It appears you have not registered with our community. To register please click here ...

!!

Welcome to Russian Women Discussion - the most informative site for all things related to serious long-term relationships and marriage to a partner from the Former Soviet Union countries!

Please register (it's free!) to gain full access to the many features and benefits of the site. Welcome!

+-

Author Topic: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)  (Read 42725 times)

0 Members and 12 Guests are viewing this topic.

Online Confederate

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 678
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: 1 - 3
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1725 on: September 25, 2020, 07:55:08 PM »
The increase and now massive testing it would seem is going to drive up the numbers. However, in consideration of all of the preventative measures taken, do you get the feeling someone is pulling the strings on the numbers as far as "upticks" go? They said there would be one in July, there was then they said there would be one when schools opened in the fall, there is. Now they're saying there will be another massive one with the winter flu season. They have a firm grip on the fearmongering and refuse to let it go.

Fear porn is what it is.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2020, 08:19:45 PM by Confederate »
War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.
George Orwell 1984

Online Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16423
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1726 on: September 27, 2020, 07:08:09 AM »
Florida citizens are in mitigation fatigue.   

That's why I favor a shorter strict lockdown that's effective to get numbers down to good test n trace levels rather than dragging things on month after month..

Here the after summer wave has hit, but still manageable with low positivity rates, much like the US NE states.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2020, 07:35:21 AM by BC »

Online Faux Pas

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9697
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1727 on: September 27, 2020, 08:03:39 AM »
That's why I favor a shorter strict lockdown that's effective to get numbers down to good test n trace levels rather than dragging things on month after month..

Here the after summer wave has hit, but still manageable with low positivity rates, much like the US NE states.

The lock downs, masks, gloves, sanitizing measures and social distancing has proved ineffective. The spikes continue. Why does this factoid go unmentioned?

Offline BC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12382
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1728 on: September 27, 2020, 08:12:11 AM »
FP,

I wouldn't say ineffective at all, just imperfect as there are still those that do not abide by the rules.

Here it has been quite effective, but still not perfect.  At least it's not much of a political deal but instead simple complacency.

Online Faux Pas

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9697
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: No Selection
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1729 on: September 27, 2020, 08:29:51 AM »
FP,

I wouldn't say ineffective at all, just imperfect as there are still those that do not abide by the rules.

Here it has been quite effective, but still not perfect.  At least it's not much of a political deal but instead simple complacency.

BC,

Where the US splashes, the ripples are felt around the world.  I believe it's not a political deal in Italy, I really do. It's a pacifier and submission to something they don't understand. Following orders if you will.

They certainly have you believing it is effective. I'll give you that. You might ask what would happen if we didn't take these measures? We'll never know, will we? They tell us covid is in the finest of mist and can remain airborne for hours. This tosses out the distancing, doesn't it? n-95 and surgical masks are at best 12% effective. That means it's 88% ineffective. Most cloth facial coverings are 100% ineffective. Never has the CDC called for gas mask and hazmat suits which then would only be about 80% effective. We're being sold a bill of goods BC. As bright as you are, I don't know how you can miss that.

Spikes and increasing infections would have happened without the submission to the junk science side of it, dont'cha think?

Online BillyB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14779
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
    • Good Story
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1730 on: September 27, 2020, 09:25:21 AM »
The lock downs, masks, gloves, sanitizing measures and social distancing has proved ineffective. The spikes continue. Why does this factoid go unmentioned?


They are each effective to some degree. The vaccines that will come out won't be 100% effective either but add all layers of protection and the spread rate significantly decreases. The spikes we are seeing is only after governors ease restrictions and we try to go back to living life normally. By the end of the year, states like NY and NJ will have 1 out of every 500 citizens dead from COVID. There are far few deaths per day today than there was deaths per day months ago because they took action to prevent the spread and continue to take action although they ease up on some restrictions.

Here's the Rt link BC provided. In March when we didn't take measures to limit the spread, the Rt rate skyrocketed. Only after we used masks, cleaned hands more often, limited our activities, and social distanced did we bring the Rt to manageable levels.

http://rt.live/
Do your part to limit the spread of COVID-19

Offline fathertime

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8691
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1731 on: September 27, 2020, 02:16:11 PM »


They certainly have you believing it is effective. I'll give you that. You might ask what would happen if we didn't take these measures? We'll never know, will we? They tell us covid is in the finest of mist and can remain airborne for hours. This tosses out the distancing, doesn't it? n-95 and surgical masks are at best 12% effective. That means it's 88% ineffective. Most cloth facial coverings are 100% ineffective. Never has the CDC called for gas mask and hazmat suits which then would only be about 80% effective. We're being sold a bill of goods BC. As bright as you are, I don't know how you can miss that.

Spikes and increasing infections would have happened without the submission to the junk science side of it, dont'cha think?
Well old mobers strikes again, you are in agreement with him over masks. 

My own view remains that the virus will continue to wreck havoc and there isn't much that can be done.  I don't think trump can do much to stop it and don't necessarily fault his version of a response.  Other countries have clearly done better but they may have a different situation and populace to deal with.  Here in the states we have a lot of older and obese people that can't live through the virus...in africa they don't have that problem.  My wife/son are getting tested tomorrow for covid since they are travelling to colombia later in the week.  Colombia has been hit hard, this despite a strict lockdown.   

Fathertime! 
I just happened to be browsing about the internet....

Online tfcrew

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4762
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • North Texas
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1732 on: September 28, 2020, 10:02:00 AM »
Quote
Perhaps the worst side effect of COVID-19 is the total abandonment of logic and reason by many, many people in our nation. And simultaneously, those same people behave with an insane level of condescension while doling out their lessons.
http://townhall.com/columnists/adamguillette/2020/09/28/i-received-the-vaccineand-a-lecture-n2577058
The same kind of people [including Joe Biden] that blame Donald Trump for the 200K who have succumbed to the virus. 
 Remember that millions of Americans were to die when the pandemic report surfaced?
 
~There is no one more blind than those who refuse to see and none more deaf as those who will not listen~

Online GQBlues

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10483
  • Country: us
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: No Selection
  • Trips: None (yet)
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1733 on: September 28, 2020, 04:17:14 PM »
http://townhall.com/columnists/adamguillette/2020/09/28/i-received-the-vaccineand-a-lecture-n2577058
The same kind of people [including Joe Biden] that blame Donald Trump for the 200K who have succumbed to the virus. 
 Remember that millions of Americans were to die when the pandemic report surfaced?
 


Correction. Biden declared 2 million US dead due to COVID-19.
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Online BillyB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14779
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
    • Good Story
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1734 on: September 28, 2020, 04:53:40 PM »

Correction. Biden declared 2 million US dead due to COVID-19.


I didn't watch that video. I did watch a video recently where he said 200 Americans died of COVID and another video where he said 200 million Americans died of COVID. He got the number 2 right.
Do your part to limit the spread of COVID-19

Online BillyB

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14779
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
    • Good Story
  • Spouse's Country: Ukraine
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1735 on: September 28, 2020, 09:45:15 PM »
What's up with you guys in California voting in Democratic politicians that refuse to wear masks in public places? Somebody needs to tell them there's a pandemic going on. I wonder if Senator Feinstein will pull a Pelosi and say she was set up by the airport.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8783661/PICTURED-Democratic-Sen-Dianne-Feinstein-seen-walking-Washing-DC-airport-without-mask.html
« Last Edit: September 28, 2020, 09:50:41 PM by BillyB »
Do your part to limit the spread of COVID-19

Online Trenchcoat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5550
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: Looking 3-5 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1736 on: October 03, 2020, 03:23:50 AM »
Ok guys, had a major brainwave last night and think I've got this pandemic think all worked out. My thought is and remember you've heard it here first ;) is that eventually nearly all of us will build up immunity to this virus, in fact I think it is probably already happening. Now we know that a person needs to breath in a fair amount of particles off it to catch it. My thought is that odds are people in general are breathing in small doses of the virus, enough for the body to create an response but not enough to catch it fully. Over time that response builds up and we become immune to it, so almost vaccine like in its own way. We already know the virus can attach to pollution particles and so can disperse widely. We also know that bats have natural immunity to the virus. What are the odds that similar occured there.

So far in the UK there has been a lot less deaths during this second wave. Now I know it takes time for cases to follow through and there are drugs around now but I'm reckoning in general this could likely be down to the population already building up natural immunity to the virus. I reckon that repeated exposure to small particles will end up building up a natural long term immunity to the virus no vaccine needed.
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Online Trenchcoat

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5550
  • Country: gb
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: No Selection
  • Status: Looking 3-5 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1737 on: October 07, 2020, 02:29:16 PM »
Well the virus contracting figures seem to be massively on the up worldwide with many countries on their second wave. Here in the UK the virus figures have gone way up and we're going into a big second wave. Death figures have so far risen slowly but are on the up so we're have to see if they really jump in a couple of weeks like before. Then we'll know whether it's a case of hold on tight and hope for the best.
No Deal is Ideal, It's a Free Britain we want :)

Online Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16423
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1738 on: October 09, 2020, 07:21:43 AM »
The Trump Treatment for Covid Is Coming Soon - WSJ

                                         Op-ed by Scott Gottlieb - former FDA Commissioner

http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-trump-treatment-for-covid-is-coming-soon-11602181229


We now know that a week ago, Trump was developing a severe response to his COVID infection and had to be hospitalized.  His medical team ordered a cocktail of various drugs, one drug still in experimental trials and not yet granted Emergency Use Authorization (EUA) by the FDA for the treatment of COVID.   Another was administered under a recent EUA. 

The results are indeed remarkable:  Trump's doctors expect him to be able to participate in events tomorrow, a mere eight days days after hospitalization.

These two new drugs were advanced as part of Trump's Warp Speed program, the program that could have one hundred million doses of vaccine ready to go in a couple of months.   The two new drugs used to treat Trump were not vaccines, but therapeutics:

            Gilead's Remdesivir - An inhibitor recently granted an EUA.   .  Trials show in comparison to placebos that Remdesivir reduced the death rate in 70% of infected patients so ill as to need supplemental oxygen.  And it reduced hospital stays by five days.

            Regeneron's REGN-COV2 -  an antibody cocktail administered IV providing the same antibodies expected to be produced in response to a vaccine, except the Regeneron antibodies are produced in vitro.

The Democrats' political campaign of fear mongering has already cast doubt on the vaccines to be available soon.   Pence told Kamala during the debate that her campaign of fear mongering discourages use of vaccines and is "unconscionable."   And I agree, given so many ill-informed Americans already are averse to any vaccination. 

Will the Democrat's same politics of fear  be applied to the two therapeutics that prompted a remarkable recovery by Trump?    Is this not indeed "unconscionable?"

Online msmob

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10202
  • Country: ie
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 0-2 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1739 on: October 09, 2020, 07:31:01 AM »
I don't perceive realistic expectations of a properly tested vaccine NOT being available soon in any numbers as 'fear mongering' .

It is being honest.


I cannot comment on 'Trampu's' health / 'recovery', as we don't know all the circumstances,other than a lot of ignorant politicians and mover /shakers getting too close and not respecting good practice.


Online Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16423
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1740 on: October 09, 2020, 08:41:21 AM »
I don't perceive realistic expectations of a properly tested vaccine NOT being available soon in any numbers as 'fear mongering' .

It is being honest.


"NOT being available soon in any numbers" is unspecific, typical of your posts.  Barring some highly unlikely event, it will happen 1Q2021.  That's specific, and take it to the bank. 

As your basis for deriving your "honest" fear:   Are you one of the corporate leaders of the pharmaceutical industry?  Do you sit on regulatory bodies?   Have you any experience in investing in new drugs?  Do you understand the mission and backing of Operation Warp Speed?  Do you understand the theory of vaccines?  Do you have a shred of optimism? 

The answers, No, No, No, No, No, and No. 

You are allowing your brain to be victimized by the politics of fear and are merely repeating it.  Liberal sheeple.   

Offline BC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12382
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1741 on: October 09, 2020, 08:51:22 AM »
Gator,

Warp speed is about supporting pre-production and taking on part of the risk before trials are over.  Most nations are doing it.

Online Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16423
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1742 on: October 09, 2020, 09:17:20 AM »
Gator,

Warp speed is about supporting pre-production and taking on part of the risk before trials are over.

Yes as reflected in my posts months ago. 

The key part is the phramaceutical companies are doing the work under the auspices of the FDA.  Because of govt funding, the companies are investing more money when normally they would proceed over years to reduce investment risks.   

Please tell Kamala that Trump and his West Wing are not doing the R&D, nor approving it.   


 
Quote
Most nations are doing it.

Who does more of it?  Who does it better? 

I will not ask who does it faster because we know the answer is Russia. 

When consulting for a client in a jam, I would say to  them:  "Fast, low cost,  high quality.   Pick any two."



Online 2tallbill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10238
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Living the dream
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1743 on: October 09, 2020, 09:28:36 AM »
Florida teen reportedly arrested after not wearing mask while having panic attack
http://nypost.com/2020/10/07/teen-arrested-after-not-wearing-mask-while-having-panic-attack-report/
FSUW are not for entry level daters
FSUW don't do vague
FSUW like a man of action. Be a man of action 
If you find a promising girl, get your butt on a plane.
There are a hundred ways to be successful and a thousand ways to f#ck it up
Kiss the girl, don't ask her first.

Offline BC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12382
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1744 on: October 09, 2020, 10:28:49 AM »
Yes as reflected in my posts months ago. 

The key part is the phramaceutical companies are doing the work under the auspices of the FDA.  Because of govt funding, the companies are investing more money when normally they would proceed over years to reduce investment risks.

IIRC the same companies in 'warp' are also being supported by others. 

Quote
Please tell Kamala that Trump and his West Wing are not doing the R&D, nor approving it.   

Approving and lowering the bar for approvals are two different things.


Quote
Who does more of it?  Who does it better?


You are probably faster with a calculator than I.  As for more, I would say 'substantial', as for better, pharma company A, supported by multiple countries won't sell different qualities.

Quote
I will not ask who does it faster because we know the answer is Russia.
 

Indeed, phase III cut out completely, whereas Trump wants to shorten it.

Quote
When consulting for a client in a jam, I would say to  them:  "Fast, low cost,  high quality.   Pick any two."

Looks like for some, it will be lower price for same quality.  On a per dose basis, Europeans will be paying less at least last time I looked.

Online Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16423
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1745 on: October 09, 2020, 02:49:38 PM »
IIRC the same companies in 'warp' are also being supported by others. 

Yes, in exchange for advanced purchases to be delivered when regulatory approvals for use are granted.   

Quote
Approving and lowering the bar for approvals are two different things.

As part of Warp Speed, the Phase 3 trials are shortened, but in no instance less than two months.   The pharma companies are still concerned with liability and nothing will compel them to deliver if their records and data show it is not safe.   

Quote
You are probably faster with a calculator than I.  As for more, I would say 'substantial', as for better, pharma company A, supported by multiple countries won't sell different qualities.

Of course not.  The relative contributions by different nations can be estimated by quantity of their preordered doses.  And not all nations are participating in all vaccines.  I believe the US is participating in seven, and many more vaccines than that are being researched around the globe. 
 

Quote
Indeed, phase III cut out completely, whereas Trump wants to shorten it.

Not the full truth.  I understand a minimum of two months has been established, and it will be longer because
not all available doses will be administered immediately.  The roll out of all doses could take months, but loess than a year for the entire nation.   The roll-out varies by vaccine.  A couple require -40C storage.   

Quote
Looks like for some, it will be lower price for same quality.  On a per dose basis, Europeans will be paying less at least last time I looked.

You always have for essentially all pharmaceuticals, something that Presidents and Congress have complained about for a long time, yet never  changed the policy.  Some reduced pricing is needed for less wealthy nations. 

Offline BC

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12382
  • Country: it
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married > 10 years
  • Trips: 4 - 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1746 on: October 09, 2020, 05:33:27 PM »
Yes, in exchange for advanced purchases to be delivered when regulatory approvals for use are granted.

A lot more than that.  See below.   

Quote
As part of Warp Speed, the Phase 3 trials are shortened, but in no instance less than two months.   The pharma companies are still concerned with liability and nothing will compel them to deliver if their records and data show it is not safe.
   

Indeed. As far as Europe goes they have an advantage with liability aspects.  It's called universal healthcare. Yep again a win as far as liability is concerned lower costs AND lower prices.  Do you now see a relationship, buying power, and advantages that universal healthcare brings to the bargaining table and how lower pharma costs also support it?

Quote
Of course not.  The relative contributions by different nations can be estimated by quantity of their preordered doses.  And not all nations are participating in all vaccines.  I believe the US is participating in seven, and many more vaccines than that are being researched around the globe. 

Although this topic is worth its own thread, here's a partial picture:

http://www.euractiv.com/section/coronavirus/news/eu-pays-e336-mln-to-secure-astrazenecas-potential-covid-19-vaccine/

Quote
The overall price they will pay to acquire the doses has not been revealed, but under an earlier deal struck in June with AstraZeneca by Germany, France, Italy and the Netherlands, all members of the EU, AstraZeneca agreed to sell 300 million doses for 750 million.

Quote
AstraZeneca has already agreed the supply of 300 million shots of the same vaccine to the United States for $1.2 billion

Sharpen your pencil...

But wait! There's more!... How about:

http://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/22/us/politics/pfizer-coronavirus-vaccine.html

Quote
A European-led fund-raising effort in May brought $8 billion in pledges from the worlds governments, philanthropists and leaders for coronavirus vaccine research, even with the United States sitting out the conference.

Quote
Germany recently took a 23 percent stake in a German firm, CureVac, that President Trump once tried to lure to American shores in hopes that its vaccine, if successful, would be distributed in the United States first.
And there is much much more.

Some interesting figures to fiddle with. Some quick head math seems to show the EU, Germany, and others are getting a pretty good deal or?

Quote
Not the full truth.  I understand a minimum of two months has been established, and it will be longer because
not all available doses will be administered immediately.  The roll out of all doses could take months, but loess than a year for the entire nation.   The roll-out varies by vaccine.  A couple require -40C storage. 


I'm not too worried as many of the manufacturers have agreed with each other in a manner to keep political push out of the game.  The concern with Trump is his undue influence efforts over CDC in the issuance process and approval of EUA's

Quote
You always have for essentially all pharmaceuticals, something that Presidents and Congress have complained about for a long time, yet never  changed the policy.  Some reduced pricing is needed for less wealthy nations.

Yes, the EU has addressed these aspects via COVAX.  Read the following article closely, keep in mind the US is (again) not participating in a global effort, and consider the purchasing power and leverage vs Trump's 'wheeling and dealing'.  Which do you think will be more effective down the road?  Consider also that most likely that the vaccine is not a one or two-shot deal.  We're talking yearly purchases.  Maybe Biden will join up as well, IMO a much better deal than Trump and the US 'going it alone'.

http://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_1540

Quote
The European Commission is committed to ensuring that everyone who needs a vaccine gets it, anywhere in the world and not only at home. No one will be safe until everyone is safe. This is why it immediately responded to the WHO's call for action and has raised almost 16 billion since 4 May 2020 under the Coronavirus Global Response, the global action for universal access to tests, treatments and vaccines against coronavirus and for the global recovery.

Although you and others seem convinced that due to Trump's magic the US is contributing and doing more than anyone else, that is very likely not the case.  But lets put politics aside for a moment and look closely at the best and most effective overall approach to vaccine development, distribution whilst maintaining low prices and maximizing availability.  This is a huge missed opportunity for the US to lead the charge against this virus, and benefit.  Instead, we have relegated ourselves to the bleachers on the world stage, viewed upon in dismay by the rest of the world for our self-serving posture.  O'Brien was right. "This will be the biggest national security threat you face in your presidency,".  I would delete 'you face in your presidency' and insert 'we as a Nation face'.

It is truly, and very SAD.

Politics somewhat aside, would you agree or disagree with my assessment?

Online Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16423
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1747 on: October 12, 2020, 07:56:15 AM »

Some interesting figures to fiddle with. Some quick head math seems to show the EU, Germany, and others are getting a pretty good deal or?


Three explanations: 

1.  Lower prices has always been the case for EU for medicines.  Canada also has lower prices. That's what happens in a  laissez-faire vs. big government, socialistic societies.  In one way it is good because the high US pricing has indirectly been subsidizing lower prices to less wealthy countries for a long, long time. It is surprising that EU chose not to contribute but to suck on the same teat of subsidies. 

2.  AstraZeneca is actually a consortium of Europe pharmaceutical companies and Europe university, so Europe needs to get an edge.   The other leading vaccines are being developed mostly by US companies.  I do know that the US has already paid for much of the supply.

3. AZ vaccine is inferior to  developing US vaccines according to Nancy Pelosi (ha ha) - read more about that and you will begin to understand how wacky our Speaker can be.
 

Quote
The concern with Trump is his undue influence efforts over CDC in the issuance process and approval of EUA's

CDC has nothing to do with EUA's.  Regarding Trump, as is his nature he did not hide in the basement but pushed for action.   Regardless, the FDA will make the safety decisions as the process was designed decades ago. 


Quote
...the EU has addressed these aspects via COVAX..... keep in mind the US is (again) not participating in a global effort, and consider the purchasing power and leverage vs Trump's 'wheeling and dealing'.  Which do you think will be more effective down the road? 

Isn't the COVAX initiative more about "equitable access to affordable vaccines" than getting a better price for Europe.  EU has been buying subsidized medicine for decades, and they should use those savings to step up and help Africa, et al.  The US will be helping too. 


Quote
But lets put politics aside for a moment and look closely at the best and most effective overall approach to vaccine development....

Splendid, lets do that.  However, after saying you are putting politics aside, in your next breath you criticized Trump's policies.  You are hopeless.

Quote
This is a huge missed opportunity for the US to lead the charge against this virus, and benefit.  Instead, we have relegated ourselves to the bleachers on the world stage, viewed upon in dismay by the rest of the world for our self-serving posture.

It is good that Europe is working together.  I say that because you need to just to keep up.   



Quote
It is truly, and very SAD.

Yes it is to be mired in fearmongering, spying on the President, lying to the public,  obstructing the President, fomenting hatred....all because of the left's great compulsion to gain power, regardless of the costs. 
 


Online Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16423
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1748 on: October 12, 2020, 08:03:01 AM »

Politics somewhat aside, would you agree or disagree with my assessment?

So you want to try again.  OK, let's try. 

COVAX seems like it could evolve into government control of the pharmaceutical companies.  Making them regulated utilities with control over not only prices but production, distribution, investments, maintenance, etc.     The government should regulate safety and safety only.  If the companies gouge the public regarding prices   

This is based on a one-minute read of COVAX.  Devil could be in the details.

___________________________


Regarding the US approach, Trump very early recognized vaccines are the only answer to the pandemic.  He promptly started a private-public collaboration to develop the vaccines at "warp speed".  And many months later, you find fault with his initiative?!

Biden and your party found fault with Trump's travel restrictions in January.  Who was correct?

You found fault with Trump not disclosing to the public in the early months haw dangerous the virus could be.   If Trump had been completely candid, he would created a panic.  I question how many essential workers would have reported to work.  Imagine life in NYC or anywhere with limited availability of  food stores, pharmacies, etc. 

« Last Edit: October 12, 2020, 08:28:45 AM by Gator »

Online Gator

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16423
  • Country: us
  • Gender: Male
  • Spouse's Country: Russia
  • Status: Married 5-10 years
  • Trips: > 10
Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China)
« Reply #1749 on: October 12, 2020, 08:16:06 AM »
The Scientists and Doctors Change their Minds....Again

The World Health Organization has warned leaders against relying on COVID-19 lockdowns to tackle outbreaks.

We in the World Health Organization do not advocate lockdowns as the primary means of control of this virus, Nabarro said.

The only time we believe a lockdown is justified is to buy you time to reorganize, regroup, rebalance your resources, protect your health workers who are exhausted, but by and large, wed rather not do it.

Nabarro said tight restrictions cause significant harm, particularly on the global economy.

Lockdowns just have one consequence that you must never, ever belittle, and that is making poor people an awful lot poorer, he said.

http://nypost.com/2020/10/11/who-warns-against-covid-19-lockdowns-due-to-economic-damage/



Before reading too much in this, I am sure if you listened to the one hour video, the WHO would be stressing the need for testing, contact tracing and quarantine.    The US is well behind Asia in such vcapabilities.  For example, an outbreak occurred just recently in a Chinese city of several million citizens.   China intends to test 90% of the city's population within one week!!!!! 

The US does not have the capacity for such testing.  Even if we did, compliance  of the population with testing would be impossible.

 

+-RWD Stats

Members
Total Members: 8793
Latest: Brentpisse
New This Month: 12
New This Week: 2
New Today: 0
Stats
Total Posts: 516321
Total Topics: 19989
Most Online Today: 1657
Most Online Ever: 12701
(January 14, 2020, 07:04:55 AM)
Users Online
Members: 27
Guests: 1615
Total: 1642

+-Recent Posts

Re: Japtats Trip report by ML
Today at 10:16:16 AM

Re: Operation White Panther by msmob
Today at 09:44:12 AM

Re: Japtats Trip report by Patagonie
Today at 09:02:54 AM

Re: Operation White Panther by Patagonie
Today at 08:59:21 AM

Re: Japtats Trip report by japtats
Today at 07:45:58 AM

Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent? by msmob
Today at 07:42:47 AM

Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China) by Gator
Today at 06:37:30 AM

Re: 2019 - nCoV (novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan, China) by Gator
Today at 06:35:22 AM

Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent? by msmob
Today at 06:27:35 AM

Re: Brexit good, bad or indifferent? by fathertime
Today at 05:56:29 AM

Powered by EzPortal