It appears you have not registered with our community. To register please click here ...

!!

Welcome to Russian Women Discussion - the most informative site for all things related to serious long-term relationships and marriage to a partner from the Former Soviet Union countries!

Please register (it's free!) to gain full access to the many features and benefits of the site. Welcome!

+-

Author Topic: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread  (Read 1610 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9029
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« on: December 11, 2019, 09:24:31 AM »
I take it that there is not enough other topics here has to also
be sidetracked by the VO/VM argument.

Good point
FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Kiss the girl, don't ask her first.

Offline GQBlues

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8822
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2019, 09:32:56 AM »
The only stupid segment of this debate are people who actually will take the time to argue against other people's choices. Only a really insecure dolt do that.

Do what you believe is good and comfortable for you. Why defer because someone from the internet you don't know tells you it's wrong. Especially from one who doesn't have a commendable record in their own relations to begin with to be in a position to make you believe their way is the only way.


Don't be as stupid...
« Last Edit: December 11, 2019, 10:07:00 AM by GQBlues »
~1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming
~

msmob  (Yes, he really said these)

Offline ML

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9387
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2019, 06:00:43 PM »
The only stupid segment of this debate are people who actually will take the time to argue against other people's choices. Only a really insecure dolt do that.


I agree.  Only a stupid and insecure dolt would praise the VO route.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Online BillyB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12611
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
    • Good Story
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2019, 06:50:15 PM »
Do what you believe is good and comfortable for you.


This is definitely one of those song moments. I've got to be me!

There are people that will pass info about you and your family. Do not share info about yourself or share photos as they can search for you on the internet and distribute what they found since they are allowed to participate here.

Online Patagonie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2677
  • Country: fr
  • Gender: Male
  • >20 travels along the slavic earth
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2019, 04:32:45 AM »
I couldn't stop myself to copy this one here :


As i pay my plane ticket, my flat and all your expenses during the dating. 
It's me who decide HOW i date you
If you don't like my rules we purely and simply don't meet and will never meet.
That's simple.     

And I never had a problem to meet women everywhere. 
There are plenty. 
 

When a man  or a woman try to avoid the competition the repeated odds will drop them alone one day or an other.
Read : "Operation white panther"
"Je glissais through the paper wall, an angel in the hand, s taboy. I lay on the floor, surgi des chants de Maldoror, je mix l'intégrale de mes nuits de crystal, i belong to the festival.

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9029
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2019, 07:27:04 AM »
..and travelling thousands of miles to take tea with lots of women is going to tell YOU WHAT as opposed to extensive video chats and a meeting two people REALLY want?)


Having tea with lots of women will tell you if you have mutual chemistry
since most of them you won't have it. Once you find somebody that you
have mutual chemistry with you can pursue her. You don't waste a flight, 
weeks of vacation and, thousands of dollars pursuing a girl that ten seconds
after meeting at the airport you know she isn't the one.

This method isn't for everybody. You have to be able to tell if a girl likes
you or not. Some guys just pick the hottest girl who will agree to meet
them again. Some guys can't make a decision and are like some tourist
stuck in the center divider on a busy street with cars zooming by both
ways.

Some men are too shy to meet a girl that they don't know or to have
a real conversation with. Some women don't want to exchange letters
with some man who might never come, but they are happy to have tea
with some guy to see if they like each other.

IF things don't work out for you on a visit one trip then this is what you
are stuck with, OR you can mope around and feel sorry for yourself, OR
you can keep following a girl around who has rejected you like a kicked
puppy hoping that she will come around like a girl in a Hollywood movie.

I advise ALL men to study this method because you might have to use
it if things don't work out on a visit one trip.

FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Kiss the girl, don't ask her first.

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8181
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2019, 08:11:05 AM »
I couldn't stop myself to copy this one here :


As i pay my plane ticket, my flat and all your expenses during the dating. 
It's me who decide HOW i date you
If you don't like my rules we purely and simply don't meet and will never meet.
That's simple.     

And I never had a problem to meet women everywhere. 
There are plenty. 
 

When a man  or a woman try to avoid the competition the repeated odds will drop them alone one day or an other.

..and it SUCH stuoid 'advice'...that of ..to use a Russian translit...an egoist))ˇ

Most of the women I met would NOT meet guys on visit many trips... 

I include my wife (like the sound of that)  and ex wife..

It had f'all to do with 'competition'..they just did not take guys on such trips as serious..

Honestly, if the boot was on the other foot....would you be interested in meeting such women?  Think of how we felt for Pat...


There you go......

We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9029
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2019, 08:40:52 AM »
..and it SUCH stuoid 'advice'...that of ..to use a Russian translit...an egoist))ˇ

Most of the women I met would NOT meet guys on visit many trips... 

I include my wife (like the sound of that)  and ex wife..

It had f'all to do with 'competition'..they just did not take guys on such trips as serious..

Honestly, if the boot was on the other foot....would you be interested in meeting such women?  Think of how we felt for Pat...


There you go......

Who is going to ask a woman to meet for tea by saying

"Hey, I'm gunna ask a whole mess of wimmin to tea, you are
just one of the heard an I wanna try you out!" Only an idiot
would say or do that.

What you do is say "You have a beautiful smile, I would love to have
a cup of tea with you and see how many times I can get you to smile."

The purpose is to meet the ONE girl. If you meet a great girl then you
pursue her. You want to sift girls with letters.

Every single meeting you hope that this girl is the ONE. Every meeting
you want to meet the future Mrs ________________ your name here.

Some guys have been very fortunate to write to many girls, then they
sift it down to just one girl and then they visited her and everything
went great and they lived happily ever after. Hooray! I am happy
for them.



« Last Edit: December 12, 2019, 08:54:33 AM by 2tallbill »
FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Kiss the girl, don't ask her first.

Offline JayH

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5686
  • Country: au
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Looking > 5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2019, 08:47:03 AM »
The fact is MOST  guys are incapable of carrying out a successful  VM  trip.
As  some have said --there is no ONE correct method.
Personally --  I like the 2T suggestion to cultivate one relationship in advance  --  and THEN --if that leads nowhere - move to the invite many to a coffee etc .This is a high risk strategy and you need to have the right personality to get away with it.
But-importantly --if a connection is made-focus on that immediately.

To meet many --you need a pretty good story  to get away with it -- and lying will kill you!Above all else-- it better be a pretty good explanation of what the hell you are doing there.
The forum  will tell you what women will be thinking quick enough .

I made many( many many) trips and spent a lot on the ground.For those not prepared  or incapable of making return trips then confining search   and establishing solid contact/s is more  likely to succeed.

One last point -I am not a believer in the 7 day turnaround and marriage deal - for the 1 in 100000 that happens- good luck if you think that can work-- good luck.
SLAVA UKRAYINI  ! HEROYAM SLAVA!!!!
Слава Украине! Слава героям слава!Слава Україні! Слава героям!
 translated as: Glory to Ukraine! Glory to the heroes!!!  is a Ukrainian greeting slogan being used now all over Ukraine to signify support for a free independent Ukraine

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8181
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2019, 08:47:13 AM »
Beel,

FSU W get guys who come for two weeks and write out of the blue, " I will be in Moscow for two weeks and would love to meet you for a couple of days .. I will pay for your ticket from Siberia" and wonder why they FAIL...

For GAWD's sake,  man...  THINK ..

If a FSU W turns up in the US and says the same..How many guys would meet her? ... ))





We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9029
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2019, 09:08:49 AM »
The fact is MOST  guys are incapable of carrying out a successful  VM  trip.
As  some have said --there is no ONE correct method.
Personally --  I like the 2T suggestion to cultivate one relationship in advance  --  and THEN --if that leads nowhere - move to the invite many to a coffee etc .This is a high risk strategy and you need to have the right personality to get away with it.
But-importantly --if a connection is made-focus on that immediately.

To meet many --you need a pretty good story  to get away with it -- and lying will kill you!Above all else-- it better be a pretty good explanation of what the hell you are doing there.
The forum  will tell you what women will be thinking quick enough .

I made many( many many) trips and spent a lot on the ground.For those not prepared  or incapable of making return trips then confining search   and establishing solid contact/s is more  likely to succeed.

One last point -I am not a believer in the 7 day turnaround and marriage deal - for the 1 in 100000 that happens- good luck if you think that can work-- good luck.

Jay you've made several excellent points.

1. There isn't ONE method
2. VM as a back up plan for a Visit One
3. VM is in some ways high risk (I slightly disagree but this was your point)
4. VM is not for everyone
5. DON'T LIE!
6. Have a story (It must be the truth) example: I came to meet a girl
(the last girl you've met) and it didn't work out, then I saw your photo
and thought I'm absolutely and not going home without meeting this girl! 
I am not going to my grave thinking to myself that I could have met this
girl and I didn't do it. What if you are the perfect girl for me? I really needed
to find out.
7. A one week wonder and a lottery ticket have a lot in common, but lottery
tickets only cost a few bucks. A bad one week wonder can cost you half
of everything you own.

FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Kiss the girl, don't ask her first.

Offline JayH

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5686
  • Country: au
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Looking > 5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2019, 09:36:54 AM »
Jay you've made several excellent points.

1. There isn't ONE method
2. VM as a back up plan for a Visit One
3. VM is in some ways high risk (I slightly disagree but this was your point)
4. VM is not for everyone
5. DON'T LIE!
6. Have a story (It must be the truth) example: I came to meet a girl
(the last girl you've met) and it didn't work out, then I saw your photo
and thought I'm absolutely and not going home without meeting this girl! 
I am not going to my grave thinking to myself that I could have met this
girl and I didn't do it. What if you are the perfect girl for me? I really needed
to find out.
7. A one week wonder and a lottery ticket have a lot in common, but lottery
tickets only cost a few bucks. A bad one week wonder can cost you half
of everything you own.

To  elaborate on something that happened to me --I embarked on a visit to my long term on/off Ukrainian relationship that was intended to be a serious amount of time together  of a few months- well - that lasted 4 days( or so )  and I was on my own !  After a week of feeling sorry for myself and spending time with friends in Ukraine ( guys & girls) and being invited out I basically embarked on a long VM  ( actually meet many) which resulted in making a lot of friends and given the recent break up I did not feel ready to jump in readily to a new relationship-but was happy meeting and socialising etc
So --  at the end of my planned time on my last  night I had moved to city an easy drive to the airport the next day- and thought --ok -let me see if anyone grabs my attention here !
As it happened  I got chatting and said the "hey ,I am here in your city-let's meet and say a real life "hello"/
What transpired was that she was in Kyiv and returning the next day-- so i said -come and meet me at the airport for a coffee. So --ok - I am thinking this is a very long shot !!
Well-- I am waiting at the appointed spot - time slides by --then I look up and entering the terminal is this beautiful elegant immaculately dressed woman that I immediately look at. Then it dawns on me she is walking towards me smiling -- "my god it's actually  her" -far more beautiful and spectacular than her photos .
Her personality literally knocked me out! We communicated every day from that  point and we have been together ever since .
So-- a very rewarding piece of opportunism ! :)
SLAVA UKRAYINI  ! HEROYAM SLAVA!!!!
Слава Украине! Слава героям слава!Слава Україні! Слава героям!
 translated as: Glory to Ukraine! Glory to the heroes!!!  is a Ukrainian greeting slogan being used now all over Ukraine to signify support for a free independent Ukraine

Online Faux Pas

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9083
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2019, 10:10:42 AM »
Who is going to ask a woman to meet for tea by saying

"Hey, I'm gunna ask a whole mess of wimmin to tea, you are
just one of the heard an I wanna try you out!" Only an idiot
would say or do that.

What you do is say "You have a beautiful smile, I would love to have
a cup of tea with you and see how many times I can get you to smile."

The purpose is to meet the ONE girl. If you meet a great girl then you
pursue her. You want to sift girls with letters.

Every single meeting you hope that this girl is the ONE. Every meeting
you want to meet the future Mrs ________________ your name here.

Some guys have been very fortunate to write to many girls, then they
sift it down to just one girl and then they visited her and everything
went great and they lived happily ever after. Hooray! I am happy
for them.

I fault no one for the method they choose. Full stop. Life is too short, do what suits you. The method/plan you seem to endorse is the VM for tea and see what happens. I've followed your trips and diaries on the boards over the years. Let's speak frankly for a minute, many guys that take on this plunge couldn't get laid in a women's prison passing out pardons and I am not referring to you Bill. Many do look east for some measure of success in general with the fairer sex because they have none at home. Many of those guys read of VM trips and no doubt embark on a sex tourism trip to see how many women they can lay under the guise of a VM and in search of the "one". We have several active in this forum now that's done it and posted about it (you know who you are). Many do go just to get laid. I'd venture many from both VO and VM camps alike but the VO folks actually have a better cover over the VM. Any Quasimoto can arrive in an East European city and have an assembly line of dates for tea, tequila shots, meals and/or sex. It's not difficult especially if you're flush with cash.

One of the few times I agree with the numskull Moobs. If you're actually looking for Miss Right rather than Miss Right now, your best tool is due diligence. Getting to know the lady prior through communication which by the way, is much easier now than it was 12-13 years ago when I was doing it. I've always been a proponent of VO with due diligence mainly because this shit is expensive and very time consuming.


Offline JayH

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5686
  • Country: au
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Looking > 5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2019, 10:22:21 AM »

One of the few times I agree with the numskull Moobs. If you're actually looking for Miss Right rather than Miss Right now, your best tool is due diligence. Getting to know the lady prior through communication which by the way, is much easier now than it was 12-13 years ago when I was doing it. I've always been a proponent of VO with due diligence mainly because this shit is expensive and very time consuming.

The now readily available & easy communication has been a game changer in regard to preparation and it is a point very well made.

Interesting though  that we still have some here handing out dumb advice that it is better to go hang around a park with your tongue out than try and establish decent contacts in advance.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2019, 10:24:48 AM by JayH »
SLAVA UKRAYINI  ! HEROYAM SLAVA!!!!
Слава Украине! Слава героям слава!Слава Україні! Слава героям!
 translated as: Glory to Ukraine! Glory to the heroes!!!  is a Ukrainian greeting slogan being used now all over Ukraine to signify support for a free independent Ukraine

Online Patagonie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2677
  • Country: fr
  • Gender: Male
  • >20 travels along the slavic earth
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2019, 10:22:42 AM »
The fact is MOST  guys are incapable of carrying out a successful  VM  trip.
As  some have said --there is no ONE correct method.
Personally --  I like the 2T suggestion to cultivate one relationship in advance  --  and THEN --if that leads nowhere - move to the invite many to a coffee etc .This is a high risk strategy and you need to have the right personality to get away with it.
But-importantly --if a connection is made-focus on that immediately.

To meet many --you need a pretty good story  to get away with it -- and lying will kill you!Above all else-- it better be a pretty good explanation of what the hell you are doing there.
The forum  will tell you what women will be thinking quick enough
.

I made many( many many) trips and spent a lot on the ground.For those not prepared  or incapable of making return trips then confining search   and establishing solid contact/s is more  likely to succeed.

One last point -I am not a believer in the 7 day turnaround and marriage deal - for the 1 in 100000 that happens- good luck if you think that can work-- good luck.
Lying will not kill you, it will only kill you if you are not enough confident when you are arranging the reality. What counts is not what you tell, but HOW you tell it.
This is when generally men are caught because they feel guilty. And why they feel guilty? Because they have been raised by mum who tell them "be a good boy", "always tell the truth" even if they are shooting a bullet in their foot each time.

ADVANTAGE : women. They have been raised in a world where it's perfectably acceptable to lie. At least to save their ass from Bob Big Dick who try to invite them to the coffee after school for the 15th time. So by social convention from their 12, they would say :
I have some homework.
Grand mama is sick
My sister waits me right now i have to leave
And if they could "your dick is too big for me, i have to refuse".
And the list goes on...
And they lie from their youngest age they not only notice that nobody cares so they don't feel ashamed, but they start to understand all the benefits they can get back.
So every man perfectly knows how skilled are women in lying? (dig in your worst memories please)
Why?
Because they are trained to perform this from their youngest age.
DISADVANTAGE : men


The good boys are stucked in the conceptual bla bla (named BS) of women.
And the conceptual BS of women have a double function : put the shame on men,
and prevent them to play the same BS to women (to their exclusive profit, if possible of course). 
 
Bottom line : what happens on the field (you need to discover) :
There are tons of conventions that you can use in the language with women that you will never have a problem if you know how to use it. 
 
You need to improve your skills and experience by incorporing the flexibility of a world "INCREASED" "ARRANGED" (a pure women world)
Incorporing some "talents" of women will largely make your life more confortable, and less guilty.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2019, 04:16:36 PM by Patagonie »
Read : "Operation white panther"
"Je glissais through the paper wall, an angel in the hand, s taboy. I lay on the floor, surgi des chants de Maldoror, je mix l'intégrale de mes nuits de crystal, i belong to the festival.

Online Faux Pas

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9083
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2019, 10:47:24 AM »


Interesting though  that we still have some here handing out dumb advice that it is better to go hang around a park with your tongue out than try and establish decent contacts in advance.

Well here's the thing, my first VO trip was to St Petersburg in 2006. It went fabulously. We both liked each other a lot and had a wonderful time. We both agreed to go forward and see what happens and there were no other commitments. When it was over I still had IIRC 4 days to my own devices in St Petersburg. I did nothing but wander the city doing different things and hanging out. I must have met at least a dozen more beautiful women. No agencies, no Tinder and no website just human interaction. I am convinced it can be done. Only a couple of those women approached me. Albeit I wasn't hanging out on park benches

Offline JayH

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5686
  • Country: au
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Looking > 5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2019, 11:10:41 AM »
Well here's the thing, my first VO trip was to St Petersburg in 2006. It went fabulously. We both liked each other a lot and had a wonderful time. We both agreed to go forward and see what happens and there were no other commitments. When it was over I still had IIRC 4 days to my own devices in St Petersburg. I did nothing but wander the city doing different things and hanging out. I must have met at least a dozen more beautiful women. No agencies, no Tinder and no website just human interaction. I am convinced it can be done. Only a couple of those women approached me. Albeit I wasn't hanging out on park benches
You can see above I dismiss no possibilities.I have met plenty standing around etc   A strategy more inline as a back up than a first option.
SLAVA UKRAYINI  ! HEROYAM SLAVA!!!!
Слава Украине! Слава героям слава!Слава Україні! Слава героям!
 translated as: Glory to Ukraine! Glory to the heroes!!!  is a Ukrainian greeting slogan being used now all over Ukraine to signify support for a free independent Ukraine

Offline Trenchcoat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4813
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: Looking 3-5 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2019, 02:45:02 PM »

Having tea with lots of women will tell you if you have mutual chemistry
since most of them you won't have it. Once you find somebody that you
have mutual chemistry with you can pursue her. You don't waste a flight, 
weeks of vacation and, thousands of dollars pursuing a girl that ten seconds
after meeting at the airport you know she isn't the one.

This method isn't for everybody. You have to be able to tell if a girl likes
you or not. Some guys just pick the hottest girl who will agree to meet
them again. Some guys can't make a decision and are like some tourist
stuck in the center divider on a busy street with cars zooming by both
ways.

Some men are too shy to meet a girl that they don't know or to have
a real conversation with. Some women don't want to exchange letters
with some man who might never come, but they are happy to have tea
with some guy to see if they like each other.

IF things don't work out for you on a visit one trip then this is what you
are stuck with, OR you can mope around and feel sorry for yourself, OR
you can keep following a girl around who has rejected you like a kicked
puppy hoping that she will come around like a girl in a Hollywood movie.

I advise ALL men to study this method because you might have to use
it if things don't work out on a visit one trip.

I think this is top advice you give here 2tallbill. It's what I should have tried earlier on and of course like you say a handy technique if a VO trip falls flat.

I've enjoyed various VO trips in the past to varying degrees but it always seemed to come with the downsides of only finding out if there was chemistry on arrival, pinning hopes on there being something and feeling so what committed to being with that person/setup arranged for the duration.

That and it could take many VO journeys to find the one. The odds really get reduced a lot using such a method. Some guys get lucky and many that are keen on VO seem to put it across as if you find the right girl on the first attempt but that rarely happens apart from the lucky few.

To me it's stupid to presume a romantic interest with a girl a guy has never met on person and the VO route seems to push things that way. Better to find out what the girl is like and vice versa and go from there. I think your advice the other day was great Bill :) It's something I'm going to move on early in the new year and sort out some times to get out there.
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Offline ML

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9387
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #18 on: December 12, 2019, 02:53:38 PM »
This is when generally men are caught because they feel guilty. And why they feel guilty? Because they have been raised by mum who tell them "be a good boy", "always tell the truth" even if they are shooting a bullet in their foot each time.

ADVANTAGE : women. They have been raised in a world where it's perfectly acceptable to lie. At least to save their ass from Bob Big Dick who try to invite them to the coffee after school for the 15th time. So by social convention from their 12, they would say :
I have some homework.
Grand mama is sick
My sister waits me right now i have to live
And if they could "your dick is too big for me, i have to refuse".
And the list goes on...
And they lie from their youngest age they not only notice that nobody cares so they don't feel ashamed, but they start to understand all the benefits they can get back.
So every man perfectly knows how skilled are women in lying? (dig in your worst memories please)
Why?
Because they are trained to perform this from their youngest age.
DISADVANTAGE : men


The good boys are stuck in the conceptual bla bla (named BS) of women.
And the conceptual BS of women have a double function : put the shame on men,
and prevent them to play the same BS to women (to their exclusive profit). 
 
Bottom line : what happens on the field (you need to discover) :
There are tons of conventions that you can use in the language with women that you will never have a problem if you know how to use it. 
 
You need to improve your skills and experience by incorporating the flexibility of a world "INCREASED" "ARRANGED" (a pure women world)
Incorporating some "talents" of women will largely make your life more comfortable, and less guilty.

WOW . . . pretty deep stuff Pat !!
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Offline Trenchcoat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4813
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: Looking 3-5 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #19 on: December 12, 2019, 02:55:18 PM »
Beel,

FSU W get guys who come for two weeks and write out of the blue, " I will be in Moscow for two weeks and would love to meet you for a couple of days .. I will pay for your ticket from Siberia" and wonder why they FAIL...

For GAWD's sake,  man...  THINK ..

If a FSU W turns up in the US and says the same..How many guys would meet her? ... ))

That's not what 2tallbill is saying Mobe, he's taking about meeting women in the same city and not for a couple of days but just maybe up to an hour or so just to see what each other are like. He's not talking about a lot of messages before hand either. It's not a meeting of presumed love but a meeting to find out what each other is like. It makes far more sense for both parties. FSW often don't want lengthy messaging and Skype they just want to see the dude. Men just want to get to the right woman without a lot of bother. It only makes sense for those into each other to continue seeing each other.
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Online Patagonie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2677
  • Country: fr
  • Gender: Male
  • >20 travels along the slavic earth
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2019, 04:34:39 PM »
WOW . . . pretty deep stuff Pat !!

 
Thank you ML
I always learnt a lot from people.There is a lot to know about women.
 
But with women the best is to copy or incorporate their skills, that's harder but largely more efficient, rather than just store an information. 
 
Example : men in a conversation will speak of a topic and finish it barely before starting an other. With women you can have two  or three topics at the same time (dual or quad core processor) and that perfectly accepted. 
Use it and enjoy.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2019, 05:02:15 PM by Patagonie »
Read : "Operation white panther"
"Je glissais through the paper wall, an angel in the hand, s taboy. I lay on the floor, surgi des chants de Maldoror, je mix l'intégrale de mes nuits de crystal, i belong to the festival.

Offline rwd123

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 274
  • Country: ua
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2019, 06:40:37 PM »
I find myself agreeing with Bill a lot. I don't hold much interest in communications prior to a real meeting, and willing to move on quickly if there's a lack of chemistry.

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8181
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2019, 09:49:07 PM »
That's not what 2tallbill is saying Mobe, he's taking about meeting women in the same city and not for a couple of days but just maybe up to an hour or so just to see what each other are like. He's not talking about a lot of messages before hand either. It's not a meeting of presumed love but a meeting to find out what each other is like. It makes far more sense for both parties. FSW often don't want lengthy messaging and Skype they just want to see the dude. Men just want to get to the right woman without a lot of bother. It only makes sense for those into each other to continue seeing each other.

Dear Trench,

I PERFECTLY understand what Beel is saying ..

It is BOLLOX in this day and age ...   

With all the tools we have to communicate, why not weed out the 'blind date' aspect of dating ?

It's ESPECIALLY galling to read proponents of VM -who should know better - travelling so many hours to get to the FSU - believing a dose of 'speed dating' is a wise method to meet one's future spouse ..

VERY few are the guys who can remember important facts....if meeting SO many ladies... your head will be a spin ...plus there'll be the sensible keepers who'll never agree to meet guys wit such dating aspirations
We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Online Patagonie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2677
  • Country: fr
  • Gender: Male
  • >20 travels along the slavic earth
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #23 on: December 13, 2019, 01:49:00 AM »
I find myself agreeing with Bill a lot. I don't hold much interest in communications prior to a real meeting, and willing to move on quickly if there's a lack of chemistry.
Me too, it sucks my time, my energy. I prefer to go out, practice my hobbys, repare my house, meet friend, see my family, and chase locally.
Read : "Operation white panther"
"Je glissais through the paper wall, an angel in the hand, s taboy. I lay on the floor, surgi des chants de Maldoror, je mix l'intégrale de mes nuits de crystal, i belong to the festival.

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8181
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #24 on: December 13, 2019, 02:37:53 AM »
Me too, it sucks my time, my energy. I prefer to go out, practice my hobbys, repare my house, meet friend, see my family, and chase locally.
..

IF you just like to chase tail and fail..

VM IS the way to go ;)
We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Offline Boethius

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2012
  • Country: 00
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #25 on: December 13, 2019, 12:41:30 PM »
Correct me if I am mistaken, Bill, but I thought that you met Angel Eyes on a VO trip that didn't work out, i.e., you went to visit a woman, and she and you didn't hit it off.  So, you asked other women out for coffee.


If my recollection is accurate, your visit was not a VM, it's just that you regrouped rather than mope around or try to create a relationship where one would not arise.


This post was composed without the aid of google.
Mon pays ce n'est pas un pays, c'est l'hiver.

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9029
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #26 on: December 13, 2019, 01:19:31 PM »
Correct me if I am mistaken, Bill, but I thought that you met Angel Eyes on a VO trip that didn't work out, i.e., you went to visit a woman, and she and you didn't hit it off.  So, you asked other women out for coffee.

If my recollection is accurate, your visit was not a VM, it's just that you regrouped rather than mope around or try to create a relationship where one would not arise.

This post was composed without the aid of google.

You are mostly correct, the difference is just semantics. When first I traveled
to Voronezh it was to meet a different woman. It didn't work out so it turned
into a VM trip or my backup plan became a VM however you want to call it
I started seeing other girls that I had ZERO contact with previously. I had
4 or 5 dates before I found Angel Eyes. Once I met her, I cancelled a date
and pursued her exclusively.

I also went to Georgia to meet a girl on a VO trip. It didn't work out and I
tried to meet other girls in Georgia. I also made a VO trip to St Pete, it
didn't work out with the girl so I scrambled around finding other girls to
date. These dates were just a meeting for coffee and tea, occasionally
for lunch.

I made two VM trips to Kiev.

I made a VO trips to Odessa, Lugansk and Dnepropetrovsk where it fell
apart after the trip. I made VO trips to St Pete, Tblisi and Voronezh which
turned into VM. I made a trip to Portland Oregon to meet a girl who has a
tourist visa, but it didn't work out.

I do recommend VM as a backup plan, otherwise I recommend men to
do what fits their personality, goals and situations. I especially tell men
not to use VO tactics to visit many.

You can read a dozen trip reports where men write extensively to girls
and then want to meet several of them. I think that is a huge mistake
and that's the method that p!ss off FSUW.

Any good girl who you are communicating with extensively will want
to meet you at the airport. Obviously if you are meeting several girls
then you can't meet all of them at the airport. Now you have to do a
bunch of crap that is NOT conducive to building a relationship with an
FSUW. FSUW will screw with you and your time. Go read all the trip
reports where they do exactly that.

If you want to visit many you don't do that. It's far better to write nobody
until the week before the trip. Then ask them to meet you for tea. That's
my opinion of the way to visit many. You are actually meeting one girl,
and then determining what happens with that girl before meeting another.
You NEVER date a girl who you don't think is the ONE twice. You need to
either pursue her or dump her.

FSUW don't have a problem with this. I was meeting them. If we clicked 
then I would pursue them exclusively. If it didn't then I wish them success
and send them on their way.

If you aren't decisive then you can't do this. You can't go back and forth,
don't recycle girls. Either she is the girl or she's not. If you can't tell then
she's not.

FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Kiss the girl, don't ask her first.

Offline GQBlues

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8822
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #27 on: December 13, 2019, 02:55:39 PM »
I also went to Georgia to meet a girl on a VO trip. It didn't work out and I
tried to meet other girls in Georgia. I also made a VO trip to St Pete, it
didn't work out with the girl so I scrambled around finding other girls to
date.
These dates were just a meeting for coffee and tea, occasionally
for lunch.

I remember that. :devil:

Maybe my memory is a bit cloudy these days, but I thought it was far more than mere coffee, tea or an occasional lunch.

I think it involved 'black bars' and such...no? Wasn't that the genesis of the virtual 'war of Russian poison roses'?
~1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming
~

msmob  (Yes, he really said these)

Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9029
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 3-5 years
  • Trips: > 10
The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #28 on: December 14, 2019, 12:29:34 AM »
I remember that. :devil:

Maybe my memory is a bit cloudy these days, but I thought it was far more than mere coffee, tea or an occasional lunch.

I think it involved 'black bars' and such...no? Wasn't that the genesis of the virtual 'war of Russian poison roses'?

Your memory is mostly correct. I got on a scammer/sex tourist list because I posted
photos with the girls eyes blocked out. I deleted the photos later but then I was
designated as a lesser bad man because I wrote a trip report that they didn't like.

People who are interested can read the report here (Eventually found my dreamgirl)
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=3432.0
« Last Edit: December 14, 2019, 12:31:44 AM by 2tallbill »
FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Kiss the girl, don't ask her first.

Online Faux Pas

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9083
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: The visit one VO vs visit many VM debate thread
« Reply #29 on: December 14, 2019, 07:05:31 AM »
Your memory is mostly correct. I got on a scammer/sex tourist list because I posted
photos with the girls eyes blocked out. I deleted the photos later but then I was
designated as a lesser bad man because I wrote a trip report that they didn't like.

People who are interested can read the report here (Eventually found my dreamgirl)
http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=3432.0

I remember that and the invasion of the anti-date posters some of which still post here

 

+-RWD Stats

Members
Total Members: 10004
Latest: benl
New This Month: 11
New This Week: 3
New Today: 2
Stats
Total Posts: 498564
Total Topics: 19560
Most Online Today: 3193
Most Online Ever: 12701
(January 14, 2020, 07:04:55 AM)
Users Online
Members: 36
Guests: 3156
Total: 3192

+-Recent Posts

Re: bizness by krimster2
Today at 09:32:52 PM

Re: Starting and Running a Business in the Republic of Georgia, Batumi by BillyB
Today at 08:40:58 PM

Re: WE DID IT!!! by whynotme
Today at 08:21:39 PM

Re: bizness by BillyB
Today at 08:08:44 PM

Re: UK Royal Family privacy and Canada by BillyB
Today at 07:24:02 PM

Re: bizness by krimster2
Today at 01:16:26 PM

Re: bizness by ML
Today at 01:03:01 PM

Re: bizness by krimster2
Today at 12:57:34 PM

Re: bizness by msmob
Today at 12:47:46 PM

Re: Starting and Running a Business in the Republic of Georgia, Batumi by ML
Today at 12:30:17 PM

Powered by EzPortal

create account