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Author Topic: Thirty Years since - How have FSU States changed since the end of the USSR?  (Read 532 times)

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Online Trenchcoat

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So we're now almost 30 years from the break up of the Eastern Bloc that led to the break up of the USSR by the early 90s. So I thought it worthwhile to bring this discussion. I know there are members on here that root most of what happens in FSU countries as down to what happened in USSR times. Yet we are now roughly three decades on from that era and many of the FSU States have taken separate paths forward in their development since that time.

To my mind these three decades of independence create their own narrative and influence on those that live in FSU countries particularly the young that know of no other time. My point here is that many of the girls a lot of us are now coming to meet are from a post USSR period with its own societal uniqueness and have been influenced much by life under the post USSR country in which they now live. The society in which they grew up in could be seen as quite different to the society as under the USSR.

Ukraine for example has recently taken down virtually all their statues of Lenin, brought back the Ukrainian language, renamed its cities to their Ukrainian names and made independent it's Orthodox Churches from Russia. Belarus meanwhile has hung on to a lot of the old Soviet traditions from the break up moreso than Russia only excepting a little bit more western influence in the last few years. Russia has moved away from Soviet times but is still autocratic. Poland and other Eastern Bloc countries meanwhile have joined the EU.

So I ask you here, do you guys think society in FSU countries is now very much a different construct to USSR times?
No Deal is Ideal :)

Offline ML

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So I ask you here, do you guys think society in FSU countries is now very much a different construct to USSR times?

One observation . . . not mine, but rather of my Ukrainian wife.

During USSR times in Ukraine, people in general (not talking family) were much nicer and more cooperative than now exists.

Seems when everyone was more or less equally (except for Commie leaders) poor but mostly sure of their next paycheck, they pulled together in community projects, entertainment, etc.  i.e. there were a lot of something like block parties.

But when paychecks became unreliable or nonexistent for many as FSU broke up and people had to really scramble to just survive, and when opportunities opened up for some to start making relatively huge incomes (e.g. sellers of mostly illegally imported goods), people turned inward to think only of themselves and their family  . . . and the socially friendly atmosphere broke down.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Offline Boethius

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They are still formed by the Soviet Union.  You can see this if you understand what a Soviet mentality is.  One would assume something different would have developed, but I think it will take another two generations.


This post was composed without the aid of google.
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Online msmob

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Considering you are addressing your question (to) the guys... most of whom have no experience of Soviet times, I am left wondering...as usual... at the pointless questions you ask....   and conclusions  you arrive at...

Most of us rely on an answer from our partners......if they are old enough to KNOW / to be able to give an answer.

« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 02:24:37 AM by msmob »

Online Trenchcoat

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Considering you are addressing your question the guys... most of whom have no experience of Soviet times, I am left wondering...as usual... at the pointless questions you ask....   and conclusions  you arrive at...

Most of us rely on an answer from our partners......if they are old enough to KNOW / to be able to give an answer.

You may submit their answers as your own as the head of the house hold ;)
No Deal is Ideal :)

Online msmob

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You may submit their answers as your own as the head of the house hold ;)

Whilst I appreciate the humour ....it doesn't diminish the point I'm making ..!

Online Jamesukjames

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 I'm very interested to hear what others have to say.  Rather than the resident troll trying to put others down to functioning penis envy.  I would say society in UK has radically changed in the last 30 years.  From a Latvian point of view the factory supplied jobs with a free appartment free community heating and hot water and free phone calls and phone in the apartment.   Local farmers used bater and no money changed hands milk for bacon etc.  Farmers had a party to kill a pig and share it out when finished some one else's pig was slaughtered.   Farmers competed to make their own best vodka many died drinking the vodka.   Many 30 years ago wished the Germans had won the war.  After the war many Latvians moved to Germany and many Russians moved in to take their places.  Many rural areas there are hardly any young people left they work in eu countries and many farms lay dormant.  The factory is closed the apartments are still owned by the factory who charge rents that are higher than the tenants pensions so the tenants rely on the younger generation sending money from abroad to pay the rents.  If the tenants can not pay they are evicted and young working families move in.  Story of a town on the Latvian russian border.

Offline Boethius

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Troll or not, he is correct, that most posters here have almost no experience with Soviet times, and, therefore, cannot make a comparison.  There are posters here who grew up in the USSR, and they, almost universally, view those times favourably.  My husband does not.

This post was composed without the aid of google.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 03:12:26 PM by Boethius »
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Online msmob

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.. the resident troll trying to put others down to functioning penis envy. 

'Ri-ight' - like you you're going to tell us how it 'was' - more of your 'generalisations' .... ?



1/ I agree that the UK has changed ... 33 years ago - we had Mrs T introducing laws to ban 'promotion of homosexuality' in schools

2/ No same sex marriages

  From a Latvian point of view ..  After the war many Latvians moved to Germany and many Russians moved in to take their places. 

Er, The Soviet Union 'Russified' the Baltic States and moved / disposed of 'trouble-makers' ...


Many rural areas there are hardly any young people left they work in eu countries and many farms lay dormant. 

 Latvia IS an EU country and I'd agree that the east and southern areas ( more Russian speakers ) is more depressed ... You might like to check up on the status of Latvian resident aliens... 

I spent four days in the border region last year ... I lived with one in CY for three years...

The factory is closed the apartments are still owned by the factory who charge rents that are higher than the tenants pensions so the tenants rely on the younger generation sending money from abroad to pay the rents.  If the tenants can not pay they are evicted and young working families move in.  Story of a town on the Latvian russian border.

There are no substantial towns on the RU / Latvian border - either side it is bereft of towns ....


PS: I'm seriously wondering how your mind works as neither my little or big brain are feeling any 'envy'
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 04:25:14 PM by msmob »

Online krimster2

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guess what?
“the artist formerly known as Prince”, actually was just “Prince” all along!
FSU?
I’m not buying it one bit!
вы думаете, что любой из этих людей, даже российских, подозревает, что я русский?

вот как я могу создать американскую личность
Я могу взять напрокат

Online SteveInBoston

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Re: Thirty Years since - How have FSU States changed since the end of the USSR?
« Reply #10 on: February 15, 2019, 10:10:49 AM »
Do you mean "the Artist"?  He sang a song once about violet-hued precipitation.

Online krimster2

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Re: Thirty Years since - How have FSU States changed since the end of the USSR?
« Reply #11 on: February 15, 2019, 10:29:15 AM »
yeah, but then the excrement hit the reciprocating cooling device...
and he exceeded the recommended dosage of his recreational pharmaceuticals
wonder how many people have died
because they thought, "damn that felt good!!!  I bet if I took twice as much, I'd feel twice as good!!!"
sic transit...
 
« Last Edit: February 15, 2019, 10:32:15 AM by krimster2 »
вы думаете, что любой из этих людей, даже российских, подозревает, что я русский?

вот как я могу создать американскую личность
Я могу взять напрокат

Online SteveInBoston

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Re: Thirty Years since - How have FSU States changed since the end of the USSR?
« Reply #12 on: February 15, 2019, 11:07:02 AM »
I have read all the name changes were mainly for getting out/around contract requirements with his record label.  He started using his name again after the contractual period ended.

Online Gator

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Re: Thirty Years since - How have FSU States changed since the end of the USSR?
« Reply #13 on: February 15, 2019, 11:45:26 AM »
There are posters here who grew up in the USSR, and they, almost universally, view those times favourably.  My husband does not.

My wife is 53 and certainly knew Soviet life. 

Life was stable, and she still cherishes fond memories of those days.   She received a sufficient education.  And she had ample opportunities to participate in her favorite activities: sports and ballet.   

Starting at age 17-18, she worked and was was paid very well, first in gymnastics and then modeling.  She said the former paid her 3x a graduate engineer salary.  Modeling paid even better and included travel to Europe, Moscow and St. Petersburg, staying at the best hotels.   

She avoided politics and did not join the Communist Party.  Part of her reason for not joining - her family were Cossacks and had been forcibly relocated to Siberia, losing much valuable land in the move.   

Online krimster2

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Re: Thirty Years since - How have FSU States changed since the end of the USSR?
« Reply #14 on: February 15, 2019, 11:45:38 AM »
I bet prince and michael jackson and elvis are jammin together while the devil plays percussion...
with janis joplin joining the harmony

« Last Edit: February 15, 2019, 11:47:51 AM by krimster2 »
вы думаете, что любой из этих людей, даже российских, подозревает, что я русский?

вот как я могу создать американскую личность
Я могу взять напрокат

Online BdHvA

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Re: Thirty Years since - How have FSU States changed since the end of the USSR?
« Reply #15 on: February 15, 2019, 12:04:51 PM »
TrenchCoat thank you for starting an intelligent thread.

Most likely they will be playing The Stones 'Sympathy for the Devil'.

NB:  Someone can research the background/meaning of the lyrics.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2019, 12:12:11 PM by BdHvA »
Experierence is not what happens to you. It is what you do with what happens to you. A. Huxley

Online krimster2

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Re: Thirty Years since - How have FSU States changed since the end of the USSR?
« Reply #16 on: February 15, 2019, 12:43:30 PM »
hey now, it's not that bad!!!
at least none of us is Gavrilo Princip with a cheap pistol and a radical gleam in his eye!

I for one welcome the manipulation of national symbols to instill nationalism in the masses as an antidote to radicalism.
 
вы думаете, что любой из этих людей, даже российских, подозревает, что я русский?

вот как я могу создать американскую личность
Я могу взять напрокат

Online Maxx2

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Re: Thirty Years since - How have FSU States changed since the end of the USSR?
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2019, 08:34:37 PM »
There are posters here who grew up in the USSR, and they, almost universally, view those times favourably.


I've found that true with some of the ones I've met. Partly that might be because that was the time of their mindless youth? My trainer at the gym was the middleweight (I think that division) boxing champion of Georgia from age 15 to age 20. Then he went into the Navy. My guess he looks back fondly on those times. Often later at night he and some of the others go and hang out at a bar that they tell me was an old KGB hangout. I've been there a few times. Vodka and smoked fish on a corner of Stalin Street.

 

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