This is a guide to my experiences on a 2-week trip to Odessa in May/June 08 (still here as I post this). I have tried to put in as much practical and specific advice as possible for anybody following in my footsteps. Although written about Odessa I think large sections of this would be applicable to any trip to Ukraine or Russia.
The purpose of the trip was to have a holiday in a nice city and meet women.
Clearly some of this advice may not be suitable for everybody so I will describe myself to put it into context. I am a 39 year old single childless Brit from London, have been to Odessa, Kiev & Poltava before and will post a separate comment about agencies I have dealt with there. I went out with a woman from St Petersburg for a year before deciding that she was not quite the right person for me. My sister says that I am not ugly, I really do look younger then 39!, well educated, well-travelled professional and think I am a reasonably attractive candidate.
I have met a number of extremely nice, attractive, well educated and stable women here and will be back soon to follow up with one of them. My biggest problem is that after a slow start I have now met 5 women any one of which I would be happy to see again on an exclusive basis although I do have one favourite right now.
Odessa Airport & CustomsAirport is tiny but quite busy, although I was at the back of a full 737 I got through passport control & customs quickly. Customs were only interested in whether I had any jewellery or not. Apparently they charge a lot of tax (44%) on jewellery so I would avoid bringing any in unless you are going to hide which I do not advice. There are jewellery stores in Odessa.
I do not think the VIP service is worth it, as it would not have saved me any time.
AccommodationI stayed at Odessa Executive Suites.
www.odessaexecutivesuites.comI highly recommend them. They met me at the airport. There main accommodation is brilliantly located right behind MacDonald’s on Deribasovskaya. They were renovating when I went to visit. I am actually staying at the J apartments, which are also very well located. Properly maintained, good security, good size, cheaper then hotels and good customer services.
Apartment had all of the things I needed (except for a tea pot!) and the computer with Internet access was a lifesaver. They have satellite TV but not many English language channels (except for Russia Today, CNN & BBC World) as the satellite serves the Middle East and parts of Western Europe.
Also used the food delivery service and the mobile phone rental.
Although I have not stayed there speaking to locals Londonskaya is the most recommended hotel. Hotel Otrada although not in a brilliant location is used by EU civil servants so must be good; I used their café for meetings. Ate at Arcadia Plaza, which is in a nice location, located right next to Arcadia. Avoid Odessa hotel, bad location right on the waterfront and not that good although it is big.
ATM & Cash I have read about concerns using ATM’s here. One way to reduce the risk is to use only one banks ATM, I used Raffeisbank which is a big Austrian bank which I assume will have better security then a small local bank.
I only bought in $1,000 in cash, which was not enough, I should have bought in $2,000 as it is a very cash intensive business and for the first week I went to an ATM every day. You can bring up to $3k but anything more then $1k you have to declare to customs, I think there are also issues if you take out more then $1k. There is a very good thread on the website about cash & ATM’s called Bring money into Ukraine.
I did have a problem with my Visa card after a trip to St Petersburg but my bank cleared it all up and issued me with a new card.
Let your bank know that you will be abroad as once in St Petersburg they blocked my Visa card thinking it was being used fraudulently.
Local PhoneYou must try and get a local SIM card for your GSM phone or rent the whole phone, I cannot imagine trying to organise meetings etc without it as not all local phones packages allow foreign calls. You can rent them from various people including Odessa Executive Suites.
ShopsIn terms of high-end boutiques the shopping is amazing, as good as London so you can tell there is a lot of money in this town. You can find most things you need, I did my food shopping in the supermarket in the basement of the big shopping mall just of Deribasovskaya.
SocialsThree days before I went to Odessa I decided to attend one day of the Anastasia social in Odessa. I paid them $400 dollars in advance for one social only on the Saturday (2nd day). I booked it because I was curious as to what they are like and was struggling to get meetings arranged (see comments on Anastasia) on my first weekend;
I missed first social in Nikolaev but men I spoke to seemed to like it and said that they had made good contacts.
On Saturday lots of women attended (perhaps ratio of 5 to 1) although it was noticeable that some did not stay for the whole period. They get a card that gives them free food & drinks so there is no incentive for them to stay for the whole period once they have finished food. Their ID’s were checked at the entrance though. Meeting was from 1pm to 7pm at a local nightclub.
On Sunday I went because I had enjoyed Saturday, the staff said I could pay in cash on the Sunday. However there were a lot fewer ladies so I left after 1 ˝ hrs (I had not paid as Anastasia staff were not there at beginning). Ratio of men to ladies was 1 to 1 while I was there. There were only two tables of women that were really appealing. The first very tight group all left after 1 ˝ hours, I saw them all together in town later, the second group of 4 arrived late but were immediately hit upon by two of the men who were clearly not going to let anybody else in so I left. I saw a lot of the men in town at 7pm so the social must have finished early.
Advice if you do go;
• Please try and make an effort in dressing, it was embarrassing comparing the dress code of the women to the men. The most successful man on the Sunday was dressed in a tux although I do not think you have to go that far.
• You are in a target rich environment but only a proportion of them are worthwhile candidates. Try and meet a number of women, I spent too much time on Saturday with my first lady and did not leave enough time to meet others especially as the two most attractive women I saw did not stay the whole time.
• That is one problem with the socials is that you know nothing about the women except for physical appearance.
• Also as soon as you see a women you like head straight for her. I saw one woman I wanted to meet by the time I was free she had left.
• They put dance music on at midway point which I thought was too soon as it made talking difficult but it was fun although few of the men danced.
• Staff made no effort to help introduce men to women or vice versa so it is up to you to make the connections (although interpreters were provided). If you cannot approach a woman without help you are in the wrong place. The staff did organise some entertainment on the day i.e. dance contest.
• Men I spoke to on the full tour where interested in the fact that I had made my own way and was not dependent on Anastasia for anything. They said that if they had there time again they would do the same as the hotel they were in was nothing special. They were also interested in the idea of having multiple agency contacts.
• I saw a few of the men around town later and they seemed to have made some contacts.
On whole I enjoyed the social on Saturday, it was one of those once in a lifetime experiences but I would recommend making your own way and just attending the socials and then only pay for the first two in advance. And as recommended definitely take a notebook and pen.
Agency ContactsI made contact at four agencies
Odessa Marriage Agencies Owner Ron Singerman
www.odessamarriageagency.comRon was very good, they did deliver the goods but were not very pro-active. I used their basic matchmaking service where they interview 10 ladies you are interested in and met two ladies through them one of whom I liked. However never heard anything about whether any of the other 8 were interested in meeting. The focus of their efforts seemed to be on the interviews whereas my focus was more on meeting as many women as possible from my short list. In retrospect I was not that interested in the interviews as I could get the information myself in meetings. So I think the best thing to do is give them a shortlist of ladies you like and agree a price for each introduction.
I would use them again but I would keep in regular contact with them if you need to meet more women. I did not push them as I had enough contacts already. Nastya was one of the best interpreters I met.
Anastasia Internationalwww.anastasia-international.comThere is a lot of negative comment about Anastasia on this site, which is deserved. However I went with an expectation that a 1/3 of the women would be scammers, 1/3 real and 1/3 would not be interested in meeting. If you go with low expectations & limit the number of letters that you write you will eventually meet some nice women.
Anastasia is a letter-writing organisation, which is a front end for a number of nameless local agencies. In Odessa every single women I met (5) came from a different local agency. Some of these agencies are scammers and some genuine although I could never work out which was which. Anastasia works by charging for the letters and sharing the income with the local agencies, which encourages fraudulent letters.
The common thread for success was;
o If I iniated contact first (because I liked the profile) the more chance you will meet a scammer (defined as showing a great interest in meeting until you arrive in Odessa at which point they are out of town, in love already or simply do not respond to your final letter).
o If I responded to a letter from the lady the higher the chance of a real meeting.
o The number of letters or the quality of the letters was no indication as to whether they were real or not. In fact the longest chain of letters and highest quality were from the scammers.
At the first meeting some agencies charged $15 an hour for translation, one $10 an hour, several $20 an hour and one had the cheek to charge $35 introductory fee as well.
In the end using them is like wading through treacle but I did meet 3 women through the process who were great and were worth the effort but see my recommendations at the end.
Goodo Great website, very well laid out, good technology
o Lots and lots of women who fit what I was looking for (because there are so many sub agencies behind the scenes as compared to agencies like Adam & Eva which is just one agency).
Bado High scam rate
Odessa – out of 9 ladies I wrote to I met 4, 2 more called me but meetings fell through (partially my fault in 1 case) and 3 were scammers. Of the four I met seemed genuine and certainly three of them were great and was happy to meet again.
Kherson – out of three ladies I wrote to all three were scammers
o Very poor customer service – initially I tried to arrange accommodation through them. Initially the response times were adequate but the weeks before I went were very slow which was a problem, as I needed to change my plans. The reason I booked accommodation with them was because I wanted to book interpreter in advance to start organising meetings. I was never given a contact for an interpreter, which removed the main reason for using their accommodation.
o No single point of contact, no central office to speak to in Odessa.
I would use them but only as a backup to another agency. Only start writing when you are within 4-5 weeks of arriving in the town you are visiting. Pick 10 ladies to write to, you may meet 2-3. DO NOT WRITE BEFORE YOU KNOW ARE GOING TO UKRAINE/RUSSIA. There is no relationship between the number of letters you write and the quality of them and whether the ladies are real or not. I met some ladies after only two letters were exchanged.
Army of BridesWrote to three women, all three scammers. On my first trip to Odessa in 2005 I had written to two women in Odessa both genuine so it shows how things can change
Appolinaria - Apollo Internationalwww.appolinaria.comLast minute contact because of problems with Anastasia and Odessa Marriage Agency. I agreed with them a price per introduction, as I did not use their tour service.
Very interesting agency as they are actually a model agency with a sideline in the marriage business. Charge very high prices so they are a complete opposite of other sections of the business, which are dependent on high volume, low margin letter writing. As they describe it you wont meet women of this quality elsewhere, not strictly true as I did meet other nice women but every women I met through them was special and my current favourite women is with them.
I have been to there office and had two lunches with Vladimir Burylin, the owner and Victoria their tour manager (Vladimir paid for the first lunch). I liked them both very much and they took me on a tour of Arcadia. Also gave me two extra free contacts, after paying for five introductions.
If you can afford them I would recommend them.
There are other agencies in Odessa, I had enough contacts without needing them but I would take with you their contact details as backup.
Keeping busyMost women you meet will be working in the day or will want to spend time with families at the weekend so you will have long stretches of time with not much to do. Things that kept me busy are;
o Walking around Odessa – lots to see, fantastic architecture and very safe
o Took some DVD’s to watch on my laptop & books to read
o Laptop allowed me to do work from here using WiFi and PC in my flat
o Sitting at café Kompot on Deribasovskaya, drinking tea, watching people go past and using my laptop with WiFi.
o There is a school here that teaches Russian to foreigners which had I known about earlier I could have booked some lessons with them
o There are lots of museums etc to see
o Try and go to Arcadia to see the nightclubs if you can. There is a company that provide lady guides to accompany you.
Age GapIn the end the women I have met have been aged 29 to 21, my favourite is 27. I have ended up meeting women younger then I had originally planned to before I came.
Ideally I would have preferred to meet somebody aged around 27-30 but a lot of the profiles that attracted me were aged 21 to 27. This is because Ukrainian women tend to get married at a younger age then in the UK so the available pool of women declines after age 25.
One 21 year old I met was immature but another 21 year old was very mature, intelligent and not phased by the 18 year age gap.
On balance I think it is very important to set your self an absolute must not go below a set age limit (21 for me in the end) but set it a couple of years lower then the normal maximum of 15 years which would have been 24 for me.
It’s in the waterThere is definitely something in the water in Odessa, Kiev and St Petersburg you will never see so many attractive women in such a short space of time (I live in London and was recently in New York as a comparison). As a test walk down the main street in your town and count the number of women who you count as “10” and then do the same in Odessa or elsewhere.
In Odessa there is also a Hare Krishna sect dancing group which goes down Deribasovskaya every day, I have seen them in many cities but have never seen such an attractive group of devotee’s (men and women) all together.
I know this makes me sound like an image obsessed man who is only interested in a pretty face but there is no denying that part of the appeal of the RW is that they are an attractive group of people.
Children are also very cute which bodes well if I have ever have a half English half Ukrainian child.
Of the women I have met, they are all extremely attractive, university educated and in gainful employment or education (quite often both).
There pictures look different!One thing to be aware of is that people look different in real life compared to their photos. Some times the women look worse in real life, sometimes they just look different and quite a few are more attractive in person then in the photo’s. It is not because you are being mislead it is simply that people look different in photo’s. I have only met one women (on a previous trip) where the photos were misleading; the lady had put on a lot of weight over the years.
What to Bring with YouYou can find most things in Odessa so you do not have to bring a lot. What I found useful were;
• Food – you can buy food here but to avoid having to spend my first day food hunting I bought some food with me and used the Odessa Executive Suites food order. I also bought detergent for the washing machine.
• Mixture of smart and casual clothes, first meetings I tried to dress up, to show that I can look smart if I want before reverting to my more normal smart casual for 2nd meetings. Shoe brush is very useful to keep shoes looking clean.
• Notebook & pen
• Lonely Planet Ukraine guide and Russian Phrasebook
• DVD’s, Books, Camera, Rechargers
• Gifts – I made little gift bags with a mixture of English honey, teabags, Aveda travel packs of shampoo & conditioner, London tube map & chocolate (from Dean & Delucca in NY). Gave them out on any 2nd meetings as a thank you for meeting me.
• Business cards I had printed but with my personal name and address
Odessa – what it is likeGreat city, I have been to about 45 countries so far and Odessa is one of my favourites. If I marry a women from here I know I will probably return 1-3 times a year for the rest of my life so it does make a difference liking somewhere as well as the women. Things I like are;
• Great restaurants & cafes, quality of food, presentation etc is comparable to London. I actually rate them slightly higher
• Decent flight connections
• Great place to people watch and not just all of the beautiful women
• Night clubs at Arcadia, I am not a big night club goer but wow they were great
• I love the architecture of the old part of the city, all pre 1917
• Beaches
• If you were into shopping amazing selection of high end shops
General Advice After 4 Trips to Russia & Ukraine• My first two trips to the East were to meet one woman only, after several months of writing. In both cases met nice women but felt nothing on meeting them in person. I now believe that meeting many women on each trip is the most effective including women I did not know about before coming. You can though meet too many women a mistake I may have made on this trip.
• Do not be dependent on only one agency; make sure you have a backup plan and contact details of other agencies if necessary.
• Go to social if you are curious but do not book the whole package unless you are a complete newbie to foreign countries.
• Bigger cities mean that you are more likely to have multiple agency contacts; the downside is that you will see a lot of other foreign men and girls have met other men (which I actually think is a good thing). As I come from a big city I prefer women who are accustomed to big cities.
• Have a plan organised in advance, do the research on the city you are going to in advance, I skipped a bit and was making plans after I arrived.
• Go to one city only. I originally planned to visit other cities on my trip but you will make enough contacts if you go to one place to keep you busy and you run the risk of running out of time pursuing contacts you have made (a mistake I made on a previous trip).
• Go to a city, which is interesting in its own right, with lots to see and do that way if you not meet any women you have had a nice holiday. St Petersburg and Odessa meet these criteria.
• Make sure you do not waste any days so always have meetings arranged in advance. You maybe lucky and meet the right women on you’re first meeting but always plan for it not to happen. Most women work so except for weekends plan on only being able to meet one or two women a day.
• Start writing to ladies once you have booked your flights but not before. Do not write too many to any one lady, it can be very time consuming, expensive and is prone to scammers.
• Read as much of the advice on this website as possible, not everything I have written will apply to all of you.
• As somebody else has already written GET ON THE PLANE TO COME, if you don’t have a plan to do so then don’t bother writing to ladies. The only downside is that you may get hooked on RW but not meet the right women first time and have to return again and again and again !!!
• Last piece of advice is that you are unlikely to meet and fall in love on one trip (unless you are here for many weeks) so to avoid losing the initiative you should be ready to return within a couple of months.
If you need any specific help please let me know.
