Hello from the Pacific NW

[JimSeattle1963]

Hi, I'm 44 and have decided to have a go of pursuing love with FSU women.  I've been on the Elena's Models site for just over a year, and have corresponded with a number of women, and am now getting serious about traveling to FSU to meet some of the women I have corresponded with.
I found this site because I wanted to think more deeply about the WMVO, WOVO, WMVM question, and try to see what makes sense for me.
The woman I am most serious about is in Moldova, which in itself is "interesting", due to the conditions there.  She actually somewhat picked me out, based on info in my profile, and as it happens, I sent her an EOI because she came up in one of my searches.  And she quickly responded, we wrote a few times, and then she shut down her profile, to correspond with only me.  (Yes, I actually believe this in her case)
I've been married twice to USA women, once for 20 years, and the second time for less than a year.  If only I'd married the 2nd one first, I'd still be a happily married man!  Long story...
I have 3 kids, 2 daughters in college as of now, and a son who has 2 years of high school left.  I'm in a place in my life where my parental heavy lifting is done, and I can manage a bit more travel and adventure than in the past.
Why FSU women?  Well, it seemed like a good idea at the time.
A Ukrainian woman expressed it this way in her profile:  "I have not been poisoned by the dual curses of feminism and materialism".  I don't know if that's true of HER or not, but it summarizes my current feelings about AW.  Now, I have been badly beaten up in Family Court by my first ex, and experienced all the awful "delights" that await fathers in anti-male family court.  So, I'm pretty down on the FemiNazis in the USA that have turned family court into a place to assault good fathers and good men on the general principle that because 5% of men are pretty bad, we'll organize the system around those 5% and take it out on the other 95%, and make it possible for a spiteful woman to manipulate the system to rape, pillage, and plunder the ex.   The excesses or the FemiNazis or the excesses of the patriarchy, both pretty bad, can't we find a reasonable middle ground?  Anyway, I've survived all that.

I'll share part of what I wrote to the lady I'm most interested in:
"You asked me why I think a Russian (Former Soviet) woman would be a good match for me.  A Ukrainian lady's profile on Elena's models said it best:  "I have not been poisoned by the dual curses of feminism and materialism".  Many USA women are first concerned with what material things a man can give to them.  I do not want such a woman.  Or they are overly concerned about "equality" in little details, when it makes no sense, because man and woman must work as a team.  He does the messy, smelly, offensive things like taking out the garbage, or removing dead, rotting, smelly opossums from under the house, or tasks like fixing broken things that men are often good at, or things that require physical strength.  She does things that come naturally to her and that she is good at.  Equality for the sake of sameness is not helpful.  There are differences.  USA feminism is misguided and focuses on equality, or arguing over who should get more, and not on working together as a team.  This is an over-generalization.  There are many women in USA who are not suffer from the dual curses of materialism and feminism.  However, most of them are happily married and not available.

Also, in USA, many of the available women have serious issues.  Just before I started corresponding with you, I went on two dates with a USA woman from (nearby city).  I liked her, and she liked me, but...  Soon became clear to me that she was too badly wounded from her previous relationship.  I did not think she was emotionally healthy enough to be in a relationship with anyone, and especially not me.  She also was not a good problem-solver, too much of a victim, and could not see that the prison she was in was of her own making.  Several months ago, I did date a woman from Hawaii who was a good woman, but it was bad luck, I was not over my 2nd ex-wife, and I was not ready for the relationship then.  I have thought about finding her again, because she would be a wonderful friend, but I have not done so, (extraneous personal stuff removed)
My 2nd ex-wife is a very good woman, but we disagreed about money and also about where to live.  So even with her, it came down to issues of materialism and feminism that kept us from being together.  This woman (has certain issues I had to work around a little bit), but that was not really a factor.  I loved her very much, but she chose her career and her worries about money instead of making a full commitment to being with me.  She actually made a little more money than me because she works in a big city, and I work in a medium-size city.  It really sucked to feel I had to leave.  I still have very warm feelings for her, but I decided to leave because I could not feel respected as a man because she could not make the level of commitment I needed from her."

When I sign up for the dating sites that match you on compatibility things, they send me TONS of good women from the big city 90 minutes north of me, and ALMOST NONE from my city.  I already did the relationship with the woman from the big city, been there, done that, got divorced from her, don't want to move from the city where I am, I like it here very much and have a very good job here.
So, the irony is that when trying to find a good quality woman who will come and live with me where I am, it seems easier to find the quality of woman I am looking for on another continent.
I don't want Trailer-Park-Trudy, with the tattoos and chain-smoking and alcoholism, and who needs me economically, rather than wants me as a partner, I want an educated, professional, highly capable, family-oriented woman.  I'm not looking for a drop-dead gorgeous trophy wife either.  I'm most attracted to women who are a little taller than average, and somewhat larger-boned/thicker than the skinny models that dominate popular media, because I like to have a little more to hang onto and cuddle with, and I already did my service to the petites of the world with my first wife, and I'll take the big-backside former basketball center over the petite gymnast. I'm 5'11" 200 lbs myself.

The woman I'm most interested in is from Moldova, and I'm getting serious about arranging a trip to see her in about 4 months.  Gotta take my 17 year old daughter on her graduation trip (my family tradition) first, or I would have been heading over in July/August instead of October. 
There are other women I write to, but none that have quite the chemistry as with this woman, and she's been pretty honest with me, as best I can tell, and doesn't try to tell me only what she thinks I want to hear.  So, I am here to learn, to research and decide for me on the WxVx question, based on my situation, and gather more data to help me think through the next steps of the relationship with my woman in Moldova.

[Ooooops]

A Ukrainian woman expressed it this way in her profile:  "I have not been poisoned by the dual curses of feminism and materialism". 

Smart girl       But do you know what she means by that? 

[Blues Fairy]

Both materialism and feminism are good in homeopathic doses.   

[steviej]

Hello Jim - welcome aboard, or should I say abroad?
You will find a great bunch of guys and ladies here, full of opinions and experiences - and more than willing to share There are guys just starting their search, guys who have been searching for even up to 3-5 years, and those of us who are happily married for several years to our spectacularly wonderful RW ladies. Read the threads, pick and chose, and you'll find things useful to your situation. There are horror stories and faily tale endings. I will suppport you immediately on one account: the FSU ladies are overall I think the best group of ladies in the world, and well worth all the hassle, time, money, complications and pitfalls to find your special girl. She is there, I guarantee it, and she is waiting and hoping that a man just like you will find her. She wants what you want. Are there scammers, manipulators, gold-diggers, serial-daters, and so-on-and-so-forth? Of course. They are all there. But don't let that discourage you. I have no doubt that with your age and experience, you can find the happiness you seek with a special FSU woman. Good luck!

[steviej]

Both materialism and feminism are good in homeopathic doses.   

Actually, the most recent scientific studies show they are highly toxic even in very small doses

[steviej]

Jim , by the way, there was a fellow here from Alaska a while back. Some of the guys suggested he look into the Vladivostok area. They thought there were a high number of available and quite desirable ladies in that area. Being in the North West, that might be a convenient (relatively) destination for you also?

[ambach123]

If you think RW are not materialistic, I got some ocean front property in Arizona for you.

In my observation they are more materialistic than AW.

Just waite until you start corresponding with them, and the first question they ask you.

[Kuna]

If you think RW are not materialistic, I got some ocean front property in Arizona for you.

In my observation they are more materialistic than AW.

Just waite until you start corresponding with them, and the first question they ask you.

ambach,

Again... without wanting to offend you - you have no idea what you're talking about.

If you think the typical good FSUW are materialistic, or more so that AM, you need to look no further than your attitude and conduct for the answer why.

In the Apartments thread you made it obvious you talk about your "wealth" and your have no problems flaunting it.     (A very unattractive trait in anyone)

You claim to be wealthy but you can't claim to be wise.  Hopefully you're lucky, because you'll need it.  FSUW will eat you alive - they're too smart for you.

Kuna

[ambach123]

Kuna, you seem to be a reasonable guy.

Nonetheless, I don't know anything about your culture or you. I will never offer you any criticism about you or your country.

I don't know how much you know about my country. But I would suggest you refrain from criticiizing my country or me.

It is my observation that Ukrainian women are more materialistic than AW, if someone wants to believe otherwise, I am fine with that. The very first question they ask, " What do you do? " That is before any information is provided to them other than age, height and weight. I don't see anything wrong with that, but that is just a fact.

With regard to my intellectual capacity, you have no clue who I am; may be in your culture you make assumptions, in my culture you don't. We have very high regard in our culture for self made people, whether your culture does or does not, I don't care and I don't care to know either. But I have disdain for someone who does not know anything about me or understand my culture and still makes comments.

[Kuna]

ambach,

I'm glad you're not offended... I'm just trying to give you a clue.

You're totally lost at the moment and you have no idea what you're talking about.  It's actually sad... but I'll persist for a while yet.

Nonetheless, I don't know anything about your culture or you. I will never offer you any criticism about you or your country.

I don't know how much you know about my country. But I would suggest you refrain from criticizing my country or me.

ambach, I'm not criticizing you,  I'm criticising your perturbed view of things.  You've really got no clue and that is evident by the things you ask an the things you say.

As for how much I know about "your country", I've worked extensively with Americans and in America.  I am involved in the tech industry and my most recent "sport" was as a Tier 2 manager in a small public company running Mergers and Acquisitions of little businesses started by "entrepreneurs" probably not dissimilar to you.

Something that I've learned over the years is that we all have our strengths and weaknesses.  There is no such thing as the perfect human.  You have flaws you simply wouldn't believe you have, but most of all the flaw you're demonstrating most of all is your inability to be introspective, and to understand advice.

You've got no clue at this point.

I'm saying this to HELP YOU...  not because I want to.

It is my observation that Ukrainian women are more materialistic than AW, if someone wants to believe otherwise, I am fine with that. The very first question they ask, " What do you do? " That is before any information is provided to them other than age, height and weight. I don't see anything wrong with that, but that is just a fact.

What do you THINK they will ask you?  Do you not think that is a fairly normal question to ask someone?  You're just so obsessed with how good you THINK you are that you take this as if they are trying to size up your bank account.

Mate,  I've stood in bars in Sydney and been asked flat out what I earn, "because you're a great guy and really funny but I want to make sure we're not wasting time".

This lovely lady was just being honest, she knew she was the hottest girl in the best bar in Sydney and she was aiming high.  I was shocked the first time it happened to me so I admit I stumbled.

Not a month later I was back in the same bar and a different girl opened my suit coat to look at the label on my jacket.  She cheekily said, "It's a nice suit I just wanted to make sure you wore good labels.  How much do you earn, I don't want to waste our time."

This time I was more prepared for how disgusting Sydney girls had become so I immediately said, "It's no problem at all,  I earn X and I own Y in property and I don't want to waste time either.  Tell me, would you be prepared to do Z every time I demand it?"

The poor little thing was offended... but no matter which way you look at it these girls are no better than hookers.

ambach,  I think you're just too obsessed with yourself if you think a girl asking what you do for a job is materialistic.

Sorry, it's how I feel!

With regard to my intellectual capacity, you have no clue who I am; may be in your culture you make assumptions, in my culture you don't. We have very high regard in our culture for self made people, whether your culture does or does not, I don't care and I don't care to know either. But I have disdain for someone who does not know anything about me or understand my culture and still makes comments.

Your intellectual capacity and more so your character is demonstrated through your posts - and I know enough about you to say I think you'll fail miserably and will be eaten alive by all sorts of predators in FSU because you have not got a clue and you're going to look like a goose.

The women won't respect you - but if you're lucky a few will try to fleece you.

You can have disdain for me if you think I don't understand your culture but here's something I do know:

Earlier you said the most expensive part of this journey for you was taking 10 days away from your business (because you're such a hot shot).  ambach, what I know about real businesses is that they have strong systems and processes and there are deputies available to keep things moving while the captain is away.  If you're business relies on you being on deck all the time you have big problems.  You're business is not scalable OR sustainable.

You also need to realise that it takes an immense amont of time with your wife once you marry a FSUW and if you're stuck in your business (can't leave because it costs me so much money while I'm away) either your relationship or your business will suffer.

ambach, I think you are light years away from being ready for this.  Get your act together at home first and then start again.

Don't be offended...  we've been trying to give you advice.  You're just too silly to understand it.


I guess this means you won't want my advice anymore because I don't pander to your ego...  Good luck "my friend", you're going to need it!


p.s. look at the posts gtex made (who is gtex anyway?)  Whoever he is he picked it a while ago.  What's most important is that YOU recognise your weaknesses though, not that we do.

[viking]

I would love to have JB chime in right about now!

[steviej]

Kuna is right on here. 

I think I asked in another thread (confusing my threads already ), but I wonder why is ambach123 pursuing this at all? Why would he want to marry a woman from a group he has such a negative opinion of? You need to do some soul searching. What are you really looking for ? Why ? Whether you see 5 girls or 50 girls has no bearing on the negative views you are raising. This is not shopping. This is about establishing serious relations with living breathing human beings with dreams, hopes, desires, and yes, for that man who will be loving, caring, best friend and a great husband. Do you want to give this? Is the strong need to give all this to a great woman a need you have? If not, I'd say spare the ladies the future trauma and crash & burn of having gotten tied up in your confusions and dissatisfactions.

[groovlstk]

I think I asked in another thread (confusing my threads already ), but I wonder why is ambach123 pursuing this at all? Why would he want to marry a woman from a group he has such a negative opinion of?

Take away the beautiful faces and sexy legs and the motivation is gone, completely.

I've said it before but I'm always amazed at the amount of crap and risks guys are willing to put up with just to be with a beautiful woman.

[JimSeattle1963]

Jim , by the way, there was a fellow here from Alaska a while back. Some of the guys suggested he look into the Vladivostok area. They thought there were a high number of available and quite desirable ladies in that area. Being in the North West, that might be a convenient (relatively) destination for you also?

StevieJ, Thank you for the Vladivostok suggestion, I will look into that!  I've corresponded with a small handful of ladies in the Siberia region, which I think is sort of where Vladivostok is, and I know I need to improve my command of FSU geography.

[roykirk]

StevieJ, Thank you for the Vladivostok suggestion, I will look into that!  I've corresponded with a small handful of ladies in the Siberia region, which I think is sort of where Vladivostok is, and I know I need to improve my command of FSU geography.

Hey Jim!  You're just up north of me!  My girlfriend is in Novosibirsk (Siberia), and Vladivostok is way east of there.  It's on the east coast of Russia and seems like about the end of the world to me, even when I'm in N-k.  Unfortunately, even for us on the west coast, it seems like most flights go the long way (east).  If you punch in roundtrip from SEA to Vladivostok to any of the Internet travel sites, chances are it will give you some convoluted route going east.  You'll probably have to manually put together your own itinerary from SEA to Tokyo, then Tokyo to Vladivostok.  Northwest does non-stops from Seattle to Narita. 

[Muckraker]

You go Korean Airlines through Seoul.  There is a nice transit hotel in the airport to rest if needed as well. 

originclub is the agency in Vladik. 

Muck

[OlgaH]

Actually, the most recent scientific studies show they are highly toxic even in very small doses

for example if talk about such Russian women issue as "to stay at home or to work?" the scientific studies show that Russian women prefer to work and make their career   

The public opinion foundation:
Women's happiness
07.03.2002

Respondents were asked the following question: "IF YOU HAD A TEENAGED DAUGHTER, WHAT WOULD YOU WISH FOR HER TO BE HAPPY AND SUCCESSFUL – TO BE HAPPILY MARRIED OR TO HAVE A GOOD JOB?" A good job is in first place.

We would note that there is no disagreement on this issue among men and women, young or elderly people, the well-educated and so on. The overwhelming majority of those surveyed in all socio-demographic groups said they would want their daughter to have a good job and build a good career.

However, 43% of those surveyed are convinced that "most Russian women would prefer not to work if their family had a good income" (49% of those surveyed hold the opposite opinion). Men (48%) were more likely to think so than women. As for women, they think women would prefer to have a job even if their family had a good income (55%).

February 2004
90% of Russian women would prefer to work even if their family had a good income.

[steviej]

for example if talk about such Russian women issue as "to stay at home or to work?" the scientific studies show that Russian women prefer to work and make their career   

The public opinion foundation:
Women's happiness
07.03.2002

Respondents were asked the following question: "IF YOU HAD A TEENAGED DAUGHTER, WHAT WOULD YOU WISH FOR HER TO BE HAPPY AND SUCCESSFUL – TO BE HAPPILY MARRIED OR TO HAVE A GOOD JOB?" A good job is in first place.

We would note that there is no disagreement on this issue among men and women, young or elderly people, the well-educated and so on. The overwhelming majority of those surveyed in all socio-demographic groups said they would want their daughter to have a good job and build a good career.

However, 43% of those surveyed are convinced that "most Russian women would prefer not to work if their family had a good income" (49% of those surveyed hold the opposite opinion). Men (48%) were more likely to think so than women. As for women, they think women would prefer to have a job even if their family had a good income (55%).

February 2004
90% of Russian women would prefer to work even if their family had a good income.

Olga, you are just amazing .. like a walking Library of Congress! My wife is only a sample of 1, but to her, the most important things in life for a woman are a good husband and a good home. Of course, her requirements for a "good husband" are quite strict 

[dispozo]

I really liked Khabarovsk very beautiful city. I don't know of any agency in the city. It is about a two hour flight north of Valdivostock.

Here is a link to some photos I took there: http://picasaweb.google.com/dispozo/KhabarovskRussia2007

Good luck!!

[Ooooops]

Alaska Air was going to do Anchorage - Petropavlovsk-Kamchatski flight.   I'm not sure if it's already working or not, but that will be the best solution from Seattle, IMO.

[Muckraker]

www.airgardenhotel.com

Link to the transit hotel inside Incheon International for the layover on the way there (the way back is very direct timewise).  The hotel is about five minutes walk from deplaning.  Bags are checked through so you only have what is in your carryon.  You can buy a phone card on the plane to call from the transit hotel too (your roaming GSM mobile phones won't work in S. Korea, they use a unique frequency there).  You can arrive in Vlad fully rested this way.

Sorry for sounding like a travel agent here, but I love Vlad and I can only wish people the same that I found in Vladivostok.

Here a sample itinerary and pricing. From www.koreanair.com

Seattle to Vladivostok     
Flight 1 Thursday, September 04, 2008 
  Departure: 14:15 Seattle, USA - Seattle Tacoma 
Arrival: 17:50 +1 day(s)    Seoul, Korea Republic Of - Incheon International 
 Airline: Korean Air KE026  Aircraft: Boeing 777-200/200ER 
 Fare Type: Economy Restricted 
 
  Change of plane required. Time between flights = 16:10 
   
Flight 2 Saturday, September 06, 2008 
  Departure: 10:00 Seoul, Korea Republic Of - Incheon International 
Arrival: 14:20  Vladivostok, Russia - Vladivostok 
 Airline: Korean Air KE981  Aircraft: Boeing 737-800 
 Fare Type: Economy Restricted 
   
Vladivostok to Seattle     
Flight 1 Saturday, September 13, 2008 
  Departure: 16:20 Vladivostok, Russia - Vladivostok 
Arrival: 16:50  Seoul, Korea Republic Of - Incheon International 
 Airline: Korean Air KE982  Aircraft: Boeing 737-800 
 Fare Type: Economy Restricted 
 
  Change of plane required. Time between flights = 1:35 
   
Flight 2 Saturday, September 13, 2008 
  Departure: 18:25 Seoul, Korea Republic Of - Incheon International 
Arrival: 12:15  Seattle, USA - Seattle Tacoma 
 Airline: Korean Air KE025  Aircraft: Boeing 777-200/200ER 
 Fare Type: Economy Restricted 
 
travellers   Fare   taxes       
1 adult(s)  x  (1,592.00 + 87.70)  =  1,679.70 USD   
 
Regards,

Muck
 

[roykirk]

That's a nice itinerary and a nice price!  Once, as a test, I checked airfares from Anchorage to Vladivostok on Expedia and Orbitz, and both inexplicably would only offer me flights going east.  I think the problem must be that they don't check fares and routes with the Asian airlines.

[chivo]

I think some of you are getting a little ahead of yourself. It would serve him better to consentrate on the woman/women instead of the place.

While I'm sure saving a couple of hours of flying time is nice, he would be better served finding the right woman first. If he finds one in Vlad, great, so be it. It's a little premature to think about flying to a place just because of convenience.

Seattle heading east is no worse than travelling from San Fran or LA, especially now since they have direct flights out of Chicago to Moscow.

Find the woman first, then worry about where to go. Of course your options shouldn't be limited to any particular region. Good luck.

chivo

[roykirk]

I think meeting the right person first is a given.  I am just speaking about flights in general.  Of course I would recommend he meet the right person before flying to Vlad, or anyone else for that matter.

As far as flights, the direct flight from LAX to SVO on Aeroflot is great.  It's 13 hours in coach hell, but every time I've managed to have the seat next to me empty, so it could be worse.  Someday I'd like to do the SEA to Frankfurt, then Frankfurt to Novosibirsk, but I think S7 currently only does this flight once per week, so it creates a scheduling headache (and it's not cheap).

[chivo]

I think meeting the right person first is a given.  I am just speaking about flights in general.  Of course I would recommend he meet the right person before flying to Vlad, or anyone else for that matter.

You'd be surprised by the people who think searching an area is your best bet.

As far as flights, the direct flight from LAX to SVO on Aeroflot is great.  It's 13 hours in coach hell, but every time I've managed to have the seat next to me empty, so it could be worse. 

Yes, done it a few times myself. I even got lucky one time and had a whole middle section to myself. Slept like a baby for 8 hours. Best flight this way I ever had .

Someday I'd like to do the SEA to Frankfurt, then Frankfurt to Novosibirsk, but I think S7 currently only does this flight once per week, so it creates a scheduling headache (and it's not cheap).

Not exactly the best safety record as well, even though I've flown with them before. I'm sure you'll get your chance. Good luck

Also, welcome Jim and good searching to you.

chivo