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Author Topic: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?  (Read 10462 times)

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Online msmob

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #75 on: October 25, 2007, 02:43:14 PM »
Hey Dan, are you seeing this?

As predicated, to him, I knew someone would have to differ with me..

Maybe you don't know what a Bentley looks like;) I was with  two Moscowvites and we all commented on the upmarket cars.. how many there were...  ;D

Bentley sales in Kiev are hundreds of percent over budget..Premiums -  to overcome waiting lists are approaching 50-70%

In the same block as a luxury shopping mall in arabskaya ( pron?)  district - there is a BMW, Porsche and Bentley dealership with 100m of each other !

Anyone with property in central districts of Kiev have made 250% in two years.. I know 'coz I DIDN't invest with a former girlfriend who went on to buy apts and land and is laughing at me !! I know a young couple that stretced themselves to borrow money to buy and apartment for $50k a year ago- it has nearly doubled in price.

Her salary  was £2500/ month and now it's $5k... Is there more than one Kiev ?

Food in restaurants is up as is the cost of apts ( if you can rent one) and hotels.

One of my sales guys got bumped and had to pay nearly 450 Euros at the Radisson.. There are hotels charging 600-700 night now.. Where were rates ANYWHERE near that 3 years ago ?  

Conversely, I can fly to Kiev more cheaply from London, Hamburg and Moscow and buy ticketless fights on the internet. ( What airlines are you using?!)

I suppose you'll tell me you didn't notice that the streets are clogged with cars, and any taxi driver will tell you journies take much longer.

And YET.. I agree that many ladies realise that life in Kiev isn't so bad after all.


Ladies away from the capital have VERY different expectations that women from Kiev .. maybe "boom" hasn't reached them yet.


The strange thing is it is happening all ove the FSU... my wife's ex was trying to buy her out of a 3 bed apt in Siberia for 500,000 roubles a year ago.. now he'd need to find another million !!




 






Not that I disagree there is more wealth floating around in Kiev, however I was there in August and did not see a single Bentlay. Infact top end marques are still rather rare on the roads (though no doubt they are there).
I have visited Kiev in 2004,2005,2006 and 2007 and I have not seen a dramatic change regarding the level of affluence and opulence. Yes prices have gone up, but mainly when one needs to buy property. Despite all the increase in wealth in 2004 the apartment I can hire for $145 is still available for $150 per night despite a 25-30% drop in value of the dollare. A meal at a pricey restaurant used to cost between $100-150 in 2004 and is the same in 2007.
Transportation costs (taxis) have gone up but nothing dramatic.
Certainly the airfares from UK are much higher, in 04 I could fly over for £160 rtn and now it is over £300, some of this is offset by abolishment of visa and the fee for it.
There has been no dramatic increase in the salary of people working in Ukraine so they find themselves under more and more pressure to finance the increase in costs which pinch them most if they want to buy an apartment.
Has it become more difficult to find a woman? Well I don't know from personal experience but that is what I am told by those who went looking in the last 1-2 years. Still I think that the increase in wealth of local Ukrainians is only a small part of why quality Ukrainian and Russian women are less inclined to look for Western husbands. More knowledge of how it really is to live in the west, stories of abuse and misuse by western men and maybe a developing pride of ones own country/culture might all be contributing factors, and I am certain there are other important reasons as well.
We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Offline Misha

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #76 on: October 25, 2007, 02:52:04 PM »
Hey Dan, are you seeing this?

As predicated, to him, I knew someone would have to differ with me..


Well, this is a DISCUSSION FORUM after all. Did you expect that everybody would agree with you all the time?  :cluebat:



Online msmob

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #77 on: October 25, 2007, 02:57:12 PM »
ER, yes about something intangible.. not something that eyes, and economic figures tell us all !!

When you go to Kiev do you look up.. have you noticed tall luxurious office blocks and penthouse sweets springing up?

Have you noticed all the "brands" have places there.. ?

Do you seriously think they would open up if there wasn't the return?

How's you head...? ;)





Well, this is a DISCUSSION FORUM after all. Did you expect that everybody would agree with you all the time?  :cluebat:



We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Offline Misha

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #78 on: October 25, 2007, 03:03:22 PM »
ER, yes about something intangible.. not something that eyes, and economic figures tell us all !!

When you go to Kiev do you look up.. have you noticed tall luxurious office blocks and penthouse sweets springing up?

Have you noticed all the "brands" have places there.. ?

Do you seriously think they would open up if there wasn't the return?

How's you head...? ;)


Never been to Ukraine, but I can give you the "other" side of Russian prosperity. The Russian "middle-class" is defined as families where the average earning is at least 10,500 roubles per person (i.e. $400 per month). Even using this definition, the number of Russian that can be classified as middle-class represent roughly 15-20% of the total population of Russia and up to 30% of the population of Moscow. This means that 70-85% of the population of Russia is earning less than $400 dollars per month. Their wages are stagnating and they are faced with high inflation on food which represents the bulk of their expenses. Most of these Russians do not even dream of buying an apartment and are happy if they earn enough to buy food for their families.

Offline rose

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #79 on: October 25, 2007, 03:10:53 PM »
Dear Rose
...I am fully aware of your dictatorial tactics there and that you donít allow full access to men for whom allegations were made against them about bad behaviour etc and the inner circle is sitting as a Judge and Jury. Your whole approach is totally one sided, hypocritical and condemnable. I was allowed to post there but I was barred of using any other facilities like, the Modify Button, PM, Look profiles and so on.
Wrong, if you'd write XXX (don't remember the exact number) of posts, you'll have full access. As well as access to the other facilities.
Quote
Personally I tried to reason with your members regarding my Saga, as you say, but then realised that the only purpose of your members is not to have a dialogue but to mock and ridicule any man who dares to speak to them to defend himself. So I started insulting you and taken the piss out and finally I have given you the only medicine you cannot handle, ignored you.
Yep, that was really a "gentelman" kind of behavior.
I don't responsible for others, can talk only for myself. But even I sometimes had hard time to deal with you because you don't know when to stop.
For ALL: I probably will provide a link here for people could enjoy it. That was a real ongoing soap opera with several seasons.
Quote
Now you tell me I have made myself a clown because we have different views regarding posting personal information on the internet. I expect you must have noticed that I use my own photo in my Avatar because I am honest and have nothing to be afraid of or to hide, unlike most of our members and ALL OF YOURS.
Yep, there is nothing left to hide for you because you exposed all what you could.

Quote
... For your information my post was one of the most successful posts on RWD with more than 30 pages and over 10000 reads and probably would have gone for longer until the intervention by Kvinna which destroyed any possibility of reconciliation between me and my then GF and finally forced Dan to Lock it!
Have you ever heard expression that not always size matters?

Quote
If you want to know the merits and usefulness of that thread is that can be read by any new member who can learn how not  to continue any relationship based on false premises and learn to recognise the red flags very quickly. I was not the only contributor in that post but most if not all of the members of this board, so there are plenty of opinions there to be taken notice.
Yep, there is a lot of very important information about what not to do.

Quote
But really dear Rose I do not care about the Antidate members opinion and I am afraid my estimation about your own judgment has changed and I will question everything somebody tells me and not take it at face value. Honestly I donít remember your loyalty and I apologise for that, because I am getting too old or I became very happy now with my new relationship.
Well, what I can say... I'm very happy for your new relationship and I'm sick to hear about it on every forum.

I think I'm done with you. From now on I'm not responding on your posts.

Offline ScottinCrimea

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #80 on: October 25, 2007, 03:37:22 PM »
rose,  If you're tired of hearing repeatedly about wiz's soap opera life that he seems so much to enjoy sharing with others, just put him on ignore as I have done.  He offers nothing constructive or credible anyway, so why waste the time to read what he posts?

Offline ham

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #81 on: October 25, 2007, 03:44:29 PM »
A few questions to you Damien.

Will you add a scammer to your site from one man's report?


Did you add this woman Natasha K. from this one man, Ham's, report?

If this is the same Ham who has posted on various discussion boards over the last 4-5 years he is one nut.  If you are posting this women from this one man's report, then I think you are making a big mistake.

And this is one of the problems any anti-scam site will have by posting a woman from a single report.  There are so many men who are upset that a good woman has rejected them that he will call her a scammer and some anti-scam sites will add this woman as a scammer.  This is why I think NO site should add a woman as a scammer from a single report unless the evidence is overwhelming.



leave people alone, or I shall remember when you sent precious messages to suggest your agencies; or all those aliases back in 2002...phew!
Hell, beggars can't be choosers.
What a pitiful way to earn a living, I'll admit.

Second, I blacklisted nobody.
I am a moderator, not the owner.
But if Jack gives me private lessons in his consummated art, I can register another alias & accuse myself of the murder of JFK.

PS: I'm not here to participate: just keep your feuds private please.

Offline rose

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #82 on: October 25, 2007, 03:49:23 PM »
rose,  If you're tired of hearing repeatedly about wiz's soap opera life that he seems so much to enjoy sharing with others, just put him on ignore as I have done.  He offers nothing constructive or credible anyway, so why waste the time to read what he posts?
Thank you for good advise, Scott. Are you sure that he will not squize through "ignor"? :D




Offline wiz

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #83 on: October 25, 2007, 04:42:30 PM »
Rose

This post was About a woman called Natasha who was accused of been a scammer, which you came over here to defend and make sure that she is taken out of the scammers list. Half of your objectives has been achieved but obviously you didnít like the fact that me and other members have questioned Antidateís tactics and now you turn your criticism on my personal life.

Do you really think I care about your sarcasm in your repliesÖÖor you think that your comments will have any affect in my life?

If you are sick hearing about my happy relationship Dr ScottinCrimea has already given you his advise and prescription.

It is pretty obvious you enjoy reading and writing about unhappy situations and bad relationship and that is why you mostly post on Antidate and not here.

PS: Have you just noticed Ham the Mod from Antiscam just posted his gripes against Jack?

Do you think he came over by chance or after reading my email to his boss?

I suggest letís see what is the truth and how we can take Natashaís name of their list and donít worry about my personal life!


 :offtopic:
ScottinCrimea

I knew that soon or later you will make your appearance like a jumping jack and start your usual comments and reference to my past relationships. You cannot ever say something positive about me but always try your put downsÖÖ.. Because it makes you happy ÖÖ. Typical reaction of a Small minded and ignorant man!

If you had me on IGNORE why then you have been reading my posts over here and now you decided to post and say that I have nothing constructive to offer?

Of course you do have very much to offer to other people over here by trying to start a flaming war with me, every time I make a post and of course with your other posts talking about your wifeís shopping of personal items etc you really educate new people here. Your posts are boring me to tears! :ROFL:

Do me a favour and press the IGNORE Button and leave me alone. I have long time ago told you my opinion about you and obviously you didnít liked what you heard! I suggest you donít start attacking me again, as I will not hesitate to retaliate.

I simply donít care neither I read your views anymore, without using the IGNORE button and BTW this board doesnít belong to you! :mooning:




Offline ScottinCrimea

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #84 on: October 25, 2007, 05:13:17 PM »
Thank you for good advise, Scott. Are you sure that he will not squize through "ignor"? :D

The only way you will see what he posts is if someone else quotes him, which is typically done these days to disagree with his foolish ideas or to ask him to please stop regurgitating his ridiculous rationalizations for his screwed up life.

Offline KenC

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #85 on: October 25, 2007, 07:25:43 PM »
 :offtopic:

I have to take exception to what was posted by wiz (sorry Rose & Scott)
Quote
For your information my post was one of the most successful posts on RWD with more than 30 pages and over 10000 reads and probably would have gone for longer until the intervention

There are a few reasons why a thread could get so many posts and reads and they usually have no relationship with value or "success."  One reason may be because it is a volital subject fueled by emotional members with conflicting viewpoints ie: The thread about Pike or the Photoguy thread.  Or the thread itself could have a life of it's own having to do with day to day happenings in a person's personal life over a long period of time ie: Maxx's original thread about his divorce.  This type of thread probably should be better be presented by the poster via a blog and not necessarily a thread.

The thread that wiz refers to falls into both categories, as there were many many posts made by just wiz and his ex lover Mirror over a seven month period of time (9/01/06 thru 4/19/07).  It had the elemants of two people with different viewpoints as well as the "blog" type of feel to it.  But valuable?  To whom?  I seriously doubt the thread had any learning affect to it in any way unless you think of the South American soap operas that are translated into Russian as entertainment on the same level as the Discovery channel.

But my question is what kind of deranged individual would get some sort of sick pleasure from airing their own dirty laundry in public?  To "wear" the number of reads and posts about your own personal failures as some type of badge of honor just does not compute with me.  Maxx and now wiz have posted their displeasure about their "dirty laundry" threads being locked as if there was a conspiracy against them.  Is it so important to have the limelight that even exposing your personal misery is acceptable in order to obtain it?  Whoever finally locked those two threads did the respective memberships a great service and it is too bad the original authors are too egomaniacal to understand it.
KenC
You are a den of vipers and thieves-Andrew Jackson on banks
Banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies-Thomas Jefferson

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RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #86 on: October 25, 2007, 08:20:53 PM »
leave people alone, or I shall remember when you sent precious messages to suggest your agencies; or all those aliases back in 2002...phew!
Hell, beggars can't be choosers.
What a pitiful way to earn a living, I'll admit.

Second, I blacklisted nobody.
I am a moderator, not the owner.
But if Jack gives me private lessons in his consummated art, I can register another alias & accuse myself of the murder of JFK.

PS: I'm not here to participate: just keep your feuds private please.

Ham,

If we can get everyone back ON-TOPIC, I would hope that you, and the owner, would be considerate of the prospect that an innocent lady is reported as a scammer on your site. I would further hope that this sort of event would elicit a vigorous response to correct any injustice.

Thanks for visiting - and while you don't plan to participate here, I do hope you will consider what has been written and reconsider the listing of this lady as a scammer.

Feel free to send me a PM if you prefer to take it off-board.

- Dan

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Re: RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #87 on: October 25, 2007, 09:27:36 PM »
BillyB, if 2 women who met the guy in 2 different cities say the same thing: aggressively insisted on sex during meeting (don't remember if he threatened, but both were shocked) as if they were obliged to provide him services, don't you think it's already a pattern? You, guys, sometimes, defend other guys like this, and then when it comes to you, you might pay big price because a lady whom you like might have hard time trusting you.


Rose, I'm losing faith in you as an educated person. How can you accuse me of defending the guy when I was the first to insult him by saying "he's a hamburger short of a happy meal". I think you're upset because I insulted Natasha too and you read what you want to read ignoring the rest of what I wrote. Yes, I do question Natasha's motive and smarts for accepting a date with the guy. How can any family oriented woman do that?

The man in question may be a sex tourist but he is not a deceiving sex tourist. He sends videos of his dick to women before visiting them to catch the type of women he's after. He wants a woman that thinks like him and is into sex, not the "hard to get in her pants" family oriented woman. If a woman agrees to meet him, he is of course going to expect sex. How can these women not know that is beyond me? They knew he was morally bankrupt before his visit yet they still agreed to go on a date with him and then they acted shocked that he wanted sex on the first day and reported him. Would they still go on a date with him if he first announced he was a child molester too? Let's be real here.

Wiz, thanks for the link. Natasha reported him first in April and he is only retaliating because of the report against him. That is why he mentioned Natasha is creating a "tissue of lies".
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Online msmob

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Re: RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #88 on: October 25, 2007, 09:42:55 PM »
Hi again,

no disputing ths post.

Never been to Ukraine, but I can give you the "other" side of Russian prosperity. The Russian "middle-class" is defined as families where the average earning is at least 10,500 roubles per person (i.e. $400 per month). Even using this definition, the number of Russian that can be classified as middle-class represent roughly 15-20% of the total population of Russia and up to 30% of the population of Moscow. This means that 70-85% of the population of Russia is earning less than $400 dollars per month. Their wages are stagnating and they are faced with high inflation on food which represents the bulk of their expenses. Most of these Russians do not even dream of buying an apartment and are happy if they earn enough to buy food for their families.
We'll be back, EU ..and as a certain 'gentleman' couldn't accept my offer to 'bury the hatchet' .. Don't trust a clueless Californian 'business owner' who cannot even quote me, honestly ..

Offline Mir

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Re: Natasha Klinova - a "scammer" on www.russianscamcheck.org ;)
« Reply #89 on: October 25, 2007, 11:46:38 PM »
I would point out that I did not deny there is more money floating around in Kiev and did agree that property prices have shot up.
As for what a Bentley looks like, yes I know what it looks like as I see one everyday. The man who lives in front of my house has one and each morning we drive out to work about the same time, him in a 2006 Bentley Azure and poor me in a 2005 BMW M5 :)
Yes the traffic on the streets of Kiev is heavier but I cannot accept what I have not experienced, and I did not see a single Bentley when I was there. So maybe you are confusing Toyotas with  Bentleys? :) This does not mean that none exist still it is a rare sight. BTW in 2006 a total of 45 Bentleys were sold in Ukraine c/w 9200 cars sold woldwide.In 2005 they sold 26 while their total world wide sale was 8600. http://www.balticbusinessnews.com/newsletter/070316_bbn_newsletter.pdf
In 2004 I went to the restaurant Mandarin and had dinner there, the bill was 910 UAH, in 2007 for a similar dinner it was 1038 UAH, increase? yes but not that much is it?
In 2004 I rented an apartment a few yards from TGI Friday for $145 per night, I can show you the receipt of you want to. The same is available for $147, you can check here: http://www.sherbornehotel.com.ua/
As for hotels in 2004 I don't think that Hyatt Regency or Radisson SAS existed, so yes like now they were not asking for euro 300+ to stay there, however I inquired about a single room at Primer Palace, the only 5 star hotel in Kiev then and they asked $600 upwards, now you can get a singel at this hotel for 252 euros which is $353, hey the price has gone down?!
In 2004 a room at Dnipro was $120 and Hotel Lybid $100 per night, now you can get one for 86 euro($122) and 76 euro ($107) respectively (you can check these at http://www.kiev-hotels.1bigeurope.com/index.aspx).
As for airlines, well the one near my home is KLM, I can show you tickets I bought in 2004 and 2005 for £162, £180 and this August it cost me £310. KLM from London was available for £144, it is higher then that now.
As regards salaries, well yes many people are earning much more, specially in banking and IT, but most in the service industry (health, education etc) have not seen any significant increase in salaries and still have to rely on bribes to make ends meet.
All in all I don't deny there is more wealth but I don't agree there is a significant increase in prosparity regards ordinary Ukrainians nor is there a major increase in the cost of spending a week in Kiev as a tourist.
Ukraine (and from what I have heard) Russia are developing the ills of any newborn capitalist society, from everyone being poor they are developing two distinct classes, those who are very wealthy (and very few) and those who are struggling for the basic things in life.A culture of haves and have nots.As gabaub has quoted.
So msmob are you happy with the statistics which are from a personal experience? :)

Offline rose

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Re: RE: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #90 on: October 26, 2007, 12:28:15 AM »
BillyB,
I reread my post and I think I misunderstood you.

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Re: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #91 on: October 26, 2007, 05:00:13 AM »
I would re-iterate that this thread

is about NATASHA Ė Scammer or not?


Unfortunately certain people here have a habit to always turn their posts to personal attacks against members they donít like and otherís talk about OFF TOPIC subjects thus derailing the main thrust of the post.

:exploding:

:offtopic:     :offtopic:     :offtopic:

Rose

You came here NOT to question my life, my relationships and my behaviour but to discuss the plight of NATASHA and to fight her case that she is not a scammer! 

You did not like my questioning regarding the tactics and actions taken place on the Antidate site, where you and Natasha are members and turned around your efforts trying to discredit me by criticizing my own life, behaviour and relationships.

You are claiming to be an educated person but you miserably failed with your actions in your mission and it was only Danís efforts that brought a partial success for Natasha.

You also have failed to apologise to BillyB when you acknowledged your mistake and that says a lot about you own bad manners and attitude.


ScottinCrimea.

You are a small minded ignorant and rude little man with a chip on your shoulder. You are holding a grudge against me because sometime ago I told you why I know and I am 100% sure for the feelings of my new woman where you canít be about your wifeís!

Ever since, every time I make a post in any subject and thread YOU ALWAYS get the opportunity and you start making personal attacks on me and my relationships.

BTW I knew about you before joining this board. I would suggest, why donít you start another thread and write about the real reasons for you moving to Ukraine and Crimea?

I have publicly accepted responsibility for my previous failed relationship and my mistakes but that does not give you the right to continuously pestering me and turn around any of my objective comments and referred to that relationship. You are a pathetic little creature.


KenC

I am glad and happy that finally your familyís ordeal is over and everything is fine and safe for all of you. I am also happy that you are back to your usual self.

I will also like to thank you again for your kind post explaining to me and allaying my fears for the safety of my son and his family!


It is well known fact our dispute and personal comments against each-other but if you wish to discuss your comments and merits of your OFF TOPIC subject start a new thread elsewhere and let me know. I will not shy away, you know me better.

This thread is about NATASHA and please do not derail it with OFF TOPIC comments.


Msmob

You are here on RWD to try and redress the fact that you ex-GF   "Natasha"    were named as a scammer in 2 Antiscam sites.

You are now OFF TOPIC debating with Mir the economical situation in Ukraine and Russia.
Take it elsewhere please.

Mir

The same comments to msmob applies to you. START ANOTHER THREAD.


BillyB

I do appreciate your comments and you have my full respect for staying on Topic, unlike the otherís above! That is the real reason that I always enjoy reading your posts and any comments you make.



Your Honour

I rest my case!


 :cheesygrin:
« Last Edit: October 26, 2007, 05:21:54 AM by wiz »

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Re: Natasha K*** - a "scammer" ?!?
« Reply #92 on: October 26, 2007, 03:17:45 PM »
rose asked me, and I agree with her - that this thread should now be closed. The lady has been removed from the scammer list, and there is nothing more to be said at this time.

- Dan

 

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