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Author Topic: Enjoying Ukraine  (Read 2959 times)

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Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #50 on: January 12, 2019, 03:19:49 PM »
Finally, on Christmas evening, 07 January, we attended a choir concert at Saint Volodymyr's Cathedral. This year there were more services and special events than on a typical Christmas, the reason being the signing of the "Tomos" granting Ukraine religious freedom of affairs, free from the corrupt and Kremlin dominated Moscow Patriarch.
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Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #51 on: January 12, 2019, 03:23:53 PM »
Well actually my Gal prepares best borscht and Olivier.
I have banned Herring Under a Coat from the house . . . just because it sounds so terrible.
Little to no mayonnaise used in our house also.


I feel sorry for your sheltered life, my friend. I am sure that her cooking is wonderful, but for the absolute best borscht and Olivier you would need to visit our home. :-)
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Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #52 on: January 12, 2019, 03:30:40 PM »
Forgot to mention that part of our Funicular tradition on Christmas day includes walking to St Andrew's Church. Unfortunately it remains closed for substantial renovations, but it is still beautiful from the exterior.


If you are ever tempted to walk down "Andrew's descent", the path that the Saint Apostle Andrew took when he walked down to the village of Kyiv after preaching from the hilltop, don't. It is a hard hike with very uneven brick pavers, and the nearest metro might as well be in a distant Oblast. That constitutes a taxi ride in my opinion, and the street kiosks are highly inflated anyway. Turn around and return up the hill to the plaza at Saint Michael's--you will thank me later.
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Offline JayH

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #53 on: January 12, 2019, 04:55:55 PM »
We were back in Kyiv (Kiev) at our apartment for Christmas, which is only 2 minutes stroll south of St Michael's Cathedral and 4 minutes walk north of Maiden (Independence Square). Inside the main train station.

I know this are very well --Moby got general area correct  I think. I usually stay  in this area of St Sophias when in Kyiv  -near  the SBU !

Love reading your updates !
SLAVA UKRAYINI  ! HEROYAM SLAVA!!!!
Слава Украине! Слава героям слава!Слава Україні! Слава героям!
 translated as: Glory to Ukraine! Glory to the heroes!!!  is a Ukrainian greeting slogan being used now all over Ukraine to signify support for a free independent Ukraine

Offline ML

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #54 on: January 12, 2019, 05:27:18 PM »
It has become a tradition for us to ride the Kyiv Funicular on Christmas morning.

I wouldn't risk riding on the Funicular.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Offline ML

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #55 on: January 12, 2019, 05:30:14 PM »
Mendy, as I understood from what I read on Internet, the Russian Ortho Church still owns the Lavra area churches, museums, etc.

So how is that going to work out in practice ?
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Offline ML

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #56 on: January 12, 2019, 05:39:35 PM »


If you are ever tempted to walk down "Andrew's descent", the path that the Saint Apostle Andrew took when he walked down to the village of Kyiv after preaching from the hilltop, don't. It is a hard hike with very uneven brick pavers, and the nearest metro might as well be in a distant Oblast. That constitutes a taxi ride in my opinion, and the street kiosks are highly inflated anyway. Turn around and return up the hill to the plaza at Saint Michael's--you will thank me later.

On the contrary, I would recommend it; walking down that is, not up.
But only in summer; not in winter.
Prices are to be negotiated.
I got a lot of small items at very cheap prices; but never paid the beginning price.
And, going down Andriyivskyy takes you to Podil not Kyiv city center, if that is what you were inferring.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Online calmissile

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #57 on: January 12, 2019, 06:04:29 PM »
Nice to see you posting here on a regular basis again.  Having stayed in various parts of Ukraine in both summer and winter, I have to say I much prefer the summer.

Hope to read your report this summer that you have taken the zip line across the Dnieper river.  It is a hoot.  :)
Doug (Calmissile)

Online msmob

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #58 on: January 12, 2019, 11:37:34 PM »
Moby got general area correct I think.

You either know the area ..or ...you don't ...  ;)

This is the area where I chose to stay in Kyiv ...Unlike Mendy, I DO drink and when relaxing invited biz colleagues to O'Briens for a 'seisiún' - in the days when Russians and Westerners didn't need visas  - it was an ideal place  to meet .... now it's Cyprus

I miss Kyiv




Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #59 on: January 13, 2019, 05:21:25 AM »
Mendy, as I understood from what I read on Internet, the Russian Ortho Church still owns the Lavra area churches, museums, etc.

So how is that going to work out in practice ?


The Russian Church goes to great lengths to make that claim, but they are lying.


The entire property is owned by the Ukrainian State Historical Museum system. The lower portion is leased by the Russian church. It will be interesting to see how that turns out especially since the Kyiv government paid for rebuilding and renovations in the early 2000's. They may want to break the lease, but personally I don't see that happening anytime soon. I could be wrong however, because the sale of tour tickets and religious objects is a large money maker for the Russians.


In an October interview in TASS, Metropolitan Pavel, Russian head of the lower section, outlined some of the conditions of the lease which include the responsibility to preserve the structures and monuments and pay for their upkeep. (http://tass.com/society/1028564) Their investment in upkeep would most certainly be a ranting and raving point by the Kremlin should the Russians find the lease broken.


In a nation where the average monthly salary hovers between $200-300, it is pathetic that the lower monastery's head, Metropolitan Pavel, arrives each morning with a monk driving his $325,000 Bentley. He has an very nice official residence on the lower grounds but doesn't really live in it.

I think that the broader implication will be that Ukrainian families who lose sons and husbands fighting in the Ukrainian Army will finally receive church rites and funerals, something they are usually denied by Russian led priests, supposedly because men who die fighting for Ukraine as somehow committing the sin of killing "brother against brother" all the while combatants fighting with the Russian forces are not committing the same sin and thus receive church funerals.

Also, babies born to families whose fathers are serving in the Ukrainian Army will finally be allowed baptisms, another rite which many Russian priests had refused on the grounds that the fathers were in sin.


I would also expect that
Metropolitan Onufriy (who has been instructed to cease using the title of Metropolitan--but he won't) will no longer have a seat of honour in the Ukrainian Rada (parliament). His refusal to stand for a moment of silence for Ukrainian soldiers killed in battles has ruffled a lot of feathers at home. (I recently suggested to a Russian priest that Onufriy stand on such occasions and if Moscow is upset, just tell Moscow that his hemorrhoids were inflamed and that he needed to scratch his ass.)

The new head of the united Ukrainian Orthodox Church is 39 year old Metropolitan Epiphanius (Epifaniy) and I would expect him to be present at important events in the parliament, and he will certainly stand when moments of silence to honour killed soldiers are announced.

It was interesting that on 05 January, the date that Epifaniy and the Ukrainian delegation arrived in Istanbul for the two days of Tomos ceremonies, the Kremlin sent 400 tanks across the border into the Luhansk region. It was likely designed to show Russia's displeasure with the granting of independence to the Ukrainian Church.

Anytime Russia is confronted by such troop insertions the Kremlin always claims that the Russian soldiers
are "volunteers" and not under Russian command. That is quite a feat, 400 tanks and crews just ambling off to Eastern Ukraine without formal permission, well if the liars in the Kremlin are to be taken seriously.




« Last Edit: January 13, 2019, 05:23:21 AM by mendeleyev »
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Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #60 on: January 13, 2019, 05:31:19 AM »
I was there several days ago to take photos but refused to photograph the lower section. However the Angel Princess and I did tour the lower section during last summer. It was interesting that even though she had worn a long skirt for the occasion, she was still required to don an outer skirt given to all women who entered.


She asked why, and the response was for the sake of modesty. She wore the green skirt, but I was delightfully amused when she retorted that if the monastery was so concerned about modesty then perhaps the Metropolitan should park his Bentley out of sight.
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Online msmob

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #61 on: January 15, 2019, 02:41:14 AM »
Hi Mendy

These 400 tanks - they are not mentioned by the OSCE monitoring mission

http://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/reports

Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #62 on: January 15, 2019, 02:49:36 AM »
Reported on Ukrainian TV, including footage, but not everything on TV news is truth so I will try to check it out further.
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Online msmob

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #63 on: January 15, 2019, 03:00:45 AM »
Thanks

Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #64 on: January 15, 2019, 06:43:45 AM »
The OSCE has two checkpoints at Donetsk and Gukovo. Those are permanent placements allowed by Russia, but they do not have complete freedom of movement up and down the border due to the dangers posed by current fighting.


Those are south of Luhansk, and north of the Rostov and Mariupol areas. My Ukrainian contacts insist that the insertion happened closer to Rostov on Don, and if true, would make sense as the Russians have a large military presence there and have continued to build it up as they have an eye on Mariupol. However, an insertion that large would have surely attracted the attention of the OSCE monitors, I would think, even thought the Russians do not allow them access to monitor that section of the border.


I asked if perhaps the movement was along the border but not an insertion. That would make sense as a "show of force" and displeasure. Nothing yet.

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Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #65 on: January 16, 2019, 09:11:41 AM »
Holy crap! In the past 48 hours I have been condemned to hell, cursed at, called all manner of names, and been threatened with physical violence if "they" ever find me. Thankfully most of these were at online forums and they will not find me.

The physical violence threats were issued on a language forum and I made the mistake of posting some language photos that just happened to be taken at prominent Ukrainian landmarks. The level of rage at Russians to Ukrainians and the reverse, has intensified since the Ukrainian church was granted independence from the Russians.

The threats and insults feels almost like my final days before leaving Russia.


Why? A couple of reasons.


First, I responded to a post online regarding the recent TOMOS granting independence to the Orthodox Church in Ukraine. I didn't try to drag the ROC in the mud (although it would have been very easy to do), but simply posted that I was grateful for those events and looked forward to Ukraine having a national church that is actually.....Ukrainian.


Holy shitload of insults!


I have had priests, bishops, and heads of monasteries threaten that if we so much as step inside such a Ukrainian church, my soul will burn in hell, I will spend eternity with Satan, etc.


Cool! Hopefully I'll be seated somewhere close to Russian Patriarch (and KGB agent) Kirill. I will gladly burn in hell with such fine company. By then of course Kirill with have left behind his coveted wristwatch collection, his two multi-million dollar dachas, the 2.2 million dollar Yacht gifted to him by Putin, and his fabulous home outside Moscow. Not bad for a monk who has taken vows of poverty. So, we'll both be poor...and scalding hot.


I have been unfriended on FB by a priest who I've known for years and thought was my friend.


A Metropolitan, formerly head of an Orthodox body, has counseled me to repent, seek restitution within the "real" church, and submit to counseling.


All because I rejoice in the fact that Ukrainians finally have their own church. It just isn't Russian--that is the problem.


If hell is the alternative to a Russian church, then hell is looking mighty attractive about now.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2019, 09:19:04 AM by mendeleyev »
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Offline ML

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #66 on: January 16, 2019, 09:21:52 AM »
Mendy, this is exactly why many people have turned away from ANY religion.

Rednecks that you can encounter in bars will have more scruples than most church-goers; and will certainly be more loyal to friends.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Offline mendeleyev

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Re: Enjoying Ukraine
« Reply #67 on: January 16, 2019, 09:27:18 AM »
ML, not sure that I agree completely, but I certainly understand your context. The difference here is really something beyond spirituality; it is blind nationalism.


Had I posted in these forums about the beauty of Russia, which I often do, or about the beauty of Russian churches, which I do also, then I'd have been offered sainthood instead of condemnation.


I am learning of the profound reasons why so many Ukrainians in the fast 4-5 years have come to hate Russia and Russians. They are tired of being classified as "little brothers" and as inferior. They resent their sons being killed and they borders being stripped away.


Despite claims to the contrary, the real fascists are in Russia.
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