Immigration and Visas- Are Reforms Needed?

[Son of Clyde]

What if 50,000 AM were to use this visa process to romance 50,000 RW for the sake of some sexual gratification, marrying them to get the GC or just sending them back in 89 days? I think the government is trying to prevent the behavior of some undesirable, horny guys. 

[Bruce]

BC, I can not believe I disagree with you on this one but somehow I do.  You forced me to turn the ignore button off of Alfie by quoting his response which actually makes some sense to me.  After I read it I still clicked back the ignore button, but that is another story.  Why?  The system is hypocritical, unfair and severely broken in the USA.

Every time my wife has to travel to Russia I have to pay $170 plus notary fee.  I will soon be on my third payment as we sit in AOS limbo longer and longer.  It is no fun not receiving any status ie. pending adjustment for two plus years from the government.  The BCINS fees also go up every few years.  The longer the BCINS keeps our family in paperwork limbo the more dollars they drain out of us with every "service" they provide.  

The government does let a guy do a K-1 visa and get the women in, but from that point on it is a bureaucratic nightmare for many families, especially my family.  Keep in mind we have no RFE's the whole way and it is just the slow speed of the govmint we are dealing with.  Why should we even have to deal with it at all?

I'd love to see a guy (Born and bred Apple Pie American citizen) have the ability to sponser a girl for a tourist visa.  Why does our government seriously consider young women sponsored by American citizens to be terrorist threats?  They are not, and surely are as safe as any of the South Americans pouring accross the Southern border illegally.  As long as the border with Mexico is porous and 1 million plus illegal South Americans / others who go there are running into our country each year I have no problem with any tax paying American citizen sponsoring a girl on a tourist visa.  If she does not work out with the guy, gets a job or stays and does whatever as long as she does not commit a crime and becomes another "illegal Iimmigrant"  I would be a lot happier then I am with the status quo.

Where are those minutemen and when are they going to be allowed to shoot???

[BC]

Bruce,

I appreciate your perspective and agree you present valid arguments.  My posts however address the 'getting in' part and not what you are going through further down the line.

Not plugging, but it seems William3rd may be able to provide the answers you seek.

[prince_alfie]

What if 50,000 AM were to use this visa process to romance 50,000 RW for the sake of some sexual gratification, marrying them to get the GC or just sending them back in 89 days? I think the government is trying to prevent the behavior of some undesirable, horny guys. 

True but that seems to be a rather cynical explanation. In fact, ancient societies back during the Greco-Roman era never had problems with travel like the way that we do in today's world. In fact, what is spectacular is that they ended up writing better travel guides such as: http://www.amazon.com/Guide-Greece-Central-Pausanius/dp/0140442251/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_k2a_1_txt/103-8847981-2206217

[Photo Guy]

Clyde,
I really don't think a new visa type would encourage more abuses. The same
checks and balances could be put in place, making the sponsor responsible
for the visitor, while she is here. I think a more sensible system could
be implemented.

[William3rd]

Dont hold your breath waiting for any relaxation or new procedures to assist you in your bride search.

1- fiancees are a tiny part of overall immigration.
2- the public sentiment is moving away from where you want to go.
3- alien fiancees dont give anybody a warm and fuzzy feeling- except for the guy involved.
4- keep in mind that the original process was designed for military relationships and to allow for marriages to be performed here. It was never designed for what it is being used for. It assumed that the "face time" was already accomplished.

[Son of Clyde]

I was being cynical, sorry.

It seems as if K1 and K3 visas are the only way to go for foreign brides. A tourist visa is just about out of the question and a work visa is doable if you are lucky enough to meet someone here on a work visa.

Sorry, PG I do think it would be beneficial to see reform but it may take some time.

[Photo Guy]

William,
Your post shows us how antiquated the system is - primarily
for soldiers to bring home a fiancee.

I think a 'guest worker' mentality is moving us in a
direction of relaxation of rules- in a bad way.

Why not go with a system that focuses on terrorists,
while relaxing visa requirements for people who do not
fit a terrorist profile?

[Gator]

P/G,

A two-week visitation prior to filing a K-1 would benefit the foreign woman because she would see  her "future home" before making the 90-day commitment which requires quitting her job, bringing the children (usually), etc.  However, I also understand that the first few weeks is a cultural shock for most FSU women, and many would do the two weeks and then say "no" to a K-1.

I admire your zeal, but this is the way it is.  Also, I think the current procedure encourages a man and woman to take the time to know each other before uprooting and disrupting her life.  However, it seems few couples do this.

[William3rd]

Reforms may be needed but our government will go where the money is-amnesty, guest workers, etc.

If there is no money, it has to be feel good stuff. . .

K visas dont have the right PR soooooo, it aint gonna happen.

[Turboguy]

Just some random thoughts I have had.

One of my biggest gripes is about IMBRA which has been hardly mentioned.  Sort of along the lines of what PG said earlier, I think the less government the better.   

It seems to me the founding fathers did not waste too much ink before getting to the part about our "right to life, liberty and the persuit of happiness"   I have to wonder what is happiness more than wanting to be with or marry someone we love and in a true "land of the free"  should the goverment really have the right to tell me who I can marry and that how long I might have to wait to do that?    Why should I have to provide a criminal background check to marry a gal from Russia if I don't have to do it to marry a gal from Idaho.   How important is it to protect a gal from the FSU from possible abuse when she lives in a country where abuse is common, when the abuse rates are really lower than marriages with AW and when we are not protecting our American Citizens from the same potential.    Actaully I like the checks but if we are going to have them make them required for anyone meeting online, men and women.    The biggest real abuse going on is Green Card abuse and the new law encourages that.   

Changing the subject now.   Why not have an expedited Fiancee Visa.   You pay $ 170.00 and it goes in the system or you pay $ 1170.00 and it gets priority handling.   Why not a romance visa with a $ 1000 fee and a $ 20,000 bond.  Ok, I am done ranting.

[Bruno]

A two-week visitation prior to filing a K-1 would benefit the foreign woman because she would see  her "future home" before making the 90-day commitment which requires quitting her job, bringing the children (usually), etc.  However, I also understand that the first few weeks is a cultural shock for most FSU women, and many would do the two weeks and then say "no" to a K-1.

And what is wrong with this ? Specialy when i relate this to a other topic here where a guy share a home with a other guy in Manhattan and who can only afford hot-dog for eat... a visite of the future home by the RW will be very recommended in so case... and i think that the selection effect will be better that the IMBRA system...

[I/O]

The romancing is supposed to have been already accomplished in your lady's home country prior to the fiancee visa. 

KenC Although, in reality, this is the case for most couples nowdays, I have to challenge this notion as good sense.  I have to say that I would never have considered, under any circumstances, proposing marriage to my fiance' before she had seen my country and my situation.  For us, this was very much part of the "Romancing" time.

Yes of course, all prior to fiance' visa stage, I agree, but I am again asking has something changed in the USA of recent months because, although difficult, it is my understanding that it is not impossible for a FSU lady to get a visitor visa. We were told that it was impossible here and this is nonsense, Yes not simple, maybe too hard for those who don't want to get off their butts and do a bit of work, but far from impossible.

Unless it is strictly impossible for a FSU woman to get a tourist visa, I can not for the life of me imagine why anyone would advocate more visa types.  Goodness, it is slow enough to get processing done now, without adding to the confusion.

These guys who hoot and whistle about less government and then in the next breath advocate more visa types simply stagger me.  I am all for simplifying any system, but utterly opposed to puting patches on patches.  I happen to think that a pre K-1 or in our case SC309 visit to the country of intended residence should be a condition of the K-1 or SC309, not just an abstract option, but it is nonsense to advocate another visa type specifically dedicated to this purpose.  It'll never happen and it is not necessary.

Interested to know what the real situation is right now for you guys regarding visitor visas.

I/O

[Son of Clyde]

I/O go to www.visajourney.com it is a great site that spells out the entire visa process.

Canada (our neighbor) has an entirely different process and I think it is a lot stricter than in the US.

What the guys are probably angry about is the time factor. Being away from a loved one for months waiting for a visa approval is not so pleasant. In Europe or Australia at least the guys are a whole lot closer to FSU.

We can't just hop on a plane every week to visit and the process for some can take over a year. Not every service center is prompt. This is the US government with huge backlogs and the offices are sometimes understaffed.

Try phoning USCIS sometime and try to reach a live person. You are led into a maze of menus you must bypass to reach a human being.

I can wait another year before entering the quagmire again.

[I/O]

or Australia at least the guys are a whole lot closer to FSU.

Good God man...!!!  Have you looked at a world map in the last 50 years? I flew out of Moscow a couple of years back via London and was in Dallas Fort Worth in 17 hours including connection.  From here to Moscow you are looking at a minimum of 30 hours. 

I know the visa journey site rather well and I am even somewhat familiar with the USA regulations.  If you guys think you have it tough with the visa processing, come right on down here for a very big wake up call. First criteria is that you must have met face to face at least 9 months prior to an application for a PMV SC309 (Prospective Marriage Visa) and then standard processing time is 10 months. That's just a taste. 

I don't think you are correct at all as to why the guys are upset with the system.  I am inclind to think there is a percentage would like a longer K-1 period so they can sit on their butts at home and have the girl over for an extended inspection.  But what would I know? Just a dumb Aussie living just up the street from Russia and is sitting ignorantly waiting for a miracle to occour. BTW thanks for advising that Canada is your neighbour, I'd have never guessed.  

I/O

[Son of Clyde]

Oops, I know youse guys are very far away from the US.
When I travel to Ukraine it is about 10 hours to Germany or Amsterdam usually a 2 or 3 hour layover and another 3 hours to Ukraine. This takes up the better part of a day.

Maybe the idea of a tourist/fiance visa would be a good choice. For those who cannot afford multiple trips to her country. Having a two tier visa may be a good or not so good thing.

[William3rd]

Good idea or not- it aint happening, boys.

The trend is MORE restrictive, not less.

Just what we need- an easier way for girls to get here and jump ship on their mates.

Keep in mind- the K1 is a restrictive visa but allows her in.

We already have a tourist visa category. Answer me this- WHY doesnt the girl in question just apply for a tourist visa and come for a visit?

ANSWER= she doesnt qualify.
WHY= she cant show non immigrant intent.

Instead of all the rigamarol- why not just ask for a longer period of time for a fiancee?

The answer is still NO- no money to be made for the US corps, no feelgood for the public. Just an extreme minority. . . . . .

If you all wanted to form a PAC and greased the wheels of state a little, then you MIGHT get somewhere.

You are not going to get anywhere pissing and moaning about it here.

[Son of Clyde]

Good idea or not- it aint happening, boys.

You are not going to get anywhere pissing and moaning about it here.

Like mom used to say, whoever said life was fair? 

[KenC]

Note to all: this is a dupicate post of the one in the 90 day thread as I thought it was appropriate for both threads.

Photo,
I can see where you want to go with the visa reformation, but it just isn't ever going to happen.  It is just not that important to enough people.  I too was faced with your same problem when I met Lena.  How in the world can you spend enough time together to come to know a woman well enough to marry her when she lived in Russia?  No one has the amount of time necessary to do it, unless they can move (at least temporarily) to Russia.  Three weeks or 3 months is just not enough time to know someone that well IMO.  I dated a lot of AW that could hold up a charade for quite a while until the real person showed up.  I used to make a joke that you never knew a woman's true intentions until the 6 month mark of the relationship.  And that is with someone that shares your language and culture!

It would have taken me years, not months or weeks to pull the trigger on a K-1 and I would never ever gone the K-3 method without the woman at least spending some time here.  I seriously do not understand how guys do it.  There is such a huge risk factor in marrying someone you don't know completely.  It seems like guys just leap off that cliff with blind faith and hope for the best.

Most guys, it seems to me, kind of, sort of, know their fiancees before they bring them over on a K-1.  Even though I agree that you can learn a lot about her via the phone and to a lesser extent emails, it still is not the same nor as accurate as spending time together.  And to be honest about it, I think that there is still a certain amount of doubt in limbo when their gals show up on the K-1.  Even if you are certain of your love for each other, there has to be some doubt because no one can be sure how she will react to your life in America.  So to some extent most guys do abuse the the principals of a K-1 and use that time to gage how their RW will fit into their world.  But once the woman arrives on our shores that 90 day time clock starts ticking.  The sound of that tic tock has to be deafening!  The pressure of the time constraints pushes the man to do one of three things: #1 Pull the trigger on a marriage to a woman he doesn't know well enough #2 Confirm that she is who you thought and be comfortable enough that she will indeed fit into your world and proceed to marry #3 Have her return home.

I could never ever marry a woman under those controlled conditions and pressure.  It just isn't natural to me.  I applaud all of you that took the chance and had it all work for you. I just was not that stoked on getting married to anyone to take those kind of risks.  So I was faced with the problem of being in love with Lena but still understanding that we still faced important future benchmarks in our relationship to assure it would work for both of us.  Too logical to go forward and too in love to turn back.

I chose to manipulate the system to my benefit.  I arranged a student visa so Lena could come to America, spend an unlimited amount of time with me and have no pressure of the government telling us when we had to marry or cut bait.  I have no qualms with doing whatever is in your own best interest within such a system filled with such inequities and arbitrary regulations.  I may have abused the principals of the law but I worked within the rules and still did it my way.
KenC

[Son of Clyde]

KenC, do you know many guys who did the K3 route?
That would seem the most depressing, having your bride in another country with absolutely no control.

If the lifting of conditions is denied I would also think this would be a real tragedy if the couple did not provide enough evidence and were denied.

[Rvrwind]

Canada (our neighbor) has an entirely different process and I think it is a lot stricter than in the US.

Yep, you have to show a 1 year relationship plus marry them to bring them in, we don't have fiance Visa's, you could get your government to go that route.
Would solve several problems.
1-Would force you to get to know her better before bringing her over.
2-Give her plenty of time to learn English.
3-keep the CG's in check. (They arn't that patient)
4-Put a kink n the sex tourists act. (no need for them to bed you fast anymore)
& probably a few others I can't thinkof at the moment.

[KenC]

KenC, do you know many guys who did the K3 route?
That would seem the most depressing, having your bride in another country with absolutely no control.

If the lifting of conditions is denied I would also think this would be a real tragedy if the couple did not provide enough evidence and were denied.

Clyde,
The way I look at it is waiting for a woman you love is no different if you are married to her or engaged.  Waiting is waiting.
KenC

[Bruce]

"I chose to manipulate the system to my benefit.  I arranged a student visa so Lena could come to America, spend an unlimited amount of time with me and have no pressure of the government telling us when we had to marry or cut bait.  I have no qualms with doing whatever is in your own best interest within such a system filled with such inequities and arbitrary regulations.  I may have abused the principals of the law but I worked within the rules and still did it my way.
KenC"

Ken, its nice things worked out for you.  However, I tend to think you would have a much harder time doing the same today.

[KenC]

Bruce,
I don't know if that is true.  Lena met all the criteria for a student visa and probably now too.  My point to the story was that it is more reasonable to find a way to work within the system rather than to try and change it to fit your needs.  BTW, no one gave us any hope to get a student visa back then either and I know of at least one case personally that just did the same as us!
KenC