saying Ukrainian real estate is a good investment for 26 years. It wasn't and still is not.

[Jumper]

I see the old Russia vs ukraine comparison has come up again also.

There is no significant difference  (perhaps besides Moscow )
In women culturally, ethically etc in general.

The difference would be very individual, as well as any consideratoms to relocate.
That includes Belarus.

So a guy should base his search on finding the right woman,and his approach to do so,  not on some idealogy that scam is more or less common.
Ultimately you will marry and individual, not a city, a region, or a country.
A mans odds of being scammed are mostly related to the man.So much so that the rest isn't very relevant.

[msmob]

Hi Jumper

I sl. disagree in that 25 plus years have passed since the breakup of the USSR and 1  generation has grown up in a new national - rather that 'we are a union' outlook

The big city dwellers of Piter and Kyiv ( as well as Moscow and Odesa ) see far more western guys and there was a time when being a westerner in a FSU bar meant that you were a 'target' - a very interesting prospect... not so much, now.

In the above places, you aren't 'novel' and esp. in Russia - there's been plenty of TV coverage of the issues with problems in marriages with ( esp. Americans)  - violent husbands and a downturn in economic fortunes / outlook for future...


A lot of the naivety / aspirations of a better life / more reliable man have gone and many more ladies are likely to seek a European - rather than N.American partner - for no good reason - other than a perception - founded all too often in ignorance.

Yes, these perceptions vary - and really we should search far and wide.  Not by location, but Ukraine has a greater proportion of visits from western guys and this is reflected in set-ups more geared to part $/£/€, etc., from the visa-free traveller

Personally, I'd suggest a novice check out Belarus ( 5 days visa free) before it gets 'ruined' and Russian visas are still quite easy to get - if you can pass the financials criteria






 

[Anotherkiwi]

...Ukraine has a greater proportion of visits from western guys and this is reflected in set-ups more geared to part $/£/€, etc., from the visa-free traveller

Don't forget, Moby, that Ukraine is NOT visa-free for all Western guys.

[JayH]

Don't forget, Moby, that Ukraine is NOT visa-free for all Western guys.

It is not actually "visa free"   -- a visa is issued on arrival to many and recipients need to comply with the terms of the issued visa.
It is at no cost to many-- so "free " in that sense.
Some countries eg New Zealanders ,Australians  and more --need to apply( & pay) some time in advance for a visa that is like getting teeth extracted in the process !

[southernX]

ukraine has just increased its visa fees for australians ...

http://australia.mfa.gov.ua/en/consular-affairs/services/Visa+to+Ukraine

other than a visa on arrival at specific places visa applications for australians are costly and time consuming to say the least .

you also then have the possibility that someone in customs/passports will accidently cancel your multi entry visa on an exit , even when you have months and other entries still left ot use within the time period ..  happend to me recently , not fun at all

SX

[ML]

It is not actually "visa free"   . . .

It is for USA folks visiting Ukraine.
That's because we are the best.

[Jumper]

Moby, I do agree with the changes you mentioned, and that can decrease interest in relocation and a westerner, but the reality was for me ,boots on the ground -
No significant difference whether 1.5 million would be interested in the such a possibilty or prospect, or 700,000.
Still so many single women interested in the possibility, that it wasn't the slightest factor.
Scams have always been present, heck the bug scam Capitol used to brcyoska ola.
So things change,but stay the same.


A  family oriented guy ,without issues, with the means,and foolishness to bother with this venture, won't have huge difficultis in having plenty if interested parties.
Sure finding that one perfect match is always a challenge,  but available candidates are not.
I raced in Ukraine in 98 or 99, 
It was one of the first big FIM races
there ,and was not in kyiv, so I know the novelty of being a foreigner then.
That has changed somewhat, but for women interested in meeting a foriegn guy, its still a very small percent of young beautiful lasses getting the bulk of attention.
Your typical UW,who might have interest, still is quite unlikely to have met some foreign romantic interest, regardless it by European or wherever.

I know several  of my wife's friends,that  have  never met a guy yet in a few years of being on singles sites,agency sites , etc.
One has, from an agency, but he is a tad wacky Italian and she's unlikely to marry him. She's also a banner ad babe,so you'd think her dating card would be full.
Plenty of interest locally and internationally, but reality is men don't travel there for such in near the numbers they used to.

Yes in the larger cities business travelers are certainly far more common than in the past,  but that isn't really some huge factor in the current crop of guys looking search.

[msmob]

Don't forget, Moby, that Ukraine is NOT visa-free for all Western guys.

My apologies to our antipodean friends .. and Jay - needing to get a piece of paper at the airport is not technically 'visa-free' ..

[Anotherkiwi]

It is not actually "visa free"   -- a visa is issued on arrival to many and recipients need to comply with the terms of the issued visa.
It is at no cost to many-- so "free " in that sense.
Some countries eg New Zealanders ,Australians  and more --need to apply( & pay) some time in advance for a visa that is like getting teeth extracted in the process !

My apologies to our antipodean friends .. and Jay - needing to get a piece of paper at the airport is not technically 'visa-free' ..

Things must have changed since I visited in 2010.  I've just looked at my British passport, and it simply has two stamps - entry and exit.  No additional piece of paper, or visa form attached to the passport.  Had I used my New Zealand passport to enter Ukraine I would have had to undergo a far more painful process than that described by southernX, because there is no Ukrainian embassy or consulate in New Zealand.  There is an honorary consul, who was (and may still be) based in the Bay of Islands of all places, who cannot issue visas.

New Zealanders have to use a special travel courier to get their passports to Australia, so that the embassy in Canberra can issue the visa.  The whole process normally takes several weeks, and costs hundreds of dollars, with no guarantee that you will get your passport back in time for your flight.  The Russian Embassy in Wellington, on the other hand, has been a model of efficiency in all my dealings with them, even if the return of my passport has been with only a few days to spare before departure.  That, however, can be put down to the rule that says you can't (or couldn't then) request a visa more than 30 days before your date of entry to Russia.  They quoted two weeks' processing time for the visa, and I had my passport and visa back on the twelfth day after dispatch - both times.

However, the best by far was the Indian Embassy.  I couriered my passport and supporting documents to them from my office, leaving at lunchtime on the Monday - by 9 am Wednesday I had my passport back in my hand, complete with Indian visa.  Now THAT'S service! 

[Trenchcoat]

I see the old Russia vs ukraine comparison has come up again also.

There is no significant difference  (perhaps besides Moscow )
In women culturally, ethically etc in general.

The difference would be very individual, as well as any consideratoms to relocate.
That includes Belarus.

So a guy should base his search on finding the right woman,and his approach to do so,  not on some idealogy that scam is more or less common.
Ultimately you will marry and individual, not a city, a region, or a country.
A mans odds of being scammed are mostly related to the man.So much so that the rest isn't very relevant.

This is something I have been wondering also. I know more about Ukrainian girls since I have dated more there. Russian girls only in messaging but since I am looking to date more in Russia next I am curious. I've been to Moscow once but that was strictly tourism, the girls seemed slightly different to Ukrainian girls, slightly more serious outlook, attractive & slim though perhaps not as quite as attractive/tarty as many Ukrainian girls. I got the impression overall less likely to mess guys around but perhaps also more upfront in showing/telling a guy whether interested or not. These may be generalizations and I don't think there are huge differences in it but given the geographical distance there are probably likely to be a few differences. I get the impression Russia is more a serious market and less scamming as the culture for it is less well developed than in Ukraine. No doubt you can still get scammed and like you say Jumper its a lot dependent on the guy. To me Ukraine I think has ended up a bit of a theme park for international dating, sure some guys find a girl serious about getting together but all the westerners going there because of free visa's or similar means its all become a bit of a fun experience to be had than a serious venue for finding a partner.

Would be interested to hear what others think that have dated in Russia on whether they found much difference? 

[Trenchcoat]

ukraine has just increased its visa fees for australians ...

http://australia.mfa.gov.ua/en/consular-affairs/services/Visa+to+Ukraine

Good

[msmob]

Good

There's that Trench 'sense of humour' at work ....

Your observations about 'differences' between 'tarty Ukrainian' and serious 'Moscowvite lasses' are as accurate as the data you obtained when 'dating ' ..... WORTHLESS and INACCURATE ..

Remember you told us you were finished with FSU lasses ....    Need we warn Russia ?

[Boethius]

Moscow is different because there is more money concentrated there.  There are many women there with careers and cash that would rival or surpass that of potential Western suitors. 


Trench, Jumper is correct.  It doesn't matter where you go.  You assume you were manipulated, but I would hazard a guess if Kherson girl were posting here, she would brand you a non serious man, a sex tourist.

[Trenchcoat]

There's that Trench 'sense of humour' at work ....

Your observations about 'differences' between 'tarty Ukrainian' and serious 'Moscowvite lasses' are as accurate as the data you obtained when 'dating ' ..... WORTHLESS and INACCURATE ..

Remember you told us you were finished with FSU lasses ....    Need we warn Russia ?

Lol, you may need to Mobers, get President Putin to pass a decree that all young women have to wear short skirts & dresses

[Trenchcoat]

Moscow is different because there is more money concentrated there.  There are many women there with careers and cash that would rival or surpass that of potential Western suitors. 


Trench, Jumper is correct.  It doesn't matter where you go.  You assume you were manipulated, but I would hazard a guess if Kherson girl were posting here, she would brand you a non serious man, a sex tourist.

Well I was partly correct on this one then

Kherson girl told me she wanted marriage and children, I've recently seen her VK and it looks like she's just into more clothing, ironically dresses, lol - she looks rather nice. I would try to work with that but the impasse over she comes see me or we don't visit again just strikes me as being too risky, that she is too materialistic and if I brought her to UK/married her I would end up losing out possibly big time. I can't afford to see my estate cut in half just for a day out getting married, I need to feel confident girl isn't going to take me for a ride.

With the short skits & dresses, of course I would be willing to give a bit, or at least put up with it if she chose to wear something else. It is more of an ideal than anything else, something that is unlikely to be realized in full. Its just something I see as potentially increasing compatibility and reciprocal attraction. 

[Boethius]

Most women want to dress well and look good.  Most women also want a children and a family. 


There are no guarantees in life.  If you are that worried about your estate, a FSUW is not for you.

[Nightwish]

Trench

I must ask, why don't you just come to grips with that this is not for you?
The problem has never been, and will never be, the Ukrainian or Russian women, or the Slavic culture, their behaviour, or way of living,.
Everything that is a problem, is you.

You want a submissive dressed up sexdoll that will go out and find a job upon arrival and pay her own way.
She wont be allowed to ever go out, because then someone else can snatch her up.
She wont be able to buy her own clothes, because god forbid she will buy something expensive or a brandname, no better she dresses in the cheap rags you find at a secondhand domatrix market and be happy about it.
or.. she can, if she brings home enough money so she can care for herself with all her purchases.

This is what you described, so don't tell me I am wrong here..
You really have no clue about anything and you refuse to listen and take it in.. let me guess, about 700 years of combined experience here that all told you, you are looking for the wrong thing, in the wrong place and with the wrong mindset.

Does it never strikes you that there must be a reason almost all people here disagree with you in just about everything you write?

[BillyB]

I can't afford to see my estate cut in half just for a day out getting married, I need to feel confident girl isn't going to take me for a ride.

If the rewards of being married doesn't outweigh the risks, you can do what a lot of men do and that is stay single. Be a playboy and if you can't catch women to be a playboy, some women will allow you can rent them by the hour to take care of your needs.

[Mappy]

Nightwish is harsh but he has a point.  Seriously, Trench, apart from traducing my country by association with your ridiculous comments, what are you trying to achieve here?  Surely Thailand would be a better place for your search?

Edit/ indeed, on reflection, that is possibly an insult to Thailand. In any event, I don't get the impression that the incredibly strong Russian woman (go learn some history) is truly what you are seeking?