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Author Topic: Russian convicted of spying for the Brits poisoned (?) in the UK West Country ?  (Read 13643 times)

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Online msmob

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43295134

Critically ill man 'former Russian spy'


"A man who is critically ill after being exposed to an unknown substance in Wiltshire is a Russian national convicted of spying for Britain, the BBC understands.

Sergei Skripal, who is 66, was granted refuge in the UK following a "spy swap" between the US and Russia in 2010.

Police declared a major incident on Sunday after a man and a woman were reported ill at a shopping centre in Salisbury.

The substance has not been identified.

Police are investigating whether a crime has been committed, following the incident which began at 16:15 GMT on Sunday at the Maltings shopping centre in central Salisbury.

Skripal, who is a retired Russian military intelligence colonel, was jailed for 13 years in 2006 for spying for Britain."

Offline ML

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Yakov Smirnoff, the comedian used to say (way back when) that in USA you can always find a party; while in USSR the party always finds you.

Things have not changed that much.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Online msmob

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Yakov Smirnoff, the comedian used to say (way back when) that in USA you can always find a party; while in USSR the party always finds you.

Things have not changed that much.

The anti-terrorist unit is NOT involved ..

After Litvenenko - you'd think they would be - if they suspected a foreign power's involvement

Online msmob

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Now the anti-terrorist unit are involved and the UK govt are calling this a serious incident.

I would seem that the previous UK govt policy of down-playing away-games by Russians in the UK is finished.

The Kremlin say they know nothing of the incident

Online BillyB

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Russians naturally have a higher chance of accidently choking themselves on a rope, catching bullets with their chest, ingesting radioactive poisons, and falling out of windows. Why would anybody expect foul play?

Online tfcrew

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His daughter was also attacked and a first responder police also became sick.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-43326734

Online msmob

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Yes, she is Russian resident and was visiting

The Policeman is now sitting up in bed - but it seems that the nerve agent has effected his motor functions - he MAY recover  - only time will tell

Papa and daughter are still critical

It's the next county to me

Online BillyB

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Moby, Russia has a habit of importing chemical weapons and radioactive poisons in your country to assassinate people. What's the UK going to do about it?

Online msmob

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Moby, Russia has a habit of importing chemical weapons and radioactive poisons in your country to assassinate people. What's the UK going to do about it?

1/ First it has to find the evidence it WAS state sponsored

2/ Russia has no extradition treaty with the UK

3/ It is part of the EU - and can't really do anything - unless all other nations agree  re Sanctions - as Russia would care if 'we' did increase sanctions

4/ May be seize dubious sourced funds in the UK ?


Just like Litvenenko - nothing, really - unless 'We' send in 007 and reciprocate ?


Online msmob

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 Pervy Kanal New anchor 'warning' ..

 'rare that traitors live to old age'

http://www.independent.co.uk/video/News/sergei-skripal-russian-state-tv-anchor-kirill-kleimenov-rare-traitors-live-old-age-a8246666.html

..and Sergey Lavror says we're being 'hysterical' ? ;) ...



Online tfcrew

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Quote
At least 19 others in the area also suffered some exposure. Luke Harding is a reporter for The Guardian in London and the author of a book on another ex-Russian spy poisoned on British soil, Alexander Litvinenko. Harding says this attack was meant to send a message.

http://www.npr.org/2018/03/08/592046380/speculation-continues-in-britain-after-ex-russian-spy-was-poisoned-by-nerve-agen

Online BillyB

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Russia says this incident is part of an anti Russian campaign the West and media is on. UK needs to figure out how to stop WMDs from being smuggled into their country. I'm sure terrorists in Syria are paying attention to this incident.

Online msmob

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Well, there's Billyb's and Russia's 'theory's' and the UK govt. says..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43377856

Russian spy: Highly likely Moscow behind attack, says Theresa May

((


Online BillyB

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Well, there's Billyb's and Russia's 'theory's' and the UK govt. says..


Your government has a theory and suspects Russia did it. I never offered a theory. I said Russia did it.

Online msmob

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Well, it's all kicked off in the UK - with the PM stating on the evidence so far - the poison used was a Russian designed nerve agent - 'Novichok' ( New kind ?)   

In combination with RU state-owned media suggesting the 'UK isn't a safe place for traitors' it does rather point to a hit that used the sort of stuff only states control.

The UK isn't well-known for Maskirovka ( deception ) - nor bumping off / taking out opposition....   Moscow does seem  to have a large number of unfortunate events befalling opposition folk abroad and even has legislation to allow retribution

On a personal front, I don't want RU - UK visas to be affected for normal folks 

Two sides of the coin:
UK.http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43381880


Russia: http://www.rt.com/news/421126-lavrov-response-uk-skripal/


I hardly think Mrs May is 'under pressure' to blame the Kremlin... if the boot was on the other foot - and ( say ) Philby had been killed by a UK brand of nerve agent....

IF Moscow had jumped in and offered help - instead of the state run media talking about traitors 'not growing old' - they'd look a LOT less 'guilty'

Online msmob

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Your government has a theory and suspects Russia did it. I never offered a theory. I said Russia did it.

..indeed you did.. before the UK govt... 


Online BillyB

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I hardly think Mrs May is 'under pressure' to blame the Kremlin...


Those in charge has a responsibility to make sure what happens doesn't happen again. They need to get it right and blame the right party. An ex spy getting assassinated in normal spy games isn't a big deal. A lot of innocent UK citizens got hurt by the chemical weapons Russia smuggled in the country. That is a big deal. If the UK ever gets into conflict with Russia in the future, they need to figure out how to stop the smuggling. Better solve the problems now than later.

Online Trenchcoat

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Yes, she is Russian resident and was visiting

The Policeman is now sitting up in bed - but it seems that the nerve agent has effected his motor functions - he MAY recover  - only time will tell

Papa and daughter are still critical

It's the next county to me

Well I certainly hope he regains full motor functions in all the crucial places :D

Salisbury is much nearer to me than Mobers so you can be rest assured I have been keeping the windows closed and only breathing in when absolutely necessary ;D

Generally Salisbury is a unexciting, uninspiring place full of old fuddy duddies so not the sort of place you would expect something like this to go down.

The daughter is apparently doing slightly better than the father but given the younger age that might be expected. Also he may have been the main target for the attack.

The deadline for the Russian reply has now passed. It looks like the Russian response was basically to ask to see evidence of their military grade nerve agent was involved. So the gov't may further discuss the situation with them on this basis or it may state it is seeking a more cohesive response from its allies.

I would be surprised if they moved immediately to any action. I think though in the days to weeks to come it will move to action if there is no other explanation that comes forward. 

Given the action taken last time over the Litvinenko scandal I think the UK will certainly be looking to take a more extensive course of action with Russia this time. Personally I think UK visa's for Russians will come under fire as the UK will want to limit Russian agent activity in the UK to reduce the risk of operations being carried out in the UK. Russia of course can be expected to retaliate with banning visa's for UK citizen for visiting Russia. If as it looks Putin is behind it then he is instigating a new cold war. I think the UK will be focused on defence & security against such further attacks so this action on visa's is probably quite likely.

This is not great for me as you know I was planning a search in Russia later this year. For guys like you Moby I think this will be somewhat worse as it will cut you off from SC. Meaning a meet up in a third country would be your only option, so you could well find yourself living back in Cyprus ;)

My only other thought is if the daughter was part of some spy ring involving this chemical and things went wrong and ended up accidentally poisoning themselves. We shall just have to see what unravels over the course of the next few days I'm thinking.   

Offline ML

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This is not great for me as you know I was planning a search in Russia later this year.

And some keep wondering why I say such an idea is ludicrous . . . not just for you.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Online DaveNY

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Has Putin ordered the assassination of another Russian dissident living in the UK? From the article:

Nikolai Glushkov, a Russian exile who had links to compatriots who died in mysterious circumstances in the UK, has been found dead in his London home, his lawyer confirmed.
London's Metropolitan police said counter terrorism officers would lead the investigation "as a precaution because of associations that the man is believed to have had."

If it's an assassination and even if it looks like suicide it's probably an assassination then is Putin sending a message that the UK is not safe for dissidents? What is the UK going to do? Other than cutting diplomatic relations with Russia and imposing more sanctions there's really not much the UK can do.

http://www.cnn.com/2018/03/13/europe/nikolai-glushkov-russia-intl/index.html

Online Trenchcoat

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Has Putin ordered the assassination of another Russian dissident living in the UK? From the article:

Nikolai Glushkov, a Russian exile who had links to compatriots who died in mysterious circumstances in the UK, has been found dead in his London home, his lawyer confirmed.
London's Metropolitan police said counter terrorism officers would lead the investigation "as a precaution because of associations that the man is believed to have had."

If it's an assassination and even if it looks like suicide it's probably an assassination then is Putin sending a message that the UK is not safe for dissidents? What is the UK going to do? Other than cutting diplomatic relations with Russia and imposing more sanctions there's really not much the UK can do.

http://www.cnn.com/2018/03/13/europe/nikolai-glushkov-russia-intl/index.html

A possible assassination, maybe they are moving on their targets quickly now the UK has got wind of their activities. Generally though it looks like Russia may have been at it quietly knocking off many targets, gar more than at first thought. If there has been a systematic campaign of knocking off a lot of families of former turned spies then I cannot see the UK doing anything other than placing severe restrictions on Russians travelling to the UK, if they let them in at all. It will be the only way to retrict the attacks. Beyond that and trade sanctions I can't see much else happening. End of the day they won't be able to collapse Russia just view them as not worth having relationships with.

Online msmob

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And some keep wondering why I say such an idea is ludicrous . . . not just for you.

ML: Our partners do not run the Kremlin, may not have voted for the leadership and cannot change anything - even if the wanted to


More people in the US voted for Clinton than 'Trampu' - should 'we' all 'stay away' from the US - if we disagree with the policies of their leadership ?




Online Trenchcoat

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Well Visa's for the moment are still on, whether this will last long term we'll just have to see. I think you still have a point ML that Russia is a little more precarious on the foreign relations front as the old East/West divide still persists and could cause immense problems for those pursuing or involved with a Russian girl at any time.

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Yesterday, it seems, there was a threat to discontinue RT in GB.  Russia quickly responded that they would remove all UK correspondents and reporters from Russia.  Then, in a blatant effort to intimidate GB, the spokesperson said that it is not wise to threaten a 'nuclear power'.  Strong arm tactics.  Seems to be the new Russia.
Kissing girls is a goodness.  It beats the hell out of card games.  - Robert Heinlein

Online BillyB

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If it's an assassination and even if it looks like suicide it's probably an assassination then is Putin sending a message that the UK is not safe for dissidents?


I doubt Russians who move to the UK for a more secure life is looking to commit suicide.

- should 'we' all 'stay away' from the US - if we disagree with the policies of their leadership ?


If Trump starts assassinating Americans with chemical weapons living in the UK that he doesn't like, then yes, stay away from America if we get to that point.

 

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