Maxx-
risk fluff 
agreed it has!!
and i do think it's good you post hardcore examples of what
can happen.
It IS an added risk , so those who were in denial about it being "risky business"
should read those letters you posted closely, and be aware of the additional and very real risks.
Ronnie said.
First, AJ, if Tanya stayed in the US, she would only be doing the rational and sane thing for her long-term future. Who could fault her? It would also mean that she was willing to give you up but not her residence in the USA. That is what the green card represents after all. You, or any of us, can be replaced more easily than a comfortable and safe lifestyle in a western country
Ronnie, you did not answer my basic question?
you posted that the scenerio you describe above-
is a person not immigrating for the sole purpose of using thier spouse as a simple tool for a GC..
I asked its relevence to a true GCG - the added "risk" discussed here-
that was the context i was ovbviously posting in, when i stated *few* RW marry for that GC purpose.
You added , a bit controversally , that all (100%) RW that immigrate here are GCG
in some degree..or another.
a weird point in the context of this thread ?
because if you extrapulate out the GC scenerio to the extreme that any normal person would consider it simple financial stabilty with in the confines of the marriage, . which is what youve done?
it has nothing to do with the added risk of this endeavor?
sorry i'm so easily confused ,but i just dont understand your point ,in this context anyway..
**************************************************
as far as your point that all RW feel that the man, the husband,
is replacible ,but the immigration status in a western country is not-
That is a huge generalization, a bit unfounded , and reeks of thinking the west is so much better ,
that anyone would be silly not to consider life there irreplacible with somewhere else?
some do marry the man,,
yes his financial stabilty is considered,,
if he could bring that same financial stabilty to any country including her own ,
they woulds be fine with that,
so where would a GC came into play?
First, AJ, if Tanya stayed in the US, she would only be doing the rational and sane thing for her long-term future. Who could fault her?
noone could, i certainly wouldnt!
and i am not putting her on some pedestal by saying i know she initially would not have stayed here.
in honesty it only highlights her inabilty, at that time,
to think things thru past her immediate experience ,
and doesnt put her in a favorable light?
a bit irrational in long term thinking even?
It would also mean that she was willing to give you up but not her residence in the USA.
it "would"
IF thats how she felt , or acted.
but thats simply huge speculation on your part.
there are no IF's , she still has a brown passport even though she could have a blue one.
If we had divorced in those initial years, she would have returned to Ukraine.
there is very very little doubt of that.
If you knew her, back then, you would have the same conclusion,
not by her statement of that, but by actually knowing her,
her outlooks ,her thoughts and feeling of life there and here,
what she missed about her family and friends and familiar culture.
her actions on many similar things.
her thoughts o ngher abilty to easily work and restart her life in ukraine,
opposed to her- PERCEPTION at the time-of the difficulties of that for her here.
(perhaps unfounded but her perception was her reality)
You would know what her actions would be ,all without any adoration, simply by knowing the person well.
to think a husband cannot do the same is bizarre.
and to think that all the factors of ones FAMILY and homeland cannot
easily override some daily conveniences is equally bizarre.
why you cant imagine a world where a RW whose marriage to a foreign man dint work out in the first years,,
would rather be back in her familiar enviroment with her family and friends is strange ?
they exist wether you care to believe in them or not
it isnt like believing in the tooth fairy.LOL!
its believing that some RW have different priorities than you assume them to have.
or if you feel the USA is so far ahead of where they were,
its believing that they are foolish or immature enough to not recognize that.
Both easily a possibilty in humans!!
why you choose to deduce it isnt likley, is beyond me.
some RW who relocate to the USA, would have instead married a RM if they met the right one, just imagine?
That is what the green card represents after all. You, or any of us, can be replaced more easily than a comfortable and safe lifestyle in a western country
answered above..
but its the RW's perception, of life in the west, NOT YOURS, that would make her decision? and shes the one making the decision .
My wife was terrified of relocating her, never though the whole thing thru properly..
and would have been overjoyed if i had relocated to Ukraine instead.
She initially dint care for the culture here, wasnt familiar with it, dint feel any safer,, or more comfortable.. knew only me..
and wouldnt have replaced me to stay here..
that isnt to make myself feel better, its just her reality at that time!
you can think it foolish, naive ,or immature.Its how she felt.
(still does to some degree or percentage
)
to infer she felt differently ,or i dont really know how she felt,
or that i am trying to tell something other than her reality,
all to portray her in a better light is silly beyond belief.
seriously.
as i find her initial thoughts and feelings when here ,very understandible ,
but not well thought out , mature ,or with any real foresight.
not very complimetary really?
know without little doubt that there are many RW that felt as she did,
she is not unique in this thinking..
and did not move here with some GC as a big thing on thier minds..
Ronnie, i know well finacial security and the allure of the west is part of the whole situation.
permanent immigration to the west might be a factor to many, but certainly not all.
Your take on life there is bleak ,and isnt all encompassing?
Some have thier own flats , worth more than an average American has in his homes actual equity.Some have thier own cars and decent jobs.
The *west* is simply different ,with some positives,,but initially some big negatives as well.
They would eventually meet a great RM and marry him. bu tthey had not yet and expanded thier search or randomly met a western man by fate.
They did indeed marry the man, with hope of a good life with him of course,,
but with HIM, not WITHOUT him stuck in another unfamaliar country with no support of family.
yes yes, in reality, he may be replacible in the scenerio,as isnt everyone?
but they do not feel that way.
you have several examples of such.
that are not simply from *deluded* husbands as is insinuated here..
to act like it is the husbands putting a child up where they dont belong ,
and by doing so a disservice to them , is strange.
It's a bit of a disservice to portray every RW the same,or as having permanent immigration/GC on her brain, when marrying her husband..
looking for a better life as part of the marriage package ,
is something different than looking for simple immigration status.
it isnt one and the same , in all RW persceptions.
i think few would have the confidence that on thier own with thier very own GC,
in the USA things would be better for them , than in thier home country
I do not mean to be personal.. but you have stated many times you mostly speak with each other in Russian and your wife is still in ESL classes.
I wont pretend to know your wifes feelings...
(as you have done with my wifes and BC,Scotts and Catz,,)
but i will ask you, who i trust knows quite well her strenghts ,m weaknesses,
thoughts and feelings
(funny you dont give us other husbands that credit though lol)
did she come here with the confidence to strike out on her own without you if things went sour?? or would she have returned to her home country?
or replace you to simply stay in the "safe west"?
i could speculate, (like you have in reverse)
that she would likely not have that confidence or plan...certainly not initially
of course you could counter .... and i could say you delude yourself..and that we wont know without seeing her actual actions in the situation.
but you know what?
instead i would simply take your word for how she would react..as you do know her well obviously.
I highly doubt in your wifes mind you are so easily replacible..
but if you disagree......ok....
