Thoughts on this business idea

[Trenchcoat]

I was just wondering what members thoughts on this business idea might be. I was thinking about a business where I could offer FSW personal guidance on what to wear and how to present themselves for dating. Potentially kind of like a finishing school to prepare them to be appealing to western men. This I think could happen both online and offline potentially with premises dedicated to such in Ukraine in the future although I have no plans as such at present just turning this idea over in my mind really 🤔

[2tallbill]

I was just wondering what members thoughts on this business idea might be. I was thinking about a business where I could offer FSW personal guidance on what to wear and how to present themselves for dating. Potentially kind of like a finishing school to prepare them to be appealing to western men. This I think could happen both online and offline potentially with premises dedicated to such in Ukraine in the future although I have no plans as such at present just turning this idea over in my mind really 🤔

Hahahaha!

Let me know the second you get a single kopeck out of the pocket of an FSUW.

[olgac]

these days there are so many online coaches male and female on Russian language internet as well as so-called "psychologists" with no diploma, I would say the space is oversaturated. Besides every FSUW who was somehow successful in marrying a rich man or CLAIms she was successful, starts online coaching business on how to accomplish the same, and she will have more credibility that You. These are called "инфоцигане".

[Steven1971]

The only women who would need advice only speak Ukrainian or Russian. English speaking FSW would be sufficiently worldly wise to not need a coach. As the French say: "Cherchez l'erreur".

[Trenchcoat]

Thanks guys for the comments. I think your comments are probably valid but I think this business idea could be refined.

My thoughts now are maybe if I do this service as part of a dating agency service. A bit like the Mordinson guy used to do in Kharkiv. I don't think he worked on the girls and their presentation at all as far as I know but I mean more the personal on to one meet ups and in addition I would work on the presentation of the girl with her.

I remember one Anastasia Date tour video on YouTube years ago when they used to do tours (they stopped doing tours years ago) featured a Mother who was chaperoning her Daughter at one of the tours. She hoped to set her Daughter up with a wealthy man. I am thinking that perhaps a business could cater to such an outlook 🤔

I think the business would have to be in Ukraine with physical premises. Too many people are trying to make a go of a business online on the cheap these days.

[Steven1971]

Women who wanted to leave Ukraine left in 2022. If you're still in Ukraine during war time that seems to indicate a desire to stay. Women under 25 I imagine are on Tinder or whatever Ukrainian dating app exists. Unless they volunteer to go to the front men under 25 don't have to serve.

While a relationship is a nice thing to have I would question how important it is when your country is under attack.

[Trenchcoat]

Women who wanted to leave Ukraine left in 2022. If you're still in Ukraine during war time that seems to indicate a desire to stay. Women under 25 I imagine are on Tinder or whatever Ukrainian dating app exists. Unless they volunteer to go to the front men under 25 don't have to serve.

While a relationship is a nice thing to have I would question how important it is when your country is under attack.

That may be somewhat true. It is said that most of those who fled Ukraine from 2022 onwards were the more wealthier Ukrainians. I think that is somewhat true also. Even as refugees you really often need some good money/income to fall back on if you are fleeing to another country. While some countries have benefits for refugees it can vary as to whether that is sufficient, add in healthcare, dental care, need to return to Ukraine, any pets, etc and it can mean that in reality it may be a no go for many of the poorer Ukrainians. If jobs that Ukrainian women rely upon are left behind etc then many may see it as a no go.

That said it is true I think that many young Ukrainian Women don't wish to leave Ukraine because they have their family & friends there, their lifestyle and the country they are comfortable in, so far as that goes. Some Ukrainian women also don't speak English well or not at all and some may have no desire to improve that.

Ukraine at the moment is not the country it was pre war, it's electricity grid is smashed and its economy not so great with a lot of inflation. There is a housing shortage as a lot of homes have been destroyed so rents are higher than they were, good prices are higher. Some women may be not so comfortable there as they were and with bombs dropping on them might be looking for a way out but needing help in certain areas to achieve that.

Not all may be it is true, apparently Tinder has become much like in the West out there now, used by those locals that want a quick hook up. Not all Ukrainian women want that, some want a long term relationship of course. I think potentially another way to put this business across could be to set Ukrainian women up with local or foreign men. To help the Ukrainian woman out with his she presents herself so she will be more attractive to local men if that is what she wants. For sure done Ukrainian women just want a good local guy so that they can continue their lives in Ukraine but up their lifestyle or be with the man who attracts their attention.

Believe me Steven most of these women are still interested in dating even when their country is under attack. For sure if there is a homelessness issue or a loss of a loved one it will probably come top for a while but many Ukrainian women still wish to date as they see it as their future.

Many young Ukrainian men aged 18-22 are now flooding out of Ukraine due to a recent change in the law allowing them to do so. I think the Ukrainian government may have made a grace mistake there as many may not be back, ever. The could potentially find a girl in the West and/or a job that pays way more than back in Ukraine, settle down and get used to life in the West. Ukraine will then have a demographic problem even if it wins the war.

That may make it prime hunting ground for the thirsty Westerner

[2tallbill]

Too many people are trying to make a go of a business online on the cheap these days.

The future of doing this on the cheap is to go full AI. They won't have any real girls.
They won't even need to speak English, they will just run charges on the punters
credit cards. I don't think you know computers well enough to do this yourself. 
Some young Ukrainian guy will figure it out first.

Say, maybe you can be a hairy Boris/Russian scammer.
Create a scammer girl using Russian porn stars/athletes/popstars
Use chat GPT to write form letters to the punters, tell them that you
just need a ticket/visa or that your granny stepped on a landmine while
picking mushrooms in the forest or needs a kidney from radiation leaking
from the Nuke facilities hit with Russian bombs.

Surely you could think up a few on your own.

[Trenchcoat]

The future of doing this on the cheap is to go full AI. They won't have any real girls.
They won't even need to speak English, they will just run charges on the punters
credit cards. I don't think you know computers well enough to do this yourself. 
Some young Ukrainian guy will figure it out first.

Say, maybe you can be a hairy Boris/Russian scammer.
Create a scammer girl using Russian porn stars/athletes/popstars
Use chat GPT to write form letters to the punters, tell them that you
just need a ticket/visa or that your granny stepped on a landmine while
picking mushrooms in the forest or needs a kidney from radiation leaking
from the Nuke facilities hit with Russian bombs.

Surely you could think up a few on your own.

Some guys will love AI girlfriends, they will fulfill what they need and there's nothing wrong with that.

However I think sone people overestimate that all single men will go that way. I don't think that they will. I think there will still be a need for single men who want to meet real women and have a real relationship with someone that they can physically be with. That may be the big underestimation in all of this, and a potential opportunity.

I would never want to do the hairy Boris scam thing, it's not nice to scam people and I wouldn't want to do to others what I wouldn't like done to myself. A lot of harm can be caused to innocent people who genuinely want to find someone and others placing themselves in the way of that is plain wrong.

A lot of the old players in the dating game seem to have exited the scene perhaps never to return so I think in the future there is good opportunity to move into the the void created maybe even do something a little bit new 🤔

[2tallbill]

Some guys will love AI girlfriends, they will fulfill what they need and there's nothing wrong with that.

However I think sone people overestimate that all single men will go that way. I don't think that they will. I think there will still be a need for single men who want to meet real women and have a real relationship with someone that they can physically be with. That may be the big underestimation in all of this, and a potential opportunity.

Of course all single men won't go for that. Most single men will stick with the local
cows girls. The men who go their own way are a small subset of men. The
men who go to the FSU is a small subset of that. The girls from the FSU who will
pay a man from the UK for advice on how to dress or successfully attract Western
men is a null set.

I was joking about the Hairy Boris stuff. It takes a Hairy Boris to be one.

[Trenchcoat]

Of course all single men won't go for that. Most single men will stick with the local
cows girls. The men who go their own way are a small subset of men. The
men who go to the FSU is a small subset of that. The girls from the FSU who will
pay a man from the UK for advice on how to dress or successfully attract Western
men is a null set.

I was joking about the Hairy Boris stuff. It takes a Hairy Boris to be one.

Well, here is an interesting article from down my way, it goes a long way to explain why so many guys are single these days and what is causing them to be incels:

http://www-bbc-co-uk.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce8zgm2307mo.amp?amp_js_v=0.1&amp_gsa=1#webview=1

So basically there are many girls that are just interested in hanging out with other girls presumably they are not lesbians lol. No these tend to be straight women but they just haven't grown up yet, they want the party to continue forever more but usually it all comes crashing down once they hit 40 or so.

They basically tend not to want to know about dating decent everyday guys, maybe they might get with the Chads here and there but some don't want to know men at all. They see it as it is safer and easier to just hang out with the girls like they did in Primary School. They are basically just lazy and don't want to grow up and accept responsibilities, I have seen online on forums women like this who literally say that they wish to just hang out with other women like they did in Primary School, I guess it's a safe easy time for them as I always tend to think the School environment is nicer to Women particularly in Primary School.

Anyway, that's what goes on in the UK and has been for some time I think. That girl has gone through Uni, could had pulled a decent guy easy but didn't want too. Even after Uni she still doesn't want to grow up. She could easily get a guy quickly if she went to a Speed Dating event but she just doesn't want to get a guy even though it's easy. Never mind the lonely guys who are out there and left alone, she only cares if her own issues over loneliness.

Where she is going with this I don't know it's totally silly but if she passes over on guys now she is likely to end up alone later on in life. It doesn't have to be this way but this is what UK women are inflicting on UK men and themselves, it's totally stupid.

Why more UK dudes dong look abroad I don't know, maybe many are lazy also. I think many are conditioned into thinking that they have to go for a UK girl or nothing and there is nothing else. That is not true though. Back in the day I had no idea that the dating scene could be better abroad. I had no idea that the dating scene was so bad here and like this above. I think the abode with women has been going on a while and partly due to fallout from divorces from the 90s and partly due to women earning equally to men these days. These women have wrongly taken it as men are not relevant anymore I think. Anyway, younger guys have the heads up on this sort of going on that I never did. If I were them I would be thinking let's forget UK women as that's just wasting time and let's instead get a life with a FSW. No point wasting your life away barking up the wrong tree as I see it.

[2tallbill]

Why more UK dudes dong look abroad I don't know, maybe many are lazy also. I think many are conditioned into thinking that they have to go for a UK girl or nothing and there is nothing else. That is not true though.

Why don't more men look abroad? It really depends on age. For young men, there are
still opportunities available locally. For older and divorced men, they are too scared,
they don't know the local language, they've been told horror stories, they pee a little
bit down their leg when they meet a "real girl". It takes a certain type of man to
get on a plane then fly around the world to meet a girl for the first time Which nearly
always fails, so then most men simply give up. They tried it they failed, they blame
someone else, and another horror story is out their to discourage the next guy.

There are more than a few snares, pitfalls and booby traps (with real boobies). So seeking
out a woman in a foreign land is not for most people. Most don't have the mental makeup
to pull it off. You need to be a self starter which most men aren't. 

Most men never find this forum, which is basically a how to do it guide, but even then
it's definitely still a difficult path to pursue.

I was too stubborn and I wanted to spend my life with a very high quality, loving woman
far too much to quit.

[Trenchcoat]

Why don't more men look abroad? It really depends on age. For young men, there are
still opportunities available locally. For older and divorced men, they are too scared,
they don't know the local language, they've been told horror stories, they pee a little
bit down their leg when they meet a "real girl". It takes a certain type of man to
get on a plane then fly around the world to meet a girl for the first time Which nearly
always fails, so then most men simply give up. They tried it they failed, they blame
someone else, and another horror story is out their to discourage the next guy.

There are more than a few snares, pitfalls and booby traps (with real boobies). So seeking
out a woman in a foreign land is not for most people. Most don't have the mental makeup
to pull it off. You need to be a self starter which most men aren't.

Most men never find this forum, which is basically a how to do it guide, but even then
it's definitely still a difficult path to pursue.

I was too stubborn and I wanted to spend my life with a very high quality, loving woman
far too much to quit.

You have a good insight into this I think Bill. Even back in Secondary (High) School my Business Studies Teacher described me as a 'self starter' which I think it is fair to say I am. I didn't excel in Business Studies other than that aspect of me though.

I think guys can have their niche for the women that suit their personality and natural abilities though some can be shut out entirely of the dating market.

I think you are right that only certain men with certain traits are attracted to FSU/International Dating. Their personality traits as you have shown is one of them and I think familiarity with the country is another, the language, the culture, etc. Some guys are willing to wade in without knowing about that stuff but most probably aren't.

Hence while it may seem as the logical and even obvious choice to date abroad if there is scarcity of dating opportunity at home most guys probably rule it out without even properly thinking about it as a no-go/non starter. A great shame for them I think.

[olgac]

Why don't more men look abroad? It really depends on age. For young men, there are
still opportunities available locally. For older and divorced men, they are too scared,
they don't know the local language, they've been told horror stories, they pee a little
bit down their leg when they meet a "real girl". It takes a certain type of man to
get on a plane then fly around the world to meet a girl for the first time Which nearly
always fails, so then most men simply give up. They tried it they failed, they blame
someone else, and another horror story is out their to discourage the next guy.

Well my dad when he was in his early 50s (this is when my parents got divorced) tried dating FSU women form US, and he was actually totally turned off and scared because he KNEW the language and culture and could see through many women and understand cultural nuances that regular Americans do not. So he ended up marrying a local Russian woman already here legally she ended up being a gold digger as well and he lost a lot of money in a divorce. Oh well. At least he didn't sign affidavit of support which some women successfully use in court.

OTOH. My father passed away a month ago from cancer and actually left me a lot as an inheritance (via trust fund) so he didn't lose everything to his second wife.

[Trenchcoat]

That's the interesting thing that potentially the number of Western Men willing to go to the FSU is likely limited, it can be a fair amount in terms of numbers of men from the Western World but it's percentage is likely small.

Likewise the number of FSW looking for a Western Man is quite small also, possibly a bit higher in times of bad economic times and/or war in FSU countries but overall the percentage again is probably often quite small.

My present girl I don't think had even thought about a guy abroad until she came to the UK as a refugee (in effect) and a fellow Ukrainian woman mentioned it to her and the dating site Fdate. This was a much older woman and after she had been UK the country about a year already.

As far as I know and I'm pretty sure, she hadn't dated anyone in the UK before she met me. While she is quite attractive looking she is slightly overweight from no fault of her own. So in all that time no guy made an obvious move on her/or presumably mutual interest with a UK guy. She had a bit of an accent but her English isn't bad but I am guessing the culture/foreigner gap put a fair amount of the local guys of from trying.

So if you consider that is a foreign girl who is within reach of local guys here and not very many are picking up then them actually getting on a plane to the FSU is probably even a greater reach.

The funny thing is with the romance tours such as the AFA/Love Me one. Aside from the terrible scammers and agency girls that you get there, some local girls just turn up for the party. The love tour companies, AFA, etc often don't mind that as it adds to the number of girls. Many of those girls have no intention of getting with a foreigner, some just go for the food, entertainment and may even be a big bored but it's something to do. However, some of those girls who had no intention of getting with a foreigner actually get with one, and there are the saviours of the love tours who without them would nearly always end up with no genuine matches.

Those local girls though who had no intention or probably even interest in foreign men and end up getting with one on those love tours show that if a guy really puts himself out there in a big way in the FSU that matches can occur with girls who wouldn't have usually considered dating foreign men, wouldn't have gone on Fdate, EM, etc. Possibly that they had gone along to an event where foreign men present might have meant that subconsciously they may have not been so opposed to foreign men. In any case it is interesting in showing that the size of the dating pool between the two countries can be larger depending on what factors are at play.

[Trenchcoat]

Well my dad when he was in his early 50s (this is when my parents got divorced) tried dating FSU women form US, and he was actually totally turned off and scared because he KNEW the language and culture and could see through many women and understand cultural nuances that regular Americans do not. So he ended up marrying a local Russian woman already here legally she ended up being a gold digger as well and he lost a lot of money in a divorce. Oh well. At least he didn't sign affidavit of support which some women successfully use in court.

OTOH. My father passed away a month ago from cancer and actually left me a lot as an inheritance (via trust fund) so he didn't lose everything to his second wife.

Sorry to hear that your Father has passed Olga I know it can't be easy. I remember you mentioning about his care early this year I think it was.

I'll be honest, so long as I am with my present girl I am avoidant of chasing other FSW as it's such a lottery and I could end up with all sorts of bad outcomes. I am into my present girl and vice versa though it's not always easy we get along well most of the time I think. I get the impression of a lot of FSW potentially being very manipulative and it kind of spooks me. Even with my present girl though she seems very genuine it sometimes plays on me over whether there is any manipulation techniques. I've had a FSW before who was and that puts me in edge and makes me wonder. I think it is important for WM to be aware that potentially a deep layer of manipulation can be found in some women in the FSU. It seems that your Father came across many unfortunately and even despite knowing the language and that sort of culture existing still unfortunately got a bad one. Potentially either someone very street savvy and/or luck can come into play with that one I think.

[olgac]

Thank You, Trench! You have been with a current one for a while, seems like the relationship is going strong!
Are You planning to marry?

[olgac]

Here is a very interesting recent post from reddit on belarus subreddit form an american man who had a relationship with a belorussian girl
http://www.reddit.com/r/belarus/comments/q4f411/dating_with_a_belarusian

Then my girlfriend started to use more and more gender objectives in our talks, a man should do this, a man should do that. A real man this, a real man that. Look, I am Turkish. I am not grown up in a pussy society. Whole my life I fought on the streets, I worked, I protected my friends and my loved ones, I looked after my mom, helped economically, this is patriarchal society, and I am sure it is already known globally that Turkey is not Germany. I said how on earth you can define what is man, while you are having boobs but not a dick? And when it comes to “a real woman should do this” she escapes. A real woman should cook every day, no, she doesn’t like cooking. End of the story. I cooked 70% of the times.

She has 100% belief that she will find a guy who will pay for her entire life as if she is a small kid and the guy is her father. But she lacks every other aspect of this traditional marriage, such as she won’t cook, she won’t have less than 30.000 followers on Instagram...