What age would be preferrable to RW?

[KenC]

Ken, you have more experience at this than I do so I want to ask, does it really?   To me, the age difference thing would more likely create a problem at the early "attraction" stage.   Someone like Jazzy or Anastassia would have no attraction to a much older man and the whole relationship would never have a beginning.  

I won't argue the fact there are things a younger guy can offer but when I think back to who I was when I married for the first time at 24 and now, I am probably much better husband material now than then.   I am not saying I was bad material then but I am hopefully a little wiser (enough so that I would never get into a marriage like the first one again), a little more patient and etc.  

Back to my question in the opening sentence, I have not seen any difficulties surface during the relationship with VWRW (or any age related difficulties in any other relationships I have been in in my life).   We both just go along with a great happiness in our relationship and everything running very smoothly.

The first time I ever came to the Caribbean was with my wife a long time ago.  Within 24 hours the trip turned into a disaster.   I have never spent a summer together 24/7 with any woman in my life and I did at least have an occasional thought that spending that much time together was unnatural and could create a disaster.   Even couples married for decades do things like go to work or go shopping without their S/O.   Fortunately it has not caused a minutes problem.  

I did some quick math on the age difference poll here and there were 16 couples with an age difference of 20 years or more.   I also think like Sandro that there is more age difference and more potential problems with the age difference with a 35 year old man and a 20 year old woman than there is with a 60 year old man and a 40 year old women and there are lots more in that poll with a lot of age gap at a young age.   I am not a stranger to these forums but I don't recall anyone ever saying they had marriage problems due to an age gap.   I do think those involved in a relationship with one need to spend the time to know each other and if they are a one week wonder the risks may be higher.

Turbo,
Of course things are going to be idyllic for you now.  You're getting what you want and VWRW has yet to get hers.  Her entrance into the US and the future green card are still in play.  You're living in one of the top vacation spots in the world on a pre-honeymoon, so why wouldn't things be great?  If you think what you are experiencing now has any comparason to your future life together, you are pulling your own chain.  That is like comparing the Carribean to say, Beaver Falls!  The truth of the matter is that you will not know for any certainy what is real until VWRW is sitting in Beaver Falls with green card in hand.  Only then, with the ulterior motivations removed will you know if it is real or not.  For your sake, I hope it is real.

Older men actually do make better husbands than younger ones in many ways.  Having some age will usually help in the process of assimilation to the new country.  It has been said many times that patience (by the boatload) is necessary during the acclimation period.  Most of the volital stories I have read here and on other forums usually involve a younger guy.  Maybe younger men do not have the patience mandatory for this venture as much as an older man.  An older husband usually will be more financially stable too.  One of the most common reasons for divorce is financial issues.  That cannot be overlooked.

But the one thing you or I cannot offer our young women is YOUTH and all that goes with it. Your sage wisdom, although maybe attractive today, can become an irritating "raining on her parade" when you burst her bubble of youthful enthusiasm.  Your happiness in kicking back in the Caribbean might be wonderful for her now, but what about when her youthful energy has no outlet?  Will your relationship be strong enough to withstand the time she will be spending away from you in the company of people her own age?  Or do you plan to keep her in a gilded cage?  You may be the fittest 65 year old man in the world, but what is going to happen when you are 75?  80?  VWRW may say she doesn't want children today, but what if she changes her mind later?  Ever know a woman to change her mind?  No one knows how she will react when her biological clock starts ticking loudly at 40.  Are you prepared to father a child at 80?  Also consider that a woman reaches her sexual peak around that same age and regardless of the meds available, will you be able to keep up? (Not keep it up, but keep up physically and emotionally)

Turbo, if you had any sense at all, you should be scared sh!tless about the future.  I wish you and VWRW all the luck in the world, because you are going to need it.
KenC

[Turboguy]

I would think everybody wants to die the same day as they say or within reasonable amount of time, close together, just purely because of being old. I know it doesn't mean that young people don't die and sadly my experience is the first example of that....but... if we look at the broader and bigger picture.

Sometimes you make trade offs Anastassia.   In our case we are well aware that the odds are that she will outlive me signifigantly but felt that 5-10-15 or whatever great years with someone you love are better than 40 so-so ones.    Yes, your experience does show that having a young mate does not insure a long lifetime of happiness together. 

[Turboguy]

Turbo,
Of course things are going to be idyllic for you now.  You're getting what you want and VWRW has yet to get hers.  Her entrance into the US and the future green card are still in play.  You're living in one of the top vacation spots in the world on a pre-honeymoon, so why wouldn't things be great?  If you think what you are experiencing now has any comparason to your future life together, you are pulling your own chain.  That is like comparing the Carribean to say, Beaver Falls!  KenC

Truthfully I doubt if things will be much different in Beaver Falls except there will be more to do.  Actually after spending a lot of time sorting out in my own mind what would be a good spot for a honeymoon we are so tired of beaches and oceans and the like we have decided to call this trip our honeymoon and not take one.   We may run up to Niagara Falls for a weekend though.

I don't see the green card as making any difference for VWRW.   As far as your statement that "It has been said many times that patience (by the boatload) is necessary during the acclimation period. "   I have to agree with that.   VWRW said the other day she was a little worried because in all the time we had been together she had never seen me angry.   I think she was a little concerned what I would be like when I was angry and perhaps she would not like it.   Actually I have a hard time remembering a time when I was really angry, she may have a long wait.   I do agree that older guys do have some good qualities that may help a marriage.

I guess I don't have any sense Ken cause I am not worried about it at all.   We seem to do fine and yes, perhaps sometime in the future there will be major problems.  I am not a mind reader to know and perhaps there will be not.   If those are 10 or 15 or 20 years from now what are the chances at that time that Jazzy will still be with her "boy" and that half the other couples who are here and deeply in love will still be together?

[Turboguy]

We were joking a little while earlier about the "ignore" post and the fact that one more person had put her on ignore while one had taken me off.   We said she would have to get a few more people po'd so she could catch Elen.    This might help.

We were talking about your post and her comment when you mentioned her spending time with people her own age was, "I have no interest in spending time with people my age.   I would much rather spend time with people like KenC and Gator than with Jazzy and Anastassia or similar young people.    She sort of feels the older crowd has the wisdom and knowledge the younger ones think they do and they are much more interesting and beneficial to be around.

From my viewpoint, of course I am not going to keep her in a gilded cage.   You know the old saying "If you love something, set it free, if it comes back it is yours and if it doesn't it never was.    VWRW will be with me as long as SHE wants and chooses to be.   You can't force someone to love you or to stay and I would never try.

[KenC]

Truthfully I doubt if things will be much different in Beaver Falls except there will be more to do.  Actually after spending a lot of time sorting out in my own mind what would be a good spot for a honeymoon we are so tired of beaches and oceans and the like we have decided to call this trip our honeymoon and not take one.   We may run up to Niagara Falls for a weekend though.

I don't see the green card as making any difference for VWRW.

You simply just cannot know for sure what her reactions will be once she has the freedom of choice
 

 As far as your statement that "It has been said many times that patience (by the boatload) is necessary during the acclimation period. "   I have to agree with that.   VWRW said the other day she was a little worried because in all the time we had been together she had never seen me angry.   I think she was a little concerned what I would be like when I was angry and perhaps she would not like it.   Actually I have a hard time remembering a time when I was really angry, she may have a long wait.   I do agree that older guys do have some good qualities that may help a marriage.

I guess I don't have any sense Ken cause I am not worried about it at all.   We seem to do fine and yes, perhaps sometime in the future there will be major problems.  I am not a mind reader to know and perhaps there will be not.   If those are 10 or 15 or 20 years from now what are the chances at that time that Jazzy will still be with her "boy" and that half the other couples who are here and deeply in love will still be together?

Turbo,
You have successfully ignored all the potential pitfalls of an age gap marriage (except for your weak answer about the green card) and focused on the few positives I sighted.  I guess when you keep saying if you get a good 10 years out of it, we can assume that you are looking at this relationship as temporary.  Ten years may seem like a long time, but to me (facing our 8th anniversary this weekend) it is a spit in the bucket.

As for Jazzy's chances, hers are a hell of a lot better than yours, my friend.
KenC

[AnastassiaAsh]

WOW! KenC, you really 'hugged and kissed' Turbo and his fiancee. 

Hmmm, the most amazing thing is that when I or Jazzy or Mocking Bird come out and try to say something like that, we get a huge kick under out buts by everybody, but when YOU say some thing along those lines, it definitely starts sounding 'reasonable', that you are 'concerned' and nobody, even Turbo himself are saying anything or jumping on you.

Ha, KenC, you thought you were crazy  , no, Turbo outdid you there! 

Thank you very much for your post, these are my thoughts too.

I/O, where are your questions about the proof! Where is your sincere frustration about it? 

[Turboguy]

Ken has the wisdom that a few extra years brings. 

[KenC]

WOW! KenC, you really 'hugged and kissed' Turbo and his fiancee. 

I didn't mean to be disrespectful in any way (and didn't think I was), but Turbo asked the question and I answered it in the best way I know how.

Hmmm, the most amazing thing is that when I or Jazzy or Mocking Bird come out and try to say something like that, we get a huge kick under out buts by everybody, but when YOU say some thing along those lines, it definitely starts sounding 'reasonable', that you are 'concerned' and nobody, even Turbo himself are saying anything or jumping on you.

The viewpoint just has more credibility coming from someone in the situation as opposed to others that are not.

Ha, KenC, you thought you were crazy  , no, Turbo outdid you there!  ;)Thank you very much for your post, these are my thoughts too.

Anastassia, I have news for you, I still am crazy after all these years!

I/O, where are your questions about the proof! Where is your sincere frustration about it? 

I am the proof.
KenC

[Admin]

Bill: I think the thread went along quite nicely and was somewhat enlightening until this bizarre post below appeared.  After that, it was never gunna go anywhere but haywire. Much of the thread is tarred with the same brush as the below, claims, counter claims and nothing to back it up with. The moment a discussion gets onto the age thing it'll always go off like last weeks meat.

The part that amuses me is that rarely the more intelligent men argue in favour of age gap relationships, OTOH the girls by and large are screaming no no no it's no good, it won't work, it will fail, look most of them fail, but so far...............no evidence. I honestly didn't think the women would rise like trout to a bait without some real ammunition to fire, so far, just a few smoke bombs, but...................well ya learn something every day.

I/O

Reference the age gap bit. We have some fairly conclusive results from a live poll that continues to run here at RWD. For that reason, the table which summarized results, is never valid for more than a short period - but the poll itself has some real merit. It represents more than 100 members of RWD and depicts both the age demographic of our members, and the age gap with our partners (which can be easily-enough extrapolated to provide their ages, if desired).

Anyway - here is the link -- http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=1818.0

This poll, and a few others, are stickied in this post in the Odds and Ends forum -- http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=5455.0

Hope it helps.

- Dan

[Wayne B]

deleted cos wont looking for understanding here

Jazzy, you should never delete a post about how you feel about a subject...
You have the right to express your opinion..'always'
If someone disagrees with you..that is their opinion...
I have opinions of my own or I try to be funny....some think that I have no opinion or that I am not funny....instead of asking for clarification on the matter....it is just easier for them to put me on 'IGNORE' I guess if they 'ignore' everyone that they do not agree with.....
Someday, their opinions will not be heard   Jazzy, you always have the right to speak how you feel....

[Mir]

Ken has the wisdom that a few extra years brings. 

Naah, you are just scared of him 

[AnastassiaAsh]

Naah, you are just scared of him 

  

[Turboguy]

Scared,   I think it is great.   It gives me hopes that when I get old enough that I might find some wisdom too.

[KenC]

Note to the uninformed:
Turbo and I have debated many an issue and I have great respect for his kind demeanor on this forum.  In fact I have many times criticized him for being too nice to give some newbie the hard cold facts.  I am sure Turbo has many different emotions toward me, but "fear" is not one of them!
KenC

[Turboguy]

  Turbo,
You have successfully ignored all the potential pitfalls of an age gap marriage (except for your weak answer about the green card) and focused on the few positives I sighted.  I guess when you keep saying if you get a good 10 years out of it, we can assume that you are looking at this relationship as temporary.  Ten years may seem like a long time, but to me (facing our 8th anniversary this weekend) it is a spit in the bucket.

Ken, you are right and to be honest I ignored it deliberately despite the fact that it was as well thought out and thorough a listing of potential pitfalls that a couple with an age gap could run into.   The reason I ignored it was that to answer those things at this point is too much speculation and opinion and I would rather talk about those things down the road some years, for example when she has had the green card for a few years that speculation is no more.    For me to say it now, even as sure as I am of her motivations is just exactly what you said.   Speculation.  

As far as the part about the child, I will be very surprised if she does change her mind.    I don't see a problem with any of our plans for the future or with any compatability or libido issues.   If we have some we will deal with it.   In the meantime we have a wonderful relationship and we would rather concentrate on being happy and enjoying the time we have together.   I agree time does fly.   If seems like a few days ago that we arrived here and our time here is winding down.  

By the way, congratulations on your wedding anniversary.   I hope there are many, many more happy ones in the future.

You are right, We have battled tooth and nail at times and at other times have agreed about things and backed each others point of view.    We could call each other idiots and pm each other with friendly comments.    Respect for you I have plenty of, fear, no.  of course not.

[KenC]

Turbo,
Best of luck to you and VWRW.  You're a big boy and I know you will accept the outcome of your actions (good or bad).
KenC

[Turboguy]

Thanks Ken,   I am confident that we will be fine.   I have never felt so comfortable around anyone in my life and my belief is she feels the same.    If we are wrong, we are both wrong and are both willing to stand up to our mistakes.

[Jazzyclassy]

Jazzy, you should never delete a post about how you feel about a subject...
You have the right to express your opinion..'always'
If someone disagrees with you..that is their opinion...
I have opinions of my own or I try to be funny....some think that I have no opinion or that I am not funny....instead of asking for clarification on the matter....it is just easier for them to put me on 'IGNORE' I guess if they 'ignore' everyone that they do not agree with.....
Someday, their opinions will not be heard   Jazzy, you always have the right to speak how you feel....

I do not think it  is useful to tell anything here in this thread , am tired of being lectured here , what is the use of expressing my opinion if people can not hear , they only hear themselves and their truth

Age gap is was and will be a specific burning topic, nothing you can do about this, If I was an old western man with bags full of money I would still prefer a woman of my age well max 6-7 y.o. younger or something, but I am not an old western man Thank God for this:) so it is their choice what to decide.

[KenC]

I do not think it  is useful to tell anything here in this thread , am tired of being lectured here , what is the use of expressing my opinion if people can not hear , they only hear themselves and their truth

Age gap is was and will be a specific burning topic, nothing you can do about this, If I was an old western man with bags full of money I would still prefer a woman of my age well max 6-7 y.o. younger or something, but I am not an old western man Thank God for this:) so it is their choice what to decide.

Jazzy,
The fact of the matter is you have no clue about how you would behave as an older western man of money.  Quit feeling so sorry for yourself.  You ALWAYS have to devert the attention toward your poor self.
Keep on topic.  And the topic is not about you.
KenC

[I/O]

Well, I/O, i will give you some hard evidence, i can make a research even among my customers of so many years, but at the end you and others will say that it is strictly MY experience, that doesn't matter because YOURS is different, based on what 20-40 people/couples?

AnastassiaAsh: You seem to miss or choose to miss the point.  I didn't come in here arguing in favour of age gap relationships. I don't have evidence in favour of them pur se'. You came in here arguing against them and I am happy to listen to a logical arguement. I am happy to examine the evidence. What I would like to see is a decent wide sample of maybe 2000 marriages or more.  From broader numbers then I think we can draw some real conclusions.

Convince me....I am always happy to change my view in the face of substantial evidence. It is foolish to do otherwise. BTW many of the older couples I see in my own location who have been married for 30, 40 or 50 years have an age gap more than 10 years. My parents are the abberation in that group, they have an age gap of 2 days.

Something you should understand, the thinking man in such a situation looks ahead a lot more than 5, 10 or 15 years before he starts in such a relationship.  Believe me, I phrigged around for 6 months or more after initial communications before I capitulated and nothing is set in concrete yet.

Dan: I'll take a look at the RWD numbers later when I have some time. I am more than happy to have my thinking swayed if it is off beat.

I/O 

[Admin]

Dan: I'll take a look at the RWD numbers later when I have some time. I am more than happy to have my thinking swayed if it is off beat.

I/O 

Actually, I suspect you will find them supportive. I provided them merely so that we could have some amount of objective data - albeit a pitifully small data sample given the broader context.

- Dan

[I/O]

Actually, I suspect you will find them supportive. I provided them merely so that we could have some amount of objective data - albeit a pitifully small data sample given the broader context.

- Dan

Dan: That is the problem with any "On Board" or "Individual" data, it is such a small sample that little marrit can be placed on it. I suspect others are, in part, comming from another angle here, in so far as, they are warning of the risks of finding a GCG or similar by seeking younger women and to that extent, I would wholeheartedly agree.  That part is a no brainer.  Further, much of the sample of women in this thread wouldn't consider an age gap relationship and to them I say, "Good for you, stick to your principals, don't compromise, you will, in spite of what others say, find your man in your age group".

I/O

[Turboguy]

I have to agree with you I/O, it would be great if someone could do a really good and objective study covering a large number of marriages.

The poll here would indicate that marriages with an age gap may be far more common that Anastassia's guesstimate would indicate.   I counted 16 couples with a 20 year gap or more out of 120.   I can not recall anyone ever saying that they were getting a divorce because of age gap.

As I said before the number one cause of divorce is marriage.

I think there are many causes of divorce or things that increase the risk.   I have a feeling not knowing the person you are marrying is a much greater risk factor than an age difference but really who knows.    Sometimes even the people getting divorced don't really understand why so finding the real cause of divorces may be difficult.   

[Turboguy]

Today it rained hard all day and we were sitting around a little bored and visited the forum for AM & AW which is sometimes rather amusing

We happened to get reading a topic on relationships with age differences or May-December relationships as they were calling them and have to say for the most part they were pretty accepting.   Maybe we need to send them a few of our ladies to straighten out their thinking.

[AnastassiaAsh]

in the same way Antidate can be a really good wake up call to reality, lots of information can be taken from there to help forming some statistics, at least big part of it.

KenC, of course YOU are the proof, and maybe several others here, but there are hundreds if not thousands of men who burnt because of this age gap, how should we convert all this to numbers then? 1 in 10,000? i don't know.

Did you forget that other people are real proofs too, proof of mistakes and lost years and money and everything, there are many MANY more of those people than you and several other couples...

Oh, i am sorry, but i am getting tired in this thread...