How "private" should private messages be?

[KenC]

There has been a recent post referencing the privacy of PM's.  I also have had discussions with a member here as to being betrayed by my reference of material contained in a PM.

I have received a variety of PM's from a variety of sources.  Some are from members that I consider friends and are just a free exchange of ideas or opinions.  Some are from advice seekers.  Others have been vulgar attacks from adversarial members that do not have the ability to debate in an open forum.

I guess that I have never truly considered PM's to be sworn to some code of secrecy, but more a "personal" note between two people.  What do you think?

KenC

[Admin]

My sense is that the PM is for "Personal" or "Private" (take your pick), but in any case, it is a facility the board offers so that information/opinions/whatever need not be displayed to the open board.

One possible position is:

If you are going to write it down - in ANY medium - you simply MUST accept that the recipient can do anything he/she wants to with your message. That is the most conservative (and protective) position.

I would rather take the position that, if I put something into a PM, it is because I do NOT want it openly posted, and the recipient has an obligation to honor that obvious wish of mine. If the receiver chooses to post one of my PM's publicly, then I will simply index my future communications with the person accordingly.

Lately I've noticed that quite a few guys sure take the board seriously. It is hard for me to understand why they are so intensely invested in things stated on the board. The simple facts are:

1. This is merely an internet board with written words.
2. Few of us will ever meet face-to-face.
3. Insults and attacks often speak much more about the attacker than they do the recipient, and most on the board recognize that.

I wish everyone would lighten-up a bit and approach all this with some humor.

FWIW

- Dan

[jb]

Ken,

I have also had private communications betrayed on an open forum.  I have since learned to be very careful of what I write in a PM to people I don't know well.  Whenever someone uses a private message as a weapon levied against an adversary it merely denotes that person's inability to debate.  In the latest round of Clyde vs S&F we learn a bit more about personalities than we ever wanted to know. I'm guessing Clyde's PM to S&F ruined his good demeanor for the day.

I use stuff like this as a yardstick to measure people, as in: "If we were in the business of choosing friends, would he/she be picked first, or last?"  Reliability counts.  Betrayal of a confidential message does not show reliability IMHO.

[KenC]

Dan,

You wrote:

I would rather take the position that, if I put something into a PM, it is because I do NOT want it openly posted, and the recipient has an obligation to honor that obvious wish of mine.

I know you well enough to know that you would never do this, but what if the PM is just a vulgar attack?  Do you think the sender still warrents "the obligation to honor" privacy?  Keep in mind what the sender may want to keep private is his own lack of self control.

KenC

[KenC]

jb,

The same question to you that I posed to Dan.  Under those specific circumstances does your statement below hold true?

Betrayal of a confidential message does not show reliability

KenC

[Admin]

I would rather take the position that, if I put something into a PM, it is because I do NOT want it openly posted, and the recipient has an obligation to honor that obvious wish of mine.

I know you well enough to know that you would never do this, but what if the PM is just a vulgar attack? Do you think the sender still warrents "the obligation to honor" privacy? Keep in mind what the sender may want to keep private is his own lack of self control.

KenC
[/quote]

Ken,

You are correct - I had not considered this possibility. I guess my default is to believe the best in people - though you'd think I'd have learned my lesson by now :X.

Now that I am considering it, it sure would be tempting to post the vitriole from another for the world to see what sort of person they are.

While I know it sounds like a platitude, I really do believe it is the stronger person who takes the 'high road' and refuses to stoop to mud-slinging.

At the end of the day, I guess it boils down to looking yourself in the mirror and being proud (or not) of what and who you see staring back.

FWIW

- Dan

[jb]

I thought I had addressed that question in my reply above.

If not, then let me be clear, I believe PMs are private, if someone I had trusted with a PM were to reveal my private thoughts on an open forum, his staus will be downgraded in my opinion to the level of a porker, and he would never receive another PM from me.  I would then track him down and expose his porcine, penis sized, brain for all the world to see.

Does that clear it up?

[Michelangelo]

3. Insults and attacks often speak much more about the attacker than they do the recipient, and most on the board recognize that.

Very true...and well said, Dan.  And when I see someone post a reference to a PM (hey, what do they think the word private means?), it reflects on the person that posts it in  a negative way.

[Rvrwind]

I would rather take the position that, if I put something into a PM, it is because I do NOT want it openly posted, and the recipient has an obligation to honor that obvious wish of mine

Agree 100%, Dan.

Dan,

You wrote:

I would rather take the position that, if I put something into a PM, it is because I do NOT want it openly posted, and the recipient has an obligation to honor that obvious wish of mine.

I know you well enough to know that you would never do this, but what if the PM is just a vulgar attack?  Do you think the sender still warrents "the obligation to honor" privacy?  Keep in mind what the sender may want to keep private is his own lack of self control.

KenC

 

Thats a tough call Ken. I can see where your going with it though. In my opinion if someone has to attack me in a PM & hasn't the guts to do it on the board it merely shows his/her lack of character. It reminds me of a guy who wants to fight you but waits till you turn your back before he throws the punch, typical coward.

I live by the golden rule that states never say anything about anyone behind their back that you would be afraid to say to their face or in public.

Whether in your example one should reveal this to the general public, well I really can't say. I've never had anyone that I can remember ticked off at me enough to attack me in such a manner, at least not yet. But I think I'm gettin' tigerpaws worked up for, LOL, just jokin' Tiger.

I really don't know if in this example you give it should be made public or not. I have had stuff that I have e mailed posted on the board & I was not impressed as it put me in a very precarious position. Nothing I said that I regreted it was just the fact that it was written in confidence & that confidence was betrayed.

You are correct - I had not considered this possibility. I guess my default is to believe the best in people - though you'd think I'd have learned my lesson by now :X

 

You'd think, LMAO.

While I know it sounds like a platitude, I really do believe it is the stronger person who takes the 'high road' and refuses to stoop to mud-slinging.

At the end of the day, I guess it boils down to looking yourself in the mirror and being proud (or not) of what and who you see staring back.

 

And that's the bottom line.

If not, then let me be clear, I believe PMs are private, if someone I had trusted with a PM were to reveal my private thoughts on an open forum, his staus will be downgraded in my opinion to the level of a porker, and he would never receive another PM from me. I would then track him down and expose his porcine, penis sized, brain for all the world to see.

I like this answer better jb...you da:dude:

RVR

Canadian Cowboy

[KenC]

I thought I had addressed that question in my reply above.

If not, then let me be clear, I believe PMs are private, if someone I had trusted with a PM were to reveal my private thoughts on an open forum, his staus will be downgraded in my opinion to the level of a porker, and he would never receive another PM from me. I would then track him down and expose his porcine, penis sized, brain for all the world to see.

Does that clear it up?

All most.  What if the receiver of the PM can give a sheet what the sender thinks of him?  (Again, I trust the sender of such garbage would never be you.)

KenC

[KenC]

Richard,

I think you sumed up my feeling when you wrote:

In my opinion if someone has to attack me in a PM & hasn't the guts to do it on the board it merely shows his/her lack of character. It reminds me of a guy who wants to fight you but waits till you turn your back before he throws the punch, typical coward.

I live by the golden rule that states never say anything about anyone behind their back that you would be afraid to say to their face or in public.

KenC

[jb]

Ken,

You and I have exchanged a number of PMs in the past, had I not trusted you, I'd have never written a word.

As for the receiver not caring a "sheet" about me, or what I think, I'd probably not have sent the PM in the first place.  I get many PM's, I answer very few, and I initiate even less.

Most of my writings here are in response to something posted, or, more rarely, an effort to get people thinking.  I don't post about sexual issues, mostly because I figure by the time a man gets to this point he already knows about the birds and the bees, if not, it's too late to educate him anyway.  Bragging about one's sexual exploits does not impress me, which is why "itstime" kinda got on my short list, it's all sort of junior high school locker room nonsense to me. I wish I could go a week without some wanna be Lothario boasting about how he got in some hot babe's knickers within six hours of the first meeting.

If someone were to attack me in a PM, they do so at their own peril.  I'm not a push over.

[Bruno]

Insult flight direct to trashcan...

Usualy, PM are private but each case can lead to a other situation... by example, when someone post on the forum and write in PM very different thing... i don't like people who lie...

Really Ken, it is a difficult question... but i have learn to not take care a lot from PM of forum... i use more e-mail...

[Rvrwind]

If someone were to attack me in a PM, they do so at their own peril. I'm not a push over.

Awwww jb, I know your just a big ol' softty, LOL.

RVR

Canadian Cowboy

[jb]

LOL, Richard.

Actually I am.  I've been told that God takes care of fools and drunks, you and I may qualify on both counts.

I do recall your first trip to Tver and how you rebelled at some of the things I told you then.  She was so young, and so hot...  Whatever happened to her?

[Admin]

LOL, Richard.

Actually I am.  I've been told that God takes care of fools and drunks, you and I may qualify on both counts.

I do recall your first trip to Tver and how you rebelled at some of the things I told you then.  She was so young, and so hot...  Whatever happened to her?

How young? And how HOT?!?

:dude:

- Dan

[jb]

Believe me,,, she was young, and very hot.

[Elen]

Don't worry guy;) All your PMs to me are saved  Women can keep their mouths better than males:P

[jb]

Why am I suddenly glad I've never PM'ed Elen?

[Elen]

 You have not idea how many you lost in that life  

[Bruce]

This is so simple I am suprised it is even being brought up.  Private is private, whether you agree or not with the sender.   Erase it or respond to it, just do not post it on the board.   What ever happened to honor???

Now, PM chats discussed amongst members may come up in the form of forum posts but direct PM quotes is a no, no - unless agreed to by the original sender - but why would he / she send it PM in the first place if this was so.

[Rvrwind]

I do recall your first trip to Tver and how you rebelled at some of the things I told you then. She was so young, and so hot... Whatever happened to her?

Wow...memories....

Which one are you talking about jb?

The one in Tver that I originally came for or the one in SPB that I hooked up with for a time?

Both were very hot & young, unfortunately.

The one in Tver is married to a Russian guy now. 25, 5'5", Long Black hair, blue eyes, what a combo & a dynomite body. They got married about a year after Valya & I did. She was disapointed about her initial assessment of me but it was too late by then as I wasn't interested in rebuilding that bridge. I see her around town occasionally and she doesn't seem to me to be very happy with her choice but thats the way the ball bounces. Everytime I do see her the first question she asks is if me & Valya are still together, LOL. I think she is still secretly hoping.

The one from SPB I have never seen again. She was fun for the time we were together but only 18 years old. Couldn't see myself making it too far into the future with her but the time we did have together was memorable.

Now that I think about it there was one other that I hooked up with in Tver that I really fell for but at the time she had too many personal problems & we kinda drifted apart. I saw her not long ago & still got a lump in my throat when I was talking to her. She was a gorgeous green eyed natural blonde, 5'2", with a body & face that gets every guy lookin'. She was 25 when we met & I really fell for her in a big way.

I dated some pretty hot babes over here but am glad I found one that is a great match for me in all areas. Wouldn't trade her for the world.

How young? And how HOT?!?

Young & extremely hot..LMAO.

RVR

Canadian Cowboy

[Michelangelo]

How young? And how HOT?!?

Young & extremely hot..LMAO.

[/quote]Ok, I am on my way to Tver....I'll take the 5'2" blond with green eyes--English or no English

[Rvrwind]

You might get lucky too Micheal, last time I saw her she was still looking. That was about 7-8 months ago.

She is happy that I found somebody but had it not been for her personal problems at the time I'm pretty sure we'd be together today, real nice lady, no English but a big smile that could stop a bus. I noticed she has put on a little wieght but not so anyone else would notice. Made her breasts grow considerable though & at 5'2" I'm not sure how she keeps her balance, LOL.

But she is still damn hot.

She was at LTP, but I just checked their website & she ain't on it. Maybe she finally found a man, I hope so, she deserves it and nobody will be happier for her than me. Their old photographer was her uncle, kool dewd. We had many a conversation about his niece. He told me once that when we first split she cried herself to sleep for a long time after. I was sorry to hear that, but it was her decision to break it off, not mine. I was broken up for quite awhile myself but I got over it & I hope she has. Of course that doesn't diminish the fact that everytime I talk to her I still get butterfly's in my stomach & a lump in my throat & I am happly married. I wonder if that will ever go away.

RVR

Canadian Cowboy

[Son of Clyde]

I have no desire to debate with anyone and if I am angered by an unjustified or crude comment I will fire off a PM to that person. I am here to learn and to read the board not to argue. I have been stressed and at times may make sarcastic comments if I am peeved at a particular person. I have been called down on it by Dan and the Moderator.

This is an open forum and when you start to censor things you have watered down content. It is up to the Administrator and Moderator to decide whether to censor any content. Maybe swear words do not belong on the board. But on a PM I think we should be able to say anything we please as long as it is not posted on the board.

Yes, some are vulgar and insulting and it is why they should remain private.

Real life is not always a pretty place.

If the receivers of my PM's care to contact Dan I have no problem with that.