Down the drain...

[snowm]

I'm corresponding and telephoning for about 3 months with a girl from Dnepropetrovsk, she still quite young but i found her mature for her age...in fact this weekend i found out she really is too much.
She mentioned several times her dream to start a decoration shop, i said her at the time it was a good project but never took it seriously as it requires quite an investment both in the shop / materials / show room etc. and since her mother is not rich and the credit system in the Ukraine is prohibitive for small business i thought nothing of it.
Last weekend, we talked on the phone and she said she has got all set up to open the shop next month... that took me by surprise,

" A. where did you get the money for that?
" ho i found this man who wants to invest his money in this business "
" ...like a sponsor*? "
" ...yes...something like that, but don't worry i still want to meet you, it changes nothing, i just needed some help setting up the shop "

needless to say she going down... I'm all set up for a visit to the Ukraine, Dnepro/Krivoi Rog next October, but after this i feel really down, this was my main girl, the other girls I'm corresponding are sort of the backup and the backup of the backup.

Just though i should share this with you guys...


*sponsor - wealthy / upper middle class married guy who pays his girlfriend on regular basis, jewelry, perfumes and cash, ceases to be when cash runs out or finds a younger prettier girlfriend

[Elen]

Well it's a "surprise" for me too how people manage to get money at empty place in our system to start any business but may be before feeling yourself such badly you would clarify with strigh questions what exactly she meant speaking about sponsore - because sponsor in business does not mean "lover" in ANY case

[Leslie]

Snowm,

Until you meet face to face you don't have ANY real relationship at all.   90% of the guys who write never make the trip so a woman would be really stupid to write to just one guy.  Most women write to several guys.  Perfectly normal.

A lot of newcomers regard letter writing as some sort of investment.  It is nothing of the sort.  It does not matter how many letters you have exchanged.  If there is no (or negative) chemistry when you meet then it is game over....

Sponsorship and a business partner are two very different things but in your case both are negative.  A young woman who has just started a business is not going to be keen on emigration (unless the business fails)  If she has a "sponsor" in Ukraine parlance then any relationship you may have in future should be for fun 

Go to Ukraine in October.  Maybe enlist the help of an agency.  Date, have fun and learn the ropes.

[BC]

Hey maybe when you visit she will have a bustling shop, enough to support you both there 

In any case don't think such is a short term venture unless she is planning on starting it up and let someone else run it.

I'm taking it that you haven't met in person yet so maybe she felt 'better opportunity in hand than one in the bush'.  Considering the 'long shot' aspects of MOB her actions may be really quite reasonable.

When you say 'next October'.. is this 2006 or 2007?

Is 'quite young but mature' relative to your age?

ps.. just saw the Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post..  Leslie beat me to the 'click' but will post anyway as a second opin.

[Elen]

dating is a long process and you always could leave your business to your family espesially if sponsor  here means anybody who gives money My father is a sponsore of my busieness Or we found sponsors who'd invest money in our business  - are rather common phrases and it does not mean that you "sleep" with your father  or or with all those "sponsors"

Well Ok I can say nothing about sponsor of that girl I just suggest to make clear all things before making conclusions wich would hurt you yourself - it will be time for that in any moment later It's just hard for me to believe that girl could be such "honest" that to admit openly to other man who she is going to date that she has another male who gives her money for "particular" services.

[Turboguy]

The advice you have had has been excellent, particularly Leslie's.  I will share one of my observations that reinforces what they have said.  I have made a lot of trips to meet several gals.  Usually there has been one who really stood out and who I thought was "the one".  Others I met just because they were someplace I was going to be or could go with little difficulty. 

Most always the one I thought was "the one" turned out to be a big dissapointment.  Many times ones I was meeting just because I was going to be in their town turned out to be the ones with real potential and good chemistry.

My suggestion would be to go,  get your feet wet on this.  Spend two or three days with the gal you had such high hopes for but meet a lot of other gals too.  Use an agency if you want or write a lot of gals between now and when you go meet lots of gals.   You can find out more in a few hours or a day or two than you can writing letters forever.   

[beattledog]

Do not think anything about it.  Do not put  all of your eggs in one basket

beattledog

[PeeWee]

Well it's a "surprise" for me too how people manage to get money at empty place in our system to start any business but may be before feeling yourself such badly you would clarify with strigh questions what exactly she meant speaking about sponsore - because sponsor in business does not mean "lover" in ANY case

I thought the same as Elen when I read it. An investor could be dad's brother, mom's cousin. So many options. I would have asked the question regarding the relationship of the investor but the bigger question might be if the business is a success and this is her dream how is she going to leave it or why would she leave it?

Peewee

[PeeWee]

Snowm,

Until you meet face to face you don't have ANY real relationship at all.   90% of the guys who write never make the trip so a woman would be really stupid to write to just one guy.  Most women write to several guys.  Perfectly normal.

A lot of newcomers regard letter writing as some sort of investment.  It is nothing of the sort.  It does not matter how many letters you have exchanged.  If there is no (or negative) chemistry when you meet then it is game over....

Sponsorship and a business partner are two very different things but in your case both are negative.  A young woman who has just started a business is not going to be keen on emigration (unless the business fails)  If she has a "sponsor" in Ukraine parlance then any relationship you may have in future should be for fun 

Go to Ukraine in October.  Maybe enlist the help of an agency.  Date, have fun and learn the ropes.

Yeah...what he said.

Peewee

[snowm]

the sponsor means a sponsor in the Ukrainian/Russian meaning of the word, it's not her father (she doesn't even know where he is), it's not the uncle, the grandmother, the cousin or the local batiushka, this girl is absolutely frontal and no BS (this why i preferred her to the others).
I was a couple of times in Moscow (work related) i even know a guy who's a sponsor, he's a wealthy owner of a real estate agency who pays the rent of a beautician shop...the person in charge of the beautician shop is an 18 who melts wax just by standing close to it... and also happens to be his lover.
Anyway she went for what was closer, good luck for her, i hold no grudges because A: we never even met B: she was totally honest with me C: she's all business, and that's not the woman for me

I'm not going to get sour or anything about this, it was just a "virtual" slap in the face, better i know this now than in 2 months when I'm there.
I'm planning to go anyway but I'm missing the drive now, the other girls just don't appeal to me as this one (and yes they are great looking too, but that is not my only criteria)... i suspect I'm a closet WOVO.

[Turboguy]

Virtual slaps in the face are pretty common in this venture.  It works better if you can develop a thick skin and let rejection and disappiontment roll off your back.   Success in everything involves some failrues in the learning process.  Keep your hopes up.  The right one will come along.

[jb]

snowman,

It's good that you understand the "Quid Pro Quo" system of life in the FSU, this will save you enormous heartache in the months to come.  Rarely does a RM sponsor a young woman in a business venture for no good reason, i.e., him putting up without her putting out.

However, I cannot count the number of trip reports I've read where the guy's No.1 choice fizzled after a meeting, and a 2nd or 3rd choice became a come-from-behind runner to be the 1st place finisher.  If I were you I'd not cancel plans to visit, just cross her off the list and concentrate on those girls who are free to relocate if the conditions are right. 

[beattledog]

be sure to meet  more that one lady on your trip.   There may be no charisma between  you and the woman that you really desire to meet

beattledog

[Turboguy]

Beatledog,  Are you feeling ok.  That was two sentances.  You are getting windly like the rest of us.  Before long you will post a full paragraph.

[Elen]

And all after all words in Russian have too many variations to make conclusions based on limited experience of life in FSU
At least I would be curiouse to find out what's such that "sponsor" 

As for C' then you knew that before that she was all business didn't you? She told you several times about her plans? Next  you just pay more attention what woman is babling there about her dreams 

[snowm]

And all after all words in Russian have too many variations to make conclusions based on limited experience of life in FSU
At least I would be curiouse to find out what's such that "sponsor" 

As for C' then you knew that before that she was all business didn't you? She told you several times about her plans? Next  you just pay more attention what woman is babling there about her dreams 

Elen i think the correct translation in English is $pon$or 

Just like they ask in some russian dating sites:
Материальная поддержка:
- Хочу найти спонсора
- Готов стать спонсором
- Не нуждаюсь в спонсоре и не хочу им быть

[Elen]

The same words have different meanings in different spheras And word sponsor  IS used in different to what you think meaning here
That's all I wanted to say because I would not be forgiven at this forum if it was me who said that this dating through internet business was exactly that sphera where only your variants could take a place 

[Bruno]

It's good that you understand the "Quid Pro Quo" system of life in the FSU, this will save you enormous heartache in the months to come.  Rarely does a RM sponsor a young woman in a business venture for no good reason, i.e., him putting up without her putting out.

One month ago, my Ukrainian girlfriend have inform me that her boss will sponsor her for open a new business  What to think  ??? and more bad, her boss is a woman  :hairraising:

The reason is more simple... the second business is a complement of the first one... by having two different boss, they have more easy to mount some financial truc who allow lower tax... A lot of reason exist in FSU for someone sponsoring a other business... by example "mafia" sponsor some business and use them for clean "illegal" money...

Why not ask her directly what happen... Are you afraid to send direct question ? Really, you have nothing to loose !

[snowm]

One month ago, my Ukrainian girlfriend have inform me that her boss will sponsor her for open a new business  What to think  ??? and more bad, her boss is a woman  :hairraising:

The reason is more simple... the second business is a complement of the first one... by having two different boss, they have more easy to mount some financial truc who allow lower tax... A lot of reason exist in FSU for someone sponsoring a other business... by example "mafia" sponsor some business and use them for clean "illegal" money...

Why not ask her directly what happen... Are you afraid to send direct question ? Really, you have nothing to loose !

Bruno i asked her directly in my appaling russian (and no the meaning was not lost in the translation)

"kak sponsor?"
"[silence] da, kak etot [silence] but it changes nothing i still want to see you...bla bla bla etc."

grown men don't sponsor (in the business term) pretty young girls fresh out of vocational school unless they are relatives or friends of the family.

Like another user said in another post

"...I think it mostly boils down to if something seems wrong, it probably is."

fait accompli next please.

[PeeWee]

Bruno i asked her directly in my appaling russian (and no the meaning was not lost in the translation)

"kak sponsor?"
"[silence] da, kak etot [silence] but it changes nothing i still want to see you...bla bla bla etc."

grown men don't sponsor (in the business term) pretty young girls fresh out of vocational school unless they are relatives or friends of the family.

Like another user said in another post

"...I think it mostly boils down to if something seems wrong, it probably is."

fait accompli next please.

There are enough of them over there, that is for sure.

peewee

[beattledog]

Yes, I the beattledog is fine.  My thoughts are getting longer with each posting. This one has 3 sentences.  HA. ha

BEATTLEDOG

[BillyB]

One gal I wrote to got straight to the point. She said she was looking for a "sponsor" and if I'd be her sponsor, she'd send me nude photos, videos and if I visited her, I could have her any way I'd like. I declined but she sent me nude photos anyway.

[KenC]

One gal I wrote to got straight to the point. She said she was looking for a "sponsor" and if I'd be her sponsor, she'd send me nude photos, videos and if I visited her, I could have her any way I'd like. I declined but she sent me nude photos anyway.

And that is your story, Billy, and you are sticking to it!!!!!!!!!!
 
KenC

[prince_alfie]

Isn't the word "sponsor" translated into "financial investor?" After all, doesn't Microsoft have lots of sponsors?

[PeeWee]

One gal I wrote to got straight to the point. She said she was looking for a "sponsor" and if I'd be her sponsor, she'd send me nude photos, videos and if I visited her, I could have her any way I'd like. I declined but she sent me nude photos anyway.

I got nude photos one time from a fat guy. It may have been fat Yuri for all I know. But that is the best that I have been able to manage. Good for you, BillyB.

Peewee