Latest Demands from Jim . . .

[I/O]

Dan  Whatever the nature of the debates or discussions which have passed between you and hewhoshouldnotbenamed, frankly I think it has been a mistake to even engage the guy in discussion period. 

Jims site/s are littered with sh!te, but as with all things, there probably is one or two useful warnings in there for a few people, so I can't entirely condem the content.  RWD has a certain sh!te content also, which I have probably contributed to as much as anyone, but honestly who cares? Unless there is some material gain for one or the other parties (I certainly hope there is not) to remove certain content, then forget about it. 

It would disgust me, and I suspect most thinking members here to see "Leveraged Censorship/Editing" applied, particularly retrospectively, to this forum. 

FWIW IMHO anyone who stays away from RWD as a result of reading something negative on another site, particularly a self interest site such as Jim's, is probably more use to RWD by doing just that, staying away.  Words like "Blackmail" etc are a bit over the top and emotive, I really can't see what leverage Jim has, therefore he is best ignored.

I read quite a lot there and on other sites before finding this site and it was the relative frankness and open opinion which attracted me here.  I think I mentioned this in a very early post.  Keep this site just a little "Rough and tumble" at all costs and it will continue to succeed, do the other thing and it'll sign it's own death certificate.

We all know, or should know that this whole pursuit is not for the "Faint of Heart" so neither should the activities of RWD be "Faint of Heart".  To be polite you should ignore his requests/offers, or if absolutely necessary tell him to shove them where the sun don't shine.

I/O

[William3rd]

I think KenC is on point.

Principles stand higher than personalities. Which is why I will defend to the death (figuratively speaking) the right of even the surrender monkeys posting here to have their say although I disagree wholeheartedly with their statements.

[Jack]

I'm sorry Jinx, I don't think I quite understand your underhanded allegation (although from you it is expected) that your referring to with your statement " I thought maybe it would be good to just finally end this stupid war between Jimslist and RWD (via Jack)."

There were something like 26 different individuals who all posted mostly not so good things about Jim on the RWD in several earlier discussions about Jim's scam scam site.  How is it that I'm responsible for the stupid war between Jimslist and RWD?

[Bruno]

and we don't know the language or tone in Jim's letters to Dan.

Jinx, replace the "we" by "i"  in your post...

Let say that Jim have contact antidate with the hope to create some war between forum... misluck since the CMA is a work make partially with antidate collaboration...

Let say that Jim have contact several MOB business ( not only related to RW ) for bash about the CMA... misluck... result was some agency asking to be removed from the white list.

About language, some example :
... Excuse my French...fuck you, you idiot.
... What more do I have to do? Kiss your ass?

I have follow these negotiation from the begin... a agrement is not possible... Jim only seek to delete bad reference about him and his business... same some topic who are two year old are in the list... one other topic was started by himself... here, Dan have list 3 point asked by Jim but he have ask more... if Dan agree for these 3 point, i am sure that Jim will attack again for reach his total wish...

Do you remember that some people was shocked by the e-mail from the anti-jim site... but Jim use the same method, to other forum, to a lot of marriage agency... his real objective is not RWD but the CMA, he cannot accept that someone other that him try to regulate the MOB business.

[William3rd]

Adding to Bruno's statement-

I believe that there are certain agencies that stand in the shadows behind Jim. They tried to negotiate changes in the CMA so that they could "qualify."  The changes struck to the heart of the CMA and were refused. So the agencies cant participate and gain certification without revealing certain aspects of their business which would hurt them in the public eye.

I personally believe that these same agencies encourage the war and encourage Jim. . . .

You dont think he is bright enough to handle all this himself do you?

[Gator]

Hell no!.  Delete nothing for the reason KenC wrote,

To remove any threads because of Jim's blatant blackmail tactics would do more harm to the integrity of this forum than anything I can think.

Publishing on the Internet is all about credibility. What we say has credibility because it is implicitly vetted.  Even though what Jim writes is not open to debate, it still could be considered credible if Jim had integrity.  Anyone who attempts to expunge the record via something akin to extortion has no integrity and hence everything Jim writes, whether true or false, has no credibility.  

Bruno, you may be right about Jim's motivation.  One could feel sorry for Jim and say that he has been living in Russia so long that he has succumbed to Russian ways.   However, our RWD member Richard has also lived there a long time and has maintained his integrity.

Dan, I am surprised that you would even discuss the possibility of deleting the threads.  I assume this is some sort of red herring diversion.  I would be dipped in $hit before I would alter one word.

Now that I think about it, I believe we should remove the tag "Questionable" next to Jim's List in the table you cited.  "Questionable" is too weak, too kind.  

[jinx13]

 Bruno,

  Thanks for clearing things up for me, like I said, I don't know the language or tone that Jim is using in his correspondence with Dan, if he were trying to make peace and say "hey can we both agree to remove the garbage posted about each other on our respected sites" than I'm all for it, but if it's more along the lines of threats, and Dan's CMA project, than yeah, I would just ignore him, and not even talk about it here on RWD, and of course NOT delete a single thread.

 Jack,

 those 26 or so people that posted in that thread about Jim's list, do you think many of them even gave a damn about Jim's list or the Jim and Jack wars? No, people have spoken out about Jims List because Jim called RWD a scam site (big mistake) because he offended many who have nothing to do with any of this, but he made that claim based on the fact that YOU are allowed to slander him on this forum. You are the reason RWD is involved in this. Maybe what Bruno says about CMA and Jim not wanting anyone but him to regulate the business is true, I don't know, but I think the main factor is that you and Jim hate each other, and look for ways to ruin each others business.

 The fact that he doesn't post here doesn't surprise me, you have many friends here Jack, and he would be outnumbered, and it would just be a pissing contest anyway, but I would personally like to see the guy show up here and discuss with members here the allegations, and try and get this sh!t out in the open and end it once and for all. It serves no purpose to continually air these grievances with each other on websites that are supposed to help and counsel men in their pursuit of RW.


p.s. just realized there is more to the story, Jim also said RWD is a scam site becuase of some questionable advertisements here, forgot about that part.


 

[tim 360]

Once you give in to blackmail you become hostage to further blackmail.

Also Jimbo has zero credibility and is a force of 1,  whereas RWD is comprised of many credible people.  The answer is easy.

[William3rd]

Also Jimbo has zero credibility and is a force of 1,  whereas RWD is comprised of many credible people. 

And some INcredible people, which is why it is a real fine place to be.

[Admin]

Hell no!.  Delete nothing for the reason KenC wrote,

Publishing on the Internet is all about credibility. What we say has credibility because it is implicitly vetted.  Even though what Jim writes is not open to debate, it still could be considered credible if Jim had integrity.  Anyone who attempts to expunge the record via something akin to extortion has no integrity and hence everything Jim writes, whether true or false, has no credibility.   

Bruno, you may be right about Jim's motivation.  One could feel sorry for Jim and say that he has been living in Russia so long that he has succumbed to Russian ways.   However, our RWD member Richard has also lived there a long time and has maintained his integrity.

Dan, I am surprised that you would even discuss the possibility of deleting the threads.  I assume this is some sort of red herring diversion.  I would be dipped in $hit before I would alter one word.

Now that I think about it, I believe we should remove the tag "Questionable" next to Jim's List in the table you cited.  "Questionable" is too weak, too kind. 

Bucky,

I have never even hinted that I would remove the topics. In deference to Kevin Hayes, who has done a terrific job of trying to mediate, I decided that I would float the demands here at RWD with the members. That is all that occurred. If the poll had surprised me with a different outcome, then I would have needed to REALLY think about things - a LOT.

Today, because I posted this poll - Kevin opted-out of the mediator role. He has been doing his best to remain objective - and admittedly, I have not been terribly kind about pointing out some of the logical and ethical fallacies he was trying to defend. It was not terribly hard to find those fallacies - given the opposition - but Kevin persevered - until today.

So my guess now is that Jim will continue with his crusade to malign RWD and CMA (and me, personally) - and we shall see where it all leads.

Thanks to all for your responses which again demonstrates the integrity of our members.

- Dan

[Jack]

those 26 or so people that posted in that thread about Jim's list, do you think many of them even gave a damn about Jim's list

Well Jinx, it appears you are, again, wrong.

(And it was not a thread, but threads, with an s)




I remember reading the story of some obsessed creep who was calling the girl he was stalking a scammer. Sure enough she was listed on Honest Jim's scammer list. I asked him about this to which he responded that he verifies all scammers. Bullshit! I called him on it. Under a different guise I reported a scammer to him. He didn't want my letters or any proof at all because 'he gets too many emails'. He just wanted the name, email, contacts and photos to add to his display. No proof needed. No verification was done of course, because I had made this one up.


........

One time I actually sent this guy "Jim" an email indicating that one of his "black listed" sites was one I used and actually had no problems with them. In fact, I found them to be the best out of 3 I used. I found my wife using this site, I actually visited their office in St Pete just for kicks and giggles, and received numerous emails from ladies and not a single one was a scammer or asked for money. I also told him I referred a guy to the agency whom I met on the plane back from my first trip and he eventually found a lovely lady from Vladivostok off the site. My friend found no scammers and thought the agency was good and honest.

So I told "Jim" this and all his reply was that he received a complaint which is why it is on the blacklist. I also told him that I have not been paid any money from the agency (just in case he thought so) and I am just a happy customer. Of course there will always be un-happy customers, however, in today's world when you "Black list" someone, it is bad. He may have received a complaint, however, he also doesn't indicate that there have also been happy customers (as myself).

After getting his response I chalk up all anti-scam websites as clearly a money making venture and nothing else.



.......


Over time I've read just as many complaints about sites on Honest Jim's 'gold list' and I've read about sites on his 'black list'. His top agency breaks many of his own rules. Elena's models sells crap e-books and pushes fake monthly 'deals'. That's scam enough for me, but who cares? None of these sites and agencies are perfect. (Except for Richard's, I had to say that or he'll kick my butt). A scam agency is one that deliberately posts fake profiles and profits off of fake women. Many 'black listed' agencies are not scammers, they simply don't follow Honest Jim's rules. They are not obligated to do so.



...........


I had a lot of experiences with 'agency scams' and did not like what I saw. He is heavily biased towards his 'friends'. ! I questioned a lot of his decisions about the black list, and all his lists, and provided evidence about some who should not be on the list he had put them on, but I either got no reply, or received spurious and very doubtful answers. I even went as far as registering myself on a lot of bride sites and agency sites, just to prove that his assessments were wrong, and wrote and told him but he either refuted what I had found, or if it was a little too hot for him to handle he just refused to reply. Such a man who sets himself up to be some kind of god given 'Guru' should not only be totally impartial, but SEEN to be impartial, and he most definitely is not. In fact he is doing so much harm with his 'recommendations' and leading Guys up the garden path, that his advice should be totally ignored. If fact, even switch his lists around and view his Gold lists as a Black list and so on. ! I had other evidence given to me by really genuine web site owners about his approaches to them "I will put you on my Gold list, if you put my link on your site" !! I still have all the evidence if anyone wants to view it. ? The BEST, and ONLY way to find out who is genuine and who is not is to register for a Forum where many Guys post their experiences (such as this one) ? The Bride business is a minefield, and therefore every guy wanting to walk it should 'mind where he treads'. ! I spent 2 years investigating it and wrote a large book about it, so if anyone would like to read it, just let me know.

Good luck Guys.

Just stay away from Agencyscam.



.............


Since the day I asked this Honest Jim guy regarding a site on his 'black list' (bride.ru) and he responded with 'just trust me, I get lots of complaints' I have found him to be a joke. I did end up using bride.ru against his advice and was very happy with the site.



.......................


I mean, from a personal point of view it seems a whole bunch of fun watching a bloke who admits to IP theft and other actions which, whilst not necessarily illegal certainly cast a shadow of doubt over the ethical compass of his business, trying to make baseless claims against another business, but it can get expensive for the bystanders who do nothing.

[Bruno]

Maybe what Bruno says about CMA and Jim not wanting anyone but him to regulate the business is true, I don't know,...

Now, you will know... i will prove it !!! A letter that Jim have send to several agencies :

Hello,

   This is Jim from jimslists.com and agencyscams.com. You are listed on my White List at jimslists.com. I am contacting you today about Dan at
the following sites...

goodwife.com
planet-love.com
russianwomendiscussion.com
certifiedmarriageagencies.org

   I am sure that you have received some letters with information about the 'Code of Ethics' and 'Certified Marriage Agencies'. Maybe you have
even paid the $5 fee that he is charging for Step 1. (His banner.)
   If you are not yet aware of this, Step 2 will cost you $500. This is what it will cost you to be certified by Dan. He will (or has done so already) give many good reasons for you to pay this money. I am urging ALL agencies on my Gold and White Lists to NOT pay this fee.
   This is the problem with the 'Certified Marriage Agencies' and 'Code of Ethics'. Only agencies who can afford to pay this $500 will be
certified. Even if a known scam agency pays this money and follows a few EASY rules, they will be certified. Meanwhile, a good, local
Russian agency that cannot afford to pay this $500 fee will NOT be certified. This is not fair. Only rich agencies (GOOD OR BAD) will be
certified.
   Many men will read this list and be worried about using an agency that is not certified. So, even if you are a good agency, guys might be
scared to use you because you did not pay Dan's BLACKMAIL fee.
   Another possibility is that men will see this problem and not trust the agencies that DO pay the $500. They will think that they were certified
ONLY because they paid. So, even the certified agencies might have problems.
   I cannot see any way for Dan's plan to work. I have had my Gold, White, Grey and Black Lists for years and I have not charged anyone or taken
any money from an agency to be listed. (I only accept fees for banner advertising...and only from good agencies.)
   Whether you were planning or not planning to pay the $500 fee, I strongly urge you to NOT pay it. If all agencies join together, potential clients will see that the 'Code of Ethics' is a failure and that Jim's Lists is a good place to find out about agencies. I also ask you to talk to any other agency owners that you know and convince them to NOT pay this $500. If you know any agency that is not listed on my site, please tell me about them and about this letter.
   If the 'Certified Marriage Agencies' site does go ahead, I will work hard with ALL agencies on my Gold & White Lists to make sure that potential clients know that you are approved by JIM and you didn't pay $500 for it. I already have an “Approved by Jim” banner that you can
put on your site. (http://agencyscams.com/Banners.html) And now, if need be, I have made another banner that says ...'Approved by Jim for
FREE – NOT $500!'
   Dan has also joined forces with Jack Bragg of firstdream.com, your competitor, and together they are attacking me and my sites. They have
made a site to attack me personally and they use Dan's sites as a tool to make me look bad. This is not your concern, but it shows Dan's bad
character and lack of reliability. I know that Dan talks politely and nicely to agencies, but this is only because he wants your $500.
   I will listen to all ideas and advice that any agency has. I will work with you to make sure that men know you are a good agency that can be
trusted. I am not fighting Dan with this. I am fighting the $500 'Certified Marriage Agencies' plan that will only cause harm to MANY agencies.
   If you have any questions, comments or suggestions, I am eager to hear them. And even if you choose to pay his fee, this will NEVER change
your listing on my site. I list agencies honestly without charging money for it. Thank you for reading. I am sorry that this letters was so long. I tried to make it short.

Best of Luck,
Jim

Read it carrefully... you can see that it is all about the Jim list beeing better that the CMA... RWD is attack by Jim because RWD owner is the same that the CMA owner... two year ago, we was with topic started by Felice against Jim... and it was not a problem... attack from Jim have just started when CMA was created...

The result of his letter was the reverse of what he have expected... agency from his white list have begin ask to be removed... and now, Jim have created a new list, the "refused list" ( http://www.jimslists.com/refused.html )... previous white agency who don't wish to be listed anymore are on these list where he wrote :

"They allow scammers to run free on their sites. This builds up their database. So, guys spend money and then contact scammers. They lose money there, then maybe they lose money to the scammer. Is it not unethical to make money from allowing scammers on your site? I think so."

Now, Richard ( Tver angel ) is on these list... Latin-wife.com is on the refused list because they wrote :

If you are unable to reach a cordial and professional agreement with him I choose not to be listed on your site and would want any mention of International Introductions to be excluded from you Gold list or other favorable listings. My wish is that a mutual accord is reached between the two of you. If not I want you to understand I am in full support of Dan.

If you need more evidence, i can seek the letter send to antidate... i don't remember the URL where the letter is posted but i can find it again...

All this is about the CMA... post on RWD against jim, problem with Jack exist from very long time, several years... but all have start with the creation of the CMA... the content of his mail is mainly against the CMA... If you don't see the pattern, you are really blind !!!

[BillyB]

I remember reading RW forums for the first time. Jim was a guy who participated and helped people to the best of his ability. Then someone got personal with him or he got personal with someone and now all hell breaks loose.

So everyone wants to defend principle? Nations go to war and everybody dies in the name of principle. Smart or stupid? More like displaying stubbornness instead of defending principle. Based on America's policies, we don't support nations who have weak human rights records. How many of you guys don't own anything Chinese in your home based on principle? If a guy held a knife to your wife's throat and demanded your wallet, how many wouldn't give into blackmail based on principle? It's easy for many to say don't give into blackmail based on principle to Dan but Dan knows the stakes better than anybody and is the one affected and both him and Jim has something to lose. I see no winners with what's going on.

I read the threads about Jim at RWD and it wasn't about just debating the way he conducts business, it was personal. He too was personal. If somebody spit in your face, most all of you are going to react. By no means am I defending Jim's behavior because I don't agree with his actions or the actions of others.

I read Jim's site and I read the "Jim's list sucks" site that is dedicated to hurting Jim and provided a forum for people to join in on the bandwagon. Participants are sure to take a hit in the pocketbook.

I keep hearing this "blackmail" word from a lot of posters here. Dan hasn't been shy in voicing his opinions of Jim after being attacked himself. If he wants to say "blackmail" instead of "negotiations", then I'll take his word for it. I suspect both sides have something to gain if they would call a truce.

As of now, RWD members want to defend principle and won't give into blackmail and Jim and his allies want to equally defend principle and won't give into blackmail so this is what's going to happen so get use to this crap.

http://jimslists.com/agencies/planetlove.html

http://www.jimslistsucks.com/


I still say it's Dan's call if he wants to delete the threads. Those threads aren't going to make my top 1000 list.  New threads may emerge in the future about Jim and his business practices in a more productive way instead of a personal grudge match in that may even include Jim. I know Dan's deleted threads before such as the Ashley Neil vs AFA thread but I trust him to do this in the best interest of the forum, his forum, his business, and I think he does a good job of it.

[Admin]

I remember reading RW forums for the first time. Jim was a guy who participated and helped people to the best of his ability. Then someone got personal with him or he got personal with someone and now all hell breaks loose.

So everyone wants to defend principle? Nations go to war and everybody dies in the name of principle. Smart or stupid? More like displaying stubbornness instead of defending principle. Based on America's policies, we don't support nations who have weak human rights records. How many of you guys don't own anything Chinese in your home based on principle? If a guy held a knife to your wife's throat and demanded your wallet, how many wouldn't give into blackmail based on principle? It's easy for many to say don't give into blackmail based on principle to Dan but Dan knows the stakes better than anybody and is the one affected and both him and Jim has something to lose. I see no winners with what's going on.

I read the threads about Jim at RWD and it wasn't about just debating the way he conducts business, it was personal. He too was personal. If somebody spit in your face, most all of you are going to react. By no means am I defending Jim's behavior because I don't agree with his actions or the actions of others.

I read Jim's site and I read the "Jim's list sucks" site that is dedicated to hurting Jim and provided a forum for people to join in on the bandwagon. Participants are sure to take a hit in the pocketbook.

I keep hearing this "blackmail" word from a lot of posters here. Dan hasn't been shy in voicing his opinions of Jim after being attacked himself. If he wants to say "blackmail" instead of "negotiations", then I'll take his word for it. I suspect both sides have something to gain if they would call a truce.

As of now, RWD members want to defend principle and won't give into blackmail and Jim and his allies want to equally defend principle and won't give into blackmail so this is what's going to happen so get use to this crap.

http://jimslists.com/agencies/planetlove.html

http://www.jimslistsucks.com/


I still say it's Dan's call if he wants to delete the threads. Those threads aren't going to make my top 1000 list.  New threads may emerge in the future about Jim and his business practices in a more productive way instead of a personal grudge match in that may even include Jim. I know Dan's deleted threads before such as the Ashley Neil vs AFA thread but I trust him to do this in the best interest of the forum, his forum, his business, and I think he does a good job of it.

Billy,

Thanks for the well-reasoned post. I have actually been pretty restrained about what I have mentioned on the board. The half-dozen or so guys who I've copied on the entire exchange since December, know I have put up with a lot of vulgar insults - and tried my very best to remain 'above it.' After a time, however, I admit to letting the vile insults get the best of me and I have been increasingly confrontive.

In this case, I think Bruno hit the target with his assessment. The bruhaha all stems from CMA. There are plenty of plausible alternatives for the tensions - but in the final analysis, it seems clear that Jim was targeting CMA all along and using all sorts of ruses for his escapades.

I was recently asked about some of this - and I explained that I originally saw a path which would have engaged Jim and his sites - but he cannot seem to grasp the prospect of it being of great benefit to him. The plan I had called for a complementary relationship between sites - all aimed at genuinely making a positive difference for the guys, and the gals, involved in this endeavor.

Who knows? Maybe there is something to William's implication that one, or more, of the big agencies is pulling some strings because they fear the repurcussion of not being among the CMA sites - so discredit CMA and that concern evaporates. I don't know.

FWIW

- Dan

[wiz]

Dan

May I remind you that the Name of this discussion board is all about Russian women?

I think none of the members who are here to find information, read interesting stories and travel reports and of course post their views are interested to know or read about the squabbles between the Agency and sites owners or anybody else involved in these wars.

I don’t think many of us normal members want to know what is going on behind the scenes and you should close this thread down. Do not spoil this good forum by allowing or instigating any kind of debate regarding this subject.

Personally I am here to talk and debate about RUSSIAN WOMEN and any subject in connection to that and not the Financial interests of the various interested parties in the MOB business.

That is my view and is obvious from the very small number of people who have voted sofar, that the subject is boring and irrelevant for us!

[KenC]

Wiz,
Boy, does your post rub me the wrong way!  Who the hell do you think you are to tell Dan how to use his forum?   Scammers, agencies, CMA, Jim's list and the politics involving them has everything to do with pursuing a RW.  Your comments are devoid of any of the "camaraderie" and "community" we all usually speak of here too.  Some (most?) of us members of RWD are offended by Jim's actions and feel a sense of anger when slanderous statements are made disparaging a group that we are proud to be a part of.  Not to say that the concepts of censorship of what we even post here is not an interesting subject too.

I would guess that it is YOUR opinion that is in the minority here.  But that is the beauty of this forum, if this thread is not titillating enough for your interests, then don't friggen read it any more!  But you most certainly do not have cause to take such an arrogant shot at Dan!
KenC

[wiz]

Wiz,
Boy, does your post rub me the wrong way!  Who the hell do you think you are to tell Dan how to use his forum?   Scammers, agencies, CMA, Jim's list and the politics involving them has everything to do with pursuing a RW.  Your comments are devoid of any of the "camaraderie" and "community" we all usually speak of here too.  Some (most?) of us members of RWD are offended by Jim's actions and feel a sense of anger when slanderous statements are made disparaging a group that we are proud to be a part of.  Not to say that the concepts of censorship of what we even post here is not an interesting subject too.

I would guess that it is YOUR opinion that is in the minority here.  But that is the beauty of this forum, if this thread is not titillating enough for your interests, then don't friggen read it any more!  But you most certainly do not have cause to take such an arrogant shot at Dan!
KenC

KenC

I am not taking an arrogant shot at Dan, who I very much respect, especially for allowing this forum to be so Democratic and open to every opinion. Freedom of speech is in abundance over here and of course nobody has the right to ask for censorship, which of course you don't like either.

My view is simple: The more publicity you give to Jim the more he asks. If you just ignore him over here than there is nothing he can do. I do not spent my time reading his personal rantings and grudges against Dan and Jack. Waste of time for me and I do not need his site to ferret out the scammers who write to me. I have my own system who has worked very well for me sofar!

Because we are a community I don't want to get involved in such wars and long debates which ultimately will spoil the harmonious atmosphere that exists on RWD.

If my opinion is in the Minority so be it, I am entitled to my opinion as you are too,  but looking the voting numbers I do not see much interest around.

[jinx13]

 I wasn't going to post in this topic anymore because I feel it's waste of space, but KenC's comments really "rubbed me the wrong way"

 Yes, Wiz maybe in the minority in his thinking about this topic, count me as part of that minority too, but we are allowed to voice our opinions are we not? What was the point of starting a poll if everyone is expected to vote the same way? Kinda sounds like elections in Belarus, and anyone that speaks in the minority is quickly shot down...freedom of speech you say?  There is not as much freedom here as I would like there to be, but that's another topic.

 As for Jim, well I never talked to the guy, never heard his side of the story, so I wrote him yesterday, and he wrote back. I won't post anything he said here, and I can't speak for him, but I didn't get the impression he has it out for Dan, or is trying to blackmail him, or extort him...these are words many of you are using, but who said them? Is Dan even saying that?  Before you pass judgements on people don't you think it's fair to hear both sides of the story?

 Like BillyB said in an earlier post, both of these men our trying to help men in their pursuit of RW, but it's also a business, and sometimes these kind of disputes happen, it doesn't mean either one of them are bad people, it's just a situation where a compromise is diffucult to find, but I think they are trying...Dan wouldn't ask our advice if he didn't at least consider it.

 I do happen to agree with Wiz, I don't know why this is all being played out here, I think that is part of the problem with the negotiations. No one is taking shots at Dan, like Wiz, I also respect him, but that doesn't mean we are not allowed to question him at times.


 

[BC]

Jinx,

Have you visited Jim's site? Do you really give any value whatsoever to what he has to say there?

You said you emailed him for the first time.. hey great but guess what.. I'm wondering why.

Don't be a pawn.

[William3rd]

YAAAAWWWNNNN- Guys, give it a break. The poll is just about 90% in favor of leaving it all up. Most of the commentary is to tell "Jim" to pound sand.

The vocal minority has had more than their opportunity to talk ad nauseum. Freedom of speech has been upheld.

You always have the freedom to leave and to cast your vote with your feet. If you are going to talk the talk, then start walking the walk. . . .

But you complaining guys arent going anywhere because you like it here.

[BC]

YAAAAWWWNNNN- Guys, give it a break. The poll is just about 90% in favor of leaving it all up. Most of the commentary is to tell "Jim" to pound sand.

The vocal minority has had more than their opportunity to talk ad nauseum. Freedom of speech has been upheld.

You always have the freedom to leave and to cast your vote with your feet. If you are going to talk the talk, then start walking the walk. . . .

But you complaining guys arent going anywhere because you like it here.

Oh... a non cut n paste from our friend William in this thread!

I agree..  <-- cut and pasted 

[jinx13]

 
 Did anyone say anything bad about RWD or wanting to leave? Who is complaining? It's called an OPINION, and I thought that's what web forums were about, am I wrong?  Is it your way or the highway  ???

 As for freedom of speech, I can't comment, because I will most likely be "muted' 

[Rvrwind]

Well I'll tell you what, he has succeeded in pissin' me off!!!
I asked to have my site removed & what does he do, he makes up a special list just for me & another ageny that wanted to be removed & calls us scammers & accuses us of having scammers on our site. Brass balls he may have, but brains are sorely lacking!!!
If anybody is running an honest agency it is me & for anybody to even think of accusing me of running a scam agency has got sh!t for brains!!
I can't even see his site because he has it blocked to Russian IP's, why Jim are you afraid of us. When you accuse an agency with the reputation mine has for honesty & call us scammers & our women scammers, women who paid dearly to be in our agency I might add, well maybe you should be afraid, very afraid.
I know your reading this, I'm not stupid enugh to think otherwise, so read the email I sent you & act on it, because I will act on my part. You want to tell lies about me Bubba, you best be able to pony up because you picked the wrong Cowboy to mess with!!
Your in Russia & I'm in Russia & so is my lawyer!!!
Oh, by the way, Dan is a pu$$y compared to me, believe it!!

[Bruno]

I asked to have my site removed & what does he do, he makes up a special list just for me & another ageny that wanted to be removed & calls us scammers & accuses us of having scammers on our site.

Richard, some people see think only in black and white, without all the grey shade...

For Jim, if you are not his friend, you become his ennemy... he don't realize that the main part of agency who have ask to be removed are simply neutral party who don't wish to be between the two party fighting the war !

In private communication, i have sometime make "hard" comment to Dan or Jim about these story... Dan have always reply me in a respectfull way, explaining thing... and some few time, he have agree with me... at the reverse, Jim have not explain something and a few time, send agressive, insulting mail.

Wiz seem to think that all this is not related to RW... but what about a site who wrote :

Russian women make excellent life-long partners.    Myth (100%)
Russian women are good to have fun with for a short time.    Fact (100%)

So, for Jim, russian women are not marriage material, only good to have fun with a short time... Is it not a way for promote sex tourist and hurt several RW...

Maybe only somebody like JB is fully not interested in so topic... he is already married, never use agency and was not victim of russian scam... but not yet sure of it when someone describe RW like whiney, over-sensitive, argumentative nymphos, pathological liars ... a insult to all RW

These guy have some issue with Russia... first, he don't like RW... but a don't like Russian in general... about freepersonals.ru ( black list ):

It is a Russian guy who owns it. A free site? No way. Yes, so something is not right. Just be aware of this...
I have no proof, but I am sure that it is a site for collecting email addresses and selling them.

Seem funny that the same guy  complain about the CMA and the 500$ fee for stage two... in these case, he show himself like protector of Russian agency who will not be able to pay these amount... and in the same time, on his own site, he bash these russian owner !!!

In the past, i was on the side of Jim... i have "teach" him how hidden his real origine in his e-mail... but with time, i have learn that he use double language... to someone, he will say white, to other he will say black... he is a manipulative guys... Jinx, you have exchange one e-mail with him... but he read these forum and know that you are neutral, almost ready to choose a side... perfect for him, he will reply with a polite mail, who show himself like a victim... always interesting to win a allies in the ennemy fortress...

And seriously, why he attack Dan... Dan have not start a topic related to Jim... Felice, Jack, Jim and myself have start a topic... these topic is the only exception...

Now, something other, not yet posted here... Jim show himself like the knight protecting western men from scammer... a few year ago, i have submit some scammer to him... with evidence like fake passport or visa... he have listed these girls... but when i have begin be in cold with him, he have remove them for the list... short time after, two men was scanned by the same girl ( two european )... so, what about personal interest who go over his "noble" mission to "save" men !!!

[Jack]

Last week a Gold Listed agency and a White Listed agency wrote Jim and asked him to remove them from his site completely.


What does Jim do ???    He list's both these agencies on a list titled "Refused List".   Last week an agency that was Gold Listed, asked to be removed, and this week that same Gold Listed agency is  "part of " a list that Jim has stated,...



Some are not concerned about scammers. They allow scammers to run free on their sites. This builds up their database. So, guys spend money and then contact scammers. They lose money there, then maybe they lose money to the scammer. Is it not unethical to make money from allowing scammers on your site? I think so.

If you don't agree, fine. Go ahead and use these sites.



These two agencies were also told they now have two strikes against them.   They have to contact Jim to be removed from his "Refused List" even though they were Gold and White Listed last week.  After they contact Jim he will either move them up to the White List (where one agency was last week when they asked to be removed) or they will be moved down to Jim's Grey List. 



And all these two agencies did was ask Jim to simply remove them from his List and now they could both be Grey Listed




* If you are from one of these sites and DO care about scammers. Contact me for removal. You have 2 strikes against you. After our discussion of the problem, I will either move you to the White List or Grey List. It's ALL up to you.