It appears you have not registered with our community. To register please click here ...

!!

Welcome to Russian Women Discussion - the most informative site for all things related to serious long-term relationships and marriage to a partner from the Former Soviet Union countries!

Please register (it's free!) to gain full access to the many features and benefits of the site. Welcome!

+-

Author Topic: Itís KYIV  (Read 1161 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Boethius

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2042
  • Country: 00
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2019, 07:52:01 PM »
KAYiv in Ukrainian, KEYef in Russian.  Probably indiscernible to most non native speakers, and most would hear a "v" rather than an "f".


This post was composed without the aid of google.
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Offline SANDRO43

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10494
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
    • Sandro's Website
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #26 on: June 06, 2019, 06:09:29 AM »
KAYiv in Ukrainian, KEYef in Russian.
So it's like CAVE, as ML said. Quite a distortion of its written form, how odd :-\.
Milan's "Duomo"

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6379
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #27 on: June 06, 2019, 06:32:08 AM »
Kyiv - sounds like 'Kyyiv' and Kiev like 'Kiyev' .. according to  Google translate ..;)




Offline SANDRO43

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10494
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
    • Sandro's Website
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #28 on: June 06, 2019, 04:59:40 PM »
Kyiv - sounds like 'Kyyiv' and Kiev like 'Kiyev' .. according to  Google translate ..;)
Thanks, but:

- I don't think Google translate is very reliable as far as SOUNDS are concerned.
- Kyyiv. how would one pronounce  that ::)? The problem is that English is so unorthograhic (inconsistent in its spelling, see http://www.floriani.it/English-eng.htm for more details) to be of little use as a guide to phonetics.

I prefer to rely on 'human' advice on this :).
Milan's "Duomo"

Offline Boethius

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2042
  • Country: 00
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #29 on: June 06, 2019, 05:37:25 PM »
It's two syllables in Ukrainian, hence, not "CAVE".

Below is the pronunciation of Kyiv, first in Ukrainian, then in Russian, by a native speaker. ;)

This post was composed without the aid of google.


http://vocaroo.com/i/s1SyFAm9ZKbD
« Last Edit: June 06, 2019, 05:53:03 PM by Boethius »
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Offline SANDRO43

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10494
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
    • Sandro's Website
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #30 on: June 06, 2019, 07:09:11 PM »
It's two syllables in Ukrainian, hence, not "CAVE". Below is the pronunciation of Kyiv, first in Ukrainian, then in Russian, by a native speaker. ;)
Yes, I would transpose in Italian (we have vowel accents as diacritical marks, and no Ys ;)) as:

-UKR: Kž-iv
-RUS: Kž-ev


A disyllable with stress on the 1st syllable (Kž). No final F sound, although maybe it appears when other words follow, for an easier liaison.
Milan's "Duomo"

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6379
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #31 on: June 06, 2019, 09:21:39 PM »
Actually, surely having another word follow would change the name (ending )  - in Russian, surely ? ;)  [ don't know Ukrainian well enough ]


The -ev surely DOES sound like and 'F' ...   In English I often see Smirnov transliterated as Smirnof(f) ..Stroganov / Stronganoff

 :rolleyes:

Offline Boethius

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2042
  • Country: 00
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #32 on: June 06, 2019, 09:55:22 PM »
Actually, surely having another word follow would change the name (ending )  - in Russian, surely ? ;)  [ don't know Ukrainian well enough ]


You mean cases.


Kyiv is the nominative case, so no change.  It would change in other cases, in both Ukrainian and Russian, in most cases, identically.  There is one more case in Ukrainian than there is in Russian.  Proper use is what separates the "men from the boys" among non native speakers.


This post was composed without the aid of google.
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6379
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #33 on: June 07, 2019, 03:01:51 AM »
Thanks, Boethius!

Can you explain to this 'boy' how places names become (  I call it 'Hispanicified') with 'eh' sounds added?

I hear Russians speak of Limassol as 'Limasoleh'..

« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 07:40:42 AM by msmob »

Offline SANDRO43

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10494
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
    • Sandro's Website
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #34 on: June 07, 2019, 07:14:51 AM »
I hear Russian speak of Limassol as 'Lissamsoleh'..
Always? Or depends on sentence, and therefore case declension?

- Limassol is...
-...in/from/to Limassol
Milan's "Duomo"

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6379
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #35 on: June 07, 2019, 07:41:30 AM »
Always? Or depends on sentence, and therefore case declension?

- Limassol is...
-...in/from/to Limassol

I don't know, Sandro ((

We'll wait for the cavalry to come !

Offline Boethius

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2042
  • Country: 00
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #36 on: June 07, 2019, 09:46:40 AM »
Thanks, Boethius!

Can you explain to this 'boy' how places names become (  I call it 'Hispanicified') with 'eh' sounds added?

I hear Russians speak of Limassol as 'Limasoleh'..

That is declensions again.  These are locative declensions -

Ukrainian - I live in Kyiv -  Я в Києві живу.
Russian - I live in Moscow - Я живу в Москве.

I mixed up the word order, as that's another thing non native speakers don't do.  The first sentence sounds more "natural" to me.

This post was composed without the aid of google.



« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 10:39:12 AM by Boethius »
To love someone means to see him as God intended him. - Fyodor Dostoevksy

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6379
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: Itís KYIV
« Reply #37 on: June 07, 2019, 10:15:17 AM »
THANK YOU, Boethius - can now read up and learn
 

 

+-RWD Stats

Members
Total Members: 9950
Latest: WildTurkey56
New This Month: 9
New This Week: 3
New Today: 3
Stats
Total Posts: 485619
Total Topics: 19305
Most Online Today: 1263
Most Online Ever: 2480
(November 01, 2018, 05:22:05 PM)
Users Online
Members: 39
Guests: 1222
Total: 1261

+-Recent Posts

Re: SC meets Moby in Georgia and we end up in ...Armenia ? by msmob
Today at 12:29:31 AM

Re: SC meets Moby in Georgia and we end up in ...Armenia ? by Maxx2
Yesterday at 09:01:45 PM

Re: Music I love by SANDRO43
Yesterday at 07:37:43 PM

Re: Operation White Panther by Patagonie
Yesterday at 02:46:45 PM

Re: SC meets Moby in Georgia and we end up in ...Armenia ? by Maxx2
Yesterday at 12:24:07 PM

Re: SC meets Moby in Georgia and we end up in ...Armenia ? by krimster2
Yesterday at 12:19:58 PM

Re: SC meets Moby in Georgia and we end up in ...Armenia ? by msmob
Yesterday at 11:37:03 AM

Re: SC meets Moby in Georgia and we end up in ...Armenia ? by Maxx2
Yesterday at 11:00:12 AM

My 50 year old teenager by ML
Yesterday at 10:15:28 AM

Re: Posting Pictures of You and Your Lady by krimster2
Yesterday at 09:48:31 AM

Powered by EzPortal