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Author Topic: EU Issues  (Read 20562 times)

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Online BillyB

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« Reply #175 on: July 18, 2018, 11:38:02 AM »
In the United States, there are few immigrants who present themselves for asylum and millions of illegal immigrants who sneak through the border knowing that they have no chance for asylum.


That is true. One can claim policies between nations pertaining to asylum aren't much different from each other but there is a clear difference on how easy or hard it is to claim asylum between nations. Syrian and other immigrants aren't stupid. They know one of their best chances to be approved for asylum in Europe is in Sweden.

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« Reply #176 on: July 18, 2018, 03:50:56 PM »
I don't think there was a pull factor, or more accurately, an unruly pull factor, until Angela Merkel stated Germany would welcome all refugees.

My post stated that Sweden didn't send government officials to the asylum seekers' countries.  I think it's a very different thing if they hand out information.
No you didn't?  This is your original post I replied to:
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=22788.msg486479#msg486479
Quote
But that was after they’d let in 160,000 migrants. It changed because they can’t even house them all, let alone integrate them. Sweden didn’t encourage the migrants to arrive.
Bad memory?
Quote
But is it a refugee haven if they are deported?  The Eritrean who murdered two Swedes did so because his refugee claim had been denied.  The process is flawed because of the failure to deport failed claimants on a timely basis, but what do they gain if they aren't working, and owe thousands of dollars to people smugglers?

I'm not lecturing you.
I disagree, but that is a non important fact.

We have more then 80 000 illegal immigrants here (that we know of) people that have been declined asylum and gone underground, we can't deport them because our Government has tied the police's hands behind their back.
Latest fun article is a Afghan who cried so much on the plane they had to take him off the plane again.  :clapping:
http://nyheteridag.se/35-arig-afghan-grat-hejdlost-pa-planet-till-kabul-slapp-utvisning/

Quote
Your point, as I understand it, is that Sweden encouraged refugees to flood the country.  My assertion is, they didn't do that.  Merkel did.  Sweden was caught in the after effect of the flood caused by Merkel's invitation.  If you are correct, then please show me where Sweden sent government officials, or even NGO's with government funding, to Syria, or Iraq, or Afghanistan, or even to countries from where asylum seekers are rarely accepted, such as Eritrea, Nigeria, Somalia, etc, with information on claiming refugee status.
 
Sweden was the FIRST country to tell all Syrians, just come come here and receive Permanent residence on arrival!  NO temporary and almost no background checks was done.
It was announced everywhere on the old embassy pages, those have since our government viewpoint changed somewhat, been revised and that information has been removed.

Here you have another article about our coastguard in the Mediterranean (Coastguard is as you might know, supplied by the government)  doing the NGO boats work.
http://www.kustbevakningen.se/frontex/operation-triton3/nyheter-operation-triton/kustbevakningen-forstarker-sin-narvaro-i-medelhavet/

In all other I refer to the article I linked and the information so Billy easily found.
I can't right now find the articles about our officials from State department that was sent to hand out information about Sweden on the shores of Italy, Turkey and Greece, there have been too much buzz in the news since then, don't really know what to search for to get a match.
But in in counter-effect to that, the Swedish democrats sent people to tell refugees NOT to come to Sweden
http://omni.se/sd-delar-ut-flygblad-pa-ett-20-tal-hemliga-platser/a/0b72160f-2459-40e1-8f93-03ac88bae9ed

Merkel might have done some shitty things to, but I don't follow German politics so I can't say. I just know the articles in the press when they announced as the first country we were prepared to accept all coming from Syria and give them permanent residence.

and once again - We had no officials IN those countries to my knowledge, never claimed that, that was never needed, the information reached the "refugees" anyway.

Quote

I'm not arguing that northern countries are not the desired destinations for asylum seekers, they are, because of the generous benefits and tolerance they provide.  That is a separate issue, and that in and of itself likely is a draw. But Sweden did not create the crisis.
Sweden was a big part of creating this crisis, why else did the thousands of refugees stand on the border of Romania, Hungary and Balkan states chanting - "Sweden Sweden, let us go, we want to go to Sweden"
(as I am sure also happened with Germany as preferred choice)

again, I refer to what many experts here have talked about for 2-3 years, we had an enormous pull-factor on these people to seek out Sweden as their new heaven with all the promises about benefits and everything being "free".  Key word here - Pull factor.
Multitasking means screwing up several things at once.

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« Reply #177 on: July 18, 2018, 11:34:53 PM »
I notice Mobers has gone like Zippy of Rainbow on this thread, zip firmly drawn across mouth! lol :D

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« Reply #178 on: July 19, 2018, 01:37:33 AM »
You just ain't too attentive..

Holiday, sun, SC v correcting your bollox ....

Hardly a contest

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« Reply #179 on: July 19, 2018, 05:02:55 AM »
Mobe you know for Remain to push through their desire to impose a customs union on us they actually have to win a vote along the way somewhere. At the moment they have lost one vote after another. So despite what you've said in the past its looking like Brexit will be going through :)

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« Reply #180 on: July 19, 2018, 06:35:39 AM »
Mobe you know for Remain to push through their desire to impose a customs union on us they actually have to win a vote along the way somewhere. At the moment they have lost one vote after another. So despite what you've said in the past its looking like Brexit will be going through :)

This is v.hard for you, clearly


The UK has to NEGOTIATE with the EU and as I keep telling you the Irish border Q WILL arise...

« Last Edit: July 19, 2018, 01:45:12 PM by msmob »

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« Reply #181 on: July 19, 2018, 10:05:32 AM »
This is v.hard for you, clearly


The UK has to NEGOTIATE with the EU and as I keep twlling you the Irish borxer Q WILL arise...

Ah, still clinging to that one hey Mobers. I'm guessing with the new Brexit secretary an agreement will now be reached on that. The EU seem to fear a no deal scenario so I think they will accept the solution proposed by the UK. It's all happening now on that front so not long to wait and prove you wrong once again Mobers ;D

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« Reply #182 on: July 19, 2018, 01:46:43 PM »
Ah, still clinging to that one hey Mobers. I'm guessing with the new Brexit secretary an agreement will now be reached on that. The EU seem to fear a no deal scenario so I think they will accept the solution proposed by the UK. It's all happening now on that front so not long to wait and prove you wrong once again Mobers ;D

The EU don't need to fear a no deal solution as far as the UK is concerned ... they only care about Ireland ..

I am 'clinging' to that one as I KNOW it is the key

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« Reply #183 on: July 19, 2018, 04:15:34 PM »
The EU don't need to fear a no deal solution as far as the UK is concerned ... they only care about Ireland ..

I am 'clinging' to that one as I KNOW it is the key

Well the Gov reckon they can deal with goods etc crossing the border without needing to stop anyone/checkpoints by use of technology, agreements/schemes, and reconcilin the VAT due at a later date through an accounting system.

I'm guessing if they must be confident it will work to press on in this direction. Stuff like the London congestion charging scheme and the continuing immersion of technology on our everyday lives suggests they will be able to pull it off if decent effort, thought and testing of the system are gone into.

They've already satisfied the DUP as to no hard border so there is little left to be a problem unless of course the EU decide on no deal to try and force the UK back in the Union but that I think will backfire on them badly. Both the majority of the population & House of Commons are against such happening.

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« Reply #184 on: July 19, 2018, 08:55:55 PM »
Well the Gov reckon they can deal with goods etc crossing the border without needing to stop anyone/checkpoints by use of technology, agreements/schemes, and reconcilin the VAT due at a later date through an accounting system.

You mean Boris and co ? ))

I wonder if they'll reveal how many BILLIONS worse off we'd be - having to pay for all the kit, civil servants...  ?

ALL the fun and game within the Tory party are just that.... THe EU have again pointed out that the UK cannot pick and choose which parts of EU embership it wants to keep - if laving

Lastly, the DUP KNOW that the maj. of N.Ireland folk voted to REMAIN and will think of THEIR political future

You just aren't thinking - at all

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« Reply #185 on: July 19, 2018, 09:29:32 PM »
You mean Boris and co ? ))

I wonder if they'll reveal how many BILLIONS worse off we'd be - having to pay for all the kit, civil servants...  ?

ALL the fun and game within the Tory party are just that.... THe EU have again pointed out that the UK cannot pick and choose which parts of EU embership it wants to keep - if laving

Lastly, the DUP KNOW that the maj. of N.Ireland folk voted to REMAIN and will think of THEIR political future

You just aren't thinking - at all

It of course won't cost Billions don't be ridiculous, a computerised system can be set up and ran a lot cheaper than that, you are getting carried away.

The UK is not picking and choosing, it's a trade deal they are striking and agreements to continue to work on cetrain stuff together for mutual benefit. That and s deal on travel & visa access for both sides post Brexit.

I think we will have to wait and see whether the EU accept this or go all rigid & awkward. If they won't negotiate then we will he in new territory and it's whole thing will blow open again. I don't think that will be helpful to anyone. The EU look like they could now be open to sorting out the remaining areas outstanding. With a new Brexit secretary there is less of a block to this happening. I think by the end of Autumn we will know one way or the other. I hope you have that humble pie all ready for you to the a big bite Mobers ;D

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« Reply #186 on: July 19, 2018, 09:47:06 PM »
It of course won't cost Billions don't be ridiculous, a computerised system can be set up and ran a lot cheaper than that, you are getting carried away.

I see you selectively choose to ignore news you don't want to hear / don't understand about 'Brexit'

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/may/22/brexit-vote-cost-uk-mark-carney-bank-of-england

Brexit vote has cost each UK household £900, says Mark Carney

That's already BILLIONS .... 

You DO know that 'we' are taking on more civil servants to pay for this farce ?

The UK is not picking and choosing, it's a trade deal they are striking and agreements to continue to work on cetrain stuff together for mutual benefit. That and s deal on travel & visa access for both sides post Brexit.

It's not just a trade deal....  It's about migration control, complying to new standards in trade / non trade related matters ..


I think we will have to wait and see whether the EU accept this or go all rigid & awkward. If they won't negotiate then we will he in new territory and it's whole thing will blow open again. I don't think that will be helpful to anyone. The EU look like they could now be open to sorting out the remaining areas outstanding. With a new Brexit secretary there is less of a block to this happening. I think by the end of Autumn we will know one way or the other. I hope you have that humble pie all ready for you to the a big bite Mobers ;D

No matter who represents the UK, the FACT is that 'The UK cannot pick and choose which parts of EU membership it wishes to retain'  are the words of EU officials, other nations MEPs and leaders of other EU nations ...it is a constant that 'leavers' ignore at their peril

You clearly missed that when we leave the EU in March 2019 - that nothing is going to change - as v.little has been agreed  - We have a transition period until the end of 2020.

IF 'we' crash out without a deal ....  YOU will see how this daftness effects you in your pocket ..I'll be long gone ...exercising my right of freedom of movement as an Irish Passport holder

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« Reply #187 on: July 20, 2018, 06:29:40 AM »
Ah, no loyalty to the UK hey Mobe, the slightest little bit of trouble sends you packing with your Polish sweat shop labour ;D It's why we need people here who won't up and run at the slightest sign of trouble.

Well Mark Carney is a Remoaner and the biggest twit going. He couldn't even predict the way interest rates in the UK would move ever since he took office. He constantly predicts they will move one way only to subsequently be proved wrong each time by low inflation rates etc that completely stump him. He is just another Remoaner trying to frighten people back into the EU.

I definitely think we should see what's beyond rather than acting like a frightened child. It's the only way anyone grows, learns and develops. We could find ourselves being in a fortunate position on all of this. We could end up with a global trading Empire rather than being a backwater country constantly bring sucked dry of our wealth by the EU.

Remember Mobe, the EU is building up debt all the time through paying expensive pensions to it's top crowd. How long before it as an organisation ends up like Greece going past the point of no return and calling on members to sort our it's horrendous debt problem.

I think we are safer not putting all out eggs on one basket by trading with many not the few. I think we are safer not u der the heel of EU politicing. I don't care about 'seats at tables' the EU is one table we do not want a seat at. They are a knightmare to work with and we will happily not need a seat at a table of an organisation we are not part off. They can make all the rules they like then, we will not be subject to them. If they try and make a trade Ryle or other not in our favour we can just walk off, we will be independent and not tied to them. The power of being independent I think you will come to find Mobe is greater than a seat at a table with an organisation that knows you haven't got the walk away card to play.

The EU say we can't pick and choose, well they will soon have to decide what they are or not willing to agree to. They hold out that line to try to hold us to ransom to make it more difficult to leave. End of the day never let someone hold you to ransom, they do so because they are always the weaker party, walk away and grow stronger.

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« Reply #188 on: July 20, 2018, 10:45:10 PM »
Ah, no loyalty to the UK hey Mobe, the slightest little bit of trouble sends you packing with your Polish sweat shop labour ;D It's why we need people here who won't up and run at the slightest sign of trouble.

'Loyalty'?  Patriotism is a foolish notion ... Home is where the heart is as far as I'm concerned...   I will go where I can ensure colleagues can work and be allowed to travel freely - THAT doesn't look like being the UK and you'll find I'm not alone in voting with my feet

Well Mark Carney is a Remoaner and the biggest twit going. He couldn't even predict the way interest rates in the UK would move ever since he took office. He constantly predicts they will move one way only to subsequently be proved wrong each time by low inflation rates etc that completely stump him. He is just another Remoaner trying to frighten people back into the EU.


'Funny' that the govt doesn't replace him... and it is noted that you didn't 'bust' his point how much wrse we are off, already .....It was based on ...UK stats from UK govt agencies

We could find ourselves being in a fortunate position on all of this. We could end up with a global trading Empire rather than being a backwater country constantly bring sucked dry of our wealth by the EU.

Only economic incompetents could post such drivel - bearing in mind we have NO trade deals set up, yet and our biggest trading partner is .... fellow EU members ,,and being in the club - with a seat got us great deals with a powerful hand .....  Only deluded, chest-beating 'patriots' think being alone will mean 'better'

Remember Mobe, the EU is building up debt all the time through paying expensive pensions to it's top crowd. How long before it as an organisation ends up like Greece going past the point of no return and calling on members to sort our it's horrendous debt problem.

We don't know how much debt - as it doesn't publish accounts - which is bad .... so how do you know ...another Trench 'guess' ?  We've seen how accurate they are ;)

I think

NO..you don't ...

we are safer not putting all out eggs on one basket by trading with many not the few.

What utter twaddle... with whom doesn't the EU have trade deals, already ?


 
The EU say we can't pick and choose, well they will soon have to decide what they are or not willing to agree to. They hold out that line to try to hold us to ransom to make it more difficult to leave. End of the day never let someone hold you to ransom, they do so because they are always the weaker party, walk away and grow stronger.

Sorry, 'Trench' - but you can't play card games ...  'WE'..the UK are holding a shyte hand and the EU know it

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« Reply #189 on: July 21, 2018, 01:41:45 AM »
The EU say we can't pick and choose, well they will soon have to decide what they are or not willing to agree to. They hold out that line to try to hold us to ransom to make it more difficult to leave. End of the day never let someone hold you to ransom, they do so because they are always the weaker party, walk away and grow stronger.

What bs..  No one forced UK into EU, no one is forcing UK out or holding anyone ransom.  Reality is that UK brexiting or not is UK's choice or maybe better said choice of the ruling party in UK.  Even after whatever form of brexit occurs, UK will be welcomed back into EU, the door will be kept open regardless.

Want free trade after brexit?  work for it, pay for it with lots of time and money.  EU free trade just expanded to include Japan after 5 or so years of negotiations which is really record time to reach an agreement.. what.. 28 countries now have the benefits of free trade with Japan in one swoop?  Direct access to one third of the world's economy? Think UK will be able to do it in less time and spending (better said losing) quite a few quid in the meantime?

at risk with brexit?



http://ec.europa.eu/trade/policy/in-focus/eu-japan-economic-partnership-agreement/eu-japan-in-your-town/united-kingdom_en.htm

Bottom line, EU is not just going to give away freebies for brexit after doing all the legwork and paying for it.  The advantages are clear.. take for example EMA, UK is losing it's status as headquarters and moving out of London to Amsterdam..  result so far, Government is required to make continued UK participation in the EU medicines regulatory network partnership a negotiating objective in talks with the EU.  Tell me how losing HQ, a thousand jobs, then continuing to pay to play is a plus for UK with brexit...  then having to go down on knees and plead with EU to even allow such..

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/990972/Brexit-latest-news-european-medicines-agency-EMA-Theresa-May-parliament-votes

If you see dirt flying out of a deep hole, judge whomever is holding the shovel...  clearly it's UK holding the brexit shovel and not EU.

In the end, I think all of UK will one day realize the size of the hole that has been dug.  When the walls of sand start crumbling back in the hole and political parties inevitably change, the UK will have a new referendum and will rejoin freely. It'll all be chalked up as a very expensive lesson in humility.

« Last Edit: July 21, 2018, 01:50:51 AM by BC »

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« Reply #190 on: July 21, 2018, 03:38:59 AM »
+loads

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« Reply #191 on: July 22, 2018, 08:02:46 AM »
What bs..  No one forced UK into EU, no one is forcing UK out or holding anyone ransom.  Reality is that UK brexiting or not is UK's choice or maybe better said choice of the ruling party in UK.  Even after whatever form of brexit occurs, UK will be welcomed back into EU, the door will be kept open regardless.

Want free trade after brexit?  work for it, pay for it with lots of time and money.  EU free trade just expanded to include Japan after 5 or so years of negotiations which is really record time to reach an agreement.. what.. 28 countries now have the benefits of free trade with Japan in one swoop?  Direct access to one third of the world's economy? Think UK will be able to do it in less time and spending (better said losing) quite a few quid in the meantime?

at risk with brexit?



http://ec.europa.eu/trade/policy/in-focus/eu-japan-economic-partnership-agreement/eu-japan-in-your-town/united-kingdom_en.htm

Bottom line, EU is not just going to give away freebies for brexit after doing all the legwork and paying for it.  The advantages are clear.. take for example EMA, UK is losing it's status as headquarters and moving out of London to Amsterdam..  result so far, Government is required to make continued UK participation in the EU medicines regulatory network partnership a negotiating objective in talks with the EU.  Tell me how losing HQ, a thousand jobs, then continuing to pay to play is a plus for UK with brexit...  then having to go down on knees and plead with EU to even allow such..

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/990972/Brexit-latest-news-european-medicines-agency-EMA-Theresa-May-parliament-votes

If you see dirt flying out of a deep hole, judge whomever is holding the shovel...  clearly it's UK holding the brexit shovel and not EU.

In the end, I think all of UK will one day realize the size of the hole that has been dug.  When the walls of sand start crumbling back in the hole and political parties inevitably change, the UK will have a new referendum and will rejoin freely. It'll all be chalked up as a very expensive lesson in humility.

BC you have got your facts wrong. The UK originally voted to join the EEC in a referendum back in the 70s. The UK never voted to join the EU or accept the EEC change into the EU in any referendum. The UK only ever wanted to be part of a EEC it never wanted to be a part of the EU.

The EEC and EU are completely different, the EEC was just a free trade association for European countries, it did not extend into government, it did not extend into 'Freedom of Movement' etc.

The UK Trade Bill that has recently been passed in the House of Commons deals with putting/replicating all of the EU's free trade agreements with other countries such as Japan and Canada, etc and adopting them ourselves. So it won't take any time after all as we will continue with the same agreements as before.

I believe the EU's days are numbered, many countries and their citizens are getting fed up with it. It's also a cash hungry organisation and this will only get worser over time proving to its members that it's more of a burden az time goes on. I think eventually it will be replaced by something closer to the EEC or split into a two tier organisation western side of Europe in the tip tier, eastern side of Europe in the bottom.

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« Reply #192 on: July 22, 2018, 08:10:51 AM »
+loads

Well if you're at all bored Mobes this may wake you up.

Sitting in me pad this morning an electoral register letter popped through the door. Now of course I'm already down on the register as on the form. So it looks like it's the electoral roll check form they send out before local and General Elections! So looks like the government may be preparing for the eventuality to jettison the DUP and go for hard Brexit.

Looks like if the EU don't budge we will be having another General Election very soon Mobers. Date for return of form is 10th August so gives a good idea of when I think.

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« Reply #193 on: July 22, 2018, 10:12:50 AM »
Well if you're at all bored Mobes this may wake you up.

Sitting in me pad this morning an electoral register letter popped through the door.

...and ?

Are you SO unaware of the cycle for checking you're still at the same address ? 

It has NOTHING to do with any election

Another Trench DUH   

BC you have got your facts wrong.

NO ..he hasn't what you write below is your OPINION

The UK originally voted to join the EEC in a referendum back in the 70s. The UK never voted to join the EU or accept the EEC change into the EU in any referendum.


The UK only ever wanted to be part of a EEC it never wanted to be a part of the EU.

You don't speak for me



The UK Trade Bill that has recently been passed in the House of Commons deals with putting/replicating all of the EU's free trade agreements with other countries such as Japan and Canada, etc and adopting them ourselves. So it won't take any time after all as we will continue with the same agreements as before.

You utter moron ...  such deals much be accepted by Japan and Canada

I believe the EU's days are numbered


Based on your other theories we can be sure the EU will be around a while longer than us ;)

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« Reply #194 on: July 22, 2018, 11:37:15 AM »
Mobe, the only time they tend to check is before actual electoral events or perceived electoral possibly occurring. Even before General Elections are announced they try to send them out in anticipation of one to get it all sorted early. It's pointless for them to do it otherwise as they generally get informed of people moving in/out.

Look at the news it's all about the UK starting to make preparations in the event of no deal.

The rest is not my opinion - we had no referendum to join the EU/change from the EEC at its inception, that is a fact.

The UK Trade Bill speaks for itself whatever you think, that is what the Trade Bill says.

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« Reply #195 on: July 22, 2018, 07:17:13 PM »
Trench,

I DID tell you ..

An annual canvass is sent out to ensure the Electoral role is accurate :

EVERYONE gets such a letter EVERY year

It has NOTHING to do with 'chance' of a general election or even a second 'Brexit' vote to decide how we might leave and on what terms

Why don't you ring your local district council and they'll put you straight

Trench - I understood that there was o vote on the EEC becoming the EU ... I stated as to what happened after was only your opinion and bolded the text that was bollox.




Offline BC

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« Reply #196 on: July 22, 2018, 10:22:19 PM »
BC you have got your facts wrong.

There is absolutely nothing inconsistent with fact regarding my statement.

Quote
The UK originally voted to join the EEC in a referendum back in the 70s. The UK never voted to join the EU or accept the EEC change into the EU in any referendum. The UK only ever wanted to be part of a EEC it never wanted to be a part of the EU.

Then why did the UK ratify the Lisbon Treaty?  Was the UK not afforded several opt-outs to prior and current agreements?  Sounds like an internal problem and not EU holding UK hostage for something you did not agree to.  Instead of blaming EU for all your ails, you should look instead to your own institutions and government.  Therein lies the source of all your 'problems' so no need to point a finger elsewhere in frustration.


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« Reply #197 on: July 22, 2018, 10:34:47 PM »

BC or Sandro if you're reading, what do you think about more anti EU politicians in Italy being voted into power this year? Is Italy headed towards an Italexit?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/06/21/fresh-alarm-italy-apostles-italexit-take-control-parliament/

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« Reply #198 on: July 23, 2018, 01:18:47 AM »
There is absolutely nothing inconsistent with fact regarding my statement.

Then why did the UK ratify the Lisbon Treaty?  Was the UK not afforded several opt-outs to prior and current agreements?  Sounds like an internal problem and not EU holding UK hostage for something you did not agree to.  Instead of blaming EU for all your ails, you should look instead to your own institutions and government.  Therein lies the source of all your 'problems' so no need to point a finger elsewhere in frustration.

The British public never ratified the Lisbon Treaty, Tony Blair did. Unlike the Republic of Ireland the UK was denied a referendum on ratifying the Lisbon Treaty. If we did the British Public would have voted against it, Tony Blair knew that and so the entirely undemocratic step was taken to deny the British Public a vote on the matter. It's where the EU lost its charade of exposing democratic values as one of its jet principles as it too went along with Blair knowing they lacked the necessary support for it in the UK. It was the same politics as Robert Mugabe of circumventing democracy, if you can't win a vote you don't give a vote. I think the EU lost a lot of credibility in the UK because of that so long term turned more people against the EU.

Hell, the EU couldn't even win the referendum for the  Lisbon Treaty in the Republic of Ireland - it lost the vote then the undemocratic move was made to disregard and disrespect the will of the people by asking the Irish to vote again on the matter just weeks after the original vote. Utterly arrogant and belittling attitude from the EU and the Irish government. It's why an Irexit could be on the cards in the near future.

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« Reply #199 on: July 23, 2018, 08:55:35 AM »
Trench,

As stated, all internal issues.  Deal with it.

Sounds like you been drinking too much whine ;)

 

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